We Want Nine
Jan 21st, 2012 by 'holic
…pints that is.
What did you think I meant?
The anticipation of the visit of Manchester United, if we are being honest, has always incorporated varying degrees of trepidation. Generally the first two Wenger incarnations at Arsenal gave as good as they got, but in recent years we have mixed gallant wins with some crushing defeats, and none more so than the 8-2 ripping we got at Old Trafford earlier in the season.
Now freakish though that was it is worth noting that we went into the game with regular, although inexperienced full-backs. Carl Jenkinson had a Premier league debut to forget when he picked up two yellow cards. At least he redeemed himself later before going in the fetlock. For Armand Traore on the other flank it was his Arsenal swansong. Few tears were shed at his departure to Loftus Road just 48 hours later. It is therefore just a little worrying to be going into this game without any full-backs, particularly as that fact has contributed massively to us being pointless in 2012.
The prospect of Valencia and Nani running at us from out wide is a concern, although it will be interesting to see if Park too is included from the start. The saving grace may be that United are possibly the only side in the top flight who come anywhere near our injury list. Vidic out and Ferdinand doubtful perhaps suggests rich pickings could fall the way of Robin van Persie. Fletcher has usually saved his best form for matches against us but is another long-term absentee. The defensive shortages of late though are eased with Evans, Smalling, Jones, Evra and Rafael back in the squad.
We are not likely to be too different from the side beaten at Swansea. Thomas Vermaelen is not likely to be fit to return, and a fitness test will decide if Thierry Henry is able to take a place on the bench from which he could be summoned to score one more vital goal against a side he usually enjoyed playing against. Get the feeling we are up against it? Too right we are, and that hopefully will be our saving grace.
Only last season I previewed the corresponding fixture thus…
How on earth do I decide the destination of the βholic pound. No sensible punter will be on us for this one, and even a draw would be a measure of progress against a side who currently have a hold over us.
Aaron Ramsey scored the only goal of that game. A young side missing Vermaelen and Fabregas knuckled down and played the way they have been coached to play. They disregarded the quality of the opposition and expressed themselves. That has to be the blueprint to follow again this weekend. Aaron Ramsey again will be a key figure, but he will need those around to show for the ball and be positive with it.
There will be no excuse for him not noticing Theo Walcott, who hopefully is emerging from a brief slump in form and will be looking to add to his goal at Swansea. Theo is amongst the players who will be sporting Nike boots embroidered with β#makeitcountβ, and the active tweeters amongst them will also have their Twitter handle stitched into their footwear.
The ‘holic pound has been the cause of much head-scratching I must confess. Fancy an Arsenal win? Any win? Then you need to get to Gunners Gaming, who offer an astonishing 17/6 (Yes, nearly 3/1) against the home win. I have looked for a little more of a return that that, and have grabbed a piece of the 23/4 they offer against a draw at half-time and Arsenal to win at ninety minutes.
Obviously anything could happen, but here’s hoping we knuckle down and produce another performance. I’ll be seeing a few of you there, and to my neighbours can I offer my apologies in advance. I do get just a little bit wrapped up in our games, and United is one of those that really gets the adrenalin running. Well, adrenalin and Guinness topped up with a bit of malt, obviously. It will be good to exchange views with that nice Mr Ferguson again.
Have a good one ‘holics, and don’t forget to enter the competition to win a Thierry Henry tee from Gooner Shirts.
Cheers.
346 Responses to “We Want Nine”
Great title ‘holic – i’ll drink to that
So close!
And yes, Geoff.
I have just listened to the Tuesday Club podcast.
as with the swans game can’t help thinkin’ topman Artetetetaaaa! is gonna be a massive miss again ( no great insight there i know) – still someone might step up, or as you point out above p’raps the whole team’ll raise their game like they did last year – hope so
Come on the proper Reds
Heh ‘holic:)
Just back-drank the tail end of the last session, some top comedy from many posters!
Lester, Arteta will definitely be missed. But if Blackburn could win at the Old Toilet, we must believe that we can beat them at home.
Geoff just read of your accident over the post-glad to hear you’re safe and sound – but on the downside i guess that’s another pothole in another road. Swings and roundabouts
Oh, and tabs – you can complain all you want about a poor run of Fantasy PL form, but at least you are not so heavily rooted to the bottom that you really should be one place below last… I picked a great week to sell two players and replace them with two Newcastle defenders, didn’t I?
Fair point re Blackburn Lars – though i think it’s probably a bit trickier for us to catch mancu by surprise – like what they did. The purple knight’ll have ’em up and running for us i reckon
We Want Nine alright – nine back from injury.
Trepidation don’t come close !
Hope to see you pre-match maestro π
Lester, he will but so did he when we played them at home last season and we were predicted to be subjected to a hammering by many. Maybe they will hammer us, but I would not be surprised if we won it.
Hey AL: one more pothole in Elstree now.
Geoff, my old mucker !
Just left you a message in the last set of drinks, dear boy, which was immediately superceded.
That’s why I write in the Daily Star, or whatever it’s called. They’re the only people who listen any more.
Sad faced-thingy, however the hell one does that sort of thing.
Anyways, off to bed now – gotta be well-rested for tomorrow π
TS – http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Arsenal-Thomas-Vermaelen-in-line-for-comeback-against-Manchester-United-article856016.html
π
Nice preview ‘Holic .
Can’t afford any passengers tomorrow , fancy boots or not .
Come on Arsenal !
i like your spirit Lars – am hoping to wake up tomorrow feeling more like it meself. Sure i will as soon as i get within range of the ems/tollie and that tomorrow. Though – not sure if i’ve mentioned it – but no Artetetetetaaaa! there to settle the boys nerves and get the team ticking over is really bothering me
Hansen on MOTD ” Liverpool have been outstanding all season ” .
What ?!
Left out of the main article any mention of Dean being the ref, seeing as how Arsene was at pains in his presser to avoid calling the cunt out for fear of affecting his decision-making further at the Grove.
I’ll just ask this though. How likely is it, do you think, that a straight referee could handle ten consecutive Arsenal games without us winning one?
We’re not talking Wigan or fucking Bolton here. We are talking Arsenal.
And you were doing 30mph you say Geoff – blimey! Don’t think i get up into double figures on mine. Still think that’ll all change when i get good enough at it to take the stabilizers orf
Tomorrow is not a day for faint hearts .
What we need is a rallying cry , a call to arms , and who better to deliver it , than our long-standing Chairman .
I believe this speech was delivered in the close season , but the sentiment remains apt .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZ_Xf2ydr2k
Behind The Arse !
im not sure about the guiness,,,,but i hope every1 der 2morrow will give the team 100% support for 90min,,not 83,,we got this!!!
More breaking injury news !!!
Arshavin looks short for Sunday π
Today’s results have taken a lot of the pressure off our game tomorrow. A defeat for Spurs in the early match and even a narrow defeat to Utd would arguably see us emerge from the weekend as one of the least damaged of the top 4 contenders.
Obviously, we should be looking to win every game, especially against the Mancs, but the quantity and focus of injuries currently being carried would see me happy with a point. The prospect of Nani and Valencia running at Djorou and an under-protected Miquel will give me little sleep tonight.
In taking a look at the opposition this evening it occurred to me that they’re currently at risk of losing Danny Welbeck, who has emerged as a first team regular this term, because they won’t pay him a similar amount to that which I believe to be Nic Bendtner’s current wage. Puts some of our transfer market woes in perspective – I believe we will remain hamstrung until that unruly wage bill is brought to heel.
Sadly, I will not be making the game itself as family commitments keep me away, but I will be hoping for a loud and supportive home crowd, regardless of the result. The away fans did us proud during the debacle at Old Trafford and it’s time for the home crowd to follow their fantastic lead.
COYRRR
‘holic @ 19 – maybe he’s won his bet and he can go on to do a decent job now
Toodle-pip Mr Hillwood.
May I kindly suggest you refrain from anything as strenuous as cycling, a cigar and fine whiskey I would think is more your kind of exercise.
Jolly dee and all that!
The junior’s toilet at Blackburn really does look a good little player and apparently his contract’s almost up – soooo – Chelski?
Good god Goodwillie sneaks one in
Cycling ?!?!?!
Have a look @15.
TV to start, TH to at least be in the squad.
‘Holic,
was it not Dean, egged on by Probert, who sent Arsene off at OT for kicking the bottle of water.
Say no more . . .
Re: Trev @23: Very interesting choice of words. Does Arshavin not look short for every Sunday? π
That was sort of the point 8ball – π
Re: Tabs @21: That rant sounded familiar somehow. π
Arshavin to run between two sets of defenders legs before scoring the winner tomorrow then?
Remember the Alamo!
Welcome back, 8 ball!! π
Great to see the chairman doing his bit tabs – all hands on deck – what!
AL
I think i’ve been singing thecfimpong song to the wrong tune! !!!:
You, of course, were going for the ying tong version. In my head i had the umpa lumpa song. Try it…….
or maybes the chairman’s more of an all hands to the pump type of a fellow along with his mate Wolfie – what!
Frimpong frimpong, he’s gonna get you,
Kick him in the face, and you’ll need a new shoe…
Here’s to another famous Arsenal triumph over adversity.
Courage mes braves.
Glenmorangie 10 year old all round barman.
Hope to see you in the Tollie, ‘Holic.
Lars @8 – heh , that sounds like one of Wolfie’s moves into the transfer market π
Trev @23 π π
N7 – Good points all .
8Ball @34 Maybe so π
here ’tis Catalan
http://youtu.be/qw0zZttfUaw
Frimpong Frimpong he’ll get you …
Catalan i think i can imagine Steve T’s spot of tying it to ‘ying tong’ being sung more readily by football fans. Though am prepared to be convinced otherwise
I shall be there sir.
Some things must never change.
Stability, and all that π
AL π The Chairman and Wolfie – The Odd Couple .
It’s all there tabs!
Purple being a favorite color of mine I am somewhat shocked to hear myself saying those boots are a bit too purple for my taste. Maybe it’s the glossy shine of my screen?
I say start with Ozyikap in the middle and the Ox on the left. The rest of the team to be left as is. It will give us creativity and lack of fear that you when AA and Rosicky play. Time to try something new!
Once again ‘holic your articles are the best written and most reasoned of all the Gunner blogs out there. Please keep up the good work. Have a bourbon and cola on me.
Tuesday Club: How come I am only finding out about this Podcast? Its hilarious! I hope that Holic thinks about a Podcast too: I can just see some of these ingrates doing quite well in the bar live (0;
It will be a sad day if the only positive from this weekend is that we wont get overtaken by Liverpool and Newcastle. Come of you gunners show some spirit!
Holic, I’ve decide to feast on every beautiful play our lads bring about tomorrow, not the results. When Kos leaps into the air heading a ball away from danger, a sight to behold. Song bossing the midfield, and the like. It’s why I love futbol and what it’s really all about for me.
Great post ‘Holic.
Snir @ 15, I keep on getting an error message when I try the link on my Blackberry’s Browser, but I can only assume that its good news for today π I can sleep easier now…
Realistic and honest post, as ever, ‘Holic.
Trev@23: boom! boom! It’s the way you tell ’em.
N7G@24: have to disagree. We have to take each and every chance to close the gap on the clubs ahead of us. It is going to be squeaky Speedos down to the wire for the CL places.
MK@51: spot on.
Wind – TH to start, TH to at least be in the squad. π
GT@50: a podcast featuring table dancing would certainly be novel.
Ned I think that Holic was thinking of you in particular when he called us ingrates – table dancing FFS! (0;
I recommend you Gooners all watch this before the game – it always works for me (0; http://youtu.be/x7-iFDyVb2c
This works pretty well too: http://youtu.be/sFOl-QXpLc4
Go on Arsene you make them pay: Bastards..
http://youtu.be/lRmmHPE8EvA
…well holics if these don’t stir you to battle then you are deader than a foddermucker…(0;
GT, Well I guess I’m a foddermucker, what ever the heck that is. I just dropped into say hi, couldn’t leave you hanging like that, all alone. Course now, I’m all alone. Shit.
Sorry I missed you ABB was trying to put my girls to bed. They are both in a play – two performances today – came home wired. Only 10 persons in the audience for the first…they needed calming down (0;
…also I often drink alone this time of night…me and Snir, CoR and the Americans..
Ahh GT, You’re a great guy. See ya in the morning.
GT – What’s up man, still awake π ?
I’m getting pumped for my ultimate sports day tomorrow…
Not only The Arsenal but the AFC championship with my beloved Pats…
Oh what a day it’s gonna be… So many games to watch.
Snir / ABB still up but fading fast…see you both later. Good luck with the Pats Snir
Snir, Arsenal or my beloved 49ers are bound to have a good day tomorrow, if not both of them, which would definitely make it a Super Sunday. I used to live in Baltimore but have no feeling for the Ravens so your Patriots have carte blanche to keep on winning right up to the point they face the Niners. But first things first. Come on Arsenal!!!!
Have to protect the flanks tomorrow or we could really be exposed. Should help with TV in…lets hope its true. The midfield really has to boss the game to get the link-up play rolling. COYR!!!!
I’m absolutely stunned that no one has taken any notice of the link I put about TV starting.
It’s as if he isn’t an improvement on Miquel?!
8ball, I assumed you were a Vikings fan, living in Minnesota and all…
GT@58: I may have been called many things in my time, but ingrate doesn’t feature prominently in that particular cannon. I am extremely grateful for the company and good cheer of all in this bar, and particularly of our inestimable landlord.
SG@71: Official web site says:
Team news:
Arsenal: Henry (doubt β calf), Vermaelen (doubt β calf), Arteta (calf), Santos (ankle), Sagna (ankle), Wilshere (ankle), Jenkinson (back), Coquelin (hamstring), Gibbs (groin).
That may be the propaganda dept doing its thing. I hope you are right about TV, though.
Snir, It seems to be a case of once a Californian, always a Californian, or you are what you smoke and/or organically ingest. π
bt8b: Beloved 49ers? Say it ain’t so. Giants and Gooners are the Sunday double.
I’d settle for a 6 point swing to the Arsenal. π
With you there, bt8b
SC says it is a weekend for the G-men.
NBN: Speaking personally now, I wouldn’t trust any team that plays on fake grass, as the Giants do. If you can’t smoke it do you really want to have your team playing on it??
NBN – I said in the last post that despite AW all but ruling out TV and TH I have a gut feeling that it’s AW’s version of psychological mind games with SAF and that both will play.
Giants?!? Disappointed man, next thing you’re gonna say is that you’re a Yankees fan…
8ball – for some reason I thought you were originally from Minnesota.
Snir, No but Paul Bunyan was originally from Minnesota and his gigantic girth and height he could be the solution for Arsenal in defending set pieces.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9e/Akeley-Minnesota-Paul-Bunyan.jpg/200px-Akeley-Minnesota-Paul-Bunyan.jpg
Bunyan was born in Maine, he’s a New Englander through and through… π
We could use him as a safety cause our secondary sucks π
Ned @ 72: I was including myself in the ingrate column, along with TABs, Trev, Geoff and all the other freedom fighters…
12:57 AM Jamaican time and signing out…
Only 9 pints. That is only just over the sociable gallon mark. And there was me thinking you were up for a proper session? π
Not sure what to feel about today to be honest. I will reserve full judgement until I see who we manage to wheel out.
Up the Gunners.
My crystal ball being as murky as ever the Matt pound will go with Song scoring a splendid goal since he’s a bit overdue.
Otherwise I’m with arsabeatbarca hoping to enjoy a good go from the lads.
All the best to the lucky ones at the Grove tomorrow!
Come on the Arsenal!!!!
Is it a bit too early?
My crystal ball says that the Arsenal forwards will be lining up to score their chances and the Manc cunts will suffer injuries to their best players (including Dean).
Come on Arsenal!
Chucklelicious
http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/35rn71/
Cannons. You said forwards. Surely you just meant forward.
As Connor McCloud said in Highlander. “There is only one.”
have a bad feeling abt this game. only hope is if manu looks at our team and eases off. and no chance of that happening.
need a team performance if we are to salvage anything from this game.
lets hope.
LMAO at the title and joke hehe, classic…yes lotsa pints will be the order if we get dicked again.
Cheers ‘holic. Have a great day out and up the arse!
Cheers Esso.
Morning all. TaBS, classic maestro, pure classic π
Morning all.
The only good thing about these late sunday kick-offs is I can have a lazy morning.
See, I’m still at home.
Right, I’m off, I will not see that century, but the history books might recall that I picked the ball and rolled it to the right-back, John Lukic-style.
A young lee dixon lookalike takes possession……
OK, time to get into the shower and then down to Brixton Station.The Tollie around 2.30?
Nudges it on in H-Ollie’s name, the lucky O-man, love it!
He’s flukily nutmegged the defender and without looking up rolls the ball to his left
The silver ghost arrives unnoticed at the back stick and heads downward…
Apologies BtM, I may be a mess by then π
Today , I shall mostly be drinking Guinness , eating fingernails , and abusing Mancunian hoodies .
8Ball @79 – If you can’t smoke it , who cares what you do with it ! π
GoonerTerry @83 – What are we fighting for again ? π
Cheers Holic @93 , that was a good half a day’s work π
Feeling a little more optimistic than I have done all week . After all We’re great , and they’re sh*t right !?
Good luck everybody , wherever you be watching .
Off to get a gutbuster , prior to ‘Holic’s death by Guinness in the Tollie .
COME ON THE ARSENAL !!!!
He got his head on the end it! Well in ‘holic – a decent portent surely.
Nice century Guv’nor !!
A good omen I feel .
Morning AL , portent ? omen ? Great minds I feel !
there should’ve been an “of” in there somewhere
CoMonUPropeReDS!
Loud guitars on the headphones at eleven. Trust me, it is the way forward.
‘appen tabs – afore they get a little befuddled later, ay?
Have a good build up old chap and see you in the boozer anon
tabs@21: now THAT is a fucking rallying cry! Brilliant stuff. And like 8ball, I do find it familiar, but it is just as brilliant nonetheless!
Trev@23: heh!
N7@24: this time, I don’t think I’d take the one point if offered it now. Nil or one point wouldn’t make that much of a difference, but a win could potentially be massive. I hope Snir is right and that TV will play, that will give us a boost.
Terry@50: The Tuesday Club is almost always brilliant. They did it under the name “Up For Grabs Now” for about a year and then it became The Tuesday Club about a year ago. All the Tuesday Club episodes are on iTunes, and the Up For Grabs ones can still be found online although not on iTunes anymore.
And the Barman himself grabs the century! Well in, ‘Holic – I take that as a sign of a good result to come for the Arsenal this afternoon!
Jealous of all of you who will be at the Tollie and then at the stadium today. I have to find a way to move Stockholm closer to London so I can attend more games! I am sure you will all have a great day, let’s hope it is made even better by great footballing results as well.
Come on the Arsenal!!!!!!!
That’s the second time today
Morning all!
Incredibly fired-up for today. I’m with The Barman. So long as I see our depleted team play with their hearts today, and I firmly believe that they will, then I’ll go a home a happy bunny. I think it will be a really good game and I also believe that the crowd will be magnificent. Bring it on!!!
Tabs @ #21 – You immortalised yourself on YouTube. Magnificent. Had me in tears again. Worth a gallon of Guinness on its own. See you later…
Lars @ #6 – Cheers. Always good having a bit of fun to calm the nerves before a massive game. Hope you and The Stockholm Massive enjoy the match today.
BtM – Yes, I’ll be there around ‘dentist time’ too.
Snir @ #15 – I shall enjoy dining on my words if that brilliant news is confirmed. No other official confirmation yet of TV’s return to the team.
Looking forward to seeing some of you regulars later and a new face or two down The Tollie.
COYRRRs!!! UTA!!!
Greetings Holics
There seems to be positive news on TV5 and TH12 so I leave for the station in optimistic mood.
Federer won this morning at the Aussi Open and when he wins on the same day as we have a fixture we also win! The omens are good and I look forward to seeing/hearing from you all at the Ems.
Happy Drinking , as always COYRs
As a hardened pessimist I have a strange good feeling about today’s game.
And it looks like a renaissance transfer for this guy in Spain. It’s worth a look.
http://www.101greatgoals.com/gvideos/wellington-silva-performance-vs-almeria/
Come on the Arsenal!
‘holic@100 GOOOOOOAAAAAAALLLLLLLLL
Great downward header, reminscient of Radford in his prime.
TS@111: I’m with you, I want to see every player giving EVERYTHING today. If there is a player to be closed down I want to see it done 100%, nothing less is acceptable.
Good portents all round then: tabs, AL, Delia, lurky o
I’ll join them….
Morning all,
GoonerTerry @83 – me, an ingrate ?? Why so ?
TS, Tabs – i’ll keep an eye out down the Isledon Road, heading for the Tollie Brolly at about 2.30 myself.
Delia – glad you finally found something with which to positively charge yourself – matron !
Wolfie does a good line in such appliances – they get him in fine voice on match-days π
Splendid Trev
Splendid Trev but when you find us will you promise to pop it back in?
I don’t think people not showing for the ball is the problem with Ramsey. They show plenty, he’s just far too slow to give it and prefers sideways to forward. The new Butch Wilkins.
tabs, Holic, Professor, Ollie, Trev, BtM, AL, top man Snowy, Geoff – have fun.
Oh, and enjoy the match too. π
Well would you look at that @ 100, the Silver Ghost, good to his name, ghosting in out of nowhere to plant his sweet bonce on the ball, what a goal π
This speaks well for Arsenal Football Club today it does π Especially when combined with such beautiful but deadly skills displayed by AL for the assist, Theo, get your pen and paper! Alex, you can just look back and smirk π
Cheers Zico – shame you won’t be there too.
Probably not a bad thing for your cleaning bill though, what with Laster being there.
Old clothes everybody ! π
*Lester* even
Heh, Trev.
If he bumps into, remember, he doesn’t do things by half π
*bumps into you*
zico, as you and I both witnessed with our own eyes at the Tollie, Trev doesn’t do things by half either anymore!
Time for a shower and then off to the pub in a bit – COME ON ARSENAL!
You know it’s going to be bad when he apologises in advance
Cheers Dr.z, it won’t be the same without you buddy.
Snir: TV in squad. Great news. Words will taste good, so long as he gets thru’ the game (assuming he plays a part in it) unscathed.
UTA!
Afternoon Holics
I’m hoping the boys will us us proud today! For those who went to the game please have a great time and shout for me too I will be doing the same from my local pub!
Come on you Almighty Reds!
Big game today lads!
Right i’m off – hope to be spilling through the tollie door at 2.30ish…
Cut to 2.30 – ‘mind yer baks, clumsy fuk with pints acomin’ thru – Zico, where’s Zico?’
Good luk all!
COMONUREEEEEDDDDDDSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
O2TC to start? Can anyone confirm?
Cheers & UTA!!!
Nasri just did us a favor, way to go son!
I won’t thank him for hardly anything, but a high scoring draw will do me. Dare I say a slim City win?
The Ox confirmed to start, as is TV. Great shout Snr.
Come on lads – let’s give this lot a shoeing.
Let’s see what Ox in the Box does!
And I don’t believe I am saying this, but Man City! What a finish to the match, and as long as Spuds go back to the swamp with zero points I am happy!
I hope this is the turning point in Spurs’ season π
Sp*rs sent back to marshland with ZERO points….
Come on Arsenal !
yes, Spuds got smashed!!!
Balotelli shouldn’t of been on the pitch, and he is a dirty cunt, but we have a golden chance to leave the Mugmashers and the Magpies behind, and claw back ground on the Posh Lot and the LWC.
UTA!
N7 Gooner @ 136, I almost don’t believe that the Ox starts against United. Come on lad, do us proud on the left wing π
TH misses out but get this…
OX starts on the left…
Saved him for the best?
SG and bt8b @earlier: not really a huge fan of any major league sport, but have more connections to NYC than SF. That said, for reasons too complicated to explain, my MLB team is the White Sox.
Sorry N7, didn’t see you there…
Have to say I’m rather disappointed TH misses out.
What adds piquancy to the Spuds defeat is that Balotelli should have already have been off the field for the stamp on Parker earlier. And you know Webb wouldn’t have given that penalty if it had been the other way round, a Spurs forward tackled by a Citeh defender.
TaBS
Just witnessed PHW’s rant / broadcast.
Buy yourself a Guinness…. π
Actually, get one in for everyone you’re with right now. I’ll pay you back.,…
I’m with Catalan tabs, amazing stuff π
Seems Theo and The Ox together is not working ‘holics.
Or Theo is not working, to be more succinct…
Nice save Wozzer
Song’s having a nightmare..
Why is JD marking two of them?
Dear Arsenal midfielders.
Our wingers are fast. Just a hint…
Wow. Mertersacker is very slow. Djourou is exposed big time he can’t run.. we are playing like the away team and too slow to counter attack
Rafael doesn’t like being passed -now on a yellow
Oh dear – wot defence 0-1
I’m honesty disappointed.
Have to say TV is having a very rough time against Valencia regardless of the goal.
what a soft goal everyone can see where that ball was going except our defenders of course. Djourou is really having a nightmare. Nani and Evra enjoying theselves down his side.
My drinks don’t show up for some reason?
I’ll start second half without Ramsey, Walcott and Djorou. We’ ll be better without, even if no one supstitutes them. Enough is enough.
I don’t have a problem with JD actually, the midfield has to come into the game to support the fullbacks and RVP or he wont get get a kick…..and Theo, Theo, please don’t lose your wit when you are on the ball, ffs.
We need to sort thi9ngs out at half time – on the plus side we’re only one down. We’ve offered nothing going forward since about the 10th minute of the game. Where is the Alex Song who looked so great earlier in the season?
We may as well give Arshavin 35 in place of Walcott – I don’t know why but Theo just doesn’t look interested to me. Man Utd aren’t a great side and we’re looking so ordinary…
united are so much better than us its an embarrassment. they are doing as they please and they are missing lots of players too. what is wenger doing ?
Arteta is the biggest miss so far.
Rosicky doesn’t have the same understanding with AR and Song, and those two are playing in standing pace.
We do miss Arteta….I’d sooner see a midfield of Arteta, Coq and Rosicky at present…
Good call bringing on Nico
If he goes down we are in deep doo-doo
Wtf
oh Robin how could you!!!!
he scores when he wants
Stats so far we are 56%, and 7 shots to 5, but its goals we want COYRRR
Cue panic buying tomorrow…
Ox is our best player so far
extremly slow Mertasacker but made up for it his long legs
BFG recovers well
Park’s coming on?!
I don’t believe it.
Yesssswsssssss RVP but why isnt it 2-1
Kos. You God
WWWWWWHHHOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!
Why is the OX coming off?
Why oh why AA for the OX
Kos. Not-yet-legend-but-might-well-go-on-to-be!
Fucking. Shit. Decision. Arsene
Arsene, ridiculous substitution.
why sub the OX? unbelievable decision
Immediately deflates the crowd. Masterstroke.
the OX looks still full of energy, why?
Not Park again
AA strikes again for Manure
Arsene really doesn’t make it easy for himself. Or us.
WTF Wenger did, subbed of our best player. Nice one.
thank you Andrey
I am so so so fed up of AA playing for us. Never again
Play ourselves back into it. Get on a roll. Get the equaliser. Crowd behind you.
Take off your best player for a chronic underperformer.
Immediately lose initiative. And proceed to do nothing apart from fail to defend by said underperformer.
Genius. This time I’m with the boo boys.
Mike Dean got hit tail up now
seriously…fuck off Mike Dean
Surely that’s time up for the Russian?
He looks mentally somewhere else. Other players have busted guts today and his showing for that goal was woeful. I don’t care what his stats say, he’s had too many chances now.
Kos and OX were awsome today
is it a surprise since Ox went out we dropped ?
The game was there to be won. Nice decision Arsene.
I don’t want to say it but…WTF Arsene??!!!
I must say I have no fucking clue why that substitution was made. No fucking clue. It was probably done for a good reason, Wenger usually never does anything without a reason. So I won’t hang him for it. Yet. But I’d really really really love to hear that reason…
And I agree with GoonerTerry. I don’t want to say it but fuck it that’s how I feel.
I’m going now. Don’t want to say anything that I may regret later. But not happy. Not happy at all.
Do you think he can’t tell Walcott apart from OX? It happens (0;
Oh, ok – one more. Arshavin is a total waste of space. Get rid.
All the hard work from September to December undone in 3 league games.
Something’s got to give…
Still been reading but not posting.
But if it is good enough for RVP then it is good enough for me.
NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
Why is he called Le Prof?
I am usually the last person to question to manager but that has to be the worst substitution ever. The team had just got back in the game with momentum to push on and you take your best player in the game off!? He probably went into game with the understanding that the OX would only get 70 or so min on his debut start, but can’t you change the plan in game? Giggs at 40 or so played the entire 90, and 18 year old can’t do the same if really asked to!? Ok rant over.
Fergie will be ever gateful for Wenger’s generosity. he must’ve giggled seeing Arshavin coming on for OX. what was the point of that substitution?
That’s what you call an ‘efficient’ sub!
No sense uttering a word about 4th until we win three in a row. I don’t care what Chelsea, Liverpool and Spurs do until we win three EPL games in a row. Full stop.
we are just not good enough. united are the champions and (i think) will prob go on to win it again . if they had a midfield they would be clear of the field. so no disgrace in getting beaten but only guts kept us in it for 20 mins. in terms of ability they were streets ahead of us – only kos and ox turned up or are prob worth keeping. walcott, jd, ramsey, AA, just go. BFG tried hard but his pace will always be an issue. if we get 4th (or indeed 5th) its an indictment on rest of the league, we are mid table at best.
I’ll say this again.
I can not stand Andrey Arshavin.
He wasn’t at fault for the goal cause Valencia was giving anybody up against him a torrid time including TV but just his presence in the squad make him the first substitution and it has to stop.
Ox is ready for PL action, more ready than Theo ever was and ever will be. Never in his life will Theo thread a pass so clever like Ox did for the goal.
Please Arsene, just sell AA already.
good spot Draped – it wasn’t only the fans gobsmacked…..
Agreed CG what does AW see in him? He just stood there…but where was Vermaelen anyway? You can’t go forward leaving Arshavin behind you!!
1. It felt like we didn’t play on our home turf we got scared of United yet again bla bla bla….
2. Those missed go begging
Not happy one bit as for Arshavin well lets play him from a start now he makes such a big fucking difference !
It’s not Mike Dean’s fault this time, it’s Wenger’s. Djourou is not a full back and that sub was a brave one, and correct one, Yennaris is much more better RB then Djourou. Cant’ wait to see Wilshere instead of Ramsey, and Gervais with the OX on the flanks.
GoonerTerry- might he thought Ox was Walcott
@208, with you all the way on that one….the OX at 70 minutes still has more pace and power than ‘Farce’avin. Really hope the Ox didn’t come off because of an injury.
TV had a torrid time against Valencia but to be fair to him, he ain’t a LB and Valencia is a tough player.
Our FBs haven’t been able to deal with United wingers since Lauren and Cole.
I don’t blame AA for the goal, I blame him for his presence in the squad. AW automatically picks him as first substitution.
lurky
if yennaris is much better than DKJ then why the f- has DJ been allowed to stand back and watch swansea dn united piss all over him ?
Just as gutted and furious as the rest of you. Trying not to cuss here, but Holic what the fuck was Wenger thinking when he took off the OX…Jesus, Mary, and Joseph!!! I won’t change my mind about this one, Wenger made a big ass mistake.
221 – Because Wenger hasn’t the first clue anymore??
I’m done defending Andrey Arshavin, its time for him to move on, along with Djourjou, for their’s and the club’s sake. :/
hate Barca – Wenger does not trust youngsters anymore, “project youngsters” failed and now he seems keen on older players even if they are shit
CG
Was really very pleased to see RVP’s reaction as his astonishment means a hell of a lot more than ours, first signs that the players have lost faith in Arsene maybe?
(Not counting all those players who show up and just cannot be arsed)
The substitution today and the inclusion of Santos in the squad vs. Olympiacos are freaking mind-boggling decisions that I just can’t get my arms around.
AW – You have to sell at least one player to register TH in the PL.
Please sell AA, I’d prefer it if Squillaci would stay. I just can’t stand the sight of AA.
Not because of him, but because of you, because I know you’ll pick him!!!
Serioulsy, can anyone think of a logical explanation for Oxlade being taken off for Arshavin?
Why not bring Arshavin on for walcott at least? Or better yet leave things as they fucking are!!!
Am I the only one here who thinks that the Ox can match Messi in 2-3 years. Fast, exellent dribling skill, great shooting abilities, accurate passing, strong on the ground duels, strong on aerial duels, vision. And Wenger subbed him of. I feel 10 years of my life shorter with that sub.
from the guardian
“It would be disingenuous to say that Oxlade-Chamberlain would have defended better than Arshavin though. His defensive work during his time on the pitch was more or less non-existent. “The problem isn’t Arshavin,” says Christopher Price. “It’s defensive communication. For the first goal Djorou was directed to defend Giggs but he didn’t make a move until Giggs approached the box and then played like Giggs was going to dribble against him. For the second Arshavin stayed with Valencia when he should have had assistance from the right back. However Vermalaen is a Gooner hero while Arshavin isn’t, so the winger is the one who gets the blame.””
he has a point AA has been rubbish but where was TV ?
Sad truth is that we are a little bit short. Short in squad depth, short in consistency, short in goal scoring. We could have won that; should at least have had a draw.
As for the substitution, this was a time when AW should have let his heart rule his head. The Ox was on song. The game was a must win. We all know the reason he was taken off but giving him 20 minutes more in those circumstances wouldn’t have broken him in half. We looked a lot less incisive once he was gone. AA’s failure to clear for the second goal only compounded the error.
This arshevin is a non sense , who brought him in to replace ox ???
lets\ wait and see ,he might explain the substitution better.OX looked fine to me, in fact he was the only one with any gas in the tank the rest were too slow. but lets see what Wenger has to say about it
Ox should start every game for the rest of the season. End of.
Question: I think the most oft repeated line from the Arsenal squad including the manager has got to be “We need to learn from our mistakes.” Then why please tell me are we unable to control the tempo of the games for even 5 minutes after equalizing.
I am so pissed off at our lack of concentration just after equalizing. It is worse than a kick in the nutsack to cut down the celebration of our goal midway coz the other team has regained the lead.
As for the substitution, although the winning goal may possibly have been conceded with the AOC on the pitch, but it did seriously deflate the crowd and the team. Would love to hear the logic behind this “masterstroke”.
Three games in a row that i have the “should have taken atleast a point from that game” feeling.I feel like crap.
COYG.
lurky
oh for god’s sake, lets stop snatching at shadows of straws. we have been here so many times before. cesc, TH, LJW, ramsey, walcott, and now OX. we play like shit and rather than try and sort it out we pretend we have found the next big thing. cesc and th went to barca and were really no more than squad players. ramsey is clearly pants as is walcott *(he has played over 200 games for us – when do we learn ?) LJW looks very good but has had one season. ox has had one – ONE ! – game . evra if he was half as good as messi who is he going to pass to ? we need a team. a TEAM
I am loathed to crucify Le Boss for his loyalty to his players…but I think that this trait is getting in the way of his good judgment. Yes he wants to show support to Walcott and AA – I understand that. But they are both struggling at the moment. He is also too unmovable when it comes to changing tactics during games. Yes he had planned to take the OX off before the goal. But in heavens name, after THAT pass, and the equalizer, surly everybody knows that any un-forced changes will affect momentum…EVERYBODY. I know that!! And I am no fucking genius…so how come the Boss had such a brain fart?
He will say what he will say , he always has hundreds and one excuses and arguments , but to replace ox with arshevin must be an act of an idiot , not a genius
Park made a run into the box so TV covered him…AA just had to keep his wit and we probably would have been okay. The story here today was the midfield play..they ran us off the pitch in the first half. Better for us on the 2nd half but chasing the game isn’t easy to do.
Think Manu will force Wenger to rethink the transfer dealings for the second time this season??
I meant will Wenger change his views regarding the sale of AA23, coz surely the boo boys will be on his back from now on?
Btw, it wasn’t the failure to deal with Valencia that AA should be critised for, and TV was, as others have noted, MIA, but AA should have done better than toe-poke the ball to Welbeck to smash home the second goal. TV also got beaten to the ball by Valencia for the first goal, while we are berating him.
Kos was outstanding today. Mertesecker was much better than some in the bar are saying. Yennaris did well. Song and Ramsey adjusted better to Arteta’s absence than they did at Swansea.
NTN
ramsey was awful and song was poor. as i said before BTG did ok today but his lack of pace is a huge issue in any long term plans.
AA should have not come on the pitch today, if Wenger thought he deserved a game the he should have taken Walcott off an kept the OX on. Walcott has been poor all season and so has AA………..both need to be sold, also Djourou needs to go as well, i’m so nervous when he plays, he is sooooo clueless. He was at fault for the 1st goal he gave Giggs all the ime in the world to place his cross, i am so fed up with AW and the board, they do not care about the fans.
IHB, my point was that Ox has quallity, nothing more. It’s not ONE game btw, a saw the kid as many times as he had played for the Arsenal and for England 21’s actually (he scored 4 goals on one game if I’m right). I beleive my eyes and experience when I see a player, and when I see him I see quallity. We play like shit as a team, I agree, and I’ll let Wenger to have sleepless nights and fix that, but in Ox we have hell of a player, trust me.
I thought second half we played really well..despite all the doom
Agree regarding Mertesacker. I think he was really good covering the space behind Djourou and Yennaris. Lacks pace but more than makes-up for that will his positional awareness,experience and calming effect.
NBN @ 242 Kos was outstanding, today? Mate he is ALWAYS outstanding, our most consistent player this year, period.
Wenger Press Conference:
Wenger: “I am really disappointed. Se were nervous in the first half, but we came back well with a fantastic fighting spirit.”
Wenger: “United are a bit more mature than us. To battle like we did and come out with nothing is tough to take.”
Wenger: “I can understand the fans were upset about the substitution, especially when it doesn’t work. He had started to fatigue.”
Wenger: “People pay for their tickets and are free to express their emotions. It doesn’t mean they are right always.”
Wenger: “I have to stand up for the substitutions I make. I don’t have to explain every single decision.”
Wenger: “We lose together and win together. I will not blame one player. If I make a mistake I am sorry.”
Wenger: “It leaves us in a difficult position, because we couldn’t afford to lose. But there are a lot of positives, too.”
Wenger: “The referee had a fair game and we had a nervous first half, biut in the second half we played our game. We weren’t rewarded.”
Rosicky too was immense today, especially in the second half.
Wenger: “We need out injured players back.”
Mertesacker’s goal line clearance showed his experience and value. A lot of centre-backs would just have given up in those circumstances once the forward had gotten away from them.
ABB@248: spot on.
Did Wenger actually sad I’am sorry?
Don’t wanna moan or anything like that but I believe Daglish was correct to say in public that if his players think they can just turn up they have another thing coming. Wenger is too protective of those under performers!
Andrey the new hate figure? How is it his fault we lost. The Ox had a cramp apparantly. AA is a luxury player who is at times brilliant and frustrating but still will pick a pass and create something. Am completely in agreement with steve t on many posts in that quality is what is missing. 3 on the bounce..AA is not the fault for that. Am not moaning as I love Arsenal whatever and will be singing my head off at Blackburn but no scapegoats please we are just a little bit poo at the moment. And booing at the ground..No sir that just wrong. Lovethis blog by the way..
Well that’s that then!!
The game was there to be taken at 1-1. We created more chances than them in the second half and took the game to them. Kos was solid. Rosicky positive. Ramsey was off today but improved in the second and so did Song. Oxlade was excellent
Onwards and upwards. Hope we make top four. Really do. Otherwise, it would be really bad for the club and also Arsene could be gone
I hate barca @ 236 LJW and the OX are our future. The raw talent these 2 possess is phenomenal and it can’t be taught. Either you’ve got it or you don’t. Trust me, they’re the real deal.
Noel73 who told you he had a cramp?
Noel73
I agree with you Arshavin should not be made a scapegoat however he has been off form for far too long for my liking and to be frank for a player of as you say such luxury I have not seen any of it for at least a year!
Arthur its apparantly what Arsene said post match and for all that his sub of Yenaris for Djourou had much more of an impact i.m.o. Good sub Bad sub…such are the joys of managing a team like Arsenal. I cant be down on them at the moment..its backs against wall time..
Wish me luck, time to call my Manc supporting brother (lives in Berkshire of course) !!
I just felt sorry for Arshavin when I watched his substitution on repeat. He just needs to go on, this is not his place, nor his league.
http://arsenalist.com/video/?id=xnwuw8
Arshavin is still our record signing, I believe. If you can’t get much more than ten or fifteen minute cameos from someone like that, and those cameos are dreadful, he should be shipped out.
He’s been dreadful since his initial brilliance when he first arrived. Done nothing since that first four months or so of any note except get out breath. Sitting down.
Ned @ 253 Oh Ned, Yes the Kos gave it everything he had and then some. What a shame, cause it need not have turned out like it did. Once we get Arteta, Bac, LJW back we will turn the corner again. AA must go and Theo will warm up the bench. Of course Gervinho will be back soon too. Lots to look forward to, but believe it or not, I’ve got tears in my eyes right now. Sorry.
On the train home. I am completely shell shocked. Apart from all of the obvious mentioned above, what really gets me is that that is probably the worst manc side I have seen in years. I really do not know what else to add that I have not been banging on about for the last 3 years.
First time I have really seen the crowd turn on the manager like that. It could get very ugly very soon.
ABB
I feel for you mate but I get into it with too many emotions but I love this club till I die simple π lets drink to that?
Can someone also explain to me Shezza’s positional thoughts for their second goal? Am I the only one who thought he was in no man’s land?
Fin good luck!
Thank fuck the Spuds lost!!!!
Cheers Webby. π
What’s gonna take for someone, anyone, at Arsenal FC to shout: “Enough is enough!”
We’re possibly looking at the five easy pieces in our net at San Siro. Milan is playing great football these days. This lot of players are dead and buried. Mentally, anyway…
Maybe Arsene should knock back a bottle of Jack tonight. Hangover could provide answers to some hard questions.
Me, I’m goin’ for a shot of Jim Beam and a bottle of Bud. I’m feelin’ hopperish.
Steve T
How can defenders allow such play in your own box?
@270, Spuds are long gone, we’ll never catch them. We have to quit worrying what everyone else does and just worry about three points each week. I can’t even worry about 4th until we get 9 points from three matches.
Thanks for the Spud League countdown clock ‘olic
It always makes me smile, when skys are grey.
Steve – I agree.
He’s had 3 straight shockers in the league.
I don’t know Arthur. It looked a Fucking shambles to me. But I include Shezza as part of that. I have no idea why he was where he was. Not seen it on Tele yet so by all means correct me if I am wrong.
@ 263 lurky oliva
I think Robin’s face and body language said it all. This game was winnable.
Ox worked and ran at the defenders Arshavin’s passes were as if he was cross eyed.
Steve, Szczesny took a step out to face Valencia (if he hadn’t, Valencia would have had more or less the whole goal to aim at and could have just poked it into the net), but then Arshavin poked the ball to Welbeck or whatever ManU cunt it was and that was that. We also have to ask why Welbeck was allowed to stand there on his own when we had several of our own around him.
I am genuinely surprised that people didn’t realize that the Ox was taken off because he was tired. For those of us watching on tv, they zoomed in on him a few minutes after being subbed and he was still huffing and panting. He had clearly worked himself completely out of breath.
And I notice that only one person (Noel73) has acknowledged that Arsene actually took off Djourou at half-time because he was hopelessly out of touch with what a full-back should do. We desperately need our proper full-backs back, and I am pretty sure we’ll see Yennaris start the next game unless Bac is fit again.
We did NOT lose this game because of a bad sub by Arsene. The Ox was tired, and Arshavin was pretty much our only option. The alternative would have been a 4-4-2 with Rosicky out wide and Park up top but Rosicky was needed centrally.
This loss stings, but the real mistakes were NOT made today. Let’s try to keep our heads cool, we knew right from the start of the season that getting into the top-four would be massively difficult. It still is, but the female who is in need of a gastric bypass has only started to warm up her vocal chords.
I’m with u Gedo@227. I hate criticizing AW but playing Santos against Olympiacos and today’s genius substitution must be two of the worst decisions he’s made throughout his tenure. The skipper’s reaction to the substitution spoke a million words. Wow!!!
This is what AW had to say.
‘I can understand that the fans are upset about the substitution, especially when it doesn’t work, but he (Oxlade-Chamberlain) had started to fatigue,’
‘He was sick in the week. Arshavin is captain of the Russia national team.
‘You have an 18-year-old kid making his first Premier League start and a player who’s captain of his country and they are querying the substitution? Let’s be serious.
‘I’ve been a manager for 30 years and have made 50,000 substitutions. I do not have to justify every decision I make to you (the Press). I stand up for it.’
I still don’t accept it. A sick Ox is better than this season’s AA.
Heads are cool but when Arsenal have to bring on a 1.5m Korean to change our biggest game of the season we know we have fucked up. We are better than that and I fully expect things to change in the summer. Now its just pull back and gather ranks..
Lars. The Ox on one leg is a better option than Arshavin. You are the first person so.far that thinks it was right to make that change. And that includes 60,000 at the ground.
Giggs was huffing and panting his way to victory, and he is 38 years old. Don’t believe it for a second, sorry.
Snir, if the OX was completely out of breath he would have been of no use to us anyway.
I think the anger should be directed much more towards Arshavin who does not seem to give a fuck about even trying to repay the faith shown in him by the manager.
“He started to stretch his calf and he had given a lot, he is not used to that intensity.”
Add that to my @280.
Still, I would have had him carry on for 15 minutes and not bring on AA.
Just like Steve T said – Ox on one leg is better than AA.
Steve T @ 266: I completely understand the reaction of the crowd (and RvP) but their reaction gave United a boost just when we were pinning them backwards. Its those boos – plus the fact that we turned off during Nani’s injury – that put a spring in Valencia’s step and gave him the confidence to drive into the box and take our players on…when are we going to have players like that: ones who attack the defenders and get into the box…AND take a fucking chance!!
I thought we had a very improved 2nd half…but all that was undone by a single brain fart IMO.
Ramsey has got to be the slowest attacking midfield player I have ever seen, he makes Cesc seem like Bolt.
Imo he needs to sit like Alonso does and not be turned into Steven Gerrard.
Lars – I disagree because even if he was tired or something, he still would have tried harder than AA.
Steve, as I said to Snir: a completely tired Ox would have been of no use to us anyway. Again, a good while after being subbed he was still huffing and panting on the bench. I see no reason to believe that he had not run himself into the ground.
Again, the situation is difficult but the real mistakes were NOT made today.
AA normally does one piece of matchwinning magic in 90mins, even when he plays shit,.
Should have been Theo off not OC though.
Re: Ramsey, coming back from a serious injury takes at least one year to get back to form. It is like that in all sports. I know he can play 90 minutes and so forth. I don’t fault him for giving his all, it’s just that we shouldn’t rely on him as much given the time it takes to get the body back to where it was. Just my two cents on him.
Lars – like I said, I still think a spent Ox is a better option than this season’s AA.
Steve T
To be honest with you it started of Arshavin then Valencia was allowed to go in inside the box on the left, pass it to Park if I’m not mistaken then receive the pass back then pass it backwards and perhaps Wojtek should have stayed on the line for the shot but it was all to easy for my liking as you describe it:
SHAMBLES indeed!
Come summer Van Persie will be on his way and few others because it seems our club is loosing integrity for being involved at the top year in year out and somehow Arsene is making it happened. He chooses his players, he motivates them too he also makes the calls on who to buy and who to play.
Today showed fans had enough of those inconsistent decisions and wrong doings.
People say Arshavin is a scape goat however when you compare Theo (who hasn’t been great lately) and Ramsey (who makes teh wrong calls) at least for those two they try and it does really show that they are trying to make a difference.
Apologies if this won’t make any sense but mt detox came to a crash not during the game but certainly after it!
Seeing is believing and I have not seen enough to believe we could even push for 4th and quite frankly we don’t deserve it!
Love ya Lars, but every player on the pitch was gassed given the pace of the game in the second half. Did you see Kos’ face, completely and utterly gassed.
Just drowned my sorrows as I was reading the drinks…
Non-alcoholically of course.
But I just don’t know what to say, if the Ox actually was tired/had cramp then Wenger can’t be blamed cos Arshavin was the only person who could come off the bench in that position but then what does it say about our club’s current predicament that we’re relying on a 18 year old in his 1st season for the club on his 1st PL home start to produce the goods needed?
Dire straits indeed, St Tottingham’s Day might have to be forgotten about so we can bank that 4th place, its not beyond us but we have a few difficult games ahead, most noticably Milan away at the San Siro after Tottenham at home, the latter which will most probably decided whether St Tottingham Day occurs at all.
Give me Strength, its Squeaky Bum Time indeed.
Snir@292: that is only speculation on your part. A tired Oxlade would, for example, most likely not have defended any better than Arshavin for their goal.
Players are not the only ones who need to wake up but Arsene himself otherwise as much as I’m on the AKB ship things may indeed turn very ugly come summer.
You know sports is unforgiving – much like life itself I suppose. When you are down you get kicked in the bollox – a LOT! We often hear that we make our own luck. But the opposite is also true as well. We can also aid & assist in our own downfall – The Manager is under extreme pressure (look at us?! I am a basket case right now) and he is naturally a cautious bloke at the best of times, so I understand his precaution if he feels that the OX is on the edge of pulling up with a strain. We have a lot of important games he is thinking…I don’t want to start losing my offensive players just when I am about to get back my defenders…but crikey Arsene, you are surely jinxed at the moment. No luck at all and the football gods do not give a shit. And the supporters are about to lynch you. Maybe its time to consider moving up stairs..for the health of all of us )0;
Lars – I have no problem with the defensive aspect of the sub but from an offensive standpoint I think Ox is a better option than this season’s AA no matter what condition the Ox is in.
Fuck it take that you bum!
That wasss for Old Red Nose not my beloved Arsene. Tears in my eyes too ABB…
Snir, yes – you think he is better. But we will never have a clear and definitive answer to that. And also, the more tired you are the greater the risk of injury. Can you imagine the uproar if he had pulled a muscle and put himself out for six weeks and Arsene then said that he knew he was tired but took a gamble?Β΄
Once more, the real mistakes were NOT made today.
Lars – Of course it I who think that. That’s why I think it was a bad substitution, don’t know about others.
For a gambler, I would have expected AW to gamble on that and try to win the game. I would have understood had he done so and I think that most of the crowd would have as well.
Playing JD and Theo against Nani and Evra was football suicide.
Arthur you can’t say we don’t deserve anything. Right now we are 5th. If we catch Chelsea then we will have deserved 4th. Simple. The table does not lie. The season is not over because of this defeat, and no one can predict what will really happen. All we can do is hope for the best and that our injured players will come back in good shape & form. Speculating on RvP and others is not helpful right now – it just reflects our fears and quite frankly that just empowers our opponents..
I think that it was in a game-plan to give the Ox 70 minutes. I dont’ buy those lies about huffing and panting on the bench, and fatique. Koscielny had fatique too, Ramsey had fatique, so why don’t you change them. Surely Walcott did not had fatique, cose he barely run. I am sorry but, the problem is that Wenger doesn’t have confidence even in himself anymore!
Lars @ 278 No one is questioning Wengers decision to substitute JD. Was a good one. The OX was not in danger of going into cardiac arrest, far from it. Poor Kos looked EXHAUSTED but he carried on brillantly, wouldn’t you agree.
We didn’t lose that game because of the sub.
We lost it because their wingers tore our makeshift full backs to bits in the first half.
We lost it because the skipper missed an open goal. Much as I still love him
We lost it because Arteta wasn’t there to give us the usual composure and Ramsey is clearly exhausted and in need of a break.
We lost it because Arshavin didn’t clear his lines.
We lost it because Valencia is a great little player who will continue to eat full backs alive between now and May.
We lost it because of the crowd reaction to the sub: at 1-1 you’ve got to stay behind the team, have the inquest later.
Many, many other reasons, not just one thing. It didn’t look a great sub to me, but an experienced Intl (albeit on poor form) for a shattered 18 year old (albeit on great form) isn’t a piece of lunacy by any means. He gambled and it didn’t pay off. His sun at half time, which looked more risky on the face of it, did, and swung the game in our favour. He still knows a thing or two about the game.
Lots to sort out at the club but if we don’t finish top four it won’t be because of results this weekend.
Chin up, back behind the team and let’s move forward.
I, for one, am looking forward to watching the Ox have a run of starts now.
Oh, and Kos – world class. What a player.
Arsene will have to drop the Ox because he shows the waste of five years we have spent on nursing/waiting on Theo to become a player.
GT @ 301 Time for that drink, mate. We can still take 3rd place.
I know its a bit harsh to judge the result purely on one substitution but like they say “the proof is in the pudding”, if Arshavin came on and did something genius then we would have to applaud and admire the decision the fact is it did not work ,not only that, Ox was taken off at a time when we had our trail up and looking threatening to get the second.never mind who the sub is. Why change something when its working
N7.
” we lost it because of the crowd reaction to the sub at 1-1″
N7 I am sorry to say it but you have never been more wrong. I for one take great offence to that.
Steve T
No offence intended.
I’m saying that there are many reasons for the defeat, of which the sub was one.
The crowd was up and down all afternoon, but the sub took them from bang up for it, come on let’s fucking win this to boos and nervy grumbles.
Am i surprised at the edgy support? No, not at all. Am i laying the result at the feet of the crowd? Absolutely not. Do I think the negative reaction helped the players? Most certainly not.
There’s a time to make your feelings known. In my view, it isn’t with 15 mins to go at 1-1 against the scum.
Anyway, my main intention wasn’t to knock the support, which was pretty good on balance, it was to point out that the result had several minor causes rather than one major one.
Steve T @ 312: Like N7 I said the same thing earlier and meant no offense to the Gooners who turn up every week in support of our team. Also I know that the experience inside the stadium is always different to the one we get from TV…but that said..as soon as the substitution was made people right behind Le Boss started to remonstrate with him – even RvP looked very angry (or exasperated) that even the announcer remarked on it. Now I was on the opposite side, with my backs against the wall, I’d be saying to myself ‘we have them worried’…I would submit that at that time in the game no united player would have had a legitimate reason to be optimistic but for the way the crowd reacted…just my opinion of course..
* now IF I was on…
N7. I would be bold enough to suggest that 57,000 Arsenal fans were driven to react in the way they did by one of the most bizarre decisions I have seen AW make. No one should be surprised. I have never seen so many bemused faces.
The locals are getting restless and I hate to say it but the club have brought it all on themselves.
You can dress it up however you want, but played 22, lost 8 is not acceptable. Especially when you are asked to pay the highest prices in the league. It may be okay for those with their heads in the sand but I would suggest that we are in decline. It needed addressing 3 years ago. Funny enough, it still needs addressing.
GT. The crowd reacted the way they did with very good reason. It’s called passion, its called emotion. Believe it or not it comes from the heart. Trust me, there were an awful lot of gooners unhappy with Mr Wenger this afternoon I can tell you.
OK Steve I see where you are coming from…and of course you are right. But lets us talk about what we can do now – even if its only academic given the fact that we can’t influence the decisions of the club – instead of agonizing about what we should have done for the past 3-years. If I were sitting next to you on that train I’d be tempted to put my arms around you for mutual support right now…
I wasn’t there and I can’t tell, i did not notice the fans reaction to the sub on Tv but if its true that the fans reacted badly to arshavin coming on then that is unforgivable, it is harsh and would not do his confidence any good. I just feel Arshavin knows the fans have simply lost patience with him and he is possibly thinking of a way out. he is one of the players who thrive on the love of the fans but it looks like he is getting none.
Steve T when you have had a chance to back drink you will see that we on-liners also had exactly the same reaction at the time…100 million voices went up in horror (that was the estimated global audience today)
Wenger’s back is undoubtedly at the wall, the last time it was this bad for him I think was when we lost the inital fixture against them last year.
Wait, Robin missed an open goal? This isn’t the chance when Rosicky laid it off to him right when one of the Manc players dropped cos I didn’t think that was an open goal chance.
The fans were not booing the arrival of arshavin. They were booing the decision to take the ox off.
Wind, we had more scoring opportunities than the mancs. Our finishing was poor, but with only one recognised goal score at the club none of us should be that surprised.
Steve
I totally agree that we’re in decline, and quite probably have been for some time.
I also know quite well how different a game can look from 20 yards away, and how visceral reactions can be to events on the pitch.
However, with all due respect (and I mean that in the fullest sense of the term, no the snidey Internet sense – you are one of the more insightful regulars on here, and I am always interested in your view) I will never be able to consider it a positive when we effectively boo a sub onto the pitch.
I fully take your point about passion. My own immediate reaction to the sub was not wildly dissimilar to many on here. But I’m speaking now with the benefit of having had a few hours to calm down and properly consider the matter. A luxury I totally understand that those in the stadium did not have.
Anyway, the last thing I want to do on a night like this, when we’re all feeling shit, is argue with other Gooners. I genuinely meant no offence and my post was in part a reflection of the fact that I agree that it could easily get quite ugly at the home games. We are still in with a shout at top four this season, and until that hope fades I would hate to see the support turn on the players and manager, because it will get us precisely nowhere.
I would prefer to see us try to stick together until May, and then work out what on earth needs to be done to get the club moving in the right direction again. And I have to say that flogging and replacing the Russian would be a start, for his own sake as much as ours.
Wind @ 321 – with respect, this is the WORST period of AW’s reign.
A steady decline of over the last 3 years, has as Steve T points out above, meant this season we’ve already lost EIGHT games and are 10 points behind the scum.
Not since the mid-90’s have we been in such a poor league position in January.
Wind
Open goal was perhaps a little unfair on the maestro, but it really was a sitter and at least as big a factor in the defeat as Arshavin’s arrival, if we really must look to dole out blame.
Wenger said about the second goal “It could have happened as well if [OxladeβChamberlain] had stayed on”. We will never know that Arsene. Instead of trying to defend his decision I think he should put an end to it. This could rumble on and have a negative effect between players and manager.
N7. The reaction was not directed towards arshavin, although he is not the most popular player I grant you. The sound of the crowd almost as one singing ” you don’t know what your doing,” to the manager is not a reaction I condone, but one I fully understand.
For the last two years Mr Wenger has asked to be trusted and judged at the end of the season. Unless things turn around rather rapidly I would suggest that many may not be as forgiving as in previous years.
Not Arshavins problem. I know we all love to support the players but the lethargy has been on view for months now. Today only Kos, RVP, Ox , Mert and TV5 stood out..the rest were for whatever reasons out of sorts.which for players on 30 odd grand a week minimum is shocking. The spine is there just like 1995..its up to Arsene to use it .
The Wasp @ 325, too right mate, as at this position last season we were dipping in and out of 1st position and we were clear of 3rd placed Chelsea by about 5 points I think.
Where did things go wrong other than that Carling Cup Final?
N7 @ 326, fair play. All I can say is the last time the Captain never put away a chance against United, it cost us the game and a lot of pride. But ‘What If’ scenarios are too fanciful, what if John Terry never missed ‘that’ penalty, what if Bergkamp put that ball in the net when we were 1-0 against Barca in the final of the UCL 2006 , the list goes on… π
Better to move on in positivity than wallow in regret.
Pete @ 10:17: Now, now. No need for vulgarities. The ‘so called’ Americans you speak of have nothing to do with the playing side of the Arsenal. One of them actually owns the club. Arsene Wenger actually works for the Board so it is them who will fire him when that time comes. I would however, for curiosity sake, like to know which manager currently available could in your opinion do a better job given our current problems with injuries etc…
Holic and all fellow holics. I hope you have all had a top Tollie evening. Is there another gathering planned for next week?
Today as with all his apperances in an Arsenal shirt yhe Ox showed his is by miles a better than Walcott will ever be.
I heard the Utd coach had to stop on the M6 as Evra forgot he still had Theo in his pocket
*tumbleweed….*
During the last set of drinks I was interested in a sub theme (being espoused by TABs et. al. I think) about when the feelings deepen for the Arsenal – when they are doing well or when they are in trouble. It got me thinking then and again this afternoon (Jamaican time) about the different type of people who supports the Arsenal these days. Take me for example, I have said on here that I attended more games when we were playing shit. I felt COMPELLED to go and support. I even traveled from Germany to attend many, many games after I had moved there!! I also remembered staying behind at Highbury when we lost – hundreds of us until they chucked us out – signing until we could sing no more. My voice didn’t use to come back until Wednesday. Masochist I hear you say – perhaps…but what I can’t understand is the vitriol of the modern day Arsenal fan. I am not saying that people never booed when I was going to games on a regular basis. But Christ it seems that the folks who got attracted to the Arsenal during their recent glory years are mainly the ones that are turning in droves on the team and the Boss now. Maybe its just my perception. I know that Clive & Geoff and perhaps even Steve T have been supporting the team as long as, and in some cases longer than me – but they are never as nasty with their criticisms of the team’s performances. I totally understand their frustrations after the last few years which promised so much have delivered so little. But I don’t understand the sharp knives and the scatter-gun foul-mouthed assault on our manager & certain players every time we lose or draw these days…what causes it?
My last sentence could have been better constructed. I am specifically talking about the vulgarians in the Blogosphere and not the aforementioned chaps who normally express their frustrations respectfully in this bar..
Unfortunately due to roadworks on the northern line was unable to make today’s game – am hoping that a decent service will be resumed come the blackburn match up
Up The Arse!
No remorse GT, your analysis is spot on.
As young as I am, the first Arsenal match I can recall watching is a 4-2 defeat at Old Traf against today’s opponents, we may have lost but as I watched Vieira and Keane battle in my local corner shop, I knew subconsciously that Arsenal was for me.
I hardly even remember most of the Invincibles’ unbeaten season, and the corresponding season, the next game is our FA Cup final win over today’s opponents on a Saturday, I was at a party but the match was turned on at my request thankfully, and I was able to catch the extra time 1st and 2nd half and subsquent penalty shootout with Paddy’s winning kick.
Maybe I was lucky enough that my craveing for sweets lead me to the corner shop to witness that midfield battle that day over another Arsenal fan today who saw us dominate in 03/04, thinks I’m gonna support Arsenal as they are doing the best currently and is now disillusioned as we struggle trophylessly but we all need to get behind the club AND manager until the season ends.
*sigh*
GT: I can remember waiting around after games until the stewards would finally lose patience and move me on!
The days you refer to were very different, players actually had to play for a new contract and all the power was with the clubs who held onto players registrations even after contracts expired.
Back then Players earned the equivalent of a top businessmans wage, today they earn 70-100 times that. That’s why a lot of fans feel the vitriol they do when they see players either habitually under performing or not putting in a shift. Players earn such ridiculous sums they are legitimate targets for people struggling to live week by week.
LO@306: I think you are right that AW had always planned to take the Ox off after 70 mins, not wanting to run a teenager starting his first Premier League game into the ground. Most of us in this bar would last about 70 seconds playing at that tempo and intensity, so you can’t really argue with AW’s intention. Yet, as I said earlier in the drinks, this was an occasion to let heart overrule head. We’d just equalized. We were having the better of the game. We had momentum. The Ox was on song. Even another 10 minutes for him, even if he was running on fumes, might have been enough to get us the second goal.
someone needs a kick in the backside LOL
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/16670824.stm
First – good to see many regular ‘holics at The Tollie pre-match.
Second – I’m taking a leaf out of Catalan’s book and holding back on what I wanted to say until tomorrow.
Some information has surfaced in the drinks that you don’t get while travelling home, etc., which may put a different hue on things by the morning.
Someone mentioned something above about ‘learning lessons’, and I agree that this goes right to the heart of our problems.
GoonerTerry – I, like you, am an old-school supporter. Turn up early, sing your voice into oblivion, and just get it back in time to lose it again the following week.
However, I am getting so frustrated at seeing the same mistakes happening time after time after time. Add that frustration to the fact that everyone in the game earns unimagineable money to keep making those mistakes. Then imagine you never supported Arsenal through years of pretty dire stuff – you thought it was normal to win league titles and doubles all the time.
Then add the ability, through your computer keyboard, to anonymously abuse whoever you like, without the risk of a broken nose, and you have an explanation for the vitriol of the modern ‘supporter’.
Frustration at our club, at the moment, is understandable. Abuse, especially during games, is never helpful.
So having said I was holding back ’til tomorrow – I’m off. ‘Night all.
W @ 340: heh…what a nutter di Canio is. Fascist or not I always liked him (0;
Ned @ 340: Yes even if he had delayed his decision for a few more minutes to keep our pressure on….but on these things turns ones fortunes.
Geoff @ 399: I hear you. But Wenger of all people knows the value of money. He constantly talks about the economic situation being behind his philosophy of not wanting to waste money….
I am saddened by this turn of events. It feels like a watershed moment. It feels different than before. I think that the club must respond – they must show that they understand the fans frustrations. A charm offensive is now necessary. Wenger needs to come out and say we are tracking a few of our targets even as we await the return of our players from injury. He can’t stand aloof from the emotions of the supporters. People like to imagine that it used to be a lot different; that the Arsenal was all warm & fuzzy, and, that they used to disclose information about their plans. I don’t ever remember it that way. But our shiny new facade has given us the air of Corporate America and I think that despite the efforts of ‘Arsenalization’ the people at the top appears to be out of touch with their supporters. At lease it appears so to me from afar..
Good night Trev…Lets hope the morning brings a fresh perspective to us all…Can’t wait now to read Holic’s reflections…
Hours later that still hurts but it’s the previous two results that have put the season on life support.
Looking for positives I must say that Yennaris looks promising and not having Arteta is really demonstrating his value to us now. I don’t have any answers though – but I’m not giving up on a top 4 finish any time soon.
GT: Nice observation regarding our natural inclination to try to dribble pass everybody. By the way, you are exhibiting great form today with the comedy. Keep it going. Ha!