Jack Needs A Rest, But We Can’t Do Without Him
Feb 19th, 2013 by 'holic
You don’t need the match report because I suspect half the planet watched that tonight.
You don’t need some old boy in his spare room to explain to you just how poor we were in the first-half, although I would urge you to appreciate the quality that Bayern brought to the half. They worked harder, they were technically superior, and they had a slice of good fortune.
You don’t need me to turn on individual errors. There were many. Too many for this level of football. Singling out players serves no purpose because frankly you could see the hurt in Jack Wilshere’s eyes as he drew the short straw of the post match interview. He wasn’t the only one hurting, although he was possibly the only one who didn’t need to feel embarrassed.
You don’t need me to tell you that once again, when all seemed hopeless, we found a second-half performance of spirit and no small amount of courage as the attempt to salvage something from the evening developed. You don’t need me to tell you the pivotal part Jack Wilshere played in that. After sixteen months out the lad could do with a bit more rest than he is getting, but as you saw at the weekend we run the risk of having no forward momentum at all if we leave him on the bench.
Maybe you do need me to suggest that you don’t turn on the manager for losing to Bayern Munich, and to be fair the magnificent home support largely resisted the urge to jeer at the final whistle. Most understood we had probably just lost to a team destined to go all the way in the competition this season. There is however a situation developing where defeat to Tottenham and/or Everton will surely lead to a serious appraisal at Highbury House.
Three significant weeks await.
I learned an important lesson at an early age. Always play to win. If you can’t win, don’t lose. If you do lose buy the beer and look big.
Congratulations to Bayern and their supporters. You earned it.
355 Responses to “Jack Needs A Rest, But We Can’t Do Without Him”
They are a good side.
Back to the drawing board for us I’m afraid…..
A reminder folks, should you for some reason be feeling more anger than despair, please refrain from taking that out on fellow Gooners here.
Thanks. It’s appreciated.
Train home. It’s not a happy train.
No happy train. But happy to share the drink.
Cheers, holic, all.
I will say this- you could build a real Arsenal-style side around Jack and Tomas. I was moved by their displays each. Leave it at that I will.
I was a lot more angry after Saturday’s game for some reason…. maybe its resignation (Hmmm) I am feeling…
I will be back later with the view from the ground. Bayern are a great side that do the simple things very well. We yet again made far too many mistakes. Against a team like that you will be punished severely.
Their closing down might just be the best in Europe.
Forces the opposition to dribble through their defense lines. That’s why TR looked positive and better than most.
Superb write up ‘holic — bang on the money as usual — agreed with every word.
Roll on Villa…
Im still blaming Santos π As for the last bit Holic I’m realiably informed he didn’t see it π
Bayern are evidently a much better team, and there is a significant gulf of class in the respective forms this season. However, it would be instructive to compare their defense against ours man-by-man and we may be surprised.
Van Buyten is not a better player than Kos.
Dante is not a better player than Per.
Lahm is a better player than Sagna.
Alaba is not a better player than TV5. Well may be quite better in current form.
However, they had two excellent midfield players who were defensively impenetrable: Schwiensteiger and Martinez. And they play the pressing game effectively.
We never seem to be able to start our matches with full tempo pressing. Previously we used to be able to motivate ourselves to do that against oppositions better than us, but we have given up on pressing as well.
They were better than we were. We started well, but they soon overtook us. This wasn’t another case of a poor first half, we were outplayed, and any apparent improvement in the second was as much due to them slackening off as our better play.
As usual TR7 looked immediately better than any of ours bar Jack when he came on, and I agree with the idea of building the team around the two of them.
Okay, that’s another handful of games we’ve almost certainly been spared. No excuses now for not making Top 4, which we are still easily good enough to achieve, imo.
Oskar
Great second half momentum. Had aground scored from Walcott’s cross it was up for grabs. T’was not to be.
Heh, Oskar.
Looking forward to sat now hope the game is not flat after today,at least the match has a bit of importance.4th is the minimum now we can’t afford any more slip ups chin up gunners.
Oskar, Im Afraid your carnt build a team around a player that plays 10 games a season, Lovely player but his carears been ruined unfortunately for him and us,
Did anyone saw this:
Arsenal fan Piers Morgan (β@piersmorgan) launches his latest anti-Aaron Ramsey tirade after Kroosβ strike: βTook Ramsey eight minutes to cock it up. Quite good by his standards.
Gary Neville β(@GNev2) tells Morgan to get behind his side: β@piersmorgan youβre depressing me and I donβt support Arsenal! Be thankful you support a club with morals and history! Itβs just a moment in time.β
Top man ‘holic.
The measure of a man is how he takes defeat when beaten by a better opponent.
Your next beer’s on me.
as fly paper is to a charging elephant.
Fuck the posh, daren’t come home to the UK in case he gets nicked for phone tapping, twat.
Snir @ 8: Or use flanks effectively using long balls, flick-ons, and hold up play. You need a center forward to do that well. You have a center forward who actually does those things well and plays well with our regular wingers.
Yet we start without him, and hope Bayern would fall for the Theo-down-the-middle trick and play a high line.
Rosicky looked good because he is a much better player. Rather, he is a much direct player, a kind that raises the tempo of the whole team and creates openings. We used to thrive on that template, and when we still manage to do it we are irresistible. However we have fallen for the Barca-style, head-and-soul , without really possessing the talent to pull it off consistently.
One thing I would like to add to an otherwise rather complete report of the game is that, at least in my eyes, there was no lack of effort. We already knew Bayern is a bloody good side, and to be honest I think they may well be a better team than Barca at the moment.
I can’t really say I hurt too much right now because we knew this was going to be difficult and for my part I was mentally prepared for it. And like I have said numerous times, our longer-term future will be decided by our transfer dealings post-season, not what how we did tonight.
Must be off to bed now, take care everyone and help yourself to drinks on my tab.
Jesus that’s a great match report.
Well played ‘Holic – spot on.
Bayern were better coached and tactically more astute than us. Sad but true. Off the ball our midfielders always looked like in a limbo between pressing and staying back to maintain a defensive shape. No cohesion, no tactical awareness to adjust. I don’t even know what they were instructed to do.
On the ball everyone can see what we are lacking. And sadly we are lacking big time. Perhaps a TR7 and a formation change away from improvement?
Can’t blame the players for a lack of trying though.
Anybody drawing comparisons between Bayern and Arsenal ’98?
We have gone for tippy tappy as power is taking over again.
Missing the point a little. Nobody would want Wenger removed if the Bayern was taken in isolation.
But it cannot be, It is just another step in a consistent, inexorable and, to be quite frank boring decline of this team.
Tonight we were hammered by a better team. But for the past 5 years, and two in particular, strangely more and more teams have become better than us. Thats because of the active policy of removing our top players and giving them to our rivals.
Wenger is part of a regime that is dragging – no sadly, not is dragging, has already dragged Arsenal into obscurity by championing mediocrity. We have a financial strategy the rewards the average, keeps them happy at the expense of top players. Our players leave because we have failed to create an atmosphere that they feel they can thrive in. That can be repaired by paying out stars what they are worth and the more of them that stay, the more we will win, so the better the atmosphere will be. The theory is not rocket scientist and has been operated by every successful club since time immemorial.
But to be honest, it is probably too late to save us right now, You cannot unsink a ship. We need a new regime, one which will not swamp the club and fans in defeatist rhetoric and one which will not operate a lunatic wage equality policy of suicide.
I love Arsene Wenger, But for all of our sake he, and the cursed mandarins he works for, need to depart.
Holic, I think Bayern usually plays with lots of possession. Going two goals up at the Emirates, it’s only natural for them to sit back a little bit and play on the counter.
Cheers for such a reasoned post.
Faustus – I agree, Giroud provides a great outlet but as he was in the first eleven, we felt the consequences of their closing down.
I can see why AW opted for Theo. I’m assuming he saw him give Dante a tough time in the England Brazil game and intended to soak up the pressure and release him on the counter. It didn’t work because we conceded in the 8th minute so we had to take more initiative with the ball.
Rosicky is a very good player and I wish he’d play more. His style Shakes us off our sometimes walking pace style. He is the ultimate player to play without the handbrake.
Chippy @ 16: I agree it would be too late to build a team around TR7. He is in his thirties and his injury history would always pose a question.
But why all this mania about always building something for the future? I mean it is great to have that perspective and balance and I am happy and proud that we look after our future so diligently. But the present? The moment in time that is what the sports is primarily about?
In other words, why not play TR7 regularly when he is not injured, ahead of Ramsey or Diaby? I am not dissing Aaron, he did well, his pace though is improving still needs a season or so to make him the player he would be but has it not been obvious for long that we lack forward drives in this team especially against tactically and physically strong defenses?
Sleeping @ 25
Cannot argue with much of that !
A couple of years ago we woud have stood toe to toe and given them a game, in fact we would probably have been favourites to go through. It’s a sad reality that, not only were we underdogs, but most of us had accepted that we were underdogs even before a ball was kicked so that it wasn’t all that bad to have been beaten by a team as good as Bayern. Not so long ago, other teams used to think that about us but tonight’s game was a reality check as to how far from Europe’s elite we have fallen in such a short space of time, and as history has proved, it’s never a quick road back to dine at that particular table. Yes Bayern have improved over the past 3 years but that is because they have built a good squad. Wenger tried to do that and was so close until Cesc left. That broke Wengers team and his heart. What now remains has mine close to breaking too. I love Arsenal, always have, always will but we are a broken team and we need fixing.
Hi guys, I probably shouldn’t be on here but I do find many of the Arsenal blogs to well written and interesting. I’m a Man Utd fan and was watching the game tonight and can only say I don’t think there’s any shame in losing to them. Without a star man I don’t think I’ve seen many more cohesive and well organised teams with quality. I think they would have beaten anyone in the premier league. I think the problem we face is that there are now many good teams which makes the league the most exciting but generally means we lag behind in Europe at the moment. It’s all cyclical though.
I think the sentiment of this article is exactly right as Wilshere is the driving force of Arsenal but in my opinion your squad is paper thin and this more than anything else is your weakness.
I personally think Ramsey is crap as well.
I really hope you pull off a miracle as I’m a big believer in supporting the English teams in Europe!
Doctor @28
No idea id play him each and every time he’s fit – My only guess is that there has been some sort of failing out, Strong rumours suggest we were looking to include him in player plus cash deals in Jan, He gives us a purpose which is lacking in almost all our other midfield options bar Jack and Cazorla.
I really hate it, but G neville does talk a lot of sense. Lots of ifs, as ever – if only Rosicky could stay fit, if only the other half the team could wake up when the refs whistle first blows, if only we had some more lucky breaks, if only…. Didn’t someone write a poem about this once……..?
I heartily recomend Thatchers cider and home made sloe gin, dulls the pain, but does nothing for the speling(sic!!!)
Is he a player who gets better the more he doesn’t play?
I know he played well against a Championship side, which to be fair to him is more than his team mates managed, but is he really good enough, consistently enough, to get into the side?
I know… the players we’ve been playing aren’t consistent either, but if the answer to our problems is really Rosicky…. I’m not convinced.
Although at least he knows that having pace in the side means you have to give an early long pass now and again.
I think that not for the first time you have captured exactly the right mood in your report ‘ Holic. One bit of me didn’t want to go tonight but at the same time I couldn’t keep away. I am also much more rarely able to pay tribute to Gary Neville’s quite excellent tweet to the twat Morgan tonight. I am immensely proud of my club and I thought the support tonight was wonderful and very uplifting.
We all know much is wrong but all that matters now is finishing the season with a real sense of momentum and finishing in that 4 th place. I’m not going to debate the Wenger Out scenario tonight. We discussed little else before or after the match but let’s pay tribute to a very good Bayern side who are real contenders for this trophy and accept that we need tempo to create chances. We seem to leave it in the dressing room until the second half.
I am not yet home from the game but although disappointed we need to keep the mood as upbeat as possible– and start Rosicky on Saturday possibly instead of Santi.
To those arguing the merits of Rosicky tonight I will say one thing, not with the benefit of hindsight as you will see I suggested it in the preview.
How the fuck Aaron got to start ahead of him tonight is a mystery.
Don’t take that as a sleight on Aaron, who has a great future, but Tomas is the one player other than little Jack who gives us forward momentum, so critical in the home leg.
I don’t believe Wenger’s tactics have changed as much as some here would have it. What has changed is the quality of football we play. Most if not all the players are internationals and capable enough on their day, but the number of passes that go astray and the feeble and/or misdirected strikes at goal, and all the slowing to pass the ball backwards has become embarrassing.
Bar that golden ten minutes against WH there has been very little of the fluidity that used to be Arsenal’s hallmark.
We need better players, not a better manager.
Oskar
@ 34: Well he was our best player in the second half of the last season. He is a football player, not a miracle worker, and hence not a solution to all our problems. But he almost always improves our attacking game, irrespective of the opposition.
BTW, before his injury he was easily one of the best in Europe.
Holic , Watching Porta V Malaga. What a difference in pace and pressure ! We took on Giants tonite, for sure…mighty good of you to congratulate them, they were awesome π Can’t disagree with the way you called this one. Jack is truly in a Class of his own and Tomas is always such a lively spark. Saw tears in Arsene’s eyes, very difficult to witness.
Thanks Holic,
That last paragraph made me chuckle and ease the pain. Gutted with the result , but proud of the way Jack n TR played .How i wish we had TR unhurt these past two three years. We DO have good players, i just feel they are not that confident of their own capabilities. Just hope they fight and win the fourth..
well.. time for a media blackout for a few days..
a round for the house.
I thought that the first half was a horrific watch for us. The fans were singing like crazy to start, but Bayern had a game plan and were pressing us in our own half, so we resorted to hoofing it to Theo. And I think that it is pertinent to point out that they did have a plan. I see no evidence that happens for Arsenal and it is why we lose.
Granted, this Bayern team is very good and organized and even with a plan we may have still lost, but I am sick of seeing players running all over the pitch like headless chickens. This has been happening for years now. When they do this, it is obvious that they don’t really know what they are supposed to be doing and is the biggest indictment against Wenger, in my opinion.
Losing to a better team is a lot easier to take than losing to a shit team though.
I still don’t agree with the formation of the team on the pitch these days, – which I have to put down to AW.
Tippy tappy triangles don’t work against teams that know how to press and close down.
Which Bayern did quite succesfully against us I should add.
But briefly in the 2nd half you can see that we are not total rubbish, we just need improvement in certain areas, a bloody good defensive coach has to be the starting point, surely?
Spot on ‘Holic.
Well beaten, no complaints.
Just home from the game.
Outclassed. Simple as that. The better team won.
We were second best in every position bar LJW and second best in terms of defensive organisation and in attacking drive.
A clear demonstration of how far we have to go to be competitive in the ECL again. It’s a long way back. More than just 2 -3 quality players.
But 4th place is probably still within reach if we can play as well as our best of this season in the critical games to come.
Well done Bayern, you’re a class outfit again.
Tom (Manu Fan), Umm, I believe you have ‘something’ of OURS, could you please return ‘it’ at your earliest convenience π And another thing fellas, we played w/o a REAL left back against GIANTS π
No anger, no harsh words, just that same sad resignation of what we are becoming more and more every season, ordinary.
Jack is so different class to the rest of the team that it hurts me to see him struggling to do it all.
I chose this nick and changed from Drapedindarkness because at least when you are depressed it can get better, should I change it back now π
And what is it with teams scoring really flukey goals against us, seems to happen a lot lately.
Sad to see where we have fallen. Tonight showed what we should aspire to become: efficient, confident and dominate without having to become over stretched. Well played Bayern. We lost to the run away leaders of the best league in Europe ( at the moment).
Take this as a learning opportunity. Come on Arsenal. Learn.
Holic,
One of your best posts yet. What makes it so special is you encapsulate every possible sentiment in such few words..! There’s obviously much more you want to say – but that will wait for another day for obvious reasons. Lets at least get fourth – its so important.
Congrats Bayern indeed..!
NorCal says this is a learning opportunity, and I couldn’t agree more. My only additional statement (a question, actually), is whether they really haven’t already learned, and this is just the process of getting there.
Bayern is the team we want to be. That kind of team takes the sort of economic stability we now have, and an administration capable of executing a plan that jives with the realities of today’s game. It was not always like that for them, I hope people remember. They worked to this, and had some instability in the meantime. Considering that they were unequivocally the giants of the Bundesliga, not winning the league a couple of years running represented a proportional downfall to what Arsenal has experienced in the Prem.
Arsenal’s administration is why many people think we’re incapable of making the leap, and that’s fine. I have my questions, too, but I still confess to not being able to think of many better visionaries than Wegner out there as manager. And those who you argue are better aren’t coming, never were. Everyone else involved in the admin? I really don’t know. But if anyone’s willing to be honest, they don’t know either. We’re all just speculating.
In the meantime, I’m appreciative of what we have, as frustrating as some moments along the way may be, because the tsunami we’re attempting to recover from afflicted many other excellent teams just as badly.
Tonight proved that we are not capable of beating the best, or second-best, side in Europe. This season has proven that we are not one of the three best teams in England. We may not be one of the top four. But NONE of that means that what’s happening is necessarily the death-knell, or the gradual irreversible decline prompted by greed, ineptitude, whatever. Those are valid theories, but have little more than selective anecdotal evidence as their support. So here’s another theory: Sometimes, what seems like a decline is actually a re-trenching, but it takes the subsequent years to see that such was the case. There are signs that such a hypothesis isn’t crazy, so long as you’re willing to see them. Some choose not to, or dismiss them as not as meaningful that the signs they believe are most indicative. And that’s all fine, so long as we admit that all of us could be wrong.
Personally, I hope this is an interregnum. I have reason to believe it may be. But maybe even more importantly, I really do think it’s the only way I can think and stay sane, if I’m not actually insane already.
Everything’s possible. Nothing is certain. Except that every fucking match, I’ll be watching, and dying with every kick, and it heartens me to know that the vast majority of us at least agree on that.
Also, ‘Holic, you’re the best.
Back from the stadium.
Valid points in the report Holic.
Yes, I said tonight to my neighbour that we look incapable of winning a physical challenge. The days of the destroyer DM may be gone but we have no physical power. We have loads of little blokes who run around at random – no tactics, no plan, no defensive discipline or responsibility.
I am getting very worried seeing Jack Wilshere looking so upset at each successive failure.
He is sheer class. He cares. How long will he be prepared to try to carry the entire team?
Back tomorrow.
Sorry Lars, but there was some lack of effort tonight. Too many occasions when there was noone looking for the ball at throw ins, too many attacks when too many of our players just made no effort to get forward. And their second goal, when neither of our centre backs even managed to jump to try to cut out the cross.
Bayern are a class team. Our sloppiness made it far too easy for them.
A thoroughly dispiriting evening.
Night all.
Arsenal learn nothing under Wenger, ever. That’s why he has to go. Stale, one-dimensional.
Bayern didn’t even play that well, I thought Ribery was awful.
The evening did not start well. A late finish meant that trains connections had been missed and the Tollie was just a distant dream. As a result I headed direct to the ground, stopping for a hog roast in a bun and a quick flick through the signed pictures at the autograph stall. My mind was wandering to the potential team that we would put out. The paying publicβs thoughts of Gervinho were no more apparent when I discovered that a signed photo was actually on offer cheaper than one of Zinedine Cygan.
I take my seat to discover that TS is sat only two rows behind me. Ollie on Saturday and now TS? Block 4 is rapidly becoming the block of any self respecting holic. Despite recent events the crowd seemed buoyed. They were up for the battle, letβs see if the team are.
The first half was poor. We struggled to keep the ball and we struggled to do anything of purpose with it when we had it. We gave a way two poor goals. For the first we manage to have six players in the box but not one who thinks that it might be a good idea to get closer to those lurking on the edge. The second is just another calamity corner. I have tried to work out what we do when we attempt to defend corners but I am totally stumped. I have no idea what we do these days.
The half time whistle in met with an instant chorus of boos from a crowd that has been very vocal in their support for the vast majority. However the boos are quickly replaced with a vociferous rendition of βcome on Arsenal, come on Arsenal.β The battle cry is sounded. The call to arms is made to those departing for half time.
The second half was a far more positive affair. We played with more urgency and purpose. Our goal if a tad fortunate was well deserved I thought. Ollie G then nearly levelled things with a good effort after some great play. I thought we should have had a free kick in the build up to Bayernβs third. I have not seen any TV footage yet so I am not really sure what happened for the goal. It looked sloppy but I will have to see it again.
The third I would say puts the tie beyond us. For the likes of Lars, Ollie and BtM travelling to Bayern I hope you still enjoy the occasion. That is assuming that BtM can detox and stay of the sauce long enough to make it there.
The final whistle brought a small section of boos, more in frustration I would guess. The fact is that we were totally outclassed and out played by a very good Bayern side. At times it was men against boys. They do the simple things in football. Their touch and technique are excellent. They open up and play the simple the ball the way they are facing. We quite simply didnβt. The two best teams I have seen at the Grove in recent years have been Barca and Bayern. They have both been two of the hardest working teams. Surely no coincidence? At times we were sluggish and sloppy. We did not press, we did not close down and our movement off the ball was non existent for most of the match.
Plus points included Jack who showed his class again. Ramsey never gave up and worked his socks off. Not much else I am afraid.
It is time now to reflect and find some perspective. There will be lots of negativity floating around. I am not sure that anyone would have been so negative about tonight had we been heading to Wembley this weekend and looking forward to an FA cup tie at Millwall. But tonight will have a cumulative affect and sloppy goals conceded yet again wont help out cause. The perspective has to be that this Bayern side is a top side. How many of our starting 11 would get in the Bayern starting 11? I would suggest none.
No doubt the debates will rumble on and many will continue to ask questions. I view is that we need to unite and fight in the last 12 league games. Then decisions can be debated and made.
You have to sit and wonder why Bayern are so far ahead? I have constantly heard people saying we cant compete with the petro dollars and the likes of Man U. But Bayern are a well run club, they have no debt, make huge amounts of money and donβt charge an arm and a leg for a season ticket. All of that and they have a team brimming with world class players. So why are we not on that level? Well, there is a banner that hangs above mw that says, βYou canβt buy class.β The problem is that we appear to be quite capable of selling it. The difference tonight was clear for everyone to see.
12 to go. Sing your hearts out for the lads etcβ¦β¦
I was writing up the match summary but I lost it to this phone by accident π‘ . Not sure if I’ll have the will in the morning to attempt again but I agree Holic, it actually hurts to see Jack at his age and with his recent situation have to compensate like on Saturday and today for his teammates. Always the last to leave the pitch, always applauds the fans. Me and Trev talked about this post game in the Emirates as we sat quite near each other by chance, that’s what Snowy mentioned as we talked on the way to the Emirates, but it hurts Jack so much because of the earnest desire within him to win trophies with Arsenal, and will he honestly spend the rest of his career holding up this team? Surrond quality with quality I say, if we did in January then maybe I wouldn’t have witnessed the same sort of performance riddled with Denilson-esque passes sideways and back towards Szczesny for the 2nd game in a row.
And on the matter of our keeper, being so lassez-faire with his clearances of the ball when opposition forwards are in the immediate area could cost Arsenal dearly one day, that’s the sort of thing that gets stamped out of a young keeper when he has competition for his place, even better when that competition is experienced because through practice the tendency to make those sorts of mistakes will be reduced hopefully.
On Zonal Marking, now that I’ve seen it with my own eyes, the sooner we get rid, the better because we haven’t got either the personnel or the defensive mentality to pull it off and it will continue to cost us goals. A free run at the ball combined with defenders who don’t jump is plain dangerous.
Wind, they were marking man for man. Did you see our goal?
On Zonal Marking, now that Iβve seen it with my own eyes, the sooner we get rid, the better because we havenβt got either the personnel or the defensive mentality to pull it off and it will continue to cost us goals. A free run at the ball combined with defenders who donβt jump is plain dangerous.
You know, I think I agree. I despise the reflexive bile for the system in general, which is why I tend to defend it. But I do wonder if it’s not a personnel issue.
That said, we sucked at man-marking, too.
Cdoyle@49 .. exactly what i feel. I accept that we are not the great giants we once were. But i think that has been in part by design and in part by unfortunate sequence of events.
We were definitely planning for prudence in our expenses by way of transfers. Think it was always the plan for the club to coast by (also competing) during the lean years where we were building our marketing model.The plan was to work with a core of talented young ones, during this period and also turn in profits when the opportunity arose. We were massively unlucky (eduardo and the title loss) .But some exits were a punch in the gut for this project (cesc,nasri,rvc).We have survived well financially.. but on the field we have suffered as a consequence.. but this is why i feel we just need to ride this season out..
This summer, we have no major exit sagas (pls sign sagna π arsene )..our marketing dept is finally getting thru with some major deals..we can strengthen from this point..which i firmly belive Arsene will. We have jack and some very good players. just adding a bit of quality is going to turn around our fortunes. A good summer of supplementing what we already have for the first time in many seasons will be a new start. So lets just get behind the team now till the end of the season. Lets get fourth or third. And then lets renovate , not rebuild. we will be fine. Just believe.
To take ‘Holic’s point at 55 even further: When’s the last time a corner was scored anywhere that wasn’t viewed as a calamitous error by the defending team?
One final point. How the hell were there 8 yellow cards in that game???? I am not sure the ref had the best game he has ever had.
Constructive and honest reactions. I’ve seen the goals on telly now as well as live and I agree about zonal marking although maybe if we had someone who could coach the team to employ it better it would not be so horrendous. Szczesny also is by no means the finished article and we need better back- up. We also need more than anything a dynamic midfielder who can tackle. Someone on my tube suggested Vermaelen who has lost so much from his first season.
LJW is an outstanding player and shows both class and character. We need him to be at his very best for the game with the Scum and for the rest of the season. He is too young to be captain imho but he is a natural leader and we desperately lack those in the team. Above all we need tempo throughout the side. Our lethargic openings are killing us and are exposed as unnecessary by much stronger second half performances.
Time for a lot of TLC from the fans who love the club because not being in the CL next season would make rebuilding so hard.
A pleasure to see Trev & Snowy and other familiar faces in The Tollie with the added bonus of sitting near Steve T in Block 4 albeit I was surrounded by a bunch of ‘Wenga Aaaahts!’ However, the banter became friendly when we pulled one back and I made a real effort to convince my immediate neighbours that it was ‘all back on’. Generally, the support was magnificent tonight.
No shame in losing to far superior opposition. The half time whistle could not have come soon enough. The shame is in the deterioration of our team/squad and the fact that we do not know what to do when we don’t have the ball.
We will do very well to finish top 4 and above the LWCs. There was a definite consensus of opinion amongst all whom I spoke to this evening that it’s time for a change and the end of an era.
I hope that we can manage it all with Classenal.
Daz @30 you make a great point about us already accepting that we are the underdogs. For me that feeling has only reared its ugly head over the last two seasons but particularly more this season for obvious reasons. It is only because you mentioned it though that I realised I had fallen into the trap. But honestly we are serious underdogs now, we fit the bill! It’s a sad sad situation and one I don’t have the answer for. I see so many people calling for arsene’s head, others saying we need to spend more money etc etc….. It’s got me all confused to be honest. Perhaps a very strong bourbon will take away the hurt and confusion.
By the way, a very well summarized post holic.
Just in from an extended train journey. We were very much second best apart from a spirited period in the second half. Had Giroud’s first time effort found the back of the net, who knows.
It pains me to concede that we have fallen from the upper tier of European football but Bayern are up there with the very best and may well lift the Cup at Wembley in May.
The constant repetition of giving away sloppy goals drags the side down and it takes more than LJW’s drive to pull these games out of the fire.
There was a great deal of unpleasantness in my unaccustomed block tonight , fans fighting one another, something I never thought possible during Arsene’s reign.
I just wonder where we go from here.
We have someone who is capable of coaching the defence (at least you would think years playing under GG would have rubbed off) but if he is not allowed to do the work we clearly need to be doing, he may as well be carrying the cones and handing out bibs.
As for Szcz, he should be the backup.
We read speculation about Reina and Valdez, but fuck them. Casillas is out of favour at Madrid and if we’re going for an experienced keeper, the Spanish Shay is the one I’d go for.
‘Holics,
I’m angry.
I’m pissed.
Surely, Bayern executed their game well, but there’s ALWAYS shame in losing. Perhaps it’s an American perspective. To quote General Patton:
“All real Americans, love the sting of battle. When you were kids, you all admired the champion marble shooter, the fastest runner, the big league ball players, the toughest boxers … Americans love a winner and will not tolerate a loser. Americans play to win all the time. I wouldn’t give a hoot in Hell for a man who lost and laughed.”
I will forever support the Arsenal (just like I support the Dallas Cowboys and the Texas Longhorns), but I sincerely hope losing doesn’t become “meh” for me with Arsenal like it has become with the other sports teams I mentioned.
I’m angry because we could have done better. We should have done better for a long time now. Better focus. Better strategy. Better coaching. Better execution. Better marketing. Better purchasing. Everyone from Owner to Board to Coach to Players to Staff… everyone could do so much better.
We are better than this. Going out meekly in the cups to lesser competition and getting our asses handed to us at home. If the Bundesliga is playing the best football in the world right now (perhaps, but Bayern are the same ass-clowns who allowed the Blue-Russians to win Europe last year…I’ll never forgive them for that)…then we need get their players, incorporate some of their philosophy.
I give a rat’s ass about this person getting fired or that person being traded. What I do care about is the fact that our team is no longer considered even a paper tiger. Any Championship team comes into the Ems and fancies their chances. Just get men behind the ball, frustrate the tippy-tappy, and hit Arsenal on the counter…it works much too frequently. Teams that (formerly) were our competition view a trip to our pitch as a regular Saturday stroll.
That should piss some folks off. It really should.
No sir. Fair play and all that can go play with itself.
The organization should be ashamed (I know some players cover themselves in more glory than others, but this is a team sport. They succeed or fail together in my mind).
We should be up in arms…
BTW, ABB (hello there, hope all is well), the Mancs have NOTHING of ours, by the way.
BMBD
@ #66
All cultural differences respectfully put aside, nobody I spoke to was laughing about tonight’s defeat, including yours truly. However, we Brits do that gallows humour thing rather well.
UTA!
Conceding silly goals is a worry, but I think it was more bad luck than bad play today. I don’t believe the defence is really as bad as many here insist … witness our record v the rest in the League.
Nor did anyone carry so endlessly about the defence when we were winners. The popular view back then was it didn’t matter how many they scored because we would score more.
I’m convinced the problem is much greater at the other end where, in the big games, we can rarely score when we simply have to.
Oskar
Steve T , to your question : why Bayern Munich is a much better team without petro-dollar .
The answer is with the EPL itself , awash with russian and petro dollar , TV dollar . In the beginning , it works , it bring in the best players from the world . But when there is too much money , the football mecca turn itself into a nercenary market where every player is becoming a mercenary chasing after the dollar and Arsenal is becomung the victim of .
Arsene W. can turn an obscure player into a very best player , usually he should be able to enjoy the fruit of his labor , but no , someone will triple the pay and turn his player into a mercenary.
Holic @ 55, I saw it, and without the benefit of highlights I’d say it was down to Neuer not going for the ball as it swung in that got us our goal π
If you want people who hate to lose, Lonestar, meet the Aussies … they’re by far the worst losers on the planet. I know, I lived there for 26 years suffering every cricket, tennis, swimming, yachting, golfing etc etc Brit defeat at their hands. But, like you Yankees, one thing their attitude has never helped them win is international football tournaments.
Oskar
Oskar,
I do agree that our defence is not as weak as some would perceive. What makes it look utterly hopeless is the comedy of errors that often leads to the goals.
I also agree that we seem to score in bunches this year. When it is clicking we look good when the other team chases the game. When we are chasing then we look toothless.
Lone star,
I don’t think anyone is not upset or are just shrugging their shoulders. Today we played a class team that beat us soundly. Fair play to them.
As I said earlier and as Steve T said, we should be looking at Bayern as someone we can learn from to make this the nadir since our move to the Em’s. They have a mostly German core of players. We have just resigned a very British core of young players that we should build around. They will not do it alone. We need stronger talent around them to augment their talents. It is something we can accomplish, but we need a few seasons of reinforcement not rebuilding. The past 2-3 seasons we have tried to patch together a new team each year that can compete. Without continuity from season to season we not going to be a good squad. Maybe this next year will be different.
Now we need to pull our asses up and play like we can and build momentum going out the last 12 games and hope that we can get up to 4th.
I certainly am angry at the defeat, but like most have said and I agree with, we lost to a better team. The thing that is pissing everyone off is that there is no one answer as to why we aren’t the best. There are many problems that need to be worked on. I think this could be a lengthy process and we have to hope that the players we have now are prepared to stick around because if not then we will constantly be building a new team thus leading to further problems.
Still bitter.
That is all.
BMBD.
Always did like Aussies…
@37 oskar
“We need better players, not a better manager.”
Is it that it is the manager who buy the players? Who field the players?
A bad manager buys bad players.
The only good players Wenger bought were TH14. Viera, Pires and maybe Ljungberg. Adams, Seamen, Keown, DB10 , Parlour were already here when he came. So I always wonder Wenger was too lucky in the first 8 years because. Because it was luck, you cannot count on them for the last 8 years.
Where do we go from here..
Is it me,or are Arsenals seasons getting shorter?
Wenger buys players the club can afford, and on balance his record for identifying bargains and developing them into champions is second to none.
By the way, your missing RvP, Fabregas, Clichy, TV, Santi, Poldi, Theo (of those who come immediately to mind) from your list of Wenger buys most good judges would consider top class.
Oskar
…and Rosicky, Monreal, and others can probably fill in some more.
All of them bought for very reasonable money.
Oskar
@78 Oskar
“By the way, your missing RvP, Fabregas, Clichy, TV, Santi, Poldi, Theo (of those who come immediately to mind) from your list of Wenger buys most good judges would consider top class.”
I dont mention these players because they have not wont anything (except Cesc in 2005) with Arsenal. And I dont think TV and Clichy, Poldi, and Theo are in the same class as DB10 and TH14. RVP and Cesc can just barely compared to Pires.
Arsene second to none ? The purple noise had Giggs, scholes, CR7, schmeichel, Van der Sar (We have Fabianski, Almunia, Chesny), Rio, Vidic……
We all support this Great Arsenal Club, but we have different opinion on what is the best course for it.
A lot of fans here admitted we lost to a better team. But Bayern was better because we make them to look like one. lose to bayern 1-3 AT HOME !!!! Even Barca can only manage a draw on us 3 years ago. And our famous win 2 years ago. Have anyone forget. ?? We are now educated to believe we are a mid table team, so everything is fine. We even glammourise BM to jusitfy our loss. Pathetic !!!
Why Wenger is not ANGRY at his players this time. Maybe he know it is his faults of not buying a quality GK (Lhorris, was available at a few million pounds, Even Schwartzer is a better option than chesny), his defensive tactics, his overall tactics (slow tippy tappy possession football).
I have no choice but supporting my Great Club to the very end. But I not sure Arsene will ever learnt.
All the players I listed, abc, were GOOD BUYS .. ie, the best available that we could afford, and all bought for a lot less than some clubs have paid for much worse players. That’s the most we can ask for in these inflated times.
The Manure players you mention either came for free out of Man U’s academy or by transfer fees we cannot afford. it’s pretty easy when all you have to do is decide which player you want and then fork out the going king’s ransom necessary to get him. I have no doubt Wenger would have killed to buy Ronaldo, Mata, Aguero, Hazard and many others we cannot afford. We simply do not have the buying power of Manure, Mansewer, Chelski etc.
TV, Clichy, Poldi and Theo are not in the class of Bergkamp, of course not. Of current players Messi and Ronaldo are probably the only ones who are. But all of ours are full internationals – Poldi has more than 100 caps for Germany ffs, and three of our squad have played for the current world champions – so to have bought them for what Wenger paid was excellent business in his compromised position.
Oskar
abc @ 80 : Clichy was a first-teamer in the unbeaten season. In 2005 it was RVP who was in the team and not Cesc. You also missed Sol, Jens, Kolo, Kanu, Wiltord, Gilberto, Edu, Overmars, Anelka, Petit … all bloody good players and most won a thing or two with Arsenal.
And your logic to deny Arsene great signings for those that didn’t win anything for Arsenal is spurious. We all know have our own observations and analysis about what actually is going wrong with Arsenal and Wenger for a while, but this attempt to rewrite history is really self-defeating for the sake of Arsenal.
Is it too much to hope for a 2-4 score in the return leg?
Oskar @ 82: Arsene did pass a few players in their early years when ended up being greats or thereabouts: Drogba, Ronaldo, Zlatan, Ya Ya (may be there was a visa issue as well) are the best known examples.
He has a very good record of identifying talents and more so in nurturing young players. But he is neither infallible nor a magician. His ability to produce highly competitive teams in small budget relying on relatively young players is second to none, as is his ability to rebuild teams year after year, but I think these high-wire acts of last few years are finally taking its toll.
Write up of a big, beer-buying man, ‘Holic. Pure class.
We are a team badly out of sorts. We can’t get things going consistently and every little half thing that can go wrong, does. They say you make your own luck, but for their first goal if the cross Arteta got a toe on had gone half a yard to the left or right, or up or down, Koos wouldn’t have had the shot. Even then he didn’t get a clean strike; he did a Kazim-Richards and banged it into the ground first. Bayern, though, looked like a team used to everything going right, and on the whole it did. And there is no taking away from the fact that they are a top-notch team. Things also tend to go right for them because they do most everything pretty well. Their pressing was pretty impressive. And we are known to be susceptible to good pressing. But when we did get a consistent spell of play going in the second half, we didn’t look as if we didn’t belong on the same pitch as Bayern, which couldn’t be said at times in the first half. As for zonal marking, we are not very good with the secondary zone in front of the main line of defenders. They are meant to provide a barrier to the runs of opposing forwards, especially those coming in from beyond the far post. But as we are a small side we don’t have good attackers of the ball in the air in the secondary zone. I don’t have any numbers to hand to back this up, but my impression is that most of the goals we concede from corners are from balls swung to the far post.
Thanks Faustus, you made the points I was trying to make more succinctly.
Oskar
One thing I do wonder is why, if AW can fire up the team at half time, as he appears to have done on several occasions this season, can’t he do the same before the first half?
Dr F@85: well put.
Stranger things have happened, Nognir (#84). Have a few quid on it and let us know how you go…
Oskar
Ned,
We are not only short, but even guys like mert and
TV don’t attack the ball. They wait for the ball to come to them, in the meantime, the attackers get a running free header. Mert is tall but is actually not strong in the air.
Abc,
No one is “glamorizing” anyone. BM should have won the CL last year and this year they are handily winning the best league in Europe and are arguably the 2nd best team in the world right now. That’s not glamor, that’s the truth. They are good.
I thought we started well in the first half, Ned. But when they got going they outplayed us, compounded by us losing our way after they scored. That we looked better in the second was due in part to their pulling back and only playing on the break.
Oskar
Thanks NBN and Oskar.
NBN @ 86: One of our best defenders in this season from set-piece has been Giroud. Yes, seriously. Per has blown hot and cold on that front. Sagna has been consistently strong in that aspect even in his otherwise poor matches, and TV5’s general inconsistency has shown in this area as well. Diaby had a few good showings as well. This is not Arteta’s strong suite and it had shown, and Ramsey and Gibbs have been just too wildly inconsistent while defending in the box.
Among the defenders, I know I am in the minority, but I thought Kos has been the best player this season when given chance. Both in the air and on ground. I would like to see him play in all matches if there is no injury until the end of the season. On current form dear captain needs to sit out. Whatever the fuck happened to Verminator’s form he needs to work that out over the summer, but this season we simply need to find ways to minimize the consequences of his wild inconsistency and at times just downright bizarre defending.
Painful watching Arsenal at the moment. i fear for the team and manager if things go wrong in the next two matches. only the team can do this now.
But i guess no one is surprised. its probably a good thing. Our squad is too thin in quality or depth and a lack of extra matches may work in our favour in the league.
Everyone sees the weaknesses in this team from back to front but not a lot that can be done now. lets get behind the team and finish as high as possible. and set the stage for better things next year.
I’d play Merts and Kos at CD with TV in the defensive midfield position. At least I’d TRY him there … let him off the leash a bit more since that’s how he seems to want to play from CD!
Oskar
Dont feel like slagging the team or the manager.. Theres enough of that happening even without my rants.
All I know is that Ill be up for the next game.
UTA
Faustus
I have said a few times that OG is our best defender in the air. He attacks the ball and clears it. I’m glad someone else has noticed. I also agree that TV5 is having a poor season. His form was not that great last year either but he scored some goals with his forays forward. This year the goals are gone but his off balance defending is still there. Lets hope he can find some form defending and fast because I don’t see AW benching him this year.
When I rated each player after a game in a recent drinks round I noted that OG’s rating was higher than it might have been simply on account of his excellent defending. He’s a hard worker that lad, and I really hope he finds his scoring boots soon.
Oskar
Golaso!
I’ll take a punt that Roberto will be removed in the morning.
Golaso for me?
Northern Cali-flowers are a beautiful experience, Roberto, please sample sometime…
In fact, we might need a fresh round… π
@83Doctor Faustus
“Clichy was a first-teamer in the unbeaten season”
I checked the stats : clichy 7 starts + 5 sub in EPL , if you call this first teamer, then I have nothing to argue with you.
Apologies for my drunken shyte last night Holics I was way out of line!
Steve T calls it spot on.
Got home from the match and forced myself to watch the whole thing again (don’t ask me how). Confirmed all my first impressions:
* Bayern are a class act and there’s no shame losing to them
* Giroud should have started (not sure we concede goal number 2 with him on)
* Jack a cut above. Again
* Ramsey can hold his head up high. For someone who has taken flack this season he was great. Worked hard and never once hid, even when some of the more senior players appeared to do so
* You cannot play a team this good without a proper left back and expect to prosper
* We lack a bit of size, particularly in defensive midfield. It didn’t help that Arteta, god love him, had an off night
Good to see a reasoned reaction in the bar. Good also to hear the crowd right behind the team last night – they were a credit to the club.
Onwards and upwards. We need a response at the weekend.
COYG
Clichy was a class act, abc, the best LB we’ve had since Cole. During the unbeaten season he was only 18yo and was understudy to Cole, playing a number of games when Cole was injured. In fact he was the youngest player ever to win a Premier League winners medal. After Cole left Clichy suffered serious foot injuries which limited his appearances until the ’07-’08 season when he started all 38 league games and was quite brilliant.
After that he was a regular, but missed a heap more games in following years through more injuries. When he finally came good Mansewer stole him. Our LB position has been a problem ever since.
Oskar
http://www.football365.com/f365-says/8511065/F365-Says
This is mostly spot on.
A bit fed up with first halves though, we looked on drugs then.
Oh, and we need to play Tomas more, he was superb again.
And thanks for the blog, ‘holic, that is spot on too! π
wee jack’s red eyes said it all
The only plus for me unfortunately is that I now have a better chance of a ticket for the away leg, however I would have much more prefered a good result and watch it in a bar in Munich.
Just beaten by the better side that’s football, swallow it and back on the horse. UTA
This might be a solo thought, but take away the captaincy from TV, I think it’s too much pressure for him. I would either give it too Arteta or jack! Jack might be young be he has the best team spirit out of anyone in our shattered team. Beer on me anyone?
104- N7 Gooner, a great post and a very good point about Ramsey. In fact all your points were well made. I was perversely pleased to see Jack’s red eyes. This shows he cares as much( more? ) than we do. What we all fear is that eventually in this situation he will look at a bare trophy cupboard and decide he needs to do something about it like someone else did last year.But he has a 5 year contract and we need to build around him not pile responsibility on him as seems to be the case now.
I note Kroenke was there last night and suspect it was because it coincided with a Board meeting rather than evidencing a burning desire to see a game. He would have seen a wonderful show of support for the club which did the supporters great credit. He would not have heard the innumerable conversations about Wenger. Of more concern to him will be projected cash flows for next season which will be being prepared with or without Champions League participation. He will be doing a simple sum about the necessary cost to recover it. He may not think it is worth spending Β£50 million plus to secure Β£30 million- ish but the real consequence will be the drop in revenue from lower gates and non- renewed season tickets especially in Club Level and the difficulty of negotiating top dollar commercial contracts. That will drive his decision – making re Wenger.
Ultimately though I suspect Wenger will be agonising over whether to call it a day at the end of the season. So much depends on 4th place which in the most ironic sense is a trophy now.I believe it is time for a dignified change and can never countenance wanting Arsenal to fail but there are many out there who would sacrifice the CL next year if this meant au Revoir to Wenger. But if he pulls it off for a 17th successive year Kroenke won’t feel pressure to push him knowing what a buffer to the Board he is and sitting in Denver the clamour from N 5 is a lot more difficult to hear
“swallow it and back on the horse”
π
paging Mr Smallballs
@105 Oskar
“After Cole left Clichy suffered serious foot injuries which limited his appearances until the β07-β08 season when he started all 38 league games and was quite brilliant.”
A lot people said we lost the momentum to the title in 2008 after we draw away to birmingham (at which eduardo broke his leg). I agreed too. Then you remember whose mistake cost us the win within the dying seconds of the game? Did you need me to tell you ?
Then he made far too many fatal mistakes that when he left, not many fans are as furious, we just let him go quietly, thinking we get rid of a burden.
When you compare him to Sagna, Bacary is a true first class qualty player.
thunderT
re Jack’s red eyes
it’s sad isn’t it that it’s becoming more of a rarity to see a player showing he gives a genuine flyin f**k
honest to god emotions – no fake crest thump on the chest
real stuff
Really measured comments from both the ‘holic and Blogs. I just feel a real sense of sadness to see us so out-classed and I, for one, wouldn’t want to be Wenger at this time no matter how much money he’s on.
His loyalty towards Arsenal appears to be now backfiring on him – I’m pretty sure that time will show that others in the Arsenal set-up (board, CEO etc) are more responsible for the current scenario but are lucky they don’t have to face the media on a day-to-day basis when I find it hard to believe that a man as intelligent as himself enjoys having to spout the same old platitudes when defending his players. Not that he had to last night. They were simply outplayed and outclassed.
#114
what i forgot to say was – what’s also sad about players’ goonerdom , and a real measure of it’s rarity , is our reaction to it when we see genuine examples of it
like hen’s red and white teeth
abc, ultimately, the referee’s mistake : it wasn’t a penalty π
cba, good stuff
no doubting your goonerdom ollie
god bless your gooner hair !
π
I’m sure that Arsene is gutted at where he has taken the team/ the level Arsenal is at now during his watch.
he will be hurting. just how strong is he to continue down this path. his principles of inserting raw talent directly into the first team, paying wages players haven’t really earned.
seems the whole world is against him.
hope the players will play their hearts out for him for the remaining games.
personally i don’t think that the board will act out of respect for him. otherwise we might have had a go at pep.
#see above but with loads of sense making instead or as well
cba @112 – Well said Sir, always worked for me.
Have you got the horse? π
I shall be like Tonto to your Lone Ranger, like Trampus to your Virginian, like … umm … well, you get the drift.
π
according to Lardy McBig Arse dining on a plate of the most delicious looking sausage and eggs – adjacent – “yer man with the no legs couldn’t have killed her”
you heard it here first
tabloid hacks lay down your crayons
ooohh
elllllo mr smallballs
always a pleasure to be typing in your company
a hemm hmm
*scratches self and stands proud*
a hemmmm
yeah
didn’t think that one through , did i
meant to say i’m always proud when i’m typing in your company
sheesh
still jarred
Haha π
always been a Bonanza man , me
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/65976000/gif/_65976826_pistorius_floor_plan624.gif
Some of the logic of Pistorius’ account still doesn’t add up for me.
I’ve just realised I’ll be hoping for a BarΓ§a win tonight for a very simple reason : Berlusconi.
I’ll be watching the other game though, of course.
http://www.francefootball.fr/#!/news/2013/02/20/142637_aulas-une-volonte-de-nuire-a-l-ol.html
heh, fuck off Aulas. Especially as last weekend you only had to come back from London when Bordeaux had to come back from Kiev….
millions watched as we were stuffed and made to look second best again.Three significant weeks await ? you’ve been saying that for months hoping it’ll come good when you know it won’t.
Afternoon all.
How the fuck Aaron got to start ahead of him tonight is a mystery.
I’m afraid I have to disagree with this one, sir.
If TR7 would have made the starting line up then it should of been in place of Santi, not Aaron. A midfield of Artea, Jack and Rosicky would have been ripped to shreds and would have offered way too little cover to a defence that was always going to be under the kosh.
I really like Rosicky, I like his directness, but I have to agree with the above poster that questioned if his absence seems to make him better in everybodies eyes. Don’t get me wrong, when he’s good he’s great, but I’m afraid we’ve seen way too little of that over the last few seasons. His absence outweighs his contributions at least five to one. We just can’t relie on him for any sustained period of time and he’s now coming to an age that it will be harder for him to fight back from niggles and knocks. I think injuries have pretty much robbed him of what could of been a stella career, but it just hasn’t happened, like with Diaby, sad, tragic, but maybe just time to cut our loses and bring in some players who may not be as skillful, but can contribute on a more regular basis.
Dr Faustus @10.
To say that x defender from us is better then y defender from them is an exercise in futility. They top their league and have one of the best defencive records in Europe. Their defence is better, full stop.
Excellent reports from the front Steve T, Trev, TS, TTG, Delia, N7 and Wind, cheers for that.
a stella career Heh, that’s more in my line of work. π³
Heh at Stella Career.
I have to disagree though, he showed it last seasons, and showed it in his few appearances this season : Rosicky’s still very much got it and contributes a lot.
Witness, among others, that amazing trademark sliding tackle to get the ball back in the middle of the park yesterday.
What I mean is I can perfectly understand starting Ramsey ahead of him for team balance or such, but
his absence seems to make him better in everybodies eyes
is what I object too.
Always loved him I admit, but it’s his actual presence in these recent appearances that made him look just great.
to not too of course.
Today is officially ‘can’t spell day’.
I have to say the same, Ollie, TR is playing not only with skill but desire and increases the tempo of the game for Arsenal in the best way. I certainly never meant that we should expect him to be un-injured and playing top class for years to come, maybe not even the rest of the season! But right now, he is fit and playing with more effectiveness than most our midfield, and he deserved more time to influence the game in my opinion.
How many one-touch passes did we play last night? So few. For all that Arsenal has been labeled as (and even blasted for) being a ‘tippy-tappy’ team, I saw precious little tippys and tappys last night. Everything seemed more like labored, 2, 3, (4) touch passing to rather static players. At our best, a player was making a run. TR specifically shifts that dynamic and brings the best of ‘tippy-tappy’ back to the side by moving the ball quickly, effectively, and creating openings to attack. Obviously, Santi, Arteta, Jack have the capacity to play like that as well, but the play has more often felt lethargic and directionless of late.
As for as ‘Brand’ goes, Arsenal’s Brand eight years ago was the most beautiful team to watch in the world (even more than Barca), and we were lethal and successful. But even when we didn’t win, the style was compelling, and that drew support. We haven’t just lost trophies these past few years, we’ve lost some of our style (on the field).
But, related to what I shared at the beginning of the drinks, there are a number of players on our team now with world class talent- they need more teammates of similar skill AND a more coherent, cohesive style to play in. I think we’ve lost some of that element of our ‘Brand’.
Cheers.
Ollie.
I’d agree that he was one of our best players against B’burn, but that’s just tantamont to being one of the tallest of the Seven Dwarfes. There’s also no denying that his return last season gave us a boost, but that’s kinda my point, he was out for a large chunk of that one and has missed a lot of this term too.
If he could get an extended run then I’ll probably have to change my opinion. I just can’t see it happening.
Hope to be proved wrong though.
yep, I think I can agree with all of that, pik.
Drinks on me.
but he was also very good against Bradford and Olympiacos. And yesterday.
Actually, now I realise: very good but he brings bad luck, that must be it π
Well wouldnt it be sweet if TR scored winner against LWCs again huh?:) I am biased a bit since same as Ollie ..I just like him too much as a player, but I think that Arsene would be really stubborn to not play him more than he has so far.
Yesterday our only clearly worked chance to score the goal went through him when he found Feo with pin point pass which allowed him to cross to OG who should have scored.
Thing is I cannot see too much where he would fit should all Poldi, OG and Theo play …(which they should since they are by far our most consistent attacking trio). Santi has AM position pretty much occupied and thats the place where TR thrives the most…however ..with Santi deployed on the left ..he can fit in and run on midfields and defences along with Jack with Arteta securing place behind them. Actually ..I would love to see that against Villa.
These are trying times and no mistake. I find it hard to take almost all of the press and social media seriously. One worrying sign is my increasing respect for Garry Neville whose riposte to Pers Morgan showed a profound degree of respect for our club and this from a man who used to kick our wingers to pieces . But in his condemnation of Motormouth or MotorTweet Morgan he showed that great football teams are long- term entities and that truly great ones- and we support a truly great one -have an identity that transcends a run of poor form. Indeed while our ‘ crisis’ is of huge concern to us,it would seem like a storm in a teacup to a Portsmouth or Coventry or even a West Ham fan. Indeed the LWCs have never been able to seriously think about a sustained spell at Europe’s top table and they are far from certain to sit there next year either.
The problem is that the crap spouted by websites and papers is largely worthless. So Vermaelen thinks Wenger is the man for the job still. Well what else would he say if it might mean a new manager coming in who might not fancy himself as a centre back? How does the Mail know Arsene sat alone behind a locked door for 25 minutes last night if he was indeed alone? Personally I wouldn’t believe the Mail if it told me tomorrow was Thursday.
Surely any transfer speculation is completely unfounded given the uncertainty at the club. Wenger will be focused on 4th place this season not next season and certainly won’t be planning transfer swoops at this stage not knowing what funds will be available next year.
Nevertheless despite this I find myself thinking how if I was an Arsenal director I would deal with the Wenger situation. He will be treated with dignity whatever happens,I think we can be sure of that and there may be moves to send him upstairs to a place on the Board albeit not the Director of Football poisoned chalice. This would be a mistake in my view and everyone else I speak to about it. He would be a Minister without portfolio but still exerting a strong influence on the club which might unnerve a new manager or irritate an arrogant one( not that Mourinho would come) But in case anyone forgets ( and on this site they wouldn’t)
Wenger has given 16 years of tremendously committed service to our club. We may not rate everything he has done but it is fair to say that very few other managers could have taken the Arsenal of 1996 to where they are today in prestige terms or in financial terms. His best years are some way behind him but what years they were! I hope in all the feeding frenzy now ensuing we can all find some sympathy for a man who has made many mistakes but could never be accused of not caring. Even at Β£7 million plus a year Arsenal have had the best of the bargain for most of the time he was with us.
Cheers, Ollie! I think I’m biased as well because of who he inherited the shirt from π
HA, PiK! π
Good post TTG. Have to admit I was kind of hoping tomorrow would be Friday anyway π
Eandy.
Against a team like Villa, whose defence makes ours look as watertight as a ducks bottom, we should give all our attacking players a chance.
Put TR7 in for Ramsey and go for it full guns blazing.
Piss Morgan is the biggest prick on the planet.
He comes from such a long line of pricks that his family tree is probably a cactus. π
Thats what I meant H2H, Arteta, Jack, TR7, with Santi, OG and Theo in front of them, why not.
A quick word on team selection. I think Arsene got most of the big decisions right last night, given what was available to him.
We have looked at our best and most balanced this term with Jack in the number 10 spot. For me, it was a no-brainer to play him there, particularly as it allowed us to field an extra defensive midfielder and take a little of the defensive weight off his shoulders.
I have no problem with the concept of sending Ramsey out to run his heart out for 70 mins and then bringing on Rosicky when the game began to stretch. It was the right approach for a game of this type, even if we got beat. Hopefully, TR will get some starts in the weeks to come, and I thought AR did terrifically well, as noted above.
Where I think Arsene got it badly wrong was the omission of Giroud. Throughout the first half we had no out ball – we kept clearing it and watching it come straight back, as Theo was beaten to headers by defenders who didn’t even need to jump. We swung crosses into the box at no one. Worst of all, we struggled to get anything going on the flanks, and Walcott was marginalised.
Personally, and this will probably not be a popular view, I would have started Cazorla on the bench (and this way my view before the game too). He is a great little player, but a luxury in a game where you’re going to have to work as hard as we quite evidently were. His tracking back is not the strongest part of his game, he’s not as effective as Jack in the number 10 spot and, to be totally frank, he’s not on a great run of form and would have been eaten alive down the middle by Schweinstiger and Martinez. He’s another one I’d have been happy to see arrive in the latter stages.
Finally, just to note, we were undone by two principal problems:
(i) we were extremely vulnerable at left back. Vermaelen worked hard, but he looks uncomfortable in that position, he was clearly targeted all night long and all three goals originated from that flank; and
(ii) our passing at the back was woeful, particularly in the first half. It’s hard to know how much of this was down to our players and how much down to the high quality of their pressing, but our centre backs and Arteta gave the ball away for fun at the top of our final third. We actually seemed to find it easier at times to pick our passes in their half than in our own. Fair play to Bayern – they had done their homework, because this has been an issue all season when opponents press high.
As others have suggested elsewhere, that Bayern performance harked back to the golden days of 2004. Power, pace and steel. I would dearly love to see those become our hallmarks again – hopefully lessons can be learned.
TTG – that’s a great post.
I’ve no problem with criticism of the manager: he gets stuff wrong and no one should be above reproach. Who knows, it may even be that his time has finally come.
But I find it really hard to endure some of the abuse that has been thrown at him this last week by both the press and people who have the temerity to declare themselves “supporters” of this club. He deserves more. We all do.
The day will come, soon enough I suspect, when Arsene Wenger is no longer manager of Arsenal FC.
When there will no longer be an easy figure of blame for the half wits at Le Grove, no bogeyman to throw cheap insults at when the team have lost and we’re all upset. No-one for the celebrity fans and scorned former players to pile in on after a defeat.
And someone else will need to assume the manager’s office. And his job will be made no easier by those who feel it is within their remit to “drive out” a manager they decide is not up to scratch, or by those who whip their fellow supporters into a frenzy of wounded pride.
Partly it hurts to hear the insults directed at Arsene Wenger because I admire him as a human being. But mainly it hurts because he’s the manager of Arsenal. And I don’t want to hear our manager, whoever he might be, being so roundly abused – it degrades the role and the club. We should be so much better than that.
COYG
Ollie,
Thanks.
I wasn’t- we’d have to watch another tense and exhausting game then!
Good stuff N7 I agree with a lot of that.
Although I had, pre game, opted for Theo to start through the middle. Bayerns defenders are not the fastest on the planet and I thought Theos speed would cause them problems, but with us just whipping balls into the middle Theos threat was virtualy nil. Not a bad selection, just bad tactics (i’ll eloberate on that in a future post).
Good stuff, as usual N7. Particularly your 2 points.
In other news, I may be in Qatar for the end of the season.
Although I’m trying my level best to make sure I don’t go there before the Wigan game, so that I don’t miss any game I was planning on attending.
Fingers crossed.
Just been back-drinking and apart from the odd nutter it was time well spent, good work all.
12 games to go plus what is effectively a friendly in Munich, we have the team we have and must back it all we can to give us as good a platform as possible to improve from for next season.
On a completely different topic:
How long, approximately, would a cab ride from Paddington to Finsbury Park take on a Friday evening at about 9-ish? Assuming traffic must be relatively light around then so shouldn’t be more than 20 minutes, right?
I should think far less than 20 minutes, Lars.
Were are you staying? The old Pembury? π
A thing I’ve noticed is that this team has been compared to past versions. Putting aside the Invincibles who were a one in a million team, I think compared to past versions we are now actually not that bad. We have some great players and I honestly think that the sum of the parts should be better then the whole we are seeing.
If I were to be kind I could put this down to us being a fairly newly assembled team, point in case LJW after being out for just over a year came back into a group he hardly knew. Understanding needs to be nurtured, players given time to bed in and acclimitise, partnerships takes time to florish, however I’m afraid our “problems” are a little deeper then that.
I don’t think it’s a personel thing, I thing it’s a coaching and tactics, or lack of them thing. I don’t know what goes on on the training ground but it’s plain to see that it’s either not enough or it’s not really working.
What’s up with our set pieces?
Corners and free kicks seem to be more hit and hope then adhering to any real cohesive plan.
Defending them is even worse, at the begining of the season we looked pretty solid, now I shit myself again everytime a ball comes in. Why is it that we can defend every zone except for the one where the opposition, more often then not unchallenged, score from? What the fuck happened?
Why are we still playing a formation that was built around players long since departed? It’s just not working. We are constantly running into walls, but we keep plugging away with the same movement, the same rigid formation.
Tactics, which tactics? We seem unwilling, or even worse, unable to change when things aren’t going our way. This complaint is compounded by the mandatory 70th minute substitution that more often then not looks more premeditated then part of a grand scheme hatched to suit the game in progress.
We hear the constant gripe about us playing with the handbrake on, well maybe that’s it’s only setting, because honestly, except for those ten magical minutes against Wet Spam and the crazy game against Reading I’m pretty sure that the handbrake hasn’t slipped out of the on position, maybe it’s broken!?
Do we study our opponents as well as we ought to and prepare accordingly? On this seasons evidence I would say no.
What to do, what to do?
I think we need to take a good hard look at what happens throughout the management/coaching level, it’s all well and good to just point the finger at one man, but just replacing him is not going to magically transform us, I think he needs help, if he wants it or not.
We need more specialists coaches to get the basics drummed into the players (especially in defence) if you look at yesterdays game, Bayern weren’t spectacular, their briliance was in their simplicity. Always looking for the easy pass, pressing fast and swift movement, all basics that we seem unable to master.
Our illustrious manager looks tired, he cleary needs help, but if for any reason he is unable or refuses to delegate the load then maybe it’s time we seriousy need to access his position. I really hate saying it, but the buck will stop at him, this is his team, he has total control over the footballing side of our club and if we fail it is his failure and therefor the consequences should be paid by him.
Finally, for those comparing us to how Bayern are run, Louis van Gaal won the Bundesliga, the domestic cup and took Bayern to the CL final in the same year, still didn’t stop him getting the sack a year later.
Lars.
I’m sure a sherbet dab would cost quite a bit more then this;
Take the Circle Line.
Paddington β Edgware Road β Baker Street β Great Portland Street β Euston Square β Kings Cross St. Pancras (change train) Kings Cross St. Pancras β Highbury & Islington β Finsbury Park
That should keep the wallet firmly brimming. π
*Kings Cross change to Victoria line
Mornington Cresent!
What??
Oh..
Ttg:
Good post @ 142. I agree with most and just take a little issue with the last paragraph.
You contention that his best years are “way behind him” is exactly what Piers Morgan was saying. And the day you have “sympathy” for a man who earns over Β£100k a week is the day you really should fire him..!
I just fail to see how he could have been a worse manager today than he was 10 years ago. Do you get worse as a manager with more experience?
I would actually contend that he’s a better manager today than he was 10 years ago! He’s worked bloody miracles to keep us in contention amidst the re-development of a new stadium & the property market collapse during the highbury development or when the Sheiks and Russians came on the scene and distorted the market completely.
We’re just not as competitive as we once were. But there are changes on that horizon too with FFP, new sponsorships and a fourth team now emerging with some stellar young players.
We’ve been in the top two in the league for his first 9 years at the club and in the top 4 ever since.
We absolutely do have issues of that, there can be no doubt whatsoever: the mental fragility of the team, defensive indiscipline, the lack of comparative commercial revenue and the widening gap between the top tier teams in the PL/CL and ourselves.
But the only reason we have such high expectations is largely because of Wenger.
Remember how often we won things before he came on the scene ?
Thankfully we have a board who seem to see sense and who support him unilaterally……!
I would actually contend that heβs a better manager today than he was 10 years ago!
I would have to disagree.
Yes he has done briliantly keeping us in contention during the transition, but we’ve moved now. We (according to all accounts) have quite a bit of money in the bank but are still woefully short in some areas of the field (e.g keeper and striker) This is not good management.
Ten years ago Arsenal had a swagger, we had big fucking hairy balls, we were scared of no one and came on to the field briming with confidence.
This is what we are hearing in post match interviews lately;
βWe were a bit nervous, Bayern were full of confidence and we paid for it.β
OK, that happens, but then this;
βYou could see every one of their players was confident to play at full power and confidence – it is not our case at the moment.β
Why not? Why are our little lambs so meek?
Whose job is it to build their confidence and fire them up for these occasions?
I couldn’t imagine the Wenger of ten years ago bleating to the press like that.
Ollie@155: Cheers for that. And I’ll be staying not too far from the Pembury – just up the road at my usual place, the eminently named London Highbury Hotel π
H2H@157: money is not (too much of) an issue here, I mainly want to avoid sitting on the Piccadilly Line for an eternity…
You wouldn’t have to use the Picadilly Line at all mate.
H2H: true, I wouldn’t – but I wouldn’t save too much time either π
http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/furious-wolves-fans-scream-f-off-to-all-their-players-after-they-get-beat-at-barnsley/
Hey, back up!
I was locked out for a while.
Sorry about that. Server now well and truly whacked with the big hammer…
Woah, Barca have got one ugly arse kit on.
No probsb guv’, just glad you’re back.
Yep, the ‘holic is back on.
Gala vs Schalke on the telly here.
Aaah, the bar is open again – was starting to feel all parched here!
Milan v Barca here. I want both teams to lose, but I think I want Milan to lose more.
Reckon your tripping on some of them Mushrooms mate that plain white kit Barca are wearings lovely π
π
Galatasaray 1-0
Heh@172!
Nearly 1-1.
I’m exactly with you on that game, Lars 171.
Could have been 2-0 just there, I think I chose the right game to watch π
This one is interesting in trying to decide who’s got the daftest hair do.
(Poohole, as 6 times former winner, is not included)
I have to say that every time I have seen Barca this season they have been pretty static. I get the feeling that at times they are all waiting to see what Iniesta and Messi shall come up with. Cesc is wasted in some wierd left wingish position where he rarely gets the ball and his main task on the few occasions he does get the ball seems to be to give it to Iniesta or Messi as quickly as possible.
Everything that we have been accused of in terms of slow sideways passing in later years, Barca are doing right now. At times in this game, when they switch play from wing to wing it’s so slow that many of the Milan players are actually walking across to cover the spaces.
1-1
That half was nothing to write home about. Barca tippy crappy going nowhere, Milan keeper had nothing to do.
1-0 to A.C(raphaircut) Milan.
Joe,
It’s a really interesting point about whether managers decline with age. I am almost exactly the same age as Wenger and working about 60% of the time although my wife would suggest it is more. I think in some ways I am better at what I did and I also notice other ways in which I don’t have the sharpness I had before. Part of Wenger’s problem is so many people have latched on to his style. Newcastle sign all the best,cheap French players and even Allardyce looks at the Opta stats in detail to see who is declining physically.
My contention is Wenger’s judgement is less certain. A couple of years ago I was moaning to Bob Wilson about Fabianski and he told me that very day Wenger had asked his opinion of the goalkeeping situation. Bob is very loyal and doesn’t speak publicly out of turn but he was very clear that Wenger bid in excess of Β£ 20 million for Pepe Reina which was rejected by Liverpool( phew!) . Bob also said that he was certain Shay Given was not good enough on crosses to help the defence in this respect.This sort of suggests what Bob told him. Reina isn’t the only goalkeeper in the world nor remotely the best but we have not brought in either the back- up to Szczesny or put a more experienced keeper in ahead of him. That,the public Zaha quotes and the vacillating in the transfer windows all suggest to me he is not so clear in his judgement now. Maybe having David Dein there would help but although we had the Malzs,Diawaras and Alberto Memdeses being signed it didn’t matter because we had such quality around him. Nobody moaned about people being played out of position when we had Henry or Petit in that situation. They do when it is Ramsey or Walcott. I think his confidence and surefootedness is less but he is still a wise old bird . One observation never made about him is how many great players he spotted who other clubs coveted. Fabregas,Clichy,Nasri,Song and RVP were all his discoveries and two were players he converted into stars in different positions. Nobody comes near him as a star finder.
Interested to hear other views.
EbouΓ©time soon.
Possession 75-25
Score 0-1
Huh, weird. The greatest team is toothless.
Holic is that link working now? Yet again apologies about last night a devil has gone into me!
You heard it here first…. Moyes will take over in the summer with Arsene moving ‘upstairs’.
(and that’s come from wee Davy himself)
Fucking come on Barça. I fear all these results are playing in the hands of Man U.
I’ll say it again, I think Bayern will bottle it again in the final.
2-0
I don’t think Wenger will ever move ‘upstairs’, I know it’s a commonly heard fantasy, but I don’t think that’ll interest him in the slightest.
Oh fuck, please tell me it’s not true H2H.
If only because once more it would make me the most predictable jinx in the world, seriously.
Sorry Ollie, it’s true.
ACraphaircut Milan 2 Badshirtalona 0
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh H2H.
Fucking shit weekend, fucking shit midweek.
Holics can you please test on the main home page that you can download the android app?
You have to stand strong to beat Barca not let any space and fair play those cunts deserve to loose once a while!
So I don’t have to watch Bordeaux vs Kiev tomorrow, I know Kiev will win :'(
194 Ollie.
Yep, it’s enough to make you wanna take up drinking……..
Oh.
I seem to be able to download it, ATG
Assist / goal / tabs/ or nothing?
Oh yeah,
Never had a doubt! π
heh, well in NorCal.
I wonder if I’m better at assisting or jinxing. Leaving all humility aside, I’m pretty good at both, I have to say.
Game done. Dutch commentater talking like it’s all over, a bit premature if you ask me.
We stuck three past them at the same stage last year, no reason why the tippys from tappy up land can’t do the same in the return leg.
1-1 final score.
I hope Barça go through, but doubt they will.
Of course there will be people dancing about them being out. Presumably the same people who were happy for Chelsea to beat Napoli last season….. π :s :'(
Cheers Ollie!
Ollie I hate Barca and I hope they will fail at anything!
1) We were most unfortunate to draw Bayern π 2) TR Should have started 3) Gibbsy is truly missed π 4) Power is indeed missing 5) Selling RVP to the enemy was the biggest piece of sh*t this club has ever done π 6) Playing Villa should be a walk in the park after taking on zee Germans π Nite all π
No Spanish sides in last 8?
Jeez, AC parked the bus and Barca had no answer … the manager has to go!! Looked a lot like our game yesterday.
Thanks, ttg, for including Clichy among your list of great players we lost (#184), Earlier in this drinks session I was saying the same to abc who only remembers a Clichy cockup for which certain gooners wanted him out of the club. The same gooners, I suspect, who constantly call for Wenger’s head…
Oskar
Ollie @ 191
Perhaps to take the Academy job a year early?
OTD
The comparison is irrelevant! How many games did baca lost in the league this season?
I can understand your frustration with the media and other fans but I believe perhaps it’s time. One more thing to add. Pay your respect when it’s due… He has indeed lost it and I hoped he would recover but it has not happened! For one I hope he turns things around if not that will be the end!
Arsene will be always in hearts but one he will leave I believe it’s better if remember him on high and not this low as we are now.
I’m sorry but the direction of the team has been put a side and there is only one person to blame for this and this is Arsene.
It pains me to say like I have written before there is no greater pain than to loose you best manager ever!
Then when you look at the team it’s not the team it’s the manager who tells em how to play and it failed. As much as I’m confirming and to what I have seen throughout there is no a great deal to forward to!
However another win and we are back on track
When we loose those media cunts will latch on again!
Hey Arthur,
I just sorted out an android emulator on my Mac and looked at your app. It’s cool!
Still don’t know how I did it. Love hitting random keys me π
at reports Wenger is going to be handed a massive sum of money to spend this summer, especially as the players named in the report as his targets are distinctly average.
I know all of this has to be taken with a huge pinch of salt, but seriously… does anyone really trust the man to sign the right players, given some of the rubbish he has bought in the last five years?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=0Rp1h8-tdxE&NR=1
supermac said au fait
i watched it again
i particularly enjoy the editing timing of the generously proportioned fella getting escorted out – 9 minuteish
the scourge of the south east – i’m guessing – not
for any youngsters who may be reading this
yup
it is
its him
the chant
he ate all the pies
yup
him
@ 154
Let the wallet take the strain, and more importantly get to the pub this side of Saturday.
Wolfie and I will be waiting. 8)
Getting to the pub quicker is the main idea, zico π
Blogs on the “be the best you can be” wavelength again today. Good stuff.
Got my 13 year old with me on Saturday. What chance do I have of sneaking her into the tollie garden?
Is BTM in rehab?
Between ‘slim’ and ‘none’, Steve T. You could be just inside while she’s just outside though.
good points H2H @154
Morning all
Last Night Brady was on RTE and said the following:
He said Bayern were one of the most physically impressive teams he had ever seen. Almost all of them well over 6ft. He noted the contrast in style between the physical work rate and efficiency of Bayern and the total technique of teams like Barca. He singled out Mandzukic as an outstanding centre forward because he combines the both physical power with technical ability.
He mentioned the fragile state of confidence after the Blackburn result as an element. He said that while we didnβt play well β we played against a seriously good team.
He said that the club were in a very strong place financially and that was largely down to the mastermind of Wenger. He said the club were behind Wenger and that he believed Wenger will be given serious money in the summer.
He largely dismissed the FA cup and league cup as trophies. For the top clubs there are only two trophies. He said that winning the lessor cups doesnβt mean youβll keep your job referencing Dalglish and Redknapp for missing qualification…..
Speaks a lot of sense, that Brady fella π
I have to say Ollie – when you were predicting 0-3 before the Bayern match I think there were many people here in silent agreement and watching the game behind the couch!
Yeah…Ollie kiss of death-ed the game..so actually your fault we lost π π
I see there are still tickets available for the Villa match at this late stage and Blackburn failed to sell out. I’m sure the board might be concerned that ticket sales are definitely slowing down and declining?
Wenger out! I can’t sell my tickets on the ticket exchange π
Wenger to be given ‘serious money’ in the summer?
I will NOT be holding my breath on that one! Come the end of this season I think I’ll ‘take the summer off’ and ignore all football news till we win our annual piece of silverware.
Oh and did I mention? Arsenal will have a BRAND NEW FAN at the end of August, courtesy of the Camberwell Gooner Management.
Beaming.
Congrats, Camberwell!
Big up Camberwell, and congrats Mrs Camberwell.
Golazo is spelt with a ‘z’ not a ‘s’. Thank you!
Great news, Camberwell!
Thanks all. I’m currently reading up on the effects of showing a red and white football shirt to a newborn.
Will also experiment with negative conditioning by show him/her an all white football shirt, a cockerel standing on a basketball and a chimp while banging pots and pans and generally making unpleasant noises at the same time.
Ought to do the trick!
Well in Cam’.
Congratulations.
===
Cheers Bath.
The League is what matters. Come on Arsenal!!
Cheers H’ π
Congrats, Camberwell.
Camberwell. A great Arsenal name. π
“…given some of the rubbish he has bought in the last five years?”
Okay, fair point not overjoyed.
But buying young is always a gamble, isn’t it?
And its not just AW.
Every manager and their scouting team make educated guesses. There is no such thing as a guaranteed success. Great players flourish in some places and founder in others. Its the mental bit.
Lookit Boateng at Milan. In years past, who would’ve predicted that?
Its not an exact science, is it?
Exhibit A: Bebe at ManuIOU. Sure, they have plenty to spare, but it starkly makes the point.
Exibits B &C: Sheva & Torres at Chels., both devastating players when on song, but were (using your vernacular) total rubbish at Chels.
Exhibit D: Andy Carol.
Now, to support the sublime nose AW has for talent, there are many examples. Henry? Pires? RVP? Nasri? The one, the ONLY Francesc Fabregas, Song, Rosicky, Theo Walcott, Sagna, Clichy, Skilachi (just kidding with that last one, btw).
I just think you may be a bit hard on the man, that’s all.
Cheers.
And I’m surely furstrate at AW, just for the record.
But I’ll admit to overreacting and being quite the over-zealous supporter (who lost his share of (probably foolish) bets in the last week, BTW). Hard to argue that he man’s not a genius. But nobody’s perfect.
Whenever I ask folks; okay supposing you’re right and its AW out, with whom do we replace him? Usually just blank stares and a lot of mumbling.
AW has been a big part of building the club up. Let’s not knife him now that he’s in a touch patch. And in my humble opinion, Piers Morgan is an interstellar-sized twat, and the Twitter police should cut off his finger tips.
I’ll stand by my TR7 over Santi any day of the week. Don’t get me wrong, Cazorla is a fantastic player; cannon of a shot; and I’m psyched he plays for us and not some other team. But we need something more direct. Less side-to-side, more penetrating runs at goal by a player with superlative field vision and a deft touch. (And its not rose colored glasses. I recall him from a few years ago as devastating. His form the last half of the season last year, mind, was fantastic.) Play the man AW!
Cheers all, and now, its back to the briefs!
Drinks for Homer, good posts!
Why are you posting a photo of that prick? :s
I’m trying to see if there’s a specific funny feature in that photo, but I can’t see it.
Ha! The post that was preceding mine as disappeared.
Thanks guv, no one wants to see that. π
Congratulations Camberwell.
This would never have happened had Arsenal been winning trophies. π
Thankfully, Rox hasn’t made the connection.
Yet. π
Ah , I see that it is time for the annual 70 mi warchest story from Arsenal.
Wonder if theres a single gooner out there who still believes in that BullShit.
heh zico
Sajit, as a basic policy, I don’t believe transfer speculation in the papers, doesn’t matter what time of the year it is or what named are bandied about.
Blame Ollie for jinxing our result with his 0-3 prediction? Sure 8)
Congratulations on the good news Camberwell! π
Congrats Camberwell.
Enjoy every minute.
Congrats Camberwell.
Just rely on the DNA.
@231
“Golazo is spelled with a ‘z’ not a ‘s’. ”
Is it spell azzhole? π
(Only joking ‘gov.)
Spell=spelled.
God bless. Can’t even get that right.
Oh yeah, nice one @ 200 NorCal! π
Sadly we started the first half still in the dressing room AGAIN !
Cazorla on the wing ? Said it here before, he isnt a winger. End of, no further discusion needed.
Positive from the match.
Jack ermm Jack and whats his name ? Oh yeah Jack !
Jack for captain !
All in favour say Ai !
Ai
Ai
Ai
Motion carried !
Evening all,
Congratulations Camberwell !
There’s another baby Gooner hiding in the bar, btw ……….
Just finished work and turned on the radio as Lyon v Spuds was kicking off.
Commentator: ” this has the feel of a real Champions League tie about it ………”
Why ???
Worth a read chaps, apart for 6th with a game in hand?
http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/wenger-critics-need-to-look-at-bigger-picture/1208091/#newsArchiveTabs=last7DaysNews
Spurs one nil down.
What are we meant to be hoping for here? I don’t really want them out of the Europa League as I reckon they could do with the extra games.
I’m settling on: win tonight on pens, despite suffering numerous broken legs and red cards. Make it all the way to the final only to lose on pens in the most mirth-inducing fashion imaginable.
Sound about right?
Liverpool manager Brendan Rodgers is drawing on the spirit of the ‘ghost goal’ – against Chelsea in the semi-final by Luis Garcia – that took the club to the 2005 Champions League final in a bid to turn around their Europa League tie against Zenit St Petersburg at Anfield on Thursday.
Full story: Daily Telegraph
As a manager he’s not good or bad.
He’s a medium. π
Thanks again for the kind wishes all.
Trev, ‘another’ baby gooner…?
Just back-drank. Blimey – congrats Camberwell, top work!
1h 20 before tonight’s big game.
AG 257, I’m just mistified at it being under ‘Horse Racing’ π
Trev 255 : Wind? π
Trev 256 : mind-numbing. Am I right in thinking Spuds have been in the Champions League only ONE season so far?
Muchos π
Cheers N7
Two young impresionable boys race to the park in Islington for a kick around.
“I’ll be Toni Kroos” says the first.
“Ok” says his mate. “I’ll be Phillip Lahm”………………….
More classic jinxing. I switch on and Spuds equalise.
Dembele, what a shot. Only regrets that he is not in red and white.
Ollie, I thought we want them to go through?
Fuck off Lyon, should have lost last weekend instead. Utter cunts.
I never want them to go through, lurky. Although in this case, I suppose I can live with it all right, especially against Lyon. But still. And with a last minute goal, it will give them a confidence boost. Extra time at least would have been welcome.
TrΓ©moulinas left mid tonight.
What a shit week.
I hope we’re only talkin Saturday to Friday thouh, N7…. :s
Where’s Eandy?!?
Just checked the scores, Sparta 1-0!
Ollie@274: let us indeed hope so. Anything other than a win on Saturday (and next Sunday, but let’s think about that later) and the season is all but over becuase we can not afford to drop any points at all right now.
I am here Ollie ..smiling impishly XD Chelski were lost long before this tie was about to start ..Sparta will go through!:P
Sparta all over Abramovich FC ..tear them a new one lads!
True Lars. In a strange way though, if we are to get 4 points out of the next 2 games, I think it’s better to get 3 on Sat and 1 the game after.
I know it’s not as good wrt Spuds, but anything but a win this SAturday, and it will be poison. A draw at Spuds can be considered acceptable.
but fuck, 6 points is better π
Good stuff, Eandy, fingers crossed that would be ONE good result this week (Bordeaux suffering at the moment though it’s still 0-0)
Ollie, I agree – let’s get six points π
lots of empty seats at Bordeaux,but Bordeaux score anyway
1-0 Girondins!
Bordeaux one up I see, good stuff:)
Lars and Ollie ,maybe a bit of one match at a time comes into play at this time of year.
Quite, wuif
Certainly so, washed up. I was just allowing myself to dream for a bit…
dream about winning 3-0 in Munich then.
washed up: well, one thing does not neccessarily exclude the other, right? π
Phew, Kiev missed an absolute sitter.
Sparta still hanging, Plzen leading Napoli 2:0…5:0 on aggregate..talk about competitions dark horse!
Vive les Tchèques!
Atmosphere sounds good in Bordeaux.
Yes! Girondins in the next round!
fuck me Cunts equalising in last minute ><
What a bunch of luck riding cunts. Fecking hate them.
I was giddy, but then I read that the Bus Stop got a very very late equaliser. Cunts. I’m as gutted as Eandy now.
Heroic effort by Sparta though. Espn pundits not giving them any credit at all in half time. Bleh …Viktoria Plzen has been most impressive though..beat 5:0 on aggregate a very strong side which is challenging for a title in Serie A is remarkable achievement (well they topped their group ahead of Atletico Madrid). So still one czech team in the mix.
Bordeaux vs Plzen in the final though.
(although judging by Bordeaux’ current level, I don’t see them getting any further, at least they got past this round for the first time in the last 5 attempts or something)
Haha that would have been great Ollie …oh ..and Rosickyesque through pass? Will it be Gervinhoed?
NorCalStyle:
Assist? Goal? Tabs?
Meh…
*celebrates*
Great throughball, Eandy, worthy of Master TR7 himself!
unlurky lurky π
Shit week continues
Depressed. Off to watch some Boardwalk Empire, or better sleep till Saturday.
Well in Ollie.
Nice assist Eandy.
Wish you better lurk Lurky.
Week from hell? Look on the brite side. It’s not the month from hell, is it?
Ask me in 3 weeks, i suppose. π
Once again I hear a manager say “no, there’s no point in practicing penalties because it’s so different from the real situation” – that is just astonishingly stupid. When is a training session ever anything close to a real game? If there is no point practicing penalties, then shouldn’t it be just as pointless to do anything at all in training? I mean, why practice free kicks, corners, defending, dribbling, shooting or anything? It’s not like in a real game, after all…
Hi everyone. Had only time to skim the drinks but I wanted to congratulate The Camberwell duo, lovely! Ollie, delighted your Girondins live to fight another day. The sun is shining π Now I have an elevator to catch π Good nite all.
I’ll be happy to see LWCs go all the way to penalties after extra time in the final … so long as they lose it, preferably with Bale missing the last attempt!
By the way … can someone elucidate for this exile what exactly LWC stands for? Yes I know, such ignorance is really appalling, but it’s 46 years since I left the old country.
Oskar
A great goal you scored there, Camberwell! Congratulations!!
Oskar
Well in Ollie.
I had no doubt, oh. ;).
Congrats on Bordeaux.
I see cuntski still lucky. I hope they use it all in the Europey league. Same with the little club up the lane. The more they have to play now the better.
Cheers all.
Oskar,
Lilly White Cunts
Or
Losers without class
Or
Little white cocks
Or
Live with chlamydia
Or
………
G’night abb.
Great stuff Bordeaux, Ollie π
Sorry Eandy and lurky π
Up the Arse! Wolfie will agree on that much, at least…
Left-legged Whackoff Chimps?
Sorry Clive. I went childish again. π
Congratulations Camberwells !
heh@ NorCal
This weeks been a bummer so far. Lillyputs and the russian mob winning. booo hooo!
But if this is a trend for london clubs to progress to the next stages with the last kick of the match, this bodes well for us (fingers,toes crossed! ) π
Any one here who listens to tuesdayclub? hillarious return
Ollie @ 263, cheeky! π
Well in @ 300 also Ollister, Eandy, TR7 himself would acknowledge that assist π
On the way home from a long shift at work, London’s nightlife is the designated entertainment for the night from these nightbuses hehe :p
@257, that was indeed quite a read.
(homer: self-inflicted head slap, followed by muttering, “my god, i’ve turned into an utter ass.”)
Seriously, excellent link.
Morning ‘Holic.
Hope you have a fine Friday.
Looks like we have a new CEO.
Looks like the shares are going up too. Markets happy or is this just a trick?
GPN: I am a Tuesday Club follower, and I sure as hell hope the latest episode picks up after the first 20 minutes that I have so far had the time to listen to. Fucking hell, what has crawled up Alan Davies’ backside? Moan moan moan moan moan with jerking knees is all he does these days, it seems.
I have given up on the Tuesday Club a while ago, Lars…
@240 Homer
“Whenever I ask folks; okay supposing youβre right and its AW out, with whom do we replace him? Usually just blank stares and a lot of mumbling.”
I will give you my answer : Laudrup, Heynecks (DortmunD), Loew(Germany)..
With 7.5m pounds a year, there are lots of talent coming in as manger.
If you give them the 4th largest wage bill in EPL, I don’t think they won’t bring a single fxxking trophy in 8 years.
However to ask Wenger out is not a classy act of any true Arsenal fan of the truly great club. I would have the patience to wait until 2014 summer when he choose to leave on his terms.. Meanwhile just lets support the battered old man and our great team 100%.
coygunners!!
I see PSG are slowly shedding their heritage. New badge on its way with PARIS in enormous and St Germain in much smaller. And no more Louis XIV’s kid bed – he was born in St Germain En Laye, you know ;).
Although strangely they are keeping the Fleur de Lys.
I think the St Germain bit will go eventually….
Well OK when I say heritage, they have also cleverly removed ‘1970’, probably to try and make people believe that they are a venerable club with a long history.
Loving today’s arseblog. I suspect Eandy will like it too π
I’m really appalled by the use of Anglicised words in Conf Calls with Orange.
They can’t speak French and they can’t speak English, and all that bastardisation of the language is just fucking laziness.
Depressing.
Heh yeah Ollie, I do love the Arseblog today and totally agree, image of Jack and TR running on defenses is really mouthwatering. Oh and anglicising words in other language is also awful…I hate when people around me use “czenglish” ..although I have found myself doing that from time to time as well (working in Irish company kinda gets on your brain:S)
Sagna out for Saturday? With a knee.
Time for Jenks to redeem himself.
Or do we trot out the Coq?
To be fair, he seemed to be hobbling after a certain challenge, in the first half, on Tuesday. I was amazed he lasted the game, wouldn’t have been surprised if he’d got subbed at HT.
He’s a proper warrior, as AW said.
http://www.francefootball.fr/#!/news/2013/02/22/112939_ayache-nice-ne-met-pas-le-frein-a-main.html
We should follow Nice’s example. According to this guy, they don’t play with the handbrake on.
I think Jenks is good option for right back, the ability is there, dont forget that he was great for us at the start of the season given the run of games he got. He is just bit rusty and I for one feel no worries about him starting.
Ollie, i guess they will transition into PSQ (Paris Saint Qatar) then.
Eandy, I’m with you on Jenks for rightback too, Coquelin offers more in attack but Jenks is more solid and doesn’t fall over at every little touch. If you watch the Blackburn goal again you will notice that when Le Coq lost the aerial battle he sat there complaining to/looking at the referee instead of trying to get up and win the ball back first, Blackburn scored about three seconds later. There was also the incident of his embarrasing dive in their penalty area, if he had put more effort into charging towards their goal when the defender blocked him the referee would have (just maybe) considered giving him and us a pelanty but he just felt a little contact and threw himself over like Bale stupidly does.
Indeed Cent, Le Coq should have tried to stay erect in the box. π
Heh @337. He should have stayed erect and thrust even further.
Right, that’s it – I’m off to London!
Safe trip, Lars. See you tomorrow.
Heh at 337
Lars, have a safe trip, mate, i envy you right now.
Lars in London for Villa.
The big question is will the intrepid Daily Fail photographers be able to get a snap of the Sweedish guys boat race or will he outsmart them again??
The challenge is on!
310 Abb – Cheers! Make that the Camberwell Trio!
Ah what the hell, suppose I should lay on a round considering the news. Put your plastic away, Lars π this one’s on me.
*Gratefully grabs a beer and raises the glass to toast the Cam’ Fam’. π
Just finishing up at work, and in traditional fashion I can hear the call of the saloon……
Must try and stay sober for The Feelgood Foundation EGM tonight, which by some quirk of fate, will take place near Finsbury Park.
I’ll let you all know if I find a war chest although what I would do with a bazooka and 5 machine guns that close to the seven sisters road probably doesn’t bear thinking about….. 8)
UTA
Didn’t realise we had Lars as well tomorrow. Oh dear Lord π
And tonite π
Oh dear dear dear dear Lord π
I hear Arsene has banned the sun from London Colney, if this is true then I’m so in love with this ‘new’ Arsene.
The weather is shit enough as it is, Cent π
Heh.
It won’t be easy because according to AHA the sun always shines on TV.
heh yourself ;D
Don’t overdo it, you furriners π >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Greetings! I’ve been following your weblog for a while now and finally got the bravery to go ahead and give you a shout out from Dallas Tx! Just wanted to say keep up the fantastic work!