Return Of Chamakh
Jan 31st, 2014 by 'holic
You know I am not a lover of speculation so it makes sense for me to devote transfer deadline day to a preview of Sunday’s Crystal Palace fixture so as to leave Saturday clear to write about our stellar signings at 10.59pm on Friday.
As far as the team news is concerned we have basically the same squad as went down to Southampton minus the suspended Matthieu Flamini but with Tomas Rosicky available again. My guess is we may see three changes to the team that started that match.
At the back there could be a recall for Kieran Gibbs at left-back, whilst further ahead it would not be a surprise to see Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain come in for Flamini and the experienced Rosicky replacing Serge Gnabry. The latter two changes should correct the issue with the perceived missing link between defence and attack on Tuesday night.
Of course all of that is subject to change should the aforementioned stellar signings materialise. In all seriousness anyone arriving between now and Sunday isn’t likely to be thrown straight into the side without at least a couple of training sessions to begin the process of acclimatisation.
Palace have certainly improved under our old track-suited, baseball cap wearing middle-aged friend. Since Pulis’ arrival they have picked up sixteen points from eleven games and moved up the table to fourteenth place. For some the surprise has been Marouane Chamakh. He is the visitors leading scorer with five goals to his credit. He is the ultimate confidence player, seemingly unable to turn it on when given occasional outings as cover.
Palace don’t travel well so I am looking for value with the ‘holic pound this weekend. 3-0 would be my punt of choice, but at a best of sevens I’ll avoid it. Instead I am on 3-1 at twelves. At least that way I am still in with a shout should we concede at any stage.
Striking A Chord
‘I am coming to terms with the fact that my participation in Arsenal’s journey will become a graudally diminishing one soon enough.’
If any of you missed Tim Stillman’s piece on Arseblog last (Thursday) evening then click on the link here. It is a subject about which I have contemplated writing in a similar vein, if not with the same degree of craft.
Don’t misunderstand what is being said. Arsenal will always be at the forefront of mine (and Tim’s) thoughts, I’m sure. They are ingrained on the heart, a gift from father and/or mother to son. However I have watched so many of my peers down the years change the way they support the club. The pubs around the ground these days do a roaring trade showing matches and I’m told generating an atmosphere that often beats that experienced in the Grove.
Tim nervously writes and offers self pity, selfishness, and entitlement as potential motivations, knowing full well the response such sentiments could evoke. The experience of watching the club at the Grove is changing. The perception of value for money is taking over. Where once the relative cheapness of tickets meant one would never question attendance at matches, so now people are looking more closely at the expense of a day ‘up the Arsenal’ (or indeed any other professional football club I would guess – this is not just an Arsenal phenomenon).
I have the good fortune to currently have a lower tier seat so my day at the game works out at around eighty or ninety pounds for ticket and travel plus a few shillings for Guinness. It has been interesting to see the interaction between season ticket holders and ‘mere’ silver and red members in recent days as the question of the eighth cup tie price has become an issue (season ticket holders having only paid for seven cup ties with their gold membership).
Value for money though can be taken as meaning just the expense of a day out. There is more to it than that. The whole matchday experience has changed, and not always for the better. The atmosphere for the big games is still special, but for a number of lesser fixtures it can be at best non-existent, or at worst poisonous when we haven’t produced the expected performance.
The proposed three percent increase next season only adds to the complicated relationship between club and supporters. There is a point, particularly valid tonight, where people will start to consider how their investment in their club is spent, and particularly if that investment is heading north for little return. There is a point at which people will start to vote to love the club in a different way on matchdays. It may not be next week, or next month, or even next year, but I think we all know what Tim meant. Most certainly I do.
Have a good one, ‘holics.
427 Responses to “Return Of Chamakh”
Hello
I already liked that new guy after the picture of him comforting that lad;
http://www.independent.co.uk/incoming/article8903717.ece/ALTERNATES/w620/Kallstrom-1.jpg
And after that;
Cheers Holic! Hope to see you sometime on Sunday.
Come on you Arsenal!
Essooooooooooooooo. Yes, Sunday I hope mate.
Spurs spot ugh
Top 4?
Holic, the title scared me. I thought we had signed Chamakh again!
Looks like I got stuck with the Man U spot. 🙂
My stat of the week is Palace have scored only 5 away from home all season.
Masterful blog, Holic. Top writing. Fully share those views. Not up Sunday so enjoy the day and I hope your punt comes home.
Thanks bath. You will be missed.
I haven’t been to an Arsenal match. The last time I was in London was 2003 which is BA ( Before Arsenal ) for me. I’m planning to come next season sometime and of course it will be a super special experience. I have owned season tickets for Baseball which means 81 home games a season. Talk about tedious. I gave them up ten years ago. I understand not wanting to pay top dollar to watch Cardiff and have the idiots around you slag off the team. My opinion is that the extra 25K seats or so that the Emirates has provided has let the ” riff raff ” in and taken from the Hardcore supporter experience. Then there’s the ” see and be seen ” aspect of having a 5 star stadium. The Piers Morgans of the world come out of the woodwork. The revenue it created is definitely a double edged sword
No offense meant to Cardiff btw 🙂
Well done, Guv’. I have a sneaking suspicion your pound is on the mark. You blessed London-based supporters should take heart, even at its worst, a day ‘up the Arsenal’ is likely far, far better than a day at Cowboy’s, make that, AT&T Stadium.
I’d have Chamakh back…if only for an excuse to play this during warmups – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LCYlrfH_5o
I’ll get me coat.
JKW.BMBD.
Arsegonian
Cardiff? Though I would have prefered to see more goals and sure some of them earlier, it felt so good to go to a game again 🙂
My last one before that was two years ago when TV5 scored both goals in a draw against Fulham
I hadn’t read Tim Stillman’s column this week so thanks for the pointer. It was indeed a very good read.
I only used Cardiff as the example cause they’re bottom. Like I said no offense but you get the point 🙂
Okay, have been knocked back by Newcastle on a Papa Cisse loan
I guess it’s safe to say we are also looking at loaning a striker, but without success!
I’d wager that of all these “Arsenal have been asking about” quotes, very few of them have any truth to them.
Always liked this song for its timelessness. Always true but never outdated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqvUz0HrNKY
Bob Dylan / Tracy Chapman strike force wouldn’t be too bad.
Top twenty but relegation position?
Nice preview Holic. I usually go for 2-0 as it has been our most regular home result and I hope we can stop them scoring. I hope Giroud scores them in the first two minutes and we can then take him off and wrap him in cotton wool as he has to carry a ridiculous workload this season.
Frankly the more. I hear about attempts to loan players the more farcical our planning. My admiration for Wenger is well known but his poker tactics regularly misfire on transfer deadline day. This was a chance to win the league but it’s a huge ask with one proper striker.
I may give Jim White a miss tonight
Evening H
My younger brother is a season ticket holder at the Grove,and was also at Highbury.
Whilst he can never remember missing a match at H unless he was seriously ill,he is far more ambivalent about attending every game at the Grove.More and more often he, and i might add loads of his mates who are also STH’s are watching the less important games at a local pub of choice.
He has become more and more disillusioned in the whole experience at our new stadium.
From the very overpriced warm beer and food,to the crass music and American style fanfare pre match, sarky match day stewards stopping you from doing anything remotely energetic during the game,he just doesn’t enjoy it.
I don’t think he has ever recovered from the introduction of All seater stadiums either.!!
So every time i hear from him after a match,quite frequently he is ringing from outside the Hostelry of choice.!!
He says the atmosphere inside a Pub full of mad Gooners watching the game live on a big screen,making enough noise to wake the dead,jumping up and down,’ having a good old jostle ‘ every time the Arse score,beats the ‘ sterile ‘ Americanized feel at the Grove.
So he is now much more selective of which matches he goes to see live,and lest people think what a waste of a season ticket,when he chooses the Pub over the Stadium,he always organises for someone else to have use of his seat.
So he has the best of both worlds,and as he frequently tells me,if he shuts his eyes,the Pub experience makes him feel he has gone back in time to Highbury,and what he often refers to
‘ As the Good Old Days ‘ when he and I used to stand side by side on the North Bank surrounded by a great army of fellow Gooners all jumping and jostling as one,roaring their unbridled support for
‘ Our Team ‘.
I truly believe our Generation had the very best of following the Arse at Highbury our spiritual home, that can never ever be replicated,and we will never see the like of again.
Cheers
The Sweeper.
Can we name one striker that has changed hands this window? Then can we name one who is better than Olivier Giroud or even Niklas Bendtner? Man City just struck out on their deals today with all their zillions. It’s not easy getting stuff done in January unless you deal with non contending clubs. And there’s a reason they’re non contending cause their players are crap.
I like the New Ground, but it will never be Highbury. Ever. I love going over The Arsenal to watch the football, but mostly to see me mates, who – the vast majority, I don’t see in any other context. I used to go to most games home and away. Now I can afford to go to about 3 to 6 matches a season, often only with the largesse and assistance of real mates. I still enjoy it enough to leave me wanting more after I’ve been. The day that changes I’m off for good.
I’m going on Sunday, only my second game this season.
Cant. Fucking. Wait.
Heartfelt, Holic, and always good for that.
Another 3% next season plus extra cup games to pay for is no joke, especially when one of the pre-paid seven was for Coventry. That means, of course, that for season ticket holders there was no differentiation in price between Coventry and a Champions League game.
When you throw ticket prices into the equation it does become a little difficult to stomach the fact that we are risking a potentially title winning season by going with one fit striker, plus Bendtner because we failed to offload him, and there apparently is no better player anywhere than Ju- Young Park.
And, yes, I do get the fact that it’s only a potential title winning season because the manager and players we already have have done so well.
Anyway, hope to see you Sunday, Holic.
I’m going to WD40 the crutches (and the knees) again tomorrow – no trains though, so it’s a drive to Cockfosters and the tube.
Have we, er ………………. 😉
Clive, Esso – wonderful stuff.
Nice one ‘holic.
I read Little Dutch’s column yesterday, was very good, he makes some fine points that too have raise here in the bar lately about how football is slowly squuezing out many loyal fans who simply can’t afford the ever rising prices.
I was a regular at Highbury until I left for foreign shores, but back then the highest price I ever paid was less then a couple of quid for a place on the North Bank, nothing like the prices of today, plus it was the same price regardles of the opposition.
Good stuff Clive.
Esso, have a great time mate.
Ah, the terraces at Highbury – thems was the days. Another reason I stopped going regularly was all seaters. One of my Arsenal mates started going to the Orient when the all seaters came in, just to get back that feeling of camaraderie. The great thing too was if you got a real moaner or bunch of nutters near you, you could move away.
Glad to hear I’m not the only one watching from afar. Staying in the pub and watching the game sounds much more convivial.
I’ve never managed to go to Highbury. So when it comes to see a game in real, watching it at the new home of football will probably be the highest of feelings I’ll enjoy during my life. Even if it means that I watch us vs Cardiff and I’m am seated way up under the roof where I have hard to tell which of our guys is having the ball and the people around giving me strange looks when I clap my hands, scream or jump up from time to time. It feels so damn good 🙂
When everything goes well I get to enjoy this once, maybe twice a year.
Don’t get me wrong Sweeper, I hear what you are saying and believe you that it isn’t the same anymore. But more than sorry I feel jealous 🙂
Okay officially done for the night 😉
Phew! What a night!
Bring on Palace 😆
H2H – 2 quid for a place on the terraces – fook, you must be older than me. 🙂
Can’t remember prices that far back. My first game was in March or April 1969, I think.
Btw
Reading when some of you putting up some stories from the old days is one reason I read almost every word on this side since I found it 🙂
Thanks Clive, Esso, Trev.
All of you really.
It’s you that keeps me going…
I also know someone who stands up in his own home when watching football on TV. Sitting down watching football just doesn’t seem right to him. Not me, I hasten to add.
I first paid £1.50 to stand. 1978-89 season. That season I went to virtually every game, including aways (4 games away against Sheffield Wendy in the FA Cup 3rd round alone), and that’s travel and beers as well, on a student’s income. Different world, and at the risk of sounding a right miserable old bastard, a better one as well – certainly in football terms.
dkg – my first games were in 1969.
North Bank in 1971, after decimalization was £1.10 I believe. That’s the first decimal price that sticks in my head at any rate.
That’s 78-79, not fucking 78-89. Fucking useless fingers!
Fook me, Esso, so I was paying shillngs back in ’69 (pre-decimalisation). Frightening.
I was born well pre decimalisation. My first pocket money was 1 shilling. But I was an out-of-town goner. First got to Highbury in 1978, and I distinctly remember terrace entry as being £1.50.
Why do I have this strange feeling that that’s it?
Brings a smile to my face when you think how many were creaming themselves with thoughts of Julian Draxler and AW gives us Kim Källström.
Like Uplympian earlier dreaming of Kim Basinger and waking up next to Kim Jong-Il. (Well, they’ve both got big tits – allegedly.)
Trev@25
You have nailed the key point. Bendtner turned down a move today and yet if HFB is injured he will be our main striker. There is such a lot of misinformation about that it is hard to know whether to believe anything you read but we have allegedly been knocked back for Cisse, Klose and Kalou and as I write we are supposed to have a bid accepted for Morata . Surely a well run business conducts its affairs with better planning than this. We have had a whole month to line up a deal and yet we may run out of time. We really need to get our act together when it comes to transfers
Oh no – sorry ‘holic.
Now I’ve done it.
You’re going to be hacked by the North Korean NSA from now on.
I’m not that old DK. 😉
Esso’s got the price about right, but at that time we could go into the Schoolboys enclosure for half the price and jump the fence to get into the North Bank.
My mates dad worked the turnstalls, so most of the time I got in for free, or we squeezed through with three of us on one turn.
aaaah memories.
Simple solution for this problem. Build a brand new all stander stadium.
I still trust the club. Don’t feel they’re taking the piss out of me. Must be a muppet. Which I most certainly fucking aint.
Esso: “My first pocket money was 1 shilling.”
Rich parents huh?
But you look so young Trev.
Since we going down this road:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13JK5kChbRw
Strange thought, could it be nobody wants to do buisness with us early because they hope for higher bids from other clubs?
Aaah this drags me in again. What do I know?
The Twitter account reporting the Morata bid was fake. What a lot of prats there are about in this age of social media.
Nice half-century Ttg.
Time for bed I think.
Sweet dreams all.
@46dkgÖÖner
Payment for The Victor (1d in old money), which was delivered along with the papers on a Thursday, was stopped out of it. Leaving 11d in total.
Trev … a very sane appraisal at #454 in previous drinks. If the right player isn’t available, or doesn’t want to come, or his club wants an arm, a leg and a set of bollox for his transfer, then we don’t want an expensive substitute just to say we’ve done business.
Källström’s best days may be behind him (106 caps for Sweden, so must have been good once), but he has a huge amount of experience, presumably cost very little and could do a part-time job for us during our present injury crisis.
Mind you, if we had to get an aging Swedish midfielder perhaps we should have checked out Freddie Ljungberg? 😉
Oh, and till one minute to go as I write this, so plenty of time for more AW deals, aye!
Öskar
Interesting preview Guv’nor and a good link in to ticket prices and where it might lead to. Many interesting comments from Esso, Clive , Trev, DkG and others. As one of the elderly gits on here, I can go back further than many of you young studs….entrance cost was all of 4s6d in the late 50s and early 60s – that’s 22p in decimal. In the early 90s, I went to see my late grandad who was then in his late 90s. He recalled how he went to the first ever game at Highbury in 1913 where the entrance cost was 6d – 2.5p decimal!
As for the game on Sunday, the bus will be proverbially parked so 2-0 is how I see it.
COYRRR
Pretty shaky old bus, Uplympian, with a goal difference 40 worse than ours!
0-4 minimum.
Öskar
Oh dear
Same old same old, Special One? Currently clear second only to petrodollar mercenaries in the premiership having set the pace for most of the season?
Öskar
Park off to Watford.
Oooops, should be 4-0 minimum cos we are of course at home this week!
Öskar
Interesting Holic.
I have been trying not to admit it – but there are times when I find the attitude of some of our number just rank. I am not a lifer (a few years as season ticket holder not a lifetime) but I feel part of something special and often feel privileged to be there. There are games however (not the A list ones) where the attitude of a large minority of the crowd is not ‘what I can do for my team’ but ‘what can my team do for me!’ Getting on the back of players as soon as once mistake occurs and generally being negative.
It is not the ground – big nights in the Emirates are really big nights – it is the instant gratification demanded by people made intolerant by reading on-line too much uneducated opinion (some notable exceptions of course) that stoke a fashionable rather that an objective response.
It hurts – I have the usually smug United fans now claiming their prawn sandwich brigade are true followers as opposed to our transient thrill seekers.
The club needs to be careful. It is down to Gazides and Stan. I like to think they are mindful of the type of club we continue to evolve in to.
We are not at Highbury any more so things were always going to change. But I 100% agree that we need to cater for everyone and should look to Dortmund in particular as a model of maintaining the core values and essence of what is the heart and soul of the club.
The club needs to listen.
@59Holloway2Holland
Same training ground.
What’s the narrative on Twitter then?
Arsene, that bastard who will never sign a player, spends the whole window trying to get Draxler. Eventually decides he doesn’t want to pay the money for him. Then “panics” and in the space of 24 hours tries desperately to loan Cisse, Klose and (pfffft) Kalou?
Sounds likely.
The Kalou rumour, in particular, is great. Crops up every time the support is getting a bit tense – always guaranteed to push people over the edge.
So, anyway, Wenger the mad, panicking bastard. And I hear we only signed Ozil because Arsene was out of the office and Gazidis forged his signature.
Looking forward to our next bad result so we can all hear about how it’s Wenger’s fault for not spending every last penny of the £100m we apparently just have sitting around, on one or more of the various top class strikers who have moved clubs this month.
Happy days.
Lol @ Special Needs …
N7 knows
Park to Watford on loan O.o
Okay, looks like Kallstrom has skills. Not bad:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ESE_N10zIc
Arsene appears to like Kalou. Klose is a veteran who is still scoring goals and Cisse was scoring for fun last season.
😉
Special One….no doubt you are pleased to see your Russian mafia money involved in third party ownership of players tied, all in with Maureen’ mate Jorge Mendes. How nice! All is revealed in Fridays Guardian.
Perhaps AW has visions of turning Källström into a striker. He appears to have a good shot on him.
Öskar
Good stuff, from the usual suspects above.
Wanna know what I think of this past window? Not a single journalist had/has a clue of what Arsenal did or did not do in this transfer window. It has been guesses for them, they add 2 and 2 together and get 7 then proceed to stuff it down our collective throats, of course some of us spat it back at their faces but some choose to swallow it hook, line and sinker and will now proceed to blame the club and manager for all that is wrong with the world. Meanwhile the journos and their bosses will take stock and give/receive pay-rises and promotions to the ones amongst them who wrote the best lies that got the most clicks over the past one months. How intelligent of them, they’re the real winners of transfer windows.
My 68. Should read “all tied in with” etc
OtD…..I think their defence has improved since A Pubis has taken over
as coach (driver) 😉
Too efffin correct Cent
Just seen that three of the top five did not sign a single player
Great stuff @60
Oh no! Park has joined Watford. So in a window where we ostensibly needed a striker we had one injured to join the other striker who had been out for four months and loaned out three strikers to other clubs. And we didn’t sign one in the end. But don’t worry the plan is to earn free kicks thirty yards from goal and Kjallstrom will do the rest.
If we didn’t trust Arsene we might think he’d lost the plot.
And the special cunt said he wasn’t signing any only to drop another £50M+. He shops more than Mrs. Arsegonian and that’s saying something 🙁
Did we sign anybody yet on one of those “completed at the last minute but not announced until two hours later because we weren’t sure it was going to be approved” by the highest of the high???????????????
My wife loves Maureen. I have tried to educate her regarding what a two faced cheating low life he is. Made no difference. Now she knows he can drop £50m just like that my words fall on stoney ground. I know my place.
Come on James Ward – put the sceptic away. I wanna go to bed.
Kings,
No wonder you are very cross. 😉
Lee Cattermole fails to move to Stoke.
Premier League players’ kneecaps relax and breathe a sigh of relief.
Good link, Goonertown.
Looks like we got us a free kick specialist. 😉
Evening all. Well I must say that as the window closes until next June I am quite dismayed by our lack of action in the transfer market. Reading some of the comments on here over the past week or two have been comical. I for one am amazed at the ineptitude shown by those that run this club. I am fuming, absolutely fuming. This season has proved to be one that for the first time in ages that we could be competitive. We had the opportunity to strengthen the squad, add some quality that might, just might have helped us really achieve this season. But no. Despite all of that we are treated to a journeyman who is only good enough to warm the bench at the mighty Spartak Moscow. Well please forgive me if I’m not jumping through hoops and rushing off to the nearest Threshers for a case of Dom Pom to start the celebrations.
For too long now our dealings in the transfer market have left me frustrated. For God knows how long now each window has been filled with false promises and at times downright lies. We can all remember the Cesc and Nasri are going nowhere or we are not a big club lines? Then we were treated to the Giroud and Podolski are both additions to the squad, not replacements for RVP, just before we sold him. Then we had the monumental clsuterfuck that was the last transfer window. Clusterfuck you all cry? But what about the world class signing of Ozil???? I was a s pleased as anyone when we finally concluded the deal for Ozil but please don’t tell me he was one of our main targets when those in power sat and discussed their wish list at the end of May??? The Ozil signing stands alone as one great signing. Not just a world class player but a player bought as an addition to the squad and not just a replacement. I said at the time that the Ozil signing gave the whole club a massive lift. The whole ground had a totally different atmosphere and boy did we need it. We were still licking our wounds at letting Higuain slip through our grasp whilst we somehow became embroiled in the whole pantomime that is Luis Suarez. I said then that this had to be the start. This had to be the catalyst for further development and progression.
Fast forward to January. We were sat proudly on top of the league. We have qualified from a tough Champions League Group and still look good in the FA Cup. Those in charge have had since the first of September to think about who we may want to try and bring in during the January window. An army of scouts that Baden Powell would be proud of are despatched to all parts North, South, East and West. Surely one will be able to come up with a player to help push us towards that final hurdle with our noses still in front? After all, a net spend of only 11 million since 2008 must leave us with millions to spend? The club has certainly intimated at such figures.
So what follows? Constant press and media speculation linking us with first of all Diego Costa and his £35 million buy out clause closely followed by the German Henry/RVP that is Draxler. Now I have no real intention of passing comment on either player. Suffice to say that if AW deems one or both of them as his next big signing then I am happy to go with that. Then, low and behold and in true Arsenal fashion we again seem to leave it to the last minute. I read on here about how great Draxler is. How he is such a fantastic player, how he will be a great addition. Some are even sending out premature welcome messages. Then, as per Arsenal the whole thing collapses around our ears. All of a sudden he is overpriced and not that good anyway????
I full agree that the stuff that is reported on both Sky and other sources of the media can often be dubious at best. But I also believe that there is no smoke without fire. As the clusterfuck unrolled in August and we failed in our attempts to sign the likes of Demba Ba so today seems to have been little different. Most will disagree but for me the panic button was well and truly hit. Klosse??? Well as he has now come out and siad he was disappointed not to be allowed to join us I would suggest that there was something in that one. Kalou?? Who knows but it would not be the first time. As for others, who knows? All I know is that we have ended up signing a 31 journeyman on loan purely because it looks like that someone on the medical team may well have fucked up with Ramsey. If poor old Aaron had come through 90 minutes at Southampton then my guess is that none of us would ever have dreamt that he would be darkening our doors???
I have the massive hump. Those who are still bothering to read this will have probably gathered that by now. Why does it always have to be like this? Someone please explain it to me? It is just so unnecessary. I don’t want us to spend spend spend. I don’t want us to spend money we don’t have. Be the best we can be. That’s all I have ever asked. It is all I will ever ask. For me we are so far behind on that front that its unreal. For me there really is no excuse for it anymore.
I apologise if any of the above upsets or offends anyone. That was not my intention.
Palace on Sunday??? We all know it should be a nailed on 3 points. However, I will say one thing. If it all starts to look a bit wobbly and we struggle to break them down then please do not expect any of the tolerance shown in recent months. A massive deal with Puma, an increase in ticket prices and austerity in the transfer window I would suggest may make a few of the locals slightly uncomfortable to say the least.
Nice post holic and great article from Tim.
Onwards and upwards I guess???
Hear hear, Steve. I’ve given up on the farce and expect nothing to happen these days. The one thing I would say is that I don’t believe Draxler is worth what is essentially the same money as Mata cost Manure. He might be good, but he’s untried in the hotbed of the premiership, whereas Mata has proven his credentials. If we needed a midfielder it’s a shame we weren’t in for Mata earlier, imo.
But I haven’t seen a better striker than those we already have changing clubs this window, unless you count Mitroglou, and I don’t.
Öskar
Everything is not exactly what it seems, and it’s not fair to blame the Club and Management wherever things do not go our way.
Have a look at the following article from the Arsenal Arsenal site. It might give some of us here a different perspective.
My apology Mr. Holic. If you believe that this should not be published, please delete it.
Gooner in Exile says:
January 31, 2014 at 11:07 pm
Anyone think the one reason Herr Podolski is sitting on the bench at the moment……is to make sure he is fit when Giroud gets injured?
I say when because everyone seems certain the big guy can’t go through the whole season uninjured.
See this squad management lark is a little more complex than some would have us believe.
Raddy it seems you have been sucked into the ever so spurious land of “we have £100m burning a hole in the pocket” that is spread throughout the Gunner blogosphere.
I will not deny that our current cash position looks healthy, and clearly there are improved revenues incoming from Emirates and Puma (none in the bank yet they start from 2014-15 season) and then there is the increased TV money from this year….but…….
Time to bore some people to tears…….
2012/13 Net Current Assets (Cash + Stock + Debtors – Creditors) £115m
We just scraped a profit of £5m (having made £47.5m on player trading…sales of Song and BSR). So if we hadn’t sold players we would have made a loss of £42m.
If we hadn’t sold some property we would have been break-even even with the sales of BSR and Song.
So with all increases in players wages etc over last few years thats where we were at the start of the season.
We spent £42m on a wasting asset (Ozil) so that £115m became £73m.
In 2013-14 we will see an increase in TV money, assumed to be around £25m average. So that only takes us to a loss of £17m if we don’t sell any players and no property.
That also takes no account of Ozil’s wages or any other wage increases given.
So that £115m we started the year with is now in broad terms £46m.
Sign Draxler for £37m now, or any other of the players mentioned and we will be waiting for the extra revenue to come in before we can sign any more players. And also could leave us close to be in danger of going beneath our committed cash funds level (ring fenced for Debt reasons).
The most important thing this season was that we didn’t have to sell to survive. The target next season is to make the new Revenues work, £30m per season from Emirates and £30m per season from Puma, takes us to a profit of around £40m per season (last seasons pre player sales loss plus revenue increases), so we should start to see big investment at least one or two a season, with no need to sell as those profits will be added to an already healthy opening of around £50m.
And when that starts happening and we the fans realise its with money that the club has generated itself will that be something we can shout from the rooftops? Damn right it will be.
Wenger can actually start building again…….with the knowledge that he can pay players enough to stay too.
Great link @66 Goonertown.
Those saying Kallstrom is shit are really saying “I’ve never heard of him” which isn’t quite the same thing. 🙂 He’s not a world beater but he’s good cover in midfield, which is all Arsene wants him to be, while Ramsey/Flamini are out. If he can rocket in a free kick or two during his tenure here so much the better. I noticed too that he was scoring with both right and left in that video.
Oh God the transfer drama. Will we never learn?
I honestly didn’t expect us to get anyone at all this window. I do admit I let the Draxler rumors get me a little excited, but I’m not surprised or even terribly upset that the boss decided not to shatter the club transfer record for an unproven 20-year-old, however precocious.
And I daresay John Cross lost whatever residual “in-the-know” status he still had with that Draxler bullshit.
Fuck em. Fuck em all.
COYG
Good stuff, D.I.L.Y. I will just add that I feel Arsene would have taken the risk if he saw any deal that represented value for our money. I believe splashing out now would have meant not spending much during the summer unless we sold someone huge. Another thing is that Draxler at the rumoured amount would represent an expensive project and considering he is currently injured and probably won’t have contributed much to us this season it makes sense to me that we decided not to stump up the cash wait till the summer when more players would become available, we could even get someone like Reus, who is ahead of Draxler in development, for less than we are been quoted for Draxler at the moment.
G.L. It’s all guesswork for them as John Cross himself opines here http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/arsene-wenger-transfer-bingo-arsenals-3093499
For sure, Cent. But Cross has supposedly been one whose guesses carried more weight than most.
I did a pretty good job ignoring the window this time. Like I said, I let myself get a little excited about Draxler but when it was announced that it “fell through” I checked out. Only looked at the transfer news once all deadline day.
The thing is anybody who follows Arsenal well can make these guesses. It was so plain to see that Arsenal weren’t going to sign anybody in this window unless our players sustained major injuries or someone special became available at a decent price, I can’t be arsed to find the particular post but I believe I said something to this effect way before the transfer window opened.
We had injuries in midfield which led to Kallstrom’s signing and someone special, Draxler, was available so we tried for him but the quoted price knocked us back. The above just sounds too boring and won’t get many clicks so the press won’t report it that way instead they make up stories or spice up real stories with lies just to make them more sensational.
I feel as we all do the same sort of pain as Steve T and he articulates it very well. I’m not sure I would come to the same financial conclusions as Arsenal Arsenal , although it did provide sensible perspective . My understanding is that we have cash reserves greater than any club in the world, or did at the start of the season according to the excellent Swiss Ramble . We have done well to cut out waste on the payroll but we still have the Galindos and Wellington Silvas waiting in the wings who will never play for us like Botelho and must cast huge doubt on the quality of our South American scouting network. Against this we should not forget we may have a forward gem in Joel Campbell joining us next year .
But I think despite the fact that I fully acknowledge the superlative job Wenger has done in building up our cash reserves and finding gems in players like Koscielny, Sagna , BFG and Arteta we do seem to lack coherence in some of our planning.
Bendtner and Park are the most extreme examples. Park has probably cost us upwards of £10 million in wasted fees and wages. I daren’t do the sum about how much he has cost us per minute in the first team. He is the most striking example of a panic buy you could get. TGSTEL was clearly written off by the club when we allowed him to go on loan , as we couldn’t sell him and he has done nothing at the clubs he joined to suggest he is remotely good enough to return to us and press for a place in the team. Some of his performances , notably against Chelsea in the League Cup and Coventry have brought a degree of derision , I have never heard afforded to an Arsenal player. His two goals came against a Hull side we completely mullered and his vital goal against Cardiff, which while easy was his only significant contribution to the club in the last three years. Yet we are asked to accept that a man on the cusp of joining Palace in August , and who has constantly agitated for a move away by his comments, is now a legitimate second choice striker for one of the powerhouse clubs in England?Don’t make me laugh.
As Steve says every window, bar last January’s when we acquired Monreal, another very well- priced addition , has been characterised by indecision and last minute panic. We either need Ba, Kalou, Cusse, Klose or we don’t but if we do and indications are that Wenger feels we do we can’t leave it until the dying embers of the window to try to acquire them.
Arsene always uses poker analogies about transfer windows and no doubt the reality is that negotiations are tough but if we have a mind to do it we could have acquired a decent back- up striker. I happen to believe that Mitroglou would probably have been ideal and at reasonable cost. I even think Berbatov is preferable as a short- term fix to Bendtner.Being Arsenal fanatics we need to move on and get behind the team but being fans with opinions and lots of experience of how the club operates I think we have a reasonable entitlement to feel this was a big opportunity wasted. Let’s hope it wasn’t as big a waste as I currently feel it might be.
COYG
“I feel as we all do the same sort of pain as Steve T”
Not all of us, definitely not me and I expect there are more people like me in here and out there.
Do we really think if Arsene was really looking for a back-up striker he won’t have gotten one? Kim K says he got a call on thursday and onece he said he was interested in the move the deal was done, do we still think Arsenal have difficulty dragging deals over the line? I rather think we were not in the market for any of those back-up forwards in the first place.
Morning. First of all I really don’t buy this we have not much money to invest stuff. It was quoted on hear quite recently that our net spend over the last 6 years was either 8 or 11 million. If we are really saying that we don’t have substantial funds available to invest then that has to be the biggest financial mismanagement in history.
The fact that we have needed a striker since RVP left and not managed to obtain one is quite frankly beyond belief for me. We are in a fantastic position and should be about ready to kick on. Instead we will be going into games hoping to go 3 up so that we can get Ollie G off the pitch and wrapped in cotton wool. I will genuinely hate to see the backlash if he picks up an injury and is out for any length of time.
I have genuinely started to question the ability of those at the top to conclude a deal. I’m starting to think more and more that the Özil deal owed as much to luck as anything else. I feel totally deflated with the whole situation.
I will reiterate. I do not expect us to spend money we don’t have. I do not expect us to spend on a whim. But if we have not identified one player that can add to this squad and conclude the deal having had months to sort the ground work then quite frankly I want to know why? Personally, when I’m faced with the prospect of paying even more for the privilege next season, I don’t think that is an unreasonable question at all. I’m bored with the bullshit and excuses. Be the best you can be. That’s all I want. No more and no less. Right now, for me, it’s not good enough.
Cent. I think as a club we have been looking for a top striker for sometime. The evidence of that would come from our pursuit of Higuain, Suarez and then Draxler. The fact that the club never managed to conclude any of those deals tells me that we somehow managed to bodge it. Trying to convince a player who sits on the bench in Moscow to join I would suggest is hardly the most difficult of tasks.
If you don’t think we were interested in a striker then I respect your opinion. Personally I don’t think you could be further from the truth.
I genuinely do not understand the whole “last minute panic” thing.
Is the argument that we “panic” in every single window, because we tend to do our business late? Sounds less like panic, more like a strategy, doesn’t it?
Look at the players we’ve bought in during these “panics”: Arteta, Mertesacker, Monreal, Flamini, Ozil. If this is panic then we’ve been extremely lucky with its output, have we not?
Here’s what I think is more likely: the latter stages of the window are quite simply the easiest time to do business. Clubs have to get down to brass tacks and the poker players begin to show their hand. That’s why deadline day now gets the hype it does; it’s not because every football club in the country is inept and can’t get their transfer strategy together until the last minute, it’s because the end of the window is the point of maximum value.
Arsene has been quite upfront about the difficulty of getting quality players in during the January window, much less the January window during a World Cup year. Expectation in the bar on 1 January was that it was unlikely we would do material business this month. No promises have been made or broken; they appear to have tried for a very pricey top class prospect but found his current owners demanding a king’s ransom. That can happen – it doesn’t mean that our negotiators are inept any more than City’s are for failing to sign the two Porto lads, or Chelsea’s for failing to get Rooney.
You cannot look at our January in isolation. There have been barely any transfers in the top six this month, and no striker has moved who would have been better than what we’ve got. I also don’t understand the obsessive need to refer to TGSTEL as if he’s our only back up striker – are we just ignoring Podolski now?
Taken in the round, I don’t think our forward options are any worse than those of Chelsea. They didn’t sign a striker either. What does that tell us?
Obviously, I’d like us to have spent this month. But if it wasn’t on, it wasn’t on, simple as that. We’ll spend in the summer – on better players than were available the last few weeks. What we won’t do is sign a sub-par player (loans a little different) in the hope he somehow lifts the tail end of our campaign.
Why not? Because THAT would be panic.
As for Palace, I don’t think it’ll be the gimme people are assuming. Pulis has got them playing, they’re not conceding goals and they’ll come for a draw. I expect a tetchy stadium and a real scrap out on the field.
COYG
Also, just to add, I don’t think it in any way, shape or form devalues the signing of Mesut Ozil if he wasn’t our main target at the start of the summer.
The notion seems to be that he somehow fell in our lap. I highly doubt that’s true, but even if it is, who cares? We asked them to spend some fucking money, and they spent some fucking money. Are we seriously now getting annoyed because they don’t spend it EARLY enough?
N7. The Per and Arteta deals were already in the offing. They depended on us winning our champions lge qualifier. Monreal was hastily bought because of an injury to Gibbs. Flamini was never a target until he trained with us and AW saw what he could do.
For the season we brought in Per and Arteta check out the others that signed as we hit the panic button in that window.
If people think we are strong enough and don’t need additions then I respect that. However, my view could not be further away from that.
Well said steve T. Well said.
” Be the best you can be.”
Steve T has put it very simply and is that too much too ask.
I think not.
Are we acting and being our best by buying killer kallistom or whatever the fuck this nobody’s name is.
It is ducking embarrassing is what it is.
You talk about intention – arsene and arsenal have shown their intentions with this loan – others will be laughing.
Arsene is making a fucking fortune out of getting us close and excited but no cigars.
We have bullshit injuries piling up and we have a big few months.
Steve T, our net spend over the past five or so years is 8 or 11 million and we still didn’t/don’t have loads to spend because we had to balance our books with the money we got from transfers because in funding our Stadium move we tied ourselves into shit(not shit at the time) long-term commercial deals.
As for us needing a striker “since RVP left”; we never topped the league when RvP was our main and fit striker so if we are now topping the league(even if we are not topping the league at the moment) without him or any striker then it must have been a good thing we got rid of him and didn’t sign any striker to replace him, no?
@Steve
What, so all the successful signings were pre-planned? Where does that info come from?
Santos arrived before any of the others, and was the worst of the lot. Arteta arrived about twenty minutes before the deadline, apparently with no medical. Pre-planned, my foot. If ever there was a “panic” signing, it was the current club captain.
Benayoun was a successful loan signing. Park – Christ only knows what the thinking was, but at least he cost relative peanuts.
If there’s one thing last summer taught me about windows, it was not to pay any mind to anything you hear or read. It’s either dreamt up by journalists who don’t know what they’re talking about (nothing new there), heard/made up by a bloke in his bedroom or put out by Wenger and designed to be deliberately vague and misleading.
On that last one, how could you expect him to do any different when talking up your interest openly will only add a premium to the pricetag? I prefer to take what we get, enjoy it when it’s good and focus on other things when it starts to go south. I’ve been branded “not a real football fan” for taking that view, but that’s just how I approach it I guess.
I just want to support N7 in what he has said about transfers and our inactivity this January. I think everything he has said is spot on. The waiting until the last minute is a strategy and not mismanagement. Its serves two purposes: (1) It ensures we don’t get gazumped as has happened in the past and (2) It forces clubs to come to a decision to take a financial offer which can be the maximum point of value for the buying club because there’s no time to get into a bidding war.
Two other points if I may:
We tried, all summer long, to buy a top class striker. We failed. We put Forty Nine (49) Million pounds on the table for Suarez. We failed. We put 30m on the table for Cavani the previous January. We tried to buy Higuain but changed targets when the money being asked for him came to a level when we obviously thought it would have been better spent on pursuing Suarez, who is a far better player imo. We cannot, and will never compete with clubs who can pay strikers 300k a week. So there’s a ceiling to how much we can spend. And when it comes to that type of money, we really can’t afford to get it wrong.
Every transfer is a risk. Every single transfer is a risk. Wenger had made mistakes, but has also worked miracles to get this club to where we are now at. He is a highly intelligent man, speaks several languages and has 17 years experience playing in Europe and running this club on a shoestring.
Does anyone really think they could do better?
@Porco Rosso
I think that has to be right.
This idea that is creeping in that you can’t be a real fan unless you become furious at the drop of a hat is bullshit. It’s like saying you don’t really love your wife enough if you can’t get angry enough to beat her every now and then.
@Joe
Spot on.
Wenger is smarter than any of us. More experienced than any of us. With access to vastly better information than any of us.
Does that mean he should be immune to criticism? No. But it does mean he surely has go get the benefit of the doubt and we can at least start from the assumption that he’s not stupid or mentally weak.
I think we can all wonder about the lack of signings this month. But to get FURIOUS over it, or bring charges of ineptitude, is simply daft.
N7 – 8 years of nothing by disappointment is not the drop of a hat.
Joe and porco – sometimes a great bargain is simply paying market rate.
The plain truth is that the injuries we continually and are currently facing is from having a good first 11 and a 2nd team full of kallistoms and parks etc.
Buy quality when needed, build strong academy and stop buying shit that you have to sell 2 years later for nothing.
@Aussie
OK – so you’re not angry about this month, you’re angry about the last eight years.
Totally different debate then.
That said, I’m not sure I can reconcile “you must buy in January” with “stop buying shit you need to sell two years later for nothing” (I’m assuming that would be Santos – can’t think of any other examples which fit the bill).
N7. We had been linked with both Per and Arteta all summer. The opinion of almost everyone, including those on here was that we would not spend until our champions league progression had been confirmed. Arteta and per have been great signings but I don’t remember fighting off all comers to get either. From memory we only managed to secure the Arteta deal when he agreed to take a pay cut.
Özil was, is and remains a fantastic signing. An opportunity arose. We became aware of the opportunity and did a great bit of business. As I said earlier, for me that had to be the start of something. A new era. The springboard to announce that we were back and to be taken seriously. But no, yet again we seem to have failed miserably.
Cent. I’m sorry my old mate but I don’t think you could be more wrong. Just my opinion.
Aussie, to put Kallstrom in the same bracket as Park when we’ve never seen him play in an Arsenal shirt seems a little unfair.
So, the window has closed and only one player, of limited name, has climbed through it.
Meanwhile here in the bar, the usual suspects have said what they always say, often at even greater length than usual.
I hate “as I said before” posts, so I won’t repeat what I’ve said previously. I still believe it.
Equally, I consider to respect those with whom I disagree who remain consistent in their opinions.
Oh, well. We’ll have to do our talking out on the pitch for the rest of the season. Let’s hope the team, which is largely unchanged this season, can repeat what they have done in the past couple of seasons and have a better second half than first.
COYG
@Steve
That’s not my recollection of summer 2011 at all.
Mertesacker, Arteta and Santos were far from sure things. The names only cropped up in earnest right at the death. We didn’t sell Cesc and Nasri until August, and we’d already signed the Ox and Gerv the swerve, so the money probably wasn’t even there until after the Utd game.
If Arteta was lined up all summer why were we still negotiating wages on the afternoon of deadline day, and how did he end up without a medical?
You’re quite right that our activity was late because of the Udinese games. Another good reason our transfer business has tended to be done late.
Anyway, it’s all moot. I agree with the thrust of “the best that we can be”. I just think that this season we’ve pretty near hit that mark and it feels churlish to complain too much.
I don’t think we’ll win the league, by the way. But I think we’ll sign in the summer and go again next season.
N7 and porco- I am not angry about the last 8 years or the quality of Kallistrom as a player.
I am sure he is ok and a shrewd cheap loan.
Where I agree with Steve T is simply about are we acting and being our absolute best by not bolstering a good first 11 in a very good season.
We were and are in a good position this year I believe built and buoyed by the excitement and buzz around Ozil.
That won’t last forever and we had the chance to bring in a few other top shelf buys or at least one to elevate our intentions.
We simply fucked that chance by our inaction and dicking around with money i firmly believe we have in buckets.
We are one of the biggest and best clubs in the world and sometimes we should flex our muscle and show others we are here to win, not just to compete at a high level.
I think highly disapoonted in our inactivity is my gripe when we had money and the opportunity.
Does missing suarez as a player and an expensive player at that now look like a shrewd lack of investment.
@Aussie
Disappointed, I can understand. I think we’re all disappointed.
It’s anger and accusations of ineptitude I don’t get.
Expectations have been raised because of the performance of the manager and players. To then use those raised expectations to batter them with doesn’t make sense to me. Particularly before they’ve even failed out on the pitch.
Fair points N7, expectations have been raised, but that also doesn’t mean we stop and accept our current position of winning more than we are losing as final.
In business if you stagnate you eventually go backwards. Much the same in football I’m afraid.
Others will always strive to get further out of their comfort zones by trying something above their level and creating change.
City is a good example of change wether we like their methods or not.
Now they have raised the standard platforms and others will try to out do them. The bar gets raised always.
I believe the disappointment here with a slow and painful transfer window of little substance is more to do with a feeling of a good opportunity lost and to be even better the we are now.
even the players themselves at this point in the season when a bit of fatigue is setting into our squad, would have loved one quality striker of substance to send the message we are in it to win it, not just be around the top.
City, as a comparison to Arsenal, makes no sense at all.
They’re not pushing outside their comfort zone. They’re operating on limitless resources. Big difference.
This makes for sobering reading, and gives an insight into which club is really maximising the use of its resources and outperforming:
https://twitter.com/8fact_footballl/status/429551280445345793
Frankly, the much hyped City should be ten points clear, given what they spend.
Lovely morning here. Off out for a stroll, then spend the afternoon / early evening in a pub watching the egg chasing.
And then its up The Arsenal tomorrow with me youngest, who’s already keyed up with excitement.
Aint such a bad life at times you know, just enjoy it while you can I say.
n7 – as much as we dislike city’s methods and the limitless supply of money, they are very relevant and are setting the player markets that we don’t like, and are also our competition for the title.
It is no good pulling up our stumps and taking our bat and ball home just because we don’t feel it is a fair game.
I agree if you gauge a teams position by money spent then their would be a different outcome, but that isn’t the rules.
I am not for one minute suggesting we buy stupid and aimlessly, but surely in all the world of football, with our vast scouting resources, coupled with our global status as a club, and our credit rating at the bank of Kronke, we could buy 1 great addition, rather than a loan of average level.
Surely N7, if arsene is half the manager and half the business man we all believe him to be, spending some cash on 1 quality player at this point in time would help us immensely.
Steve, mate, I have absolutely no problem with been wrong, nobody is ever right all the time.
I think at this point everyone has already made up their minds on who/what to believe when it comes to the business and money side of the club and their is little or no need trying to convince anyone to change their minds without giving them concrete evidence(which none of us has by the way) so I think I will just focus on discussing only the things we do on the pitch from now onwards, I think I will get the most joy from my Arsenal that way.
@Aussie
Not proposing we take our ball home. Proposing it’s a bit harsh to posit City as the model of what we should be doing in the context of a discussion of transfer policies, and that if that’s your yardstick you’d best prepare for disappointment.
Anyway, Cent is right that no minds are going to be changed. Esso is right that life’s too short to spend worrying about all this stuff.
Here’s to a big win tomorrow.
COYG
City are simply an opposing team in one of our key completions and there are clubs of the same attitude who are opposition in the other key comps we are competing in.
If we expect or are aiming at beating these trams at the sharp end of the season, I don’t see how loaning a player like we have done in this great window of opportunity achieves a competitive edge.
After Villa, had you told me that the next 20 odd games would pan out the way they did, I would’ve raised the old Roger Moore.
As the season started to unfold, my big fear was whether we could keep Giroud fit until January, so integral is he to the way that we currently play. The fact that we have now let all of January come and go exposing us to the same risk (i.e one Giroud injury away from oblivion) is such a massive gamble considering the good position we find ourselves in.
I wasn’t looking for us to go and spend 20 or 30 million quid, but are we really saying that in all leagues, all over the world, that we could not find a better alternative than a dis-engaged Bendtner? A player wr were trying to give away in August?
I am not convinced that buying players in the summer will be any easier either, especially if we don’t put a bit of silver in the cupboard come May.
We shouldn’t compare ourselves against City for all sorts of reasons – not least the fact that they have FOUR first team strikers, i.e players who can come in and rotate.
We have ONE central striker. One.
I expected a bit more from a big club.
Looking at the list of transfers actually done it seems that not much was really done in the end…Chelsea got Zouma (wonder how their FFP act is coming along, eh…haven’t they practically spent the Mata money with that other returning guy, Matic?)
just a lot of banging on empty cans and wind up…
anyways, onwards and upwards with the indefatigable HFB we go! 🙂
According to the BBC gossip column – love it – RVP is considered so important to Man U that it will be left to the striker to decide whether he is fit or not to play…gotta love that one!
Interesting and polarised debate. Zico makes the point about Giriud well. We haven’t got any back- up options. Poldi can’t hold the ball up or play through the centre, Sanogo is an injury waiting to happen and even if he wasn’t is totally unproven and Bendtner is useless . Our only back- up option was Theo and he won’t play for six months . So our dependence on Giroud to not get injured let alone stay in firm is ridiculously high and cannot be an example of good planning.
I don’t buy the last minute shopping is a strategy either because it seems to result in knock backs on a major scale because teams can’t replace anyone they lose. It’s the opposite of a sound strategy in my book.
In 2008 we could have won the league if we had strengthened the squad IMO but we were more cash constrained now. I would guess we might have a 15-20 % chance of winning it this year but the odds certainly didn’t improve yesterday
In another interesting drama the Crystal Palace of Tony Pulis currently sit higher in the table than Stoke City. Our job is to be sure Stoke can pass them by Sunday night.
Not saying for one second that I agree with any of these various fans movements that seem to spring up but I’m guessing I’m not the only one feeling the immense frustration at the moment. Make of this what you will.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2550009/Arsenal-fans-angry-lack-spending-37m-Julian-Draxler-falls-theyre-expected-fork-ticket-price-rise.html
Nice discussions here.
I agree with N7 that despite our disappointments there really is no justification for the accusations of ineptitude to Arsene and club. And from my perspective anger makes no sense at all. We support a well-run football club that is one of the best in the world, is currently second in PL, has a collection of great footballer and exciting emerging talents, and frankly speaking I feel privileged.
That doesn’t mean that the club doesn’t make ‘mistakes’ in the context of maximizing all avenues of excellence, and there can be inconsistencies in its statements and actions…but that types of mistakes are inherent in running any organization. It is fair to criticize Arsene & co. for any real or perceived mistake, but I feel that criticism must be tampered with the realization of all the other things they get right. Also given the simple fact that in the context of the wider world and the horrendous, horrific things perpetrated by some human beings on a vast majority of others, while the most of rest of us remain complicit through our passivity, the frothing at mouth kind of anger at a football club seems exceedingly disproportionate and inappropriate.
In absence of Theo I personally would have enjoyed seeing a goal-scoring wide player who is capable of being the fulcrum of counter-attacks joining us, even on loan. I am sure Arsene was looking into that possibility — let us stop pretending that these obvious things somehow fly under his radar — but didn’t find anyone that he thinks could positively contribute in a price range that the club can afford and/or makes sense (as we will need to bolster in summer again in a couple of key positions at least). It is interesting to see if anyone we think can really improve the squad or even provide a good back-up for Giroud has moved in this window. I don’t see any, unless we count Mitroglou. The failure of the Konoplyanka to Liverpool move demonstrates that despite the buying club’s most adventurous attempts things don’t always work out.
Also I don’t get all the negative remarks about Kallstrom. A vastly experienced and versatile midfielder who at his peak years was known to be a very skillful and intelligent player, a key member of the OL team that won multiple Ligue 1 titles. Sure he is past his prime but he is here to do a job for half a season to provide cover for Arteta-Flamini-Ramsey. Even very recently when Sweden came back to 4-4 against Germany if I recall correctly he had played rather well. So not that past his prime either. Let us first see him in an Arsenal shirt before forming judgments.
When the season started none of us — except Snir and a couple of other posters, to be fair — predicted that we will challenge for the title with the ‘thin’ squad we have. Well here we are, just one point behind (an obscenely financially doped) City who are already being hailed as the greatest team in PL ever. We made concrete progress compared to last couple of season, and the curve is upwards. To me, that forward movement is all that matters.
G’day all. Just been back-drinking.
Uplympian@54: What I really admire is your memory – that you can recall how much you paid way back. I hope you are just as good at remembering what happened 15 mins ago, otherwise it’s a sign of senility :). And I said something interesting? Really? I don’t usual do “interesting” – I do “facetious”.
Goonertown@67: Cisse was scoring for fun last season No he wasn’t – 13 goals from 47 matches. Bendtner can do that. He scored a freak/fluke/brilliant (choose your own adjective) goal against Chelsea but that I think was the season before when he played alongside Ba.
Otherwise, I’m with N7 and Joe. Wenger knows more than any of us who was available and at what price. He’s part of a management team who are running a business and making a damn good job of it. We’ve been in the CL every season since he arrived at the club. The silverware will come. If you can’t wait for it, I suggest you pop round to your local antique shop – I’m sure they have lots.
I have no time at all for people who build up their expectations based on rumours from know-nothing journalists and twitterers and then get mad when their expectations are disappointed. And then it’s Wenger’s fault? It is as plain as a pikestaff to me that if I have no expectations in this regard, I don’t suffer any disappointment. That’s what I mean when I say getting pissed off is a choice.
Next time I have a rant in this bar, you are welcome to throw this back in my face – I will thank you for bringing me to my senses.
As for our new loanee (let’s not forget that – he’s on loan), only time will tell what he still has left in the locker and whether he can cope with the pace of the PL. He certainly seems to have an effective free-kick technique.
Just for the record, his name is spelt Källström, which means that it’s pronounced something along the lines of “shell-strerm” – Lars will no doubt correct me if I’m wrong. Not that anyone is interested except for pedants like me.
But it’s not just pedantry – I think it’s disrespectful not to make the effort to spell and pronounce another person’s name correctly. I’m old school.
dk, that is a very decent approximation of the pronounciation of the name Källström.
Sorry ttg – don’t agree that Bendtner is “useless”. He played well against Cardiff and scored a vital goal which broke the deadlock. He is also an effective player for his country – he certainly gives them a cutting edge they lacked while he was banned/injured during the qualification matches for the EC. The problem is his inconsistency and his apparent lack of motivation often. For all his verbal bravado, I think he’s a very troubled young man – his off-pitch behaviour indicates that anyway. Our problem is of course on-pitch. He’s out of contract at the end of the season, which means he has no income. If that doesn’t motivate him, nothing will. Hopefully, we won’t have to use him too often.
The good news – it’s only 7 months until 31st August – the next TDD. Something to look forward to.
Hi all,
Very interesting debate going on.
I would just like to add an opinion for what it is worth, regarding transfers.
We all know that Wenger is the type of manager who likes to put faith in to his squad. At points in the past this has not worked and as a result, the protocol has changed to the point where players either go out on loan, or they find a new club. The worst scenario is not worth mentioning, but I am sure you all remember Arshavin’s last days at the club.
Wenger has pointed out that, each transfer depending upon its nature is quite an intricate procedure and in some cases can use up quite a lot of resources. So in some way, there is a clue in that point as to why under certain circumstances, we cannot work on simultaneous deals. Plus there are the players you can register for you team per season. During this window Anyway, skipping to the less obvious of my points
Sorry clicked submit accidently
I don’t know if you guys still have the hump, but gunnerblog posted on twitter that Kallstrom got injured in his first training…
Might be out for 2 months
http://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbladet/fotboll/internationell/england/article18279647.ab
Also, some guy called Jan Aage Fjortoft said that the Draxler deal didn’t go through because Bayern stepped in and said they will take him in the summer.
Not sure how true those stories are or not but I guess we’ll find out soon.
Afternoon one and all/
I’m pretty much on the fence about this one.
I think mainly because I truly believed that no one of note (no disrespect to KK) would come in, nor did I believe that the desired quality was available. The (so called) top class players being mooted didn’t move anywhere. That’s not to say that we shouldn’t of got a back up of sorts for OG. I said at the time that our major fuck up was not bringing in a top class striker in the summer, I stand by that.
Anyway, during this window, one midfielder left and one came in (albeit on loan).
As I understand, one striker left, but not a lot of other clubs were as forthcoming when it came to their strikers.
Mt last point is regarding panic buys. My thoughts are that Wenger does not consider doing business during the final days panic buying. He has often stated that he considers panic buying, to be when a club is performing badly and instead of fixing things in-house, they go out on to the market, a procedure which has often proved to be ineffective. My case in point is Saldado (£26 Mill = 1 goal from open play in 18 games) and B52 (Free from loan = 2 goals from open play in 8 games).
I agree that wenger does take his shrewdness to the heights, but when it comes off we are all singing his praises. When it doesn’t we are all calling for his head. That’s human beings, and when I say we, I do not mean everyone.
If the team was performing badly, I would say, okay Wenger, can you not see what is going on? But at present, the same squad we have, has managed to hold it’s own against a squad who cost 200 mill to assemble. If it is not broken then there is no need to fix it, however, the protocol is look at the medical records and then decide what you need (hence the Drax collapse). Then if we hear there has been another set back, everyone will say, wenger should have bought somebody. But if the reports are true and we are over stocked, the industry, will consider overstocking being a case of panic buying.
I hope of this all made sense.
Okay I’m going for a rest. Feel free to comment and I will catch up with you guys a little later.
🙂
DK , I agree with your assessment of Bendtner’s troubled state . I have seen him live in all his games other than the West Brom one and I am very unimpressed with him. He had a decent cameo against an exhausted Cardiff team camped in their own penalty area but otherwise he has been pretty pathetic. Certainly against Chelsea and Coventry he fell well below the standards of intelligence of movement and industry expected of an Arsenal player and his first touch is woeful ( remember that chance in the last minute at the Nou Camp?)
Maybe we are agreeing that because of his problems he cannot play to the level we would wish him to and in my opinion he cannot be called a viable alternative to Giroud.
I don’t automatically agree with the ex- pros on the television but it was interesting that when I caught a bit of Sky Sports at lunchtime , their panel, including two ex- Arsenal players, one of whom ( Charlie Nicholas) referred to Arsenal as. ‘ my club’, were incredulous that we had failed to strengthen .
One reason I bother to drink in this bar is that opinions even if conflicting with mine are expressed with respect and civility, just as you have . On occasions we have drinkers who don’t have much of an opinion beyond que sera . I admire their sang froid! There is also a strong faith in Wenger which is entirely justified in most respects given his remarkable ability to keep us competitive over a long period against ridiculous financial odds. Indeed he has done so well that my view is that we could have won things had we been willing to strengthen our squad. I felt this at those times and was dismayed that things went pear- shaped afterwards. Much as I would love to be wrong it is inconceivable to me that we can challenge on three fronts with one proper striker. I expect a man paid £ 8 million a year to fix that problem not see it exacerbated by the problems we have encountered on the injury front in January.
Stat : The top 7 teams brought in 6 players in January, The bottom 7 brought in 28 players. Make of that will you will, but I have an idea what it tells me.
Ps- I think Kjallstrom is a very sensible option, a player of great experience and skill who will be a realistic back- up to a strong part of our team which has been ravaged by injury. He was considered top- class a few years ago and I suspect Wenger knows his game well enough to believe he will be revitalised by this challenge. People denigrating him are being very unfair just because he isn’t a household name.
DK knows @128
In light of the discussion yesterday and this morning, I am linking an article below (with your kind permission Holic) which I believe is a thoroughly excellent summation of many of the points and concerns made by various people:
http://positivelyarsenal.com
Afternoon all,
some good work above from Steve T, and N7, and then it all got a bit repetitive to be honest.
The thing is, you can read Steve T, feel the disappointment which we all share and think yep, he’s dead right.
Then you read N7 and think yep, he’s right too.
So, here’s a piece of advice which I hope noone will find condescending:
Read all the conflicting views – balance them out and decide which side of the fence you fall on.
Then read Esso @116 – ‘cos he’s really cracked it 😉
Respec, Trev; you knows@143.
COYG
Just one slight irritation, if I may.
The very assertive claims of “Joe Bloggs knows @xxx” are no more true than “other muppet knows @yyy”.
Some folks have very good connections within the club, and even they will freely admit that, when it comes right down to it, none of us “knows” the really important stuff.
I just find the arrogance a bit annoying.
Just saying ……………
Oops, sorry Pangloss !
The ultimate irony of cross-posting ! 😉
Arseblog news confirming Kallstrom has picked up a back strain in his first Arsenal training session, but that initial reports of a 2-3 month absence were exaggerated.
They were g l,
he won’t be fit that quick ! 😉
Also, N7, Cent, et al know above. No need for me to elaborate on their wisdom. FFS let’s focus on the football and have a little faith in this club, and its manager, who, in the last 12 months at least, have earned it.
Sorry, let me clarify that they’ve earned our faith (in my opinion) over a much longer time, but that in the last 12 months their labors have begun to come to fruition.
Meanwhile Man United and Spurs each trail at halftime, so fingers crossed more sadistic laughter is in store for us today.
Trev pffffft. It is terrible luck for Kallstrom and for Arsenal, but it’s one where you have to say, ah fuck, welp so it goes. Nothing anyone can do/could have done.
Kallstrom out already??????
You couldn’t make it up.
Trev – apology accepted.
I’m not quite sure what you were saying; I thought most users of “Joe Bloggs@xxx knows” meant it in the sense of “Dammit, that Joe Bloggs is a sensible bloke. I agree with every word he says @xxx”. That’s certainly what I meant.
The alternative meaning: “Other muppet has contacts within the club; take not of what he says @yyy, it’s gospel” is surely much rarer isn’t it?
(Too easy to say the wrong thing abut transfers and let it all kick off again. Let’s start an argumentxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx have a civilised discussion about something else.)
COYG
Ok so apparently Kallstrom already had the back thing? Makes me feel better. If we knew about it before then it can’t be too serious. RIGHT?
So what the hell is wrong with Kallstrom already injured??
Oh. I assumed the Kallstrom injury “news” was a joke, but apparently not!
Somebody please tell me that, after the Sanogo-bought-with-terrible-injury record thing in the summer, we didn’t buy an already injured player to get us over a short term injury crisis.
Did this one skip the medical too ? I did jokingly ask yesterday whether it was possible to actually fail an Arsenal medical.
Frimpong sent off for Barnsley 🙂
I thought it would be Brave / Mental to announce the Puma deal / income, and face a fixture list we have upcoming with realistically a sole Striker and not sign someone. I’m afraid by not acting and a few dodgy results AW could be back to square one again with the fans like the beginning of the season.
He’s just signed a new 3 year deal, pay rise, in utter control of the Club again, now no reason for AW to change his ways. I just hope that’s not the case.
Oh dear, oh dear. It wouldn’t have happened under Slur Aleks. Former players just weren’t allowed to beat Manyoo as managers. Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
COYG
Much as I would like to see Stoke go down, just have to love that result. Schadenfreude.
Oh come on people.
I have to think that Arsenal knew what was up with Kallstrom before he was signed, and that that was factored into the plans. No need to jump to conclusions till we know more.
And really? One bad result and a barren transfer window and we’re all down on the boss again? We should know better. Ozil in, well in the title race (which no one, NO ONE, expected), lucrative new deals, well and truly competing against oil-rich clubs. And we don’t splash out in a transfer window (which those of us who know Arsenal/Arsene well knew better than to expect anyway), a draw away to a good Southampton team, and we’re all debbie downers.
For fuck’s sake.
One thing is for sure, this season is providing a premium of sadistic pleasure for the Arsenal faithful. I thought it was too much to hope that Man U would drop points at Stoke, especially after RVP equalized. But no, not only do they drop points, they lose the whole fucking game. And Spurs draw to Hull. Brilliant.
Top four beginning to look like a real stretch for United. Mata will help them I think, but he’d better start helping now. This is the point in the season when Arsenal really stuck it in gear the last two years to squeak in the top four. MU are still stalling badly. They have the quality to get it done, but so far they haven’t shown the spirit, or as Wenger likes to say, the solidarity.
I say, that Phil McNulty over at the Beeb is a shrewd fellow, isn’t he. There’s a fascinating (not) piece on their website about winners and losers in the January window.
Lots of really deep insights. It seems that the big winners were Manyoo, Fulham and Crystal Palace, while the losers were Arsenal, Newcastle United and Liverpool. McNulty really shows his mettle with this devastating assessment of Arsène Wenger’s transfer non-dealings: “Wenger has cast-iron faith in his Arsenal squad but they have a fierce programme ahead in the Premier League, Champions League and FA Cup. Has he left himself short?”.
I don’t know what the BBC’s Chief Football writer earns, but provided it’s not more than around £5 per annum, Mr McNulty is worth every penny.
COYG
Pangloss
Like you I see things through a red and white coloured lens but the majority of people in football are saying exactly the same thing. Perhaps he surmises we have such an injury prone squad that season after season we loiter around the top ( or bottom depending on how you view these things!) of the physioroom.com league or that two of our best young players are out through a stretch of games that if they weren’t already difficult enough have been complicated by the insensitivity of the TV companies and the FA. Perhaps he feels we have a reliance on a relatively small number of key players. If this is his point I think he is wrong other than in the case of Giroud which I have parroted ad nauseam? Yes he’s stating the bleeding obvious but sadly it doesn’t make it untrue.
Where he may be wrong is in terms of Fulham and Man U based on today’s results! Let’s hope he has similarly jinxed Palace who I hate to say with Pubis as their manager ‘, seem to have bought rather well. We will know soon enough.
Apparently Sky are reporting that Kallstrom is out for six weeks with a back injury picked up playing beach football. It was not picked up during the medical but confirmed now after an MRI scan.
Be the best you can be, that’s all I ask. If this is correct then I will leave you to be the judges?????
Goonsterham,
“Trev pfffffft” ……. “Oh come on people” …….. “No need to jump to conclusions” ……… “We’re all debbie downers”
Actually, we’re not – at all.
And “no need to jump to conclusions” from the person who increasingly likes to pronounce that ” ABC knows ” lacks a certain logic too.
Not that I particularly remember disagreeing with you, but as far as I am aware, all opinions, and a degree of humour, are allowed in here.
But hey , no ineptitude here. Let’s leave all our deals to the last minute and rush them through. Let’s just hope and pray that nothing happens to Ollie G tomorrow. Or the next week, or the week after that…
Fail to prepare, prepare to fail.
And you wonder why I get frustrated ????
Well Steve T, goonsterham is sure that this injury was all “factored in” before we did the deal, simply because it must have been.
I’m not arguing ‘cos, apparently, goonsterham “knows”.
Do you know what Trev, that might be the case. If it is then what was he doing in training??? How has Aaron had a “setback” when being rushed back??????
But don’t worry. Those in charge of transfers know what they are doing???? Perhaps the 3% increase in ticket prices is to pay for a bigger stock of bandages??? Perhaps , to put a smile back on everyone’s face again we could stick up some really lovely pictures of the Puma logo ??? That will keep everyone happy.
At the risk of being ridiculed here I would suggest that some of our activity, or lack of it, in the transfer market is turning us into a laughing stock.
Steve, I’m prepared to believe that our lack of transfers in a January window is down to lack of available quality.
Like zico though, I cannot accept that our striking department has been allowed to degenerate into the state that it has. Even if we failed to add a decent striker in the summer for reasons we all know, it has to have been possible to improve on Bendtner and Park during this window.
I could happily buy the Podolski alternative if the guy ever got on the pitch. Either his fitness is still suspect or the manager just does not like the player, again for whatever reason.
In any event we should have strengthened. So far, the Giroud gamble has come off. Better hope it continues that way.
For the record, I am NOT full of doom.
Just a bit perplexed that a club of Arsenal’s standing either cannot or son’t think they need to find someone to help Giroud, from somewhere.
It all just seems such an un-necessary risk given the position we find ourselves in.
I expect to be back on top tomorrow and then look forward to a full scale riot involving all 22 players at Mecca-lite on Monday. 😎
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26000458
You couldn’t make it up.
Trev, I can’t offer any explanation as to how or why we are unable to identify and conclude a deal for a striker. It is totally beyond me.
The Kallstromm news leads me to conclude Ramsey is much worse than they are letting on.
Trev,
You know much more about the sort of injury Kjallstrom may have .. This looks to my very untutored mind like more than a back strain from the potential time he seems likely to be out. It seems inconceivable to me that we sanction the signing of a stop- gap to get us over an injury crisis , who won’t be able to play for six weeks!He is after all a player in the sort of area where we are well- stocked when everyone is fit.
Of course we might have found something similar with Draxler but it is a terrible waste of cash from one who is normally so frugal. And whatever we may think we are going to have to undergo a lot of jokes and joshing about this one.
ttg
Unless of course Ramsey is going to be out for more than 6 weeks…
Ttg,
All I can say is “I agree”.
Can we send him back and save our money.
By the time he is fit, so will everyone else be.
Interesting discussions above. I, like many, am disappointed that we didn’t sign a backup striker. Maybe the boss believes that Bendtner is sufficient backup. But if he did think we needed another striker, I have no doubt he scoured the earth looking for someone better than Bendtner at a reasonable price. Someone above mentioned Mitroglou (and two weeks ago I thought he might be a good buy), but if was rated by anyone other than pundits, why did he end up at a relegation bound Fulham? I think Arsenal did their scouting and decided he wasn’t good enough for Arsenal.
We are currently in 2nd place, one point behind one of the oil whores. We have spent 17 of the 22 matches played in 1st place. There is a good chance we will back in 1st after Monday. Very few of us would have predicted this at the beginning of the season. Arsene has brought us this far and if believes he has the players to win, then I have to trust he knows what he is doing.
COYG!
You know, the weather is really bloody cold for August.
Sorry, just judging from some comments online, for a moment I was convinced it was mid-August and we’d just lost to Villa.
Oops, sorry that should have read 17 of the 23 matches played.
I’m just disappointed we didn’t get Juan Mata. What an impact he’s made 🙂
The only striker of any note moving clubs in this transfer window was Berbatov to Monaco.
That tells you all you need to know about the availability of talent during the past month.
And if anyone thinks that he is better than the options we already have, please take yourself outside and give yourself a good slap.
Heh, snowy,
The Scandinavians in here are probably all outside slapping themselves already. They do a lot of that, you know …… 😉
Trev, I know a joke loses it’s punch when you have to explain it but I honestly have no idea what you mean with that 🙂
Heh @ Trev 😉
How’s the knee btw?
I don’t see what all of the negative fuss is about, really. Despite the new Puma contract, I just didn’t see us forking out another 30-40 mil after we bought Ozil. Spot on ECG (formerly known), if Wenger thought there was a better option than Bendtner out there he would have done a deal. A lot of teams don’t want to sell, therefore no leverage on our part to do a fiscally responsible deal.
Wenger does the last minute deals to maintain leverage, we start talking to players one month before the deadline and their agents start shopping our offer to other clubs which raises the fee and the wages….there will always be a few exceptions to this and a few bad signings along the way. You never know how players will settle at the club.
I am REALLY positive by the direction of the club. We have our financial house in order and the sponsorship deals are starting to produce cash flow we can rely on for years to come. Annual price increases have nothing to do with performance, they should, but they never will.
I think Bendy will come good, I really do. It seems his head is on straight now and he should be able to contribute positively for us…just needs some games.
Snowy,
2 more operations to come, an arthroscope to determine the exact damage and then a partial or complete replacement.
Happy days ! 😉
Ouch. Good luck with all of that Trev.
Will this mean you will be the first bionic ‘holic?
Heh, reading all of the comments above is interesting read.
I agree that if we signed Kallstrom while knowing about his injury its weird, but one cannot be too furious about losing something he never had.
I think the most important thing is team responding tomorrow, beating Palace is crucial and I fear that there be a lot of moaning in the stands should the game go wrong.
Agreed with snöwy that the fact that from strikers only Berbatov (and Mitroglou – who I like just for looking like a modern day badass Agamemmnon) changed teams speaks volumes about availability of talent in January.
So, lets get behind the team and see them win tomorrow.
Trev,
You’re more than welcome to use this board to do a little cathartic venting. I’ve certainly used it that way in the past, and I’m sure I will again. And believe me, I hear you, Steve T, et al loud and clear, and I appreciate your point of view. I’m not a mindless WKB type, as anyone familiar with my presence on this board can attest. I felt a little balance was needed and I offered it.
But if all opinions are welcome here (and that’s something I appreciate about this place) then certainly mine are too? I am far from the most knowledgable or erudite member of this bar, and I’m happy to admit when I’m wrong, which I certainly am from time to time. But my posture of general support for Wenger and optimism about the club are far from an anomaly on this board. I’m happy to further clarify my thoughts.
My “pfffft” was not meant nearly as harshly as you seem to have taken it, but in the unwarranted personal attacks
department you are well ahead of me. Let’s leave that behind us shall we?
Sorry, stupid iPod touch.
As further revelations come out I admit the Kallstrom thing is a real headscratcher.
Must say that I agree totally with Zico re a back up for Giroud. I can’t believe that this has not need addressed.
I really don’t get these comments about who did or didn’t move in the window. Personally I don’t really care what other clubs do or don’t do. With the exception of Messi and possibly Ronaldo every other player on the planet has a price. It is just whether you are prepared to meet the sellers valuation. What other clubs may or may not have done does not enter in it for me. My beef has always been that we have had ample time to identify a striker back up. Someone who will add something to the squad. For some reason we seem to have failed to do that.
Kallstrom. New term for botched transfer dealings?
I get your point Steve and you are right that keeping Giroud fit is now even more crucial than before, but give me at least one actual striker name you think was realistically available this window and who is better (or at least on par) than what we already have in the team.
Lars@183. I think Trev@182 may be referring to those strange activities practised in Finnish saunas. Not Scandinavians as such but an understandable error.
Yours pedantically,
dkg
Lars,
Maybe it’s only the Finns that do it, but it was just a reference to running out of saunas, rolling in the snow and hitting themselves with birch twigs. 😉
Steve T, with sincere respect mate, we get it, you are not happy. After you finish the drink I just bought you, go home, get on the treadmill for a 5 miler and sweat it out, it will do you good. Plenty of things to be happy about with this great club.
bmgedo@185: Much as I think he may be his own worst enemy, I think Bendtner’s head may only be on straight until the next time a ball hits it. 🙂
Ah, now I see what you mean! And yes, spanking yourself with birch twigs is a very Finnish thing. The sauna tradition is quite strong in Sweden too, but we settle for just sitting in there while having a beer and a chat!
@197 dkg, humble pie has been served, he knows he is on the best team he’ll ever play for, I think he’ll come good.
BOOM!
Draxler has apparently said on TV that he did want to come but Schalke said no.
Other allegations from tweeters (who may well be trying to cover themselves of course) are that Bayern sabotaged it.
My guess (and it’s just a guess) is that Schalke think they can benefit from an auction in June. And they may well be right. My hope is that we don’t get involved in auctions. There are plenty more unripe apples on the trees.
Reading over my posts Trev, the verbiage you quote could have been left off. My apologies!
Eandy. We have a massive worldwide scouting network. They are paid handsomely for their efforts. I would suggest that identifying a suitable striker is more their remit. That sa
Well in Lars.
Is 201 what is euphemistically described as the tabs position?
Just for my own education about the strange rituals of this bar.
dkg @201, yeah it makes sense from their point of view. An auction would benefit them, and his release clause comes into play in the summer too. Plus they keep their player for another few months. Why sell to us for less than the release clause in January?
Just looking at the times, I think Lars’ goal may well have deflected in off bmgedo.
….. That said, if we wanted to spend big bucks I would have put on an offer for Costa. If we were just going short term to wait for the big one on the summer I would happily have taken anyone of the several names we were linked with. That includes the likes of Betbatov, Kalou, Klosse, Vucinic etc personally I think as a 16 game back up that they are all head and shoulders above the likes of Park and Bendtner.
Goonsterham,
Sorry old chap, but when people say “pfffft” to me, I tend to take it a little harshly.
As for “cathartic venting”, and “unwarranted personal attacks”, before you accuse me of either I suggest you find a decent dictionary and look them up.
And anyone who bothers to read my bits and bobs on here will hopefully recognise that I too am generally very supportive of both manager and team.
And while fully recognising everyone’s right to their opinion, I’m just a little tired of the “soandso knows” comments when, clearly, they don’t.
That comment, which I made with a “if I may” proviso, seems to have struck a rather raw nerve.
Anyway, this is tedious for others, so I shall say no more on the subject.
One on the bar for you if you are partaking.
@206 dkg, right off my backside, I am a genuine poacher in front of goal.
I am Trev, and cheers.
“So and so knows” is merely an easy way of stating agreement with a previous drinker. No harm in that. If you disagree with them, say so!
And yes, let’s move on.
Steve T: I would happily have taken anyone of the several names we were linked with.
Linked with by whom? Journos, tweeters, and others trying to burnish their own self-importance?
dkg@197: I fear that it is the other way round. The only time Bendtner’s head is working properly is when he is hitting it against a ball.
NBN: Heh!
dk@204: yes, the tabs position is the 101/201/301 etc drink. But for it to be a proper tabsing you have to be trying for the goal.
Is there a 14 day cooling down clause we could involve and return Kallstrom……… NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE
Ah – thanks Lars – I can’t claim that in this instance, even though I was aware an assist was in the offing.
Steve – Berbatov – really? Can you imagine him tracking back like Giroud does? I for one am glad we did not sign him.
Kalou – were not we talking strikers? And even then would be in same league as Kallstrom, which apparently is underwhelming.
Vucinic – player did not want to move.
Klose – would welcome him aswell but as far as I heard Lazio did not want to loan him, and signing 35 year old striker on permanent basis is not good business.
Costa has been thoroughly discussed here before, we would have to go in to range of 50+ mil for Atletico even consider selling him (which is, in my opinion, stupid sum of money for him), then the player would have to want to come (which I doubt he would since they are right up there in the mix for the title) and lastly, scoring bags of goals in Spain does not mean he would do so in England aswell.
As I said before, I agree that stiker department really needs solving but just want to show that available talent, especially in January, is pretty limited.
On a lighthearted note, Frimpong saw red after 34 minutes today #dench
Does sending Park to Watford on loan decrease the number of strikers we have or leave the number unchanged?
Frimpong to Barnsley, Yannaris to Brentford, Jeffrey to Wycombe; is it concerning that we are unloading the youngsters who didn’t make it to Championship rather than Premier League clubs, a sign the quality was never there in the first place?
Also, how does the BBC reckon us to be a loser in the transfer window? None of the departures: Nico Yennaris [to Brentford] undisclosed, Emmanuel Frimpong [to Barnsley] undisclosed, Chuba Akpom [to Brentford] loan, Anthony Jeffrey [to Wycombe] free, Benik Afobe [to Sheffield Wednesday] loan, Park Chu-young [to Watford] loan, are first team regulars or squad stalwarts. True, we haven’t strengthened, but we are no weaker than before the window opened. Pellegrini didn’t strengthen Citeh either, but he doesn’t seem to be castigated as a loser for it.
Barca lost at home today. Athletico have a serious chance to win La Liga. Only a imbecile of the highest order would sell their striker in January no matter what’s on offer.
Ned,
On his departure I hear that Chu-Young donated to us his very own, and aptly named, Park Bench. 😉
Well, Arsegonian, you can say that but don’t forget Defoe was just sold by Daniel Le ……… Oh yeah. 😉
It is interesting how some in here suggest we should not look at other successful buyers such as city in transfer markets as the marker but there are suggestions on here that because utd and Liverpool are behind us we should be happy as shite.
We got smacked good and proper by city, so yes they are very relevant.
C’mon guys, are we here to win or merely to provide some decent competition and just exist……
It is not only those that have moved this window that are in the market, they are simply the only ones who received a successful offer.
I think steve T has simply asked way back, was this loaner deal being our best!
I suggest it is not even fucking close.
There is no concerns about our current position on the table, the simple concern is that we run a huge risk of being short in the next month or so dependant on Ramsey and other “3 weekers” and we had a good chance to better our squad.
WhY is that too much to ask.
I guess the answer to these questions will be know soon.
The injury to our new loanee is it bad luck or bad mAnagement of a new squad members first training session.
Trev, I believe we may have loaned out Park Bench to Maureen…
@223 City failed in their bid for Mangala. If you are talking further back, City offer players like Adebayor a three times wage bump. I don’t care who you are in whatever profession, you are switching jobs for 3 times wages. Of course City is successful with transfers when you can offer that.
@Aussie
I heard that Arsene forced Kallstrom to give him a piggyback around the training pitches. For five hours.
Make of that what you will.
City are still paying Adebayor £40k a week.
They don’t own him anymore and last weekend he actually played against them while they continued to pay part of his wages.
I hope that Wenger was taking notes. If he’s been really sharp we could still be paying Ade too instead of letting City be the innovators.
Can anyone really be upset and angry when Arsenal can go top tomorrow by winning at home and Man Utd are shit despite spending £70m this season?
The sun is shining, the birds are singing and god is in his heaven. If you’re not smiling this evening then there is no hope for you.
Let’s talk wages for a second. Özil is our highest paid player on ( rumored ) £130k a week. City has players on the bench on £180k a week. United are supposedly offering Rooney £300k a week. Ronaldo reportedly makes £350k a week. In short, we can’t compete with that until our revenues take a huge jump or else we will be in debt up to our eyeballs. I’d rather Arsene go for a guy like Giroud who seems genuinely honored to be at Arsenal for £80k a week instead of some douche that wants £225k a week like the cunt we used to have. Maybe that’s just me ….
What about negredo arsegonian ? Not a bad buy.
I think the question is more about the intent shown to want to win and be the best.
For my money Our current injured loanee is not showing intent to be our best, not does it seem like a good investment.
Funny stuff N7 – give you that one.
Speaking of strikers that moved this January why no one mentions Osvaldo. He was available and as far as I know Arsene was interested in him couple of years ago.
Negredo is a decent buy on reasonable wages. However their are different considerations besides just agreeing the fee. Perhaps Negredo chose Man City. I read an article in 442 about Negredo in their top 100 players list ( December issue with Mesut on the cover) He worked with Pellegrini at Real Madrid and really likes him. So there you have it. As much as we’d like to think, not every player wants to come to Arsenal.
Let me ask you one question arsegonian – do you think kallstrom is a good buy, are your excited by his deal and do you think he will be the squad bolstering player you have been asking for….
Does his loan deal show the intent you were hoping for ……
First of all Kallstrom isn’t a buy, he’s a 4 month loan. If you are asking would I rather have Julian Draxler then the answer is yes I would. But like I’ve said theirs a reason the top 7 only brought in 6 players and the bottom 7 brought in 28. The top players are on top clubs who still have stuff to play for … The bottom teams buy off bottom clubs or broke teams or teams in lesser leagues. Even the special cunt himself ( who spends money like Mrs. arsegonian) said he’s thinking long term and not throwing away money for 6 extra points. I like long term thinking over short term thinking.
Are you suggesting N7 that if we don’t come on here spouting praise for the injured loan deal we are being negative and not happy.
I suggest some on here are happy just to be in front of UTD and others.
Not for me I’m afraid…….
I would like to see arsenal beat barca and city and Bayern and take the fucking treble.
Is that so bad ……
Chelsea need a striker every bit as much as we do. They don’t have a striker with more goals than Giroud. Their strikers are old ( Etoo ) shit ( Torres ) or don’t play ( Ba ). They have WAY more money than us and didn’t bring anybody in. What does that say? Nobody of any real quality was available.
Arsegonian – Are you jumping for joy and happy about the 4 month loan deal for arsenal to be our best.
Pretty simple question mate.
No I’m not jumping for joy but I’m not freaking out like you either. The players we have right now have got us this far so have some confidence and support who we have.
We are both arsenal supporters arseG. Please don’t pretend I am any less an arsenal supporter than you by suggesting we could have done better.
As a youngster, I liked baseball. My grandfather had season tickets to the Chicago White Sox. He passed them to my uncle who passed them to me. The White Sox didn’t win a championship from 1917 – 2005. My grandfather was born, lived and died without seeing a trophy. So this eight years without a trophy seems pretty minuscule to me. I’m a patient guy.
Show me where I said you were ” less of a supporter “
Arse – Why do you care about chelsea so much. I only care about our deals.
Next you will tell me how well we are doing versus UTD.
This speaks volumes about professional physicians and fitness coaches in the club.
http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/5792/premier-league/2014/02/01/4588039/new-arsenal-signing-kallstrom-ruled-out-for-up-to-six-weeks
I can tolerate lack of transfer activities, I can tolerate not spending big, I can even tolerate lies like that one about Park being finally ready after three years in the club and then few hours later loaning him out.
What I can’t tolerate are the constant injuries and the way we are treating them for years. Unbelievable.
Everybody has their own feelings on the topic. Some season ticket holders believe they have a right to gripe cause their hard earned money goes into the club. I’m a lowly red member who pays £50 a year. I used to do it for Arsenal player but now that Arsenal player is free, I’m not sure why I renew every year other than I like the season pack they send. Personally, I don’t think I have any room to gripe about how the club is run. I’m comfortable with the fact that Arsene Wenger has forgotten more about Arsenal than any of us will ever know. I’m also quite certain he has Arsenal’s best interests at heart so call me an AKB or whatever. I let the football people do the football stuff and I just watch the matches and hope they win.
I care about Chelsea cause I’m a voyeur :). Seriously just showing that even the richest clubs don’t always get what they might need in January.
@Aussie
I’m saying that even if we won the treble there would still be some people moaning we didn’t win the league cup and asking what happens if Giroud gets injured.
Everyone’s free to say what they want, of course. But this evening I have a smile on my face and a song in my heart.
Life is quite simply too short to argue about the proper emotional reaction to an injury to a short term loan signing. My focus is on Palace and laughing my way through MOTD.
COYG
N7 knows … In Arsene’s press conference a journalist asked ” what do you hope to achieve today? ” Arsene said ” To prepare well for Crystal Palace.” Hahaha everybody laughed. Then Arsene went on to say football is on the pitch, this other stuff isn’t real football. I’m taking that comment to heart as I cover Arsenal on my site.
Arse and N7- thanks for the interesting pints of view. Patience is a virtue and arse your story about the white sox and your grandfather certainly does shed some perspective on our 8 trophyless years.
Unfortunately the off field transfer stuff does have a direct relation with the onfield stuff.
On this occasion I am pleased to agree to disagree that this latest loan deal was a waste of time and money and his injury at his first training is quite incredible…..
Well guys I’m done. If you are genuinely happy with what we have, what we are and the way we are being run then good luck to you. I’m happy for you. For me we are a long way short of what we could be.
I will be interested to see what the atmosphere and opinions are of those around me at The Grove tomorrow. I will be interested to see what the general opinion is.
On to Palace. For those heading to the Tollie I salute you. Work prevents any attendance pre match but I may try and make a swift ale before the journey home.
The fact is this Loan thing was a gamble! And this is one of the top leagues club!
Injured what was the point? if injured longer what was the point further!????
@249 … Nowhere did I say I’m genuinely happy but I also I’m not ” absolutely fuming ” either. I’m somewhere in the middle. Considering we are one point off and will go top tomorrow with 3rd at 2nd on Monday, I’m content. Like I said, everyone has their opinions on how their season ticket money is used etc. I will say though that every season ticket holder that feels they don’t like the way the club is run has the option to not renew their tickets.
AG. Your last sentence tells me all I need to know. If you really believe that when things aren’t as you would like then you just walk away then quite frankly I’m amazed. Supporting Arsenal for me and many others is not an option. Having an opinion about how we are run is an opinion nurtured from over 40 years attending matches and supporting my club. Walking away has never been and hopefully will never be an option. Quitting might work in your world but it certainly doesn’t work in mine.
Welcome to our latest ‘out for an Arsenal six weeks’ midfielder. Just what we needed. Well done AW, for all the use Kim Källström is going to be you might as well have signed Kim Kardashian!
Dismal window transacted in typical Arsenal style by an negotiating team incomprehensibly pursuing midfielders when our real need was up front.
Berbatov good enough to fill in for Falcao, but not as back up for Giroud? Give me strength. 🙁
Fred Karno couldn’t have handled it better.
Öskar
I sincerely hope I’m wrong but I see a succession of draws coming up, lots of points dropped for want of goals.
Öskar
Guys, sometimes on here it seems there is a fear of critiquing and questioning our club and our manager, even our players at certain times and when justified.
It is ok it doesn’t make you a bad person or a negative nelly.
It is ok to want to win. We don’t have to settle for second or third best.
Winning is not bad.
This is unfortunately one of those times when the manager who earns more than any of us on here, needs to take some responsibility for his lack of action in the transfer market, resulting in a panic buy that is now injured and crocked.
That is the result of waiting too long and being left with the low level players that remain available.
Surely mata for $30+ mil would add more value to our chances of winning trophies by beating Bayern and city than our injured loanee.
Steve T and Oskar know.
Well said to you both for saying what others don’t want to hear.
The attempted defense of this BS is astonishing.
Next we will see some on hear telling us how injuries are ok, running top 4 is al we aim for and making champions league for 16 years is more than we should expect because we are financially prudent.
It’s like we are scared to be winners at the top level for fear of failing.
I would love to see us give it a big go and add a fucking huge striker buy as we should have done:
If we lose from there so be it.
Winning at the top level takes some gonads and some ruthlessness, not comfort and safety.
This latest loan deal will only scare the physios who are now on overtime rates……
You definitely misinterrepted what I meant by that. It has nothing to do with walking away. However I’m not going to clarify here. I don’t want to litter Goonerholics site with this kind of back and forth. That’s what I made a site for so I can say whatever I think there . I have a definite opinion on this subject but don’t want to cause a ruckus here.
I can understand both sides, and see where you guys are coming from. But the truth is we could have brought in a cover for giroud. We have not had this good a chance in winning a trophy in forever. I still believe it can be done, but we did miss a chance to get this striker situation fixed last summer. So we just hope and keep supporting the club
@256 …. Not a single person on here or any other blog, chat room, social media outlet etc. knows what Arsene attempted or didn’t attempt to do. That said I’m not defending or not defending. All I’m saying is I’m calm about the situation. I don’t think it’s BS …. I don’t think it’s wonderful either. Every quality player on earth doesn’t have Arsenal in their dreams. Maybe Arsene tried and got shot down. We’ll never know cause he doesn’t kiss and tell. All of this rambling about what a failure we are is opinion and nothing else. I’ve tried to use logic explaining how City couldn’t buy, how Chelsea got no striker either. If you want cover for Giroud that implies somebody not at Giroud’s level. A backup. Well we have that, Niklas Bendtner. Maybe he isn’t your cup of tea because he’s an unloyal douche bag but he is a talented player and a player who has scored in the premier league. We also have Podolski in a pinch. Now if you really meant you want someone better than Giroud, once again I challenge anyone to name a single striker that moved that was better than Giroud and we somehow missed out on
Just curious. Did any of the top clubs anywhere in Europe bring in a top-class striker in January?
Also, just seen that Philippe Senderos, late of this parish, has signed for Valencia.
AG – why are players that have moved in this transfer window even relevant to what we have done or failed to do.
Are we not scouting the world to make the big deals happen.
It’s called being proactive and putting some hard cold cash in front of a big players nose and enticing him to start negotiations.
Looking at who has moved only means those that agreed a deal.
What about all those strikers who were not made the correct offer, why not go and shake the tree a bit.
Arsenal has some of the best facilities in the world, are in CL and FA cup and 2nd in Epl.
Surely we are attractive to a big name or world class striker or attacking midfielder.
It’s called making a deal happen, not making a lame first low bid, then walking away cause they don’t accept out generous offer.
Suarez would be an arsenal player today with a bit of entrepreneurial attitude with our deal making.
Well said SanAG @ 258 – all the above gripes are about the great chance gone begging and our current growing injury list.
Because talking about who moved shows who was available. Explain to me how Athletico Madrid were selling Diego Costa when they are top of the league, have a very winnable UCL tie and just sold Falcao for a zillion pounds. If you think that was just going to automatically happen because we waved some cash about, then say hi to Mickey Mouse while you’re living in fantasy land.
Btw Steve T who is ranting with you is on record as saying he doesn’t want Suarez anywhere near Arsenal. He wants his cake and eat it too.
AG – an example of making a deal happen.
If you are currently happy with your current employment situation but someone offers you better pay and conditions and a better career opportunity you may be tempted to listen.
The rest is called negotiation skills.
Suarez is an example of the type of tricky negotiations that we adopted to get ozil.
On this occasion I believe we may minimal to nil effort to make a big deal happen.
I do not speak for Steve T – just agree with his comments “did we do our best”
BTW AG – I believe you would be a good negotiator for arsenal due to your passion for the club, your persistence and quality of argument plus you like stats which always helps when all else fails.
Most people leave their current employer not for money but for respect of their ability. That’s what we did to get ozil as he didn’t need the cash but he got respect for his ability and regular play.
My gripe is we need to do it more often as our global opposition are doing to get the big names to add to their home grown and academy squad members.
Going for gold and constantly improving shows your desire and intent.
In this transfer window we went for bronze and will not improve.
I get it. I’ve moved jobs many times. However I’m still waiting on a name. Giving me some generic job moving scenario isn’t quite showing how Arsenal failed.
Well thanks @265 … I’d love Dick Law’s job and I’d hire Steve T as the bad cop to my good cop routine 🙂
I wanted draxler as you did.
Young and worth the extra dosh.
Arsene and co didn’t make the deal happen so Schiller will go to auction next chance.
That means we lost the opportunity to avoid a tender situation by not making re deal happen. I.e we wouldn’t pay the market rate.
I have always wanted Hernandez from utd.
Hernandez is the opposite of giroud but a real poacher of goals and he is young and hungry.
He doesn’t get first team football so would relish the chance to get first team football.
Either way it doesn’t matter as we didn’t even try to make the deals happen.
The losing bidder in any deal always complains at the loss.
The winner just moves on with the prize.
I would have loved Draxler and now was the time to do it for the reasons you stated. However the only fact is none of us know the facts. Maybe we are inept. I really hope not. I’m not prepared to say we are or aren’t without some cold hard facts. If I knew we bid say £33M and Schalke asked for £38M and we walked then if say ” what the fuck Arsene!!” But I’m not even sure we talked to them at this point. Who knows what to believe when there are 100 different outlets saying 100 different things.
And for Steve T ( I know he’s sleeping now ) I respect any Gooner especially one that has attended matches for 40 years and hauls their kids to matches like you. That is true commitment and you have my respect. If you read my post above, my only gripe is complaining without knowing the facts. None of us know anything other than what we read. Once again, I’m not prepared to scream ” FAILURE ” without knowing what was actually tried. Cheers and enjoy Palace today.
Aussie – I appreciate the question about whether the team did their best trying to sign a striker. Given Wenger’s passion for the team, I have no doubt he told the staff to do their best. And I’m guessing they tried to do their best. Did they do their best? We’ll never know. Could it be that they are simply incompetent or poor negotiators? The could be true. Was it as simple as they did not find the right person to fit the job description? This could also be true.
Unfortunately we will never know. It sounds like we made an effort to sign Draxler but couldn’t get it done for the price we were willing to offer. If the 37 mil number that has been thrown about is true, I’m personally glad we didn’t spend that kind of money on a 20 yo with potential and injuries. Like you (or Steve T?) suggested, Mata would be a much better deal. Unfortunately there was no way Maureen would sell Mata to a cross city rival ahead of him in the standings. Heck, he wouldn’t even lend us Demba Ba once he found out we signed Ozil because we had suddenly become competition (if you believe what was written at the time). So he got himself a bunch of cash from Manure who he doesn’t see as a rival at this time.
And so now we have to play with the team we got. Personally, I’m confident we are going to win the PL title. I haven’t thought too much about the FA, but I don’t think we will get past Bayern this year.
And come this summer I have no doubt that we will find players to improve the team with the goal of challenging the likes of Bayern and Barca next year.
Yesterday (or two days ago depending on where you are) I was disappointed. Today I’m just looking forward to watching the next match.
Aussie – Just saw your pose on Hernandez and I totally agree he would be great for Arsenal. But again there is no way Manure would sell him to us. My guess is they would rather give him away to the Spuds rather than make some money selling him to Arsenal! 🙂
ECG knows … No way Mata would have been allowed to join us.
Focus Focus Focus. One step in front of the other. No distractions.
Hint: drink274 has something to do with Crystal Palace and I am not talking about the historical exhibition!!
Thanks AG and ECG for the broad and interesting opinions we all share.
It is nice not to always have to agree but still be able to have a strong drink and debate the arsenal things in life.
As always, I appreciate the opportunity to have my say on this site and enjoyed all above.
34 degrees in Sydney this afternoon so time for a swim and a beer.
My Saturday heroes: (1) Charlie Adam for bringing me such unexpected delight. Eight Yanited losses already? Lovely. 😛
(2) various ‘Holics above for providing me with a remedy for my recurring insomnia. I have bookmarked this particular session of drinks. The tedium of transfer discussion over the past couple of days will do the trick.
Let’s move on, shall we?
Just keep winning.
BMBD
But Lonestar, the next transfer window isn’t for 5 months! 🙂
Aussie, sounds hot in Sydney. There’s a cool one at the bar for you!
Facts?
Fact 1 … OG has gone to ground, writhing around in pain, clutching his ankle, leg or whatever, in so many games this season that the likelihood of him getting a serious injury seems inevitable, and more likely sooner than later.
Fact 2 … We lost Rambo, STILL our second top goal-scorer, first for weeks, now for who knows how long.
Fact 3 … We’ve lost Theo, arguably our #2 striker, for the season.
Fact 4 … Our back-up consists of Bendtner whom we’ve been trying to get rid of for years, without takers at any price; Park who would be considered a bad joke if called on; any number of others currently out on loan cos AW sees no immediate use for them; and Poldi whom AW much prefers as a winger and who rarely gets any time these days in any position however fit he apparently is.
Fact 5 … After Palace we face, in order … Liverpool, Man U, Liverpool, Bayern Munich, Sunderland, Stoke, FA Cup QF, Swansea, Bayern Munich, Tottenham, Chelsea, Man City. Not the kind of run to face without a striker!
Fact 6 … Apparently we were offered Berbatov on loan, but declined.
Fact 7 … We are in the best position we have been in for years, still contesting three major trophies and being taken seriously by people whose opinions matter. Which means we are in an ideal position to attract quality players, either full-time or on loan.
Fact 8 … If there’s a player we really want only a handful of money-rich clubs can outbid us. They may also offer higher wages, BUT they cannot buy ALL the class on the planet even though they try to. There’s a limit to how many strikers, for example, that Man City can buy before the next one decides ‘No thanks, I’d spend half my life on the bench. I’d rather play regularly for Arsenal’.
Fact 9 … AW’s valuation of Mata cost us any chance of his signature (for just a couple of mil some say) a while back. Look what he’s worth now. Rumour suggests the Draxler deal went the same way. Okay, this is speculation more than hard fact, but it’s being reported that way.
Fact 10 … AW is the greatest manager in our history, but just occasionally it would be nice if he had more consideration for the fans who pay his wages. If he was seen to be trying to overcome the club’s obvious shortcomings (lack of strikers, eg) rather than pretending we can manage if he can’t sign a real bargain. It cannot possibly be a secret that we need a striker ffs, so no-one is going to react differently if he says he’s looking for one. In FACT he’s more likely to have agents queuing at his door.
Fact ? … There are more you can add yourselves, I’m too peed off about this to bother.
Öskar
Fact X … Manure played RvP, Rooney AND Mata today, and still couldn’t beat Stoke. Lmfao.
Öskar
Oskar i agree with your Facts bar Fact10, when i presume the sherry kicked in.
Cheers Aussie. I agree. Tensions are high and we all don’t agree. But we are all Gooners ( and Holics ) who love the club so no hard feelings from my end. Hope everybody that’s going tomorrow has a great time and I’ll see who isn’t here bright and early ( for ECG & I. )
Having read the same two lines of argument essentially repeated over and over for 200+ posts, I now realise that’s an hour of my life that I’ll never get back. Thanks you all. Seriously, I need to get out more.
“Be the best you can be.”
“Fail to prepare, prepare to fail.”
“Winning at the top takes gonads.”
Where will this abbreviated compendium of management-speak clichés (ok. maybe not the last one) take us next?
I wonder, what is French for “deja-vu” again? And again?
Let’s storm the palace. UTA!
A little respect please all.
Thank you.
Off up the The Arsenal! Magic day in prospect. You knows it.
Have a great day, Esso, I know you will.
Noosa @283 – french for “deja vu”, is “deja vu”.
Hope that helps.
MATCH DAY!!!
COYG
Wow, what a backdrink. Looks like the club hasn’t built up any goodwill with the fans this season despite the capture of one of the best midfielders in the world and leading the league for more than half the season.
Naturally, now that we’re in 2nd that will signal the start of our perpetual freefall to join the red scum in midtable. If anyone wants me I’ll be stocking the fallout shelter with tinned food because the world is obviously going to end if we don’t win by a cricket score today.
Can’t we all just get along?
Maybe Wenger has found his striker – RVP to return? TDD has started early then…
Porco@290: would you please also stock some nice southern French reds as well…I’ll bring the cheese and olives!
Porco
I don’t think it’s too surprising that there is disappointment because being so close to a prize that we have done so well to challenge for this season but facing an injury crisis and a need to buff up personnel in one area in particular the window becomes pivotal . Yes it’s full of vulgar hype and childish speculation but it is the opportunity to fix issues. We have issues most of which are not of our making and it seemed to me that the club was lifted in a hugely emphatic way when we signed Ozil in August.
I am not sure if we can pull off something like that every window but we are in a position where we could be more ambitious than we were.in fact in the last three windows we have paid two fees. That the team is at the top of the table shows Wenger’s judgement is pretty acute and we don’t need to continually be buying players. A lot of this comes down to how much faith we place in Wenger. Is it absolute because he has done such a good job or are we entitled to challenge his judgment and if we do does this signify impatience or a lack of faith in the club?
Oskar produced a very coherent list, one that articulated much of what I and many others had been thinking about and it is hard to ignore or oppose his logic.
The Kjallstrom scenario has just compounded the frustration of those who believe the co- ordination of inwards movement of players is a potential problem. All today I have had supporters of other clubs winding me up and it is hard to put up a defence to them. The episode is ridiculous and maybe symptomatic of a problem in recruitment that I think we have.
But the window is closed, nothing sadly can be done to improve the players available to us and we are where we are. All that matters now is that we support those who are turning out for us, without reservation and hope that our luck Re injuries improves and we can show the same sort of late- season form we have in the last two seasons.
If we do we may yet have a glorious end to the season before the next window shenanigans kick in
TTG@293: people’s opinions are only their ‘opinion’…best not to let these opinions ‘wind you up’ or feel the need to defend anything…will lead to a stress free Sunday 🙂
Well, can’t wait for the match today.. When I read this (from @Oskar 279) –
“..After Palace we face, in order … Liverpool, Man U, Liverpool, Bayern Munich, Sunderland, Stoke, FA Cup QF, Swansea, Bayern Munich, Tottenham, Chelsea, Man City. Not the kind of run to face without a striker!”
– I was reminded to pray (and hope) for an injury-free run for our defence – esp. Per, Kos, Sagna without whom we wouldn’t be here in the first place and won’t get into any kind of a run.. they need to be protected against the thugs from the likes of Stoke, West Ham and other relegation contenders which seem like the entire bottom half .. THAT (more than the striker situation) could well decide where we end up and what we end up with, come May..
I saw United lose both their central defenders to Stoke’s thugs y’day wtih Carrick forced to man CB!! Imagine Arteta similarly being forced to play RB/CB…
And I also hope that they won’t end up getting redded recklessly (a la Flam) – it all seems too much to ask but hey, we all have our wishes..
Football today……….. thank fuck for that.
@TTG
Supporters of other clubs winding you up?
Easy one – there are only two clubs in the country who wouldn’t give their left arm to trade places with us, and both of them have sold their souls in a way most of us wouldn’t want to.
We could well be top again in a few hours time. For those of us who think football is still about the pitch, rather than the politicking, THAT’s what matters.
At the end of every transfer window they try to laugh at us, because it’s the best chance they get. Nod, smile, take names and give it back to them in May.
COYG
Well I’m happy.
Happy as Larry. 🙂
That N7 Gooner knows what he’s talking about. I agree with every word.(*)
COYG
*Transcribed so as not to offend Trev.
Ping.
BMBD
In off the left knee. I thank yew!
Well in Pangloss.
A definite Tabs position (for those still unsure of the rules) to Lonestar.
Well in, Pangloss.
Let’s all get behind the boys. Win the next match.
BMBD
So. Phil McNumpty has a TTD winners and losers column!?
The losers being anyone unfortunate enough to read his dribble.
Thankyou, Pangloss – and I, in turn, agree with you, and congratulate you on a well taken goal. 😉
IF @ 287
Thanks. Do you also happen to know what is Slovakian for “I’d give my right arm to be ambidextrous?”
UTA. 3-0.
DK Gooner – I think I meant Cisse was consistent apart from this season. He was awesome in his first season. But if I remember he was a January buy. I do recall that he did fall off slightly last season, but I did not follow him regularly. However whenever I looked up, he had found the back of the net, including that wonder strike which you mentioned. Sorry to have unintentionally misled. It was not my intention.
Just for the record Arsenal have purchased injured players before.
Does anybody remember Amory Bischoff purchased in July 2008?
Wenger stated that Bischoff was injured at the point of purchase and that he was a work in progress. Presumably this would have been the intention with Count Drax!
Not sure if I believe that Kallstrom was injured before we bought him if he was injured during his first training session. But I do believe that he may have had a dodgy back which became aggravated during his first training session with Arsenal.
@304 Lonestar and @291Kamahl, both spot on. It is time to put the frustrations away and get behind the boys, all of us.
Match time soon Lurky, albeit from the sofa today for me!
Come on Arsenal. Oh and I must say I hope Palace do well this season, being my local club. But not today boys! 😆
Thank you H2H, Lonestar and Trev. Touché H2H@305. I felt dirty even as I was reading it.
COYG Win the next match. It’s on.
Sofa for me too, Goonertown, as always.
In other news Sturridge have just scored. Liverpool made a lot mistakes in the past regarding transfers, but they just know how to pick a striker.
They sure do, Lurky. Just ask Andy Carroll’s agent.
Lurky – Don’t they just re: strikers!
It may have something to do with that infamous ‘Kop’!
Pangloss.
the BBC used to stand for something. It had a quality, a guarentee that it would strive to by a cut above the average.
Shame that they’ve let their standards slip and mcNulty is just proof of that sad fact. All he does now is cater to te lowest common denominater in the search for clicks and reactions. The comments page, no matter what the subject, usually just ends up a pissing contest between the mancs and the mickeys. Sad.
Fair comment re the BBC H2H.
My own two penn’orth is that i) they have to go searching for clicks and reactions because that is how their political masters (of whichever colour) measure their relevance; and ii) the same enormous choice of broadcasters that makes it difficult for Auntie to get listeners/viewers means that their is an enormous choice of employer for potential broadcasters which makes it likely that there will be more dross working at the BBC.
It’s the same with everything, when things change there are winners and losers.
By the way, the fact that I understand the BBC’s dilemma and maybe even have some sympathy for it won’t deflect me from my self-appointed task of pointing out the many times they drop below the high standards I’d like them to meet. I look upon it as a long-term project to encourage people to lobby for more quality, even if it is at the expense of choice.
COYG
I’ll be a couch potato if I’m lucky. Got to see the first half of WBA-Liverpool and Suarez is playing very well at the moment but how long until his annual bite fest, I wonder?
COYG rip a hole in the Palace walls.
West Brom equalise!
Undercover Kolo Toure. 😉
Hey everyone,
as ever, streams here
http://www.wiziwig.tv/broadcast.php?matchid=241723&part=sports
and
http://livetv.sx/en/eventinfo/211961_arsenal_crystal_palace/
lets get back to winning ways!
No Vermaelen in the squad.
Would prefer Rosicky to start, maybe he is just not ready after all.
Arsenal: Szczesny, Sagna, Mertesacker, Koscielny, Monreal, Arteta, Cazorla, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Ozil, Podolski, Giroud. Subs: Rosicky, Fabianski, Bendtner, Jenkinson, Gibbs, Gnabry, Zelalem.
Crystal Palace: Speroni, Ward, Gabbidon, Delaney, Parr, Bolasie, Jedinak, Dikgacoi, Puncheon, Chamakh, Jerome. Subs: Hennessey, Mariappa, McCarthy, Gayle, Wilbraham, Guedioura, Bannan.
Eandy, Vydra was quite poor and out of pace for WBA today, expected more from him to be honest.
Lurky – he is young and did not have that much of a game time yet I suppose, have to admit I have not been watching him closely, but he will come good. From interviews I read with him in czech papers or in general he is very level headed and humble guy.
He was championships best scorer last year, I suppose this is his transitional season and next year he might start proving his worth, he has all the ingredients to do so.
I’ve seen some of his goals from last year, that’s why I expected more I guess. He will come good, no doubt.
Neither team was much good really.
I’ve seen quiet a bit of L’pool this season and they are what you could definetly call a first half team.
Agree H2H,
Speaking of Liverpool, as much as their attacking options are good their defense is bad. All of their back four plus Gerrard are liabilities.
Their best midfielder is Henderson and that speaks volumes about their midfield too.
Hello ‘holics
I see the match day crowd is here 🙂
Really hope we are up for this, feels like it could be a tight one
Morning Holics … Weird to see Santi playing next to Arteta. Let’s see how that works.
Cmon Poldi.
Cmon Arsenal.
Let’s do these Palatial cunts.
Lets trash the New Orcs.
COYG!
COME ON YOU REDZZZZZZZZZZ
COME ON!
Let’s go boys! Three points.
Scratch that. Stat zone had the lineup wrong 🙂
Chamakh’s hair looks even weirder than normal today
Oooooo Nacho
Great pass
ooo nacho
Time wasting already
what a control by Santi
Was that guy trying to mount the HFB?
It’s all very nice one touch football.
But can someone please take a shot.
Wouldn’t you? 🙂
Exactly my thoughts H2H, we need to start testing their keeper.
How the hell are their CBs allowed to manhandle Giroud like that.
Heh Arsegonian……… NO.
Ugh …
So close
OOoooooooooooo Kosser
ooooooooh
Sagna just clutched his hamstring. Please no
ouch, close Bac, but hopefully not hurt himself too bad:(
No foul on Ox?
About time for Jedinak yellow.
What to say about that.
Palace look a well drilled unit, we’ll just have to keep chipping away and make sure we take our chance when it comes.
COYR’s.
anyone seriously want to tell me that this Pubic team has been set out to do aught but kick us?
good morning, holics!
COME ON YOU GUNNERS!!!
C’mon boys be aggressive
Come ooon!
Get in!
oooo, lovely.
OX!!!!
Oxlaaaaaaaddddweee
OOOOX!
Daft touch
Daft touch
Brilliant finish!
Holy shit!
My connection to the bar is really slow.
Anyone else having a problem?
yup H2H ..having troubles aswell
yes, h2h. dead slow.
Cheers lads.
Here comes the Stoke crap …
Woah, this is a Pulis team. Yuck.
Come on lads, finish them off.
TR on
TR7 for poldi
ox!!!
OOOOXXXX2
What a goal!!!! Chambo
Very happy for Ox!!!
oh yes!!:D
Palace have been resilient.
I hope these are the early signs of their premiership survival, but…
Well done Chamberlain! 🙂
Back to the top again!
Yes as well on the connection
Chamakh getting some love from the crowd on his departure
Fuck Arteta
TOP OF THE LEAGUE!!! Have a great night Gents
Cracking result.
Smiles on faces. 15 clear of Utd. 11 of the neighbours. 8 of Pool.
COYG
Great work by our boys tonight.
Top of the league again and Pulis humbled.
What a save by Szczesny to keep Palace out!
Impressive.
Time to recuperate and get ready for Liverpool.
UTA
What H2H said!
Giroud has been tightly marked, kicked, pulled down…everything. Someone needs to latch on to his lay offs and just crack one
Come on Arsenal!
Wenger confirms club award of back issue before loan agreed.
Should be able to play end of the month.
Spartak pay his wages until he’s ready.
For those who take an interest.
Sorry – the above is all re; Kallstrom
Patient and professional performance from the lads,
so glad to see Ox on the scoresheet, looked very bright today. Cannot say about any player that he would have bad game actually.
Great save by Woj and good to see TR back.
Only saw up to AOC’s second goal, so will have to watch the rest later.
Still, job done and yet another clean sheet. I’ll take that any day of the week.
someone mentioned palace have been playing more football since pulis arrived. not on your life.
very happy about our play, and ox’s movement for his goals was superb. harsha, spot on about og, can’t believe the abuse he gets that goes unpunished.
a draw or a chelski win will do me fine tomorrow.
Poor first half. Better second half although we still did not really move out of second gear. Two great strikes from AOC. Big Per and Kosser imperious at the back.
Job done. 3 points. Top of the league although we may have to be a tad sharper next week.
See you when you older boys and girls.
Eandy @ 394: Very impressed this season by the concentration and anticipation behind many of Szczesny’s great saves. And as a result the timeliness of those saves, especially given that our defense is not breached rarely.
Arteta hobbling was hopefully nothing bigger than a cramp. And liked the Monreal-Podolski combination down the left, good understanding. Poldi should have worked the GK from his chance though.
Solid performance. Same starting line-up for Liverpool?
@398 Theo … Shouldn’t you be over at Le Grove packing generators, 30 day lanterns and tinned meat for the impending zombie apocalypse? Only a complete imbecile would talk about the destruction of a club that sits top of the league. Remember just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t coming to get you.
Btw … Scores!!!!!
Speculative, post delousing BANG
Well in, with one or t’other Arsegonian. A post-delousing tabs position perchance. DGC, where are you now?
Apparently Kolo’s howler gifted Baggies a point today. Maybe we should start with TR7 and press high up from the get-go to force mistakes out of their slowish defense. Which would also stop the balls through the midfield supplies.
Tactically could be an intriguing game.
@ 401 = Skilful goal 😉
funny, during all of the tdd chaos and argy bargy here I fully expected the mnb to come in to selectively amplify the distaste. only a couple days late, glad you missed the party!
Don’t feed the troll, AG…
Well done boys. Great job, Ox.
Win the next match.
BMBD
Back from THOF and a fairly routine victory that secured the TTG pound. In fact 2-0 is our default score. Lots to worry about but our central defence was superb and Ches made a vital save at 1-0. Nice to see Ox have an effective second half and add goal scoring threat to a team that is not replete with regular goalscorers. Some lovely passes by Ozil and Cazorla were a sign of the difference in class between the sides. Worried that Vermaelen was not on the bench and intrigued that Navho is keeping Gibbs out. Not sure if Gibbs is fully fit. They are both excellent players but I would pick Gibbs above Nacho.
Also nice to see agent Kolo deliver for us earlier on. 15 points above ManYoo . When did that last happen?
2-0 to the Arsenal as default score, indeed. That’s the 11th of the season in all competitions — 10 of them at THOF.
As awful as it is to watch Palace playing Pubis style of football, they are organized, physical and prone to impart injuries to their opponents. They still have matches at Selhurst Park against City, Chelsea and Liverpool. So some successful doses of Neanderthal football against those sides would be welcome. (Against Mourinho, 19th century would do….)
Great win. Chuffed for the Ox. There’s no player I’d rather see score.
2-nil is the new 1-nil!
Wenger on Kallstrom (from Arsenal dot com):
“[Being fit at the end of February] is the best-case scenario. I’m sure if you have played football you might have played with a micro-fracture of your vertebra without even noticing it because on a normal scan you don’t find out. He might play before that [the end of February] but he might play as well later.
“Yes [Spartak Moscow will pay Kallstrom’s wages before he returns]. They pay the first six weeks’ wages.
“I would not have signed him if we had two or three more days to do something, but it was Friday night at five o’clock, so it was [a case of] you [sign] nobody or you do it under these conditions. I decided to do it because we might, because of the number of games we have now in February, we might need the players in March or April. There is a possibility [that he may not play] but as well there is the possibility that he scores us the winning goal that might be vitally important.
“At some stage in our job you have to make a decision. Are you wrong or right? You will only know at the end of the season. I made this decision because, since the start of the season, all our central midfielders have missed a part of the season – whether it’s Flamini, Wilshere, Arteta, Chamberlain or Cazorla. All of them have had injuries and it can happen that a few of them miss the next part [of the season] together. It’s true that in the first four to six weeks we have not sorted that problem out.
“It crossed my mind after the [setback] of Ramsey, because everybody says he is back in six weeks but because he had two setbacks who can guarantee that it will not last longer? And after Tuesday night of course, because Wilshere couldn’t play [at Southampton]… it was not a 200 per cent need, we could have gone without, but first of all you must identify a player who has the quality to play for us, in January. Then, because we have the number of players needed in that area, not to be locked in a deal of three or four years, where you pay the players to do nothing. So to find a player on a free loan, of that quality, on Wednesday morning until Friday night, is not easy.
“I know the player very well, personally. He has 108 caps for Sweden and he has played for seven or eight years in France, so I know him very well.”
Hi all. Nice to see the bar is open again.
Good result today. Well done again ‘holic – why not just say 2-0 every match from now on?
Missed the first half – which sounds like it was a good idea, though not planned – so all comments relate to second half.
Great to see Ox looking so full of intelligent running – I’m sure Mesut will pick up on that quick enough – just the sort of stuff he’s looking for. Santi has really found last season’s form the last few games – scoring and assisting. Defence was magnificent as usual. Loved to see how they all relaxed into total automated control once the second goal was on the board. Let’s hope the limping Arteta and Ox were only minor problems.
Part of me wants to see City rub Maureen’s face in the dirt tomorrow but on balance, I’d rather have a draw (then they both drop points).
Sorry to those who are still disappointed about our January window. Obviously we’d all (Wenger included) have loved to see a striker in. But Wenger’s comments above make good sense to me. If you were hoping for a world-class signing, of course Kallstrom is disappointing.
But for a little midfield cover through the business end of the season, Kallstrom was worth doing IMO.
Just in, lots of neat moves which were pleasing to the eye . We did just enough in the way of 3 points and a clean sheet by courtesy of a great save from Chesney but still lack that killer instinct against a very poor side. They defended stoutly but showed little in the way of offensive play and what little they did show was easily dealt with by the BFG and Kos who was immaculate.
I am so pleased for the Ox, those 2 well taken goals should give him a lot of confidence to press on and make a real impact in the coming weeks. Let’s hope the injury scare in the final minutes is nothing to worry about.
Monreal had a much better game than Tuesday night and TR7 looked lively when he got on.
A special mention to the Palace fans who kept their chants and drumming going for the entire 90mins, glad I wasn’t seated in the adjoining blocks!
With Liverpool dropping points, a draw at Citi tomorrow night would suit us just fine.
COYRs
goonsterham @ 410 –
you are obviously quite satisfied with the arsenes reasoning behind the kallstrom deal.
I am interested in which particular part of his explanation made you feel better with the move.
Was it the part where he said knowing he was injured prior to signing him to replace an injured player, or the fact he said if he had two more days he would not have signed him, or the bit where he said he might need him ?
This is no longer about wanting a striker or not, it is more about why rush at the last minute and loan an injury suspect player to replace an injured player ?
Loved the win 3 more points .Wenger should just stop talking about this whole Kallstrom transfer, it’s just plain stupid to wait till the last minute to get an injured player for cover. Come on you are the manager if you knew that coverage was needed, you could have loaned someone a week ago that wasn’t injured.
well said SAG and agree the 3 points was very well done and vey important.
Santi and ox were great and hopefully both stay fit for the foreseeable future
Congratulations to the Legion of Boom! Impressive victory.
Win the next match.
BMBD
Aussie and SAG, I’m not saying we didn’t need a striker, or that I wasn’t disappointed not to get one. It was, to be fair, a window where good strikers evidently weren’t on the move. (Not even Chelsea got one, and they arguably need one as badly as we do.) We could, probably, have done better this January. But I’m ill-placed to make that kind of judgment.
All I meant above was that just because Kallstrom is out for a few more weeks doesn’t mean it wasn’t worth doing. He wasn’t brought in to bring us the trophy single-handedly. He wasn’t the world-beating signing so many had hoped for. By that standard he was always going to be disappointing. But, as Wenger points out, we can realistically hope that he recovers in a couple weeks and provides a little more depth during a crucial time. He’s not expensive (in fact Wenger reveals that Moscow are paying his wages for the first 6 weeks). He’s not a permanent deal. He’s just a little more cover for the business end of the season, in an important area of the pitch. Apparently Wenger knows him and thinks highly enough of him to bring him on to do that job.
That makes sense to me. Of course, if all we wanted was a little midfield cover, we might have done better earlier in the window. But earlier in the window we didn’t know that Ramsey was going to be out those additional 6 weeks.
Again, I’m not saying Arsenal are above reproach in the transfer market. Far from it. Nor am I saying the Kallstrom signing has got me particularly excited. All I’m saying is, given Wenger’s explanation, it was worth doing.
@418 I think we re both saying the same thing. There was no way we could have gotten a world class striker at this point. Truth be told I believe we messed that up during the summer window. But my whole issue with this loan was why wait till the last day to get a cover. He knew Ramsey was going to be out for a while, flamini had three match ban. And with our injury record, even I could have foreseen us being short in the midfield. They could have done better than getting a cover that we might not end up using anyways. This was and still is our best shot at winning a trophy, I just hope we have not blown it.
Top of the league (Why am I not surprised some people discredit top of the league??????) and ready to see a battle royale to the death or mass injury of Merc City and Chavski Monday night. COYG.
we always have the quality against sides like palace but having said that its absolutely top notch taking all 6 pts against them.
we need everyone to step up a gear the next few weeks. tough tough games with the quality not at our disposal right now.
if we keep a clean sheet we have a chance against any side.
Today’s game shd see chelski looking for a draw. with some fast counter attacking. with city’s porous defense I see the scum nicking it.
Me too, SAG@419. And yes to messing it up in the summer. James from Gunnerblog had a great piece to that effect on ESPN a couple days ago. The real moment that I look back on is when we wouldn’t plump the extra few million for Higuain when we had him. Wenger didn’t want to overpay and thought he could get someone else cheaper. Well, it turned out he couldn’t, and in many ways he’s damn lucky the Ozil thing worked out and saved us all, him especially.
Given that we didn’t get it done last summer, it was always going to take some real luck and determination to get a striker of the requisite caliber in in January. No surprise at all that we couldn’t. And yes we could’ve done better than Kallstrom. But I do think it might not be a total loss. As Wenger says, only time will tell.
I also think we’ve still got a shot at this thing. Big games coming up. COYG
Celebrating the Legion of Boom!!! Waiting to celebrate the Legion of Per and Kos in May!!
Twiglet, I agree the Kallstrom thing was far from ideal. Still think, given the circumstances, it was better than nothing at all.
New post and Liverpool score predictor up on my site. I went 2-1 to the Arsenal
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