Gunners Have An ‘Owler
Oct 27th, 2015 by 'holic
The team news revealed a reasonable blend of experience and youth. The spine was provided by Petr Cech, Per Mertesacker, Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain, and Olivier Giroud. Debuts were being made by Glen Kamara and Alex Iwobi. There were also the expected promotions for Mathieu Debuchy, Calum Chambers, Kieran Gibbs, Mathieu Flamini, and Joel Campbell.
That balance was lost as early as the third minute when the Ox limped off having gone in the fetlock. Theo Walcott was sent on, hardly a like for like replacement. Joel Campbell suddenly found himself switched to the number ten role.
A cagey start ensued with both defences on top and some robust challenges from both sides, notably Wednesday’s Sam Hutchinson. With barely a quarter of an hour gone the substitute too walked off with a calf problem. That does suggest something may have been amiss in the pre-match warm-up, although the television commentator noted that Arsene Wenger had cut short Theo’s routine prior to the initial substitution.
It did make for a third debut though for Ismael Bennacer. Joel Campbell found himself back on the right flank with Bennacer now in the important creative role.
The game roared into life in the 27th minute with a spectacular strike by Wednesday’s Ross Wallace from a cut-back by Daniel Pudil. The defending wasn’t great but credit the Championship side for conjuring up the move down their left flank.
Hutchinson avoided a red card for a poor studs up challenge on Kamara two minutes later. It was surprising he had not already seen yellow, but not that this was his ninth booking of the season.
Joel Campbell’s effort was blocked and the hosts went down the other end where Flamini conceded a free-kick on the edge of the box. The goalscorer was inches away from doubling his tally for the evening. Nine minutes before the break Iwobi danced into the box and fired narrowly wide. On a rapid counter Lucas João was denied by Cech but from the resulting corner João headed Wednesday’s second from Wallace’s cross. Frankly it was no more than they deserved.
As the clock ticked down Flamini saw his effort blocked on the edge of the box. Wallace, Wednesday’s man of the half picked up a stupid yellow card for dissent when Giroud was upended by Lee. Bennacer’s header from Campbell’s cross was dealt with comfortably by teenage second string ‘keeper, Joe Wildsmith. The whistle cut short a horrendous half for the visitors.
The first attempt of the second-half came from the experienced Barry Bannan, fortunately for the Arsenal it was high, wide, and far from handsome. The reprieve was temporary. Calum Chambers conceded a cheap free-kick which was chipped to the unmarked Lees beyond the far post. His cross just cleared a ducking Gibbs and Hutchinson bundled in the third.
Three nearly became four when João, unmarked in the box, headed narrowly wide. It was becoming, literally, men against boys. Just before the hour mark bookings were traded. Loovens for the Owls and Debuchy for the Gunners. Arsenal’s third substitution saw Krystian Bielik become the fourth debutant for the Londoners, replacing the unfortunate Kamara.
The magnificent travelling support roared out defiantly “We love you Arsenal, we do”. At last they got a response, Flamini chipping to the far post for Mertesacker who warmed Wildsmith’s hands. A series of corners promised much, but yielded little. Wednesday retreated and allowed no room for Arsenal to exploit, even if we had a creative spark left on the pitch. A rare break ended with the ineffective Campbell collecting a yellow card for a trip. The same player had the last say, volleying wide of the far post from the inside right channel.
There was no doubt that the better side had triumphed. It was a tough night for the Gunners youngsters. Paul Merson suggested they needed more help from the experienced heads around them. The problem is that some of those experienced players are struggling themselves. We know where the COCup features in our priorities, but let’s hope the defeat does not spread a wider air of malaise at Shenley in the coming days.
By the look of things tonight it won’t. The friendly greetings between the opposing benches suggested we weren’t too bothered.
179 Responses to “Gunners Have An ‘Owler”
*sups*
Bad night.
The injuries even worse then the result.
Next……
Me too neighbour…
Can’t believe you’re taking all these notes while watching the game!
I really do feel bad for Ox the timing of the injury couldn’t be worse.
Well well well the night gets better. Stoke managed to survive extra time with 10 men against Chelsea’s first team and won on the 10th penalty. If Hazard wanted to get rid of Mourinho he couldn’t have done better. Oh and you should have seen the special one’s face 😀
Actually trying to sip rather than glug a drop of red
Mind you, annual leave until Monday if that helps
When I’m at home I just write it as it happens Matt. It’s not my preferred method, but I don’t want to be crafting a technically better piece at two in the morning.
Nice one neighbour. Have a good rest of week with the saucepans. 🙂
Pretty polished nonetheless, ‘Holic.
To Clive’s point in the previous drinks, it would be encouraging to see more hunger from the youngsters when they do get a chance to impress.
Really concerned about those injuries unfortunately I missed this game due to a Safeguarding course this evening. It did involve football but from a entirely different angle.
AS H2H mentioned above injuries worse than the result….
Bring on the next game…
I mean it’s a great report, make no mistake this is not a complaint 😉
Cheers ‘h
Thanks Matt.
Ned, I feel for them. We go with the Ox as playmaker, and when he is off so early we don’t have a number ten in the team or on the bench.
I was very surprised after Theo went off that Bennacer didn’t slot in alongside Kamara and push Flamini on to be the experienced creator.
I agree with all of those who are also more concerned with the injury losses tonight rather than the actual result. The performance was dire though. The youngsters did not look anywhere near ready to play at this level. That said they were not helped one bit by the experienced first teamers. We seemed lacklustre and uninterested for the majority of the game. All in all, a very bad day at the office.
Quick word for the away support. I know several that have made the long journey. Their performance was far greater than the one they witnessed.
Nice to see you back Gregoire. Top post in the previous drinks. If you bother to check recent posts and the subsequent drinks you will realise how silly your comment looks. Before you ask the answer is no. There is not a hint of sarcasm in that comment. Just to make sure you are not offended.
Fingers crossed that the injuries are not serious ones. Very grateful in the end that many were left behind at home.
On to the weekend. Let’s hope that this is well and truly put to bed by then.
I am not going to lose sleep over the result. As others have rightly stated, the injuries are what really concerns me.. COYG!!!!!!!
Top post Sweeper in the last round. Agree with all of that.
It’s times like this, with zero good to write about, when it can’t be fun writing anything at all, ‘holic. So all credit for biting the bullet and providing a forum for serious reflection in about the time it took Ox and Theo to crock themselves.
Unfortunately I added more to the last thread without realising it had closed already, and can’t get enthused to post more here! 😀
Let’s just hope we go Swan upping to better effect at the weekend…
Oskar
If only the team were as consistently good as the writer of this blog we would have no problems .Tonight was disappointing. I’m sure first team morale won’t be affected but if we get any more injuries ( and we tend to get one a game) we haven’t got the quality left to field a side that can contend for the title. There was not one encouraging performance. I wouldn’t give any player , other than Cech better than 5 and some. Surely merited a mark at all. It’s the worst performance since the 8-2 at Old Trafford.
We’ve now become the opposite of flat track bullies . We only seem to get motivated for big games . We play admirably in these matches but play a weaker side and we just aren’t at it. We need Ramsey back soon and let us hope Theo and Ox are not too badly hurt – but judging on past experience?
Well played, Holic. Don’t envy you trying to write about that.
I didn’t disagree with AW’s team selection – it could have been very damaging to throw a whole side of kids in against a robust, hardened albeit lower division side.
It turned out to be very damaging anyway. The lack of proper, timely warm-ups might be a factor in the injuries we incurred but it’s the players who are the continuing problem here.
The treatment room is once again full of our young British core. Ramsey, Chamberlain, Wilshere and Walcott are never more than a few games away from a medium to long term injury. Moreover, a recurring medium to long term injury. Add to them the old perma crocks, Rosicky and Arteta and we are, once again, in an injury crisis. Diaby, barely any longer a consideration, was also not replaced when he left in the summer.
Positive things have been said here and elsewhere about the effect of Shad Forsythe. If the above list represents a significant improvement, then thank heavens for it.
To my mind, those players will continue to suffer these injuries, an opinion which has been borne out by experience thus far, and it leaves the squad unable to properly compete in three competitions, let alone four.
The alternative is to replace them – a tough and very expensive decision to make and a suggestion for which I was accused of being disloyal last time I aired it.
But here we are again. The treatment room is full of the usual suspects and another season of high promise is threatened in October.
Agree Trev that those lambasting the kids miss the point. We only started two. I’m sure it wasn’t the intention to debut four. The injuries seemed to owe much to the lack of a proper warm up to the uneducated like me. The Ox at number ten was a gamble, but once he was gone and we didn’t have one there was an air of rudderless ship about the team. With Rosicky and Wilshere injured we had to make do.
Shad? Not seeing it right now…
The youngsters did not look anywhere near ready to play at this level.
I know he is much despised, but I saw Pulis on a website somewhere today saying that Gnabry, who is on loan at West Brom to get games, is not ready to play first team football (although I believe his actual words were “not good enough”).
It’s not so much a comment on the player or the club but the U21 system that isn’t competitive and not a good enough proving ground for young players.
Salient effort Guv’!
What another dire performance from the back-up singers. They never ever got the chance to belt out even a peep of a tune. Well done the away-day Gooners for filling that void. The young pretenders I can forgive for their impotence but the seniors; embarrassingly limp! As others have already stated, the injuries to Ox and Feo are another “here-we-go-again” worrying moment! I doubt that either, if not too seriously injured, will play at Swansea with Bayern following thereafter on the horizon in another “we-must-not-lose”. Let’s hope that the replacements, and Arsene, are far better prepared to fill the now first-team void in the competitions that actually matter most this term.
Blissfully, at least the Chavs ongoing implosion provided some festive schadenfreude tonight. One more to go Moaninho and your trike awaits! Up the Arse! COYBG!
Right on, Dan, at least we can smile over the continued downward spiralling of The Specious One. Poor bugga may have to content himself with relocating to Paris St G or Monaco, according to rumours.
What a comedown for a specialist in foulness.
Oskar
Incidentally, when I say “festive” I mean Festive Horror Show at Halloween! Oooooooooo-scary! 😎
OTD @23,
Let him just feck right off across Le Manche! It’ll almost be as good as winning the league or Champions League watching Klopp put a final nail in that cunt’s Chav coffin! Almost as good but not quite!
I agree with Cynic that the U21 system doesn’t seem to be preparing players for the step up which is why, I guess, that going out on loan is a better option – providing you get to play.
Given that the premier league appears to be getting more competitive now outside the top 5 or 6, loanees may find it increasingly difficult to get playing time so perhaps the championship is a more likely proving ground.
Having said that, not many of our loanees in recent years have ever returned to claim places in the first team squad. Bellerin, Wilshere, Coq are the only ones that spring to mind – there may be others but not many.
Perhaps home-grown / developed players are a thing of the past for top teams?
UTA.
Three years ago this result would have led to a load of bile being directed at AW and the players. Two F.A. Cups later and I get that the reaction to bowing out of this resource consuming competition is a collective “meh”. I mean, who needs to play a two legged semifinal in the middle of the league season in January?
On the injuries: find it hard to fathom how two reasonably well seasoned professionals would manage to pull up with muscle pulls/strains so early in the match? Whatever the reasons, sure seemed to let the air out of the balloon.
Cheers H!
Meh.
Next.
I thought the game was mostly bottom with just the faintest whiff of arse
I rarely, if ever agree with Oskar, but on this occasion he gets my full drunken support
Also, if Joel C is an AFC player- so am I.
And I am not.
Fuck but Ive had a lot to drink
Lots of very measured comment proving in some cases that you can be inebriated and still speak sense. Trev makes tough but highly pertinent points about our British core. All of them are secure on mega- contracts but all are always out for half a season each term. Go on physio room.com to look at the specific history of Walcott, Ramsey and the Ox. It’s pretty damning. It means that we are always struggling in midfield and we have to overplay our stronger players like Cazorla and Sanchez. We face the build up to Christmas and the festive season beyond with the bare bones of our squad.
While the kids could not be blamed tonight, the likes of Debuchy, Chambers and Campbell are just not good enough. Debuchy is out of form and not match tight and the more experienced players gave no help to the kids at all. I dread the January window where we may or may not be active but even if we are players will come in at the end of January when our season’s prospects may already be damaged. Tough decisions await Wenger but we need tougher and more reliable back- up. Shad Forsythe would have to be a miracle worker to get some of our perma- cricks fit and he doesn’t appear to be at present
Depressing evening. Not so much because of the result, but the injuries. They felt all too predictable and with the squad’s attacking options already looking thin, and a tough fixture schedule ahead, it seemed to be asking for trouble to play the likes of Ox, Theo and Giroud at all last night.
The result is that we may find ourselves in Munich with our fifth choice right winger making a start, and lacking the pace of Theo that so worried Bayern in the home game.
What can be said with certainty is that we cannot afford any more injuries in the attacking positions, and there will be precious few opportunities for rotation in the weeks ahead.
We need a bit of luck now, and hopefully it will come in the form of positive diagnoses for Theo and the Ox, although given how these things usually work I’ll not hold my breath.
Sorry for the moany post. If anyone needs a reason to be cheerful right now then I reckon the knowledge that we’re about to watch Mourinho get drummed out of English football should do the trick.
COYG
If Debuchy and Chambers aren’t good enough, and I agree they aren’t, that’s approximately £30m spent on right backs and one who most certainly IS good enough (Jenkinson) out on loan.
Good management?
The corporal walks into this squad easy. debuchy looks like such a soft touch
A couple of quick thoughts on the right back debate….
Very hard to compare Jenks, who has been playing week-in, week-out for the Hammers for the last year and a bit, with Debuchy, who has probably completed less than 500 mins of first team football since returning from a long term injury, even if the latter was poor again last night. Regular football improves any player.
Also, not convinced Chambers was signed as a right back. Bellerin was widely tipped to make the first team for a good long while before he did, which is probably why we signed a 29 year old as Sagna’s replacement – the intention being that Debuchy would hold down the fort for a season or two until the Spaniard was ready. I don’t believe Chambers was ever part of the long term thinking in that position.
Fine account Guvna of a miserable evening. Many good drinks in the bar too. I agree with the majority.
Accepting tabs’ observations about not simply dismissing the competition, the team starting turned out to be exactly the one tabs suggested.
However the result was less disappointing than the injuries and the disjointed performance of most senior players. Debuchy is a mere shadow of the player we first saw in red and white who seemed an upgrade on his predecessor.
The muscle strains sustained by Ox and then by Theo were unpredictable and extremely unfortunate. As the Guvna wisely observes, the loss of Ox removed the only player capable of playing the offensive creative role in the squad.
The seniors (exonerating Cech and HFB) were, as pithily observed by P. Merson Esq, extremely disappointing and failed to mentor the newbies who were, as observed by A. Wenger Esq, not up to the job.
I did think the head-up style of Bielik and several penetrating forward balls into the oppo box added a bit of creativity towards the end but we will need to see a bit more from him before getting the bunting out.
The better team on the night won the match and deserved the result. It was their cup final. We have other fish to fry. Meanwhile get the masseurs and the Arnica onto those hamstrings and calves.
Problem with Jenkinson is that due to his age, quality and experience now playing 2 seasons as a regular RB at a decent Premier League club, he isn’t going to want to return to be back-up to Bellerin.
That’s why sometimes squad decisions have to be made with pragmatism. Yes, Debuchy isn’t a world-beater, but at 30 it was a good step-up for him from Newcastle, and he counterbalances the youth of Chambers and Bellerin (I imagine no one countenanced that Bellerin’s ascension would be so rapid at the beginning of last season). Stick Debuchy into the current first XI and I don’t think he’d look quite so much of a liability. Just as Per was excellent against Bayern, but we’re suddenly questioning his contribution b/c he was part of a team that capitulated against Sheff Wed….
Very valid points N7 in relation to the right back position.
Far too easy to dismiss Debauchy as not good enough when he hasn’t played and is obviously in need of game time. I also feel that those criticising young Chambers miss the point that it takes time for young players to learn their craft and there is no easy way of doing that except by believing in their abilities and being patient. I believe centre halves don’t really begin to blossom until they reach their 30’s. Tony Adams was lambasted throughout his career and while he certainly had his issues off the field, it was only in his latter years that people begun to appreciate how special he really was.
Last night was a disaster. I would agree with Clive to some extend in the lack of attitude cost us most obviously in the lack of defensive application. But up front, we created or offered nothing at all throughout the game and this was even more concerning I felt. Young Bielik did well for what little we saw of him.
Cheers for the report ‘H.
Always likely to be a tough night, especially so after the two early injuries.
I maintain that AW picked the right side. Ox had had one start in a month. He was no more likely to ping a hamstring last night than in any other game. Theo was the obvious ‘big-hitter’ to have on the bench. If he wasn’t sufficiently warmed up, then there is no-one else to blame other than Theo himself. Presumably he arrived at the ground at the same time as everybody else.
Whatever the lowered status of the League Cup these days, the Arsenal side last night bore the label ‘First Team’ and as such attracts a large and noisy away following. As such, and unless there has been an announcement prior to the tournament starting that the competition would be used primarily for the kids, there is an onus on the Manager to field as best a side as he can taking into account injuries, tiredness etc. Giroud and Ox have barely played in the last month. Tiredness should not have been a factor and therefore imo it was the correct decision to start them.
As for the game itself, I saw no lack of effort or application or signs of complacency, which to me is generally just an easy get out for pundits in the wake of a defeat. We simply weren’t good enough. As ‘H has quite rightly pointed out, with Ox’s injury we were immediately stripped of our primary (perhaps only) creative outlet. A midfield of 3 teenage debutantes, a static Flamini and a labouring Campbell was never likely to be enough and the writing was on the wall as soon as we conceded the first goal.
At the back Debuchy continues to struggle with bench life. He has admitted that he considered leaving in the wake of AW’s Charity Shield selection, and I will be very surprised if he stays beyond January. He will still have hopes of making the Euros and unless he gets game time to improve on what was another pretty dismal display he has no chance.
I would be far more lenient in any assessment of Chambers. He is still very young. He had a very promising start to his Arsenal career, was called into the England set-up so prematurely by Hodgson that it was ridiculous, and following a predictable ‘mare at Wembley, has struggled ever since. There’s a player in there though, he had a good game at Tottenham I thought, but patience will be required. Even the most lauded of young centre halves will make mistakes, as John Stones showed at the weekend, and Stones looks a very accomplished young footballer indeed. Another example would be the sudden elevation of Smalling’s performances after being written off by just about everybody.
As for the kids, impossible to make any assessment based on last night. As others have pointed out, our most promising kids are already out on loan due to the shortcomings of the U21 system, and as AW has admitted, the promotion of Kamara, Iwobi and Bennacer was necessarily premature.
Bigger fish to fry. Let’s hope the two injuries aren’t too serious.
I’ve been under the weather all week having woken up with a filthy cold on Saturday morning, gone to the game, got drowned in the first half from my current position of row 2 of West Lower, which didn’t do anything for the cold or my enjoyment of the game which I felt was a rather scrappy affair!
So last night was hardly the pick-up I was hoping for. I applaud you all for your tempered comments, the reason why I drink in this Bar. I doubt that those who traveled to support the team would have been so generous.
The lack of appetite for a fight was evident from the off, Wednesday made it clear from the start that they were taking no prisoners and we capitulated. The back 5 were just not switched on and should be ashamed of their performances.
Once we lost the Ox/Feo we were scuppered going forward, the kids were overwhelmed by the stronger,battle hardened opponents.
We are now faced with a real injury crisis if the Ox and Feo are side-lined for any length of time. The euphoria of last week has evaporated and Arsene is once more under considerable pressure.
The next 3 games will tell us all we want to know, I’m not feeling over confident .
Thanks for the report H, on the money as ever ( excluding the ‘holic pound of course ). Excellent match reviews from the regulars.
The dismal performance matched the wearing of the 3rd (cup) blue kit – I can’t think of a worse team kit than that worn yesterday evening. I only hope sales of it absolutely bomb – it’s abominable ! For much of the game it looked like Arsene had grabbed 11 willing blokes from outside the ground and gave them a game of football – they played like a bunch of strangers. Once our only creative player went off we got the result I anticipated and fully deserved.
The form of Debauchery is a concern – there is a good player somewhere inside but it’s nowhere to be seen right now. He obviously needs game time to get back up to speed but his insipid displays don’t warrant inclusion at the expense of Bellerin. With his public comments about this, it’s surprising he is not showing the determination required.
Fingers crossed on the injury front but recent history does not inspire confidence of a good outcome.
To Delia’s point, that back five are all internationals, two of whom have more than 100 caps. They should have been able to deal with a Championship attack.
In Debuchy’s defence, he looked perfectly good enough before his injury last season. I don’t think ability is the problem. He has played only 66 Premiership minutes since his last injury (thigh) and a further 457 since the one before that (dislocated shoulder).
N7G: You are right about Chambers. AW always said he saw him as a CB or DM rather than an RB. All four of his appearances this season have been at CB. Last season, it was 8 at CB, 2 at CM and 23 at RB. So the direction is clear.
If Chambers was signed for all that money as a centre back, why sign Gabriel?
Afraid Chambers looks like a very expensive mistake.
@Cynic
Because you need four centre backs?
I’ve no idea what the thinking was around signing Chambers, so I can’t speak for that, but all the noises around Bellerin were that he was expected to be a first team player in the not too distant future, so I don’t think there was ever much intention of Chambers becoming our permanent right back.
Have seen and heard enough bashing of AW’s bringing on Debuchy last season. There was no one, repeat, no one who was critical of signing an experienced right back to replace the incumbent right back whom Debuchy had already supplanted as first choice for the French national side. And to NBN’s point, he was playing well before the injury vs. City, and it wasn’t his fault that he got Arnautoviched on his return vs. the Orcs.
Clearly needs game time, and in the present circumstance of the injuries to Ox and Walcott, may see some more. He should be desperate to show some sort of form to be considered back into the French national squad as well.
How’s this for out of the box thinking? If Ox and Theo are out for their usual four to six weeks, why not move Bellerin up to the right sided attack with Debuchy at right back? Would not use that against Swansea or Bayern, where you would need Bellerin in right back against pacey left sided attackers, but up against the four in a row premiership fixtures of WBA, Norwich, Sunderland, Villa. that could work well, as his pace going forward would worry them.
BJ…..if the threatened injury crisis in fact materialises, that is indeed a prospective plan ( even a cunning plan 😉 – Bellerin has very good attacking skills when he forays into the opposing final third.
Cheers H.
I’m too late to the party to say anything new. I disagree with Delia that “the euphoria of last week has evaporated and Arsene is once more under considerable pressure.” It seems to me that we played badly and went out of the League Cup. Oh well. Our squad is too thin to get anything out of it anyway. And we knocked the Spuds out.
None of which puts Arsene under any more pressure than he was, for me anyway. League results are definitely the yardstick at the moment.
Gibbs worries me. Is he scared of the football or what? He’s like the anti-Gabriel. He’d rather concede than get stuck in where it hurts.
Oh, and who put an Arsenal badge on that weird blue kit? And why?
Why sign Gabriel. Well answered N7.
I might add that the meeja, and Arsenal supporters from hither and yon have been howling that we need CBs. AW signed Gabriel and he has turned out to be a monster (and no, not b/c of that haircut) and a great signing. Chambers, as stated, is inconsistent, true, but is one for the future. Have to admit that he makes me nervous whenever he is on the sheet or the bench.
AW … to some the man can do nothing right. It bit harsh i think.
Not happy with a loss. Really concerned with the Theo/Ox injuries.
2 injuries which may derail our progress, that is my take away from the game.
I cannot believe how freak those injuries were and how could it happen. Well knowing our luck it may be longer than sooner for the duo.
The game was poor, we were appalling and it just raises the question as to do we really have a bench strength??? It worries me that we will end up playing the first team a lot and that will result in them being tired or injured. Will this apparent lack of backup hurt us again??
An update to this is that forward Theo Walcott and midfielder Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain are expected to miss the club’s next three games.
—-
🙁
I have no doubt whatsoever that Chambers was signed as a right back. That is why Jenks was allowed out on loan. The rise to prominence of young Hector may have surprised many at the club. With Debuchy bought as Sagnas replacement it kind of put young Chambers in a bit of a quandary. All of a sudden our young £16 million right back in waiting was third choice. His height and injuries to other centre backs have meant that he almost fell into the centre back roll by default.
I also agree with those that talk about Debuchy. He clearly needs games to get match fit. He hasn’t become a bad player over night.
All of that said I’m not sure that either will be at the club next season. Like Debuchy, Chambers needs to play.
Great to see so many ‘holics back in after result like that, and the broad range of opinion that has resulted. Thanks all.
in other news
just gotta new hammerdrill
its called a GBH 2000
yeah!
you heard!
*bickering Arse regulars beware*
IT HAS THREE
REPEAT
***THREE***
SETTINGS
grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
bish
Bash
BOSCH!!!!!!!!!!!
cba that is four settings.
oh
howdy ‘hol
missed ye there
trust yer well
*headmaster alert*
*has no time to spit polish boots*
*just spits blindly and hopes*
.
“STAND BY YER BEDS”
run 8ball
save yerself
Master ‘ol be a right demon
an as god as be me judge
a feckin left ‘un too
😉
Good and measured debate. I. Retained don’t feel Wengervis under pressure. I hate losing especially playing as badly as we did last night but the League Cup is a distant fourth in terms of our priorities.
Tabs made a good point about Chambers and Debuchy. Debuchy started very well but was unfortunate with injuries and he needs game time. The suggestion of moving Bellerin up was made to me earlier on and I think,it makes excellent sense. I suspect he will be very effective there and may give Wenger a dilemma because he is ideally skilled to play there . I will also cut Chambers done skack. He hasn’t convinced me yet but he has time.
The more concerning thing was the level of the youngsters. We used to take teams of seven or eight kids to other Premier teams and beat them on their own grounds a few years ago. Today we have Pulis dissing Gnabry and Barnsley sending back Crowley who is one of the shining stars of our youth team. Certainly with the possible exception of Bielik yesterday’s crop looked very raw . I’ve always loved the fact that we create a lot of our stars but that looks a way off occurring again after last night.
I’ve a new hammer…..
Sorry Spillchucker playing havoc throughout
I meant to say that I dont see Wenger under pressure at all. I also want to cut Chambers some slack as opposed to done skack which makes him sound like a drug taker.
To assert ‘no doubt whatsoever’ as to what position Chambers was signed to play in is clearly hyperbolic nonsense unless your first name is “Arsene” and your second name is “Wenger”.
The fact that AW has gone on record as saying that he ultimately sees Chambers in a central defensive midfield berth should at the very least sow some doubt and give pause for thought before making such bold sweeping assertions.
The signing of Debuchy put Chambers in no kind of ‘quandary’ … given that Debuchy was signed before Chambers! Chambers knew exactly what he was walking into … as a utility fill in.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see Chambers out on loan at some stage but unlike Debuchy he won’t be sold.
Bring on the drill cba ?
oooh, a little aggro…..
I’ve a new hammer…..
100% agree with Steve T. Chambers is 3rd choice right back, 4th with Jenkinson in the picture. Time will tell if he’s worth his transfer fee at CB, it doesn’t look so at RB.
Debuchy is in a difficult situation. It must not be easy for France’s fist choice right back to find himself at 30 watching from the bench a 20 year old kid playing better. It looks like one of those cases where competition is making him worse. Instead of playing to his strength he ventures forward much more than he used to but unlike Bellerin he doesn’t have the speed to recover when caught out of position. He needs to play more like his old self (like Sagna) rather than trying to emulate young Hector. Now to be honest he’s had to play behind Ox and Campbell, both very inconsistent at tracking back.
Hopefully we’ll see the good old Willy back in the next 3 games with Bellerin in front of him.
ah
howdy dr Z
🙂
may ye have long
an many’s a year o’ joy
outta yer thumpy
or a persuader
de use it’s proper
grown-up big boy now name
a hammer
a fine beast indeed
.
.
ah
howdy tabs
ya mad hoor
how’s life by you?
Chambers was signed as a future CB. Fact.
*unsurprised drill’s first beneficiary baff*
OI
BAAAFFFFFFF
NOOOOOOOOOO
*DZDZZZZZZDDDZZZZZZZZZ*
.
.
.
.
“Clean up in aisle 66”
@Tabs: no need to come so harsh on Steve T. Here’s what Arsene said when Chambers was signed:
“He can play at centre-back, right-back and central midfield. I hope he will give us competition for the players in these three positions,” Wenger told several national newspapers.
“He hasn’t played many games, no, but the English players on the market in England are very expensive and at the end of the day I was ready to take a gamble because he is a player for the future.”
If it’s not made of kryptonite it disnae affect me ya daft Paddy.
as polite an insult
as ever i’ve had
capital p for Paddy
give us a hug ya big dote
🙂
Sorry ah broke yer drill pal. :0/
Like I said Matt, he was signed as a utility fill in. AW subsequently said that his long term future would be in midfield. Clearly the assertion that he was signed as a right back ‘with no doubt whatsoever’ is wrong. Nothing to do with being harsh or otherwise.
Very well cba ta, hope you’re likewise?
baff
the GBH 2000
is a titan among(st) titans
a titan
yes indeedy
bits broke?
*engages tabs’ services*
.
yup tabs
things are well
or as well as can be expected
all things considered
🙂
“TAKE THE JOCK TO THE CLEANERS , TABS”
So basically he was signed as a right back, wasn’t much good there, got shifted to centre back, wasn’t much good there, so was talked about as a midfielder but has never played there (but probably won’t be any good there) and fan wisdom now has it that he was signed to play anywhere but the position he is currently playing and not looking very good in.
In a nutshell.
In a nutshell … no.
*chose right legal repremesentation*
d’ye charge by the hour
or the raised eyebrow , tabs?
Evening Tabs. I do hope you are well. I must say, paying 16 million for a 19 year old “utility fill in” is a new one on me I must say. From memory Chambers played almost every, if not every game for Southampton as a right back. Where he ends up playing who knows. Has he actually played the defensive midfield roll? Certainly not with any regularity that’s for sure. Will he still be an arsenal player next season? Again, who knows? But I do believe that he needs to play or his development will be hampered. I believe that he was signed as a right back. It’s just my opinion. If he was destined to play at centre back why did we sign Paulista? Why did we play nacho in the centre? If he was bought to play the holding roll then why did we recall Le Coq when we lost the likes of Jack and Atreta? As I said, just my opinion. Everyone is still entitled to one.
Talking of opinions, what is your opinion of Theo these days? It’s not that long ago that you were 100% sure that he would be sold in the last window. He was not worth his place at the club? The fact that I had dared to suggest he should get more game time was bordering on treason. Funny how things turn out.
As I said, everyone is entitled to an opinion. It’s what makes this place a special place to be.
“So basically he was signed as a right back”
Nope, see AW’s quote above.
“Got shifted to centre back”
Again, nope. He played his first games for Arsenal at centre back.
“Wasn’t much good there”
Clearly so poor that he was called up for England (albeit prematurely imo).
“Talked about as a midfielder, has never played there (but probably won’the be any good there … ”
Talked about as a midfielder by the Manager which is rather the crucial point. He has played there for Arsenal. Whether he will be any good there in the future is up for speculation either way but thank fuck the Manager is not given to such premature and negative predictions based on negligible/zero evidence. I wonder where Coquelin would be if he was.
So in a nutshell …
Raised eyebrow cba. The bollocks being spouted here keeps me rich ?
So good at centre back that when he was fit and available, he was on the bench and Monreal was shifted into the middle to cover.
Wasn’t Debuchy also tried at centre back last season in at least one game? Shady memory at work, but I’m fairly sure he was.. not sure if Chambers was fit at that stage or not.
So if you insist on getting snippy over what was meant as a lightly comic summing up of the discussion, and if you feel the need to defend your position in such a way, feel free.
I’m off to do something much more fun.
*spleen twitches*
Hoping Arsene doesn’t put play Chambers at right back against Montero again…
“On 10 August, Chambers made his competitive debut for Arsenal, playing the full 90 minutes of the 2014 FA Community Shield against Premier League champions Manchester City at Wembley Stadium. Playing at centre back instead of his usual right back position to cover for Per Mertesacker”
Apparently.
Here is the AW quote on Chambers where it originated on arsenal.com a couple of months after signing him:
http://www.arsenal.com/news/features/20141015/calum-chambers
“He is only 19 and can play at centre back, right back and central midfield. I hope he will give us competition for the players in those three positions.”
Note the order.
To repeat my @44 for the benefit of SteveT: All four of his appearances this season have been at CB. Last season, it was 8 at CB, 2 at CM and 23 at RB. His 25 league appearances for Southampton were all at RB. So the direction is clear.
@81.
Does that mean your wealth is gained from being self employed?
🙂
Ned. Is it not the remotest of possibilities that Chambers has played games at centre back because we have been desperately short there for some time now? We are also seem to be more than stocked at right back?
Just a thought.
As I have been told many times on here by various patrons, don’t always believe 100% what AW says.
Where Chambers ends up playing I would suggest is still very much up in the air. He is the third choice right back and fourth choice centre back. Dot Com have him listed as a defender so no doubt he is destined for the midfield roll???
🙂
SteveT , evening.
So many questions but I shall attempt to take them one by one …
Dunno why paying 16m for a utility fill in is a new one on you. You obviously haven’t been following very closely at all. People pay for potential all the time. Often, until that potential is realised, and a position is nailed down, young players are often described as utility players.
He played 18 games for Southampton at full back. Luckily Arsenal don’t buy players on the evidence of 18 games. He had also played for England at every level at centre-back, which obviously had some bearing on why he was bought and informed AW’s quotes when he was bought.
You are welcome to ‘just your opinion’ regarding the position he was bought for, despite all evidence to the contrary. That is rather different to expressing that opinion ‘with no doubt whatsoever’.
I have already agreed that Chambers needs games and is likely to go out on loan at some point above.
“Why did we sign Paulista?
Because we need 4 centre backs.
Why did we play Nacho at centre half?
Because Paulista wasn’t bought until Jan, Kos was injured and Chambers was filling in for the injured Debuchy, Bellerin having been tried and considered not quite ready after fairly tough afternoons in Dortmund and Stoke.
He wasn’t ‘bought to play the holding role’. Complete strawman argument. All that was said was that AW has stated that that was where he saw his long term future, hence why Coquelin was recalled.
As for Theo, my opinion hasn’t changed. I’ll find you the direct quote if you really want. Clearly I remember what I said rather better than you remember what you say. Back in July I said that I was more than happy with our 3 striking central options – Theo, Welbeck and Giroud – and that I didn’t think we’d buy a forward. What I did say was that if a forward was bought as so many were demanding, then one of the three would make way, and that prior to signing his contract Theo was the most likely, given the need to realise a transfer fee. I also said that any future Theo had with Arsenal would be central rather than wide given his defensive frailties. It certainly wasn’t me wetting his nappy and spouting Clinton Card catchphrases when August 31 came and went without us spunking 70m on another forward. How about you?
Let me know if you want me to dig the quote out.
tip top
🙂
Tabs. I was talking about your rant in the tollie? Remember that? Would probably have been around April time.
Top stuff Tabs.
I reckon Chambers was bought as CB but don’t see it much matters anyway now. I don’t see his future at right back personally. I think he is a good but raw player who will come very good in years to come. He needs time and patience- like all young people learning their trade. No idea why he is derided and scapegoated by people whose frustration seems to be over other deals we DID NOT make rather than this one that we did.
I can’t see Arsene selling him under any circumstances so, for me, a debate over whether he will stay with us hinges on whether Arsene is the manager, which I fully expect him to be next year.
cba. Will the new bit of kit help with your loose screws? Wink.
I think you will find more than enough evidence that Chambers was bought as a right back. How you wish to view that evidence is a matter for you. Clearly from the above I’m not alone in that opinion.
My thoughts around Theo have not changed. I think he has the ability to be a match winner. He is one of the few that can be a game changer. I still think he is more effective out wide than central. I still think we lack a top quality striker and have done since RVP left. I don’t honestly know if Theo will make it in the central roll. I do think that if that was genuinely his real position that we could have expected to have seen him play in the roll some years ago now, not when he had turned 26. The fact that there has been overwhelming coverage over many media sources in recent years would suggest to me that AW also thinks we lack a top quality striker.
I still think that we are three players short of what we could and should be. There has been more than one game this season that would support that view as well. You can throw as many childish insults as you like, my view remains the same.
Funny fly our view on needing 4 centre backs. As we started the season with only 2 that was more than eniugh.
…….. “but don’t see it much matters anyway now. I don’t see his future at right back personally.”
Agree totally GSD. Where he was bought to play is almost irrelevant. Where he ends up playing is what counts. It was just my opinion that he was bought as a right back.
Funny your view even…….
@Tabs: “Luckily Arsenal don’t buy players on the evidence of 18 games”
What else was there to judge him? He played for U17 and U19 (for which he was captain) a few more times but that’s it.
Arsene himself said it was a gamble on the day of his signing: http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/9397592/transfer-news-arsenal-boss-arsene-wenger-prepared-to-take-gamble-on-calum-chambers
Steve has it wrong on Chambers being bought as a right-back exclusively but got everything else right:
1) He’s 3rd choice RB
2) He’s 4th choice CB
3) He’s not on the radar (yet) at DM
4) He needs to be loaned to get game time
He’ll be 21 in January (3 months older than Bellerin) and cost 16M, so yes it’s quite an expensive gamble, similar to Ox and Walcott.
I hope he can make it and I personally think he may at CB, it will take a few years to find out. Still I understand the doubters if only because we have a precocious gifted younger player killing it at RB and the comparison does not help Chambers’ case.
Chambers has plenty of talent and I doubt if anyone would deny it. His talent is still raw but I haven’t heard anyone explain why they think he can not make it as a centre back, which is where he looks the most comfortable.
He’s the most expensive defender in our team and right now at the bottom in the pecking order in all the positions he’s been signed for. Thinking he may kill it at CB in the future does not make one immune to question the value of the gamble.
Matt. Whilst I think he was bought as a right back I don’t think it was exclusively to play at right back. Like many of AW’s signings, the ability to play in other positions may well have been a major factor.
He is a player with talent but is still raw. The barrier to him playing at centre back may well be what’s in front of him. I still would not be surprised to see us try and sign another centre back in one of the next two windows. The only way we will discover what the future holds will be when he gets a run of games.
Matt, I do question the signing now and also questioned it at the time it was made because he was an untested second choice right back at Southampton where Clyne was a constant at his position as I recall. But I also put my trust in Wenger who signed Coquelin, Bellerin and so many others who he was able to develop after trusting the qualities he saw in them at a young age.
roll
verb
move in a particular direction by turning over and over on an axis.
role
noun
an actor’s part in a play, film, etc.
Midfield roll – stumped. 😛
In his early games at CD I thought Chambers looked quality, to the extent I predicted that with time and development he might even end up as club captain in the Tony Adams mould. I said ‘might’ there…
So far we’ve seen minimal development, but then we’ve also seen minimal involvement and the kid’s still very young for the CD position where 30+yo players are commonly found.
As for Theo (if I am allowed to mention him) like Steve T all I ever wanted was for him to be given a regular run so he could prove himself. I feel he has now done that and is now the second most dangerous player in the club for opposition to worry about, after Alexis of course. But is he a ‘top class’ striker? No, not if you’re comparing him to Messi, Ronaldo, Aguero, Suarez and very few others. But he is probably in the second tier and, while finding someone better (for less than the gdp of a medium-sized country) must be exercising AW’s mind, I’m not sure he’ll find one short of getting TH14 lucky with a virtual unknown. Let’s just hope Theo gets back soon and continues to polish the relationship he’s been developing with Mesut lately.
Oskar
Midfield roll. Light snack taken in the centre of the pitch.
Poxy spillchucker
Evening Dr Z. All well in Feelgood Towers.
An interesting read. Place your own validity marks as you see fit.
http://m.101greatgoals.com/blog/scout-reveals-schneiderlin-went-to-man-united-son-to-spurs-because-wenger-was-too-indecisive/
Yes indeed Steve T – hope to see you on Sunday week at the Grove.
I will be in the mid-beer garden role before hand and the mid-gutter roll afterwards…..
Also he’s English which explains much of the 16M. We can wait 3-4 years to see if he’s worth 19M pounds (fee + wages). But for 27M euros we can get an established young defender who’s ready now or soonish, someone like Gabriel. Hell we could get two for not much more.
Again I’m not questioning the qualities of the player as he’s no doubt promising, only the value of the gamble.
Bellerin at RW with Debuchy at RB, BJ (#47)? When I suggested that a couple of rounds ago I got jumped on. But it makes a lot of sense. Bellerin is right up there with Theo for speed and his centres are as good as most. And he was originally a winger after all. Not to mention that as a defender he just might have more defending nous than other wingers I could name.
Dennis knows Debuchy needs a regular run in the side. As I remember when he first came to the Ems he looked the perfect replacement for Bacs, getting praise all round. That form can’t be far away.
Debbie and Belle might sound more appropriate to Arsenal Ladies, but there are certainly worse solutions for the interim.
Oskar
Zico. Kids sport will determine my arrival time. I will be there after for definite.
My rolls are likely to contain an assortment of meat with a minimal sprinkling of greenery.
Matt, your points re the value of such a gamble is more than relevant.
@Steve T: speaking of rumours we’ve been consistently linked with Isco for the last 2 years and we’re supposedly working out the deal with RM in January.
Not sure what to make of that but Isco is spectacular to watch it must be said, would be another masterful transfer if it happens.
…and Manure have been beaten in the shootout by ‘Brough! Rooney, Carrick and Young all missed their pens.
Oskar
@Steve – So after all those questions you’re left with a ‘rant in the tollie’. Haha … Righto. Think you’ll find it was in Feb, sometime after his performance against Leicester, the defensive paucity of which clearly also persuaded AW. He has started the grand total of one game in a wide position since that day. Luckily, it seems AW doesn’t share your faith in Theo as a wide player.
I was quite happy to admit that Theo had surprised me in a central position at the back end of last season (as I did in here in July), and that therefore, I was quite happy that we were going into the new season with our existing 3 strikers, albeit that I was unaware at the time that Welbeck would be injured for so long. Perhaps a greater knowledge of Welbeck’s situation was behind the media frenzy. Perhaps it was just there to sell papers to those who wish to work themselves into self-righteous fury when those transfers don’t materialise. Who knows?
Just stating that Chambers ‘was bought as a right back’ does not make it so, nor does it provide ‘evidence’. As GSD rightly states, it doesn’t really matter anyway. The objection I had was the assertion that it was with ‘no doubt whatsoever’ that he was. That assertion was, and remains, hyperbolic opinion masquerading as fact, which was my only point. The only one who really knows is AW and he has been unequivocal as to his versatility.
Ah ‘media coverage’. That well known reliable source of what AW thinks.
Childish insults? People in glasshouses …
Clinton Card drivel masquerading as some sort of insight will always attract opprobrium. I don’t often agree with the Liverpool Board of Directors, but I couldn’t help but notice that Brendan Rodgers, that walking advert for empty headed inspirational babble, was sacked 3 hours after stating that Liverpool were aiming to ‘be the best they can be’. Bravo! The only legitimate response imo.
Agree completely Gsd@92. Not sure why i’m being cast as the great defender of Chambers. Not sure what part of “following a predictable ‘mare at Wembley, Chambers has struggled ever since” @41 some people are finding difficult to compute.
Matt@95.
You think Chambers wasn’t watched all through Southampton’s academy? All of which he played at centre half.
The rest of your post I completely agree with. I have never disputed his current place in the pecking order, or his current form, or that he needs games, or that his transfer was a ‘gamble’. Most transfers are a gamble, especially so with a young player.
Next week in Munich I suspect we will defend deep and I believe Chambers could fulfil that role very well.his issue is facing raw speed and I think some of his best games have come at RB in Europe. I worry about him facing Montero. But in Munich pushing Bellerin up to play on the right side of midfield would scare the shit out of the Germans and stop Alaba getting forward. Chambers could play RB behind him. I suspect Hector would cover back better than Ox or Theo.
The alternative would be switching Alexis to the right and playing Gibbs on the left side of midfield ahead of Nacho. Both could do a real job in those positions.
Sad to see United go out tonight.?
It’s a slightly different team but we pulverised Boro last season in the FA Cup. I think the honeymoon period with LVG will soon come to an end.
Good debate today.
Great to see you back Tabs.
This place has missed you.
Matt. We will have to wait and see I guess.
@Tabs: I don’t dispute all his games were dissected nor he was versatile before he was bought.
Like everyone at the bar I really have big hopes for him and at this price he better deliver 😉
Bellerin at RW is a super exciting proposition.
So is Chambers or Debuchy dealing with Costa, for Bayern that is.
Agreed Joe. Welcome back TaBS et al. Respectful debate rocks if you can. Sometimes it doesn’t work that way. Fuck, I’m the maddest one here…
And for the next three matches don’t fuck about with more than one position. The team that works, with Iwobi on the right. Not ready? Watch him with Santi at quarterback and Mesut calling the shots.
Iwobi really?
Senility showing up late at night. Go back crawling to your wanker posts you old fart!
There goes your respectful debate 😀
Oh Matt…
🙂
Forgot to say thanks as ever H for the review. Forgive my manners.
Been very busy with work of late, but then again, you’ve been too for much better reasons! Hope all is good with you and yours good sir.
Matt….oh dear, don’t try and gloss it over 😉
Mississippi River song with a tinge of the Irish or Scottish to it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDtRpqoAEC8
And on an optimistic note, who am I to disagree with Thierry Henry?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3293828/Arsenal-win-Premier-League-season-genuinely-think-year-insists-club-legend-Thierry-Henry.html?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490
Allright H?
Chambers was clearly a long term bet when he was signed. I’ve no idea how he’ll turn out, but I think right now is premature to be judging him or his fee.
At the end of the day someone has to be fourth choice centre back.
We could use a full back for the purpose, but this time last season that didn’t make people particularly happy.
We could use someone from the youth team, but last summer Bellerin wasn’t even being counted as one of our “six defenders”, because he was a kid.
We could tell Arsene to go out into the market and not sign anyone unless he really feels he’s really getting value for money. I reckon that’s a challenge he’d enjoy more than we would.
We could try and find a centre back who is the finished article, doesn’t cost the earth, isn’t too old and is willing to sit on the bench for all but half a dozen games of the season. Good luck with that.
We could see what Chris Samba is up to these days.
On balance, I think Chambers – young, has potential, can play multiple positions, comes from a very well established youth set up, happy to wait for his chance – is a reasonably good option for the role. It’s certainly not one of the more glaring issues with our squad in my book.
Good luck to the lad, I say. I’d love to see him have a great career with us. And if he doesn’t, I reckon we’ll get a decent chunk of our money back for him when the time comes.
COYG
It is worth remembering that in the same summer we bought Chambers off them Southampton also sold Lallana and Shaw (possibly others) for large sums. I’m glad which one we went for myself.
Like Stones, technically Chambers looks a good footballer. Stones is currently a much better defender but 4th choice CB with three internationals to learn from and a reasonable tally of matches by the end of the season is not exactly a terrible place to be for the lad.
I was so impressed with his first few months. I think he’ll regain some form and impress again.
Matt@104: But for 27M euros we can get an established young defender who’s ready now or soonish, someone like Gabriel. Hell we could get two for not much more.
Three words: “home”, “grown” and “rule”.
And I think we paid for Chambers what Poo payed for Joe Allen.
Yeah.
GSD: I was so impressed with his first few months. I think he’ll regain some form and impress again.
Same here. He had a mare at Swansea against Montero – but so have others had – and that coloured the perception many had of him and every time an attacking player got past him it was “see, he’s no good!”. The common perception these days seems to be that Bellerin stepped right into the team and played exceptionally well from the first minute, but that was far from the case. He mixed and matched as most 19-year olds would do and no one batted an eyelid when Debuchy was reinstated as soon as he was back from injury. I’d say that Bellerin’s real breakthrough came when he was subbed on v Stoke when Debuchy got injured again, it was almost as if a few games on the side allowed him to process the first half of the season and join the dots and emerge a much more complete footballer.
Chambers has talent. Whether he can fulfill his promise remains to be seen, but considering how much talent costs these days I’d say £16 million for a player who also qualifies as home grown was quite cheap.
Morning Esso, getting there. Thanks.
10% chance of winning – 100% correct (give or take a few % points for erroneous errors which are inevitable in forecasting at 100% precision).
Maybe because Blades played at 120% and Arsenal at only 45%? Perhaps finishing with 36% U-21 talent was 18% (50%) too much? Or maybe the 50% prediction of wind and 30% forecast for hot air coming up from the south were key factors?
Whatever, 8 of 24 is 33.3% which is 100% higher % squad injuries than is desirable for a club with aspirations to win the League and probably reduces the likelihood by 35% (+ or – 25%) unless you’re one of the ~1% who think that injuries are 100% inconsequential to a favourable outcome in that regard.
However you cut it, the loss of Theo and Ox was a 150% bigger bummer than a Wednesday win on Tuesday (chances of which are only about 0.001% and even the Holic Pound doesn’t feature that level of uncertainty). Calum Chambers? He’ll do great. Future rock at CB. He doesn’t have the straight line mph for long term RB. We have Bellerin and Jenks for that. Difficult to see Debuchy (Arteta, Flamini, Rosicky) sticking around beyond this season.
See you at the usual watering hole for Spuds and yet another ‘Must Win’. Enjoyed all the friendly banter above 🙂
SteveT@88: There is an element of that, certainly.
For what it is worth (no quotes to support, pure speculation), I think Chambers was bought with an eye to being the long-term replacement for Kos, now 30, which gives him some years to mature into the role. AW likes to train central players out wide (think Ramsey). Chambers could also be a Javier Mascherano-type, able to play in or in front of the back four and give the option of playing a Barca-like 3-4-3 or 3-2-2-3.
By the same measure, I see Gabriel have being bought as the nearer-term replacement for Mertesacker.
Remember Fran Merida?
https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/fran-merida-exclusive-interview-former-152132239.html
A mistake or two in decision making with career, a little impatience, some turn of bad lucks, and from being prepared for Arsenal’s first team you find yourself fighting for your career in Spanish 3rd division.
Wishing him all the best, thew few minutes he played for the first team never looked out of place.
Dr. Faustus, Thanks for that article. Merida is obviously a good guy and he has probably had a more interesting life than a lot of footballers who have had more conventional football success. All the best to him.
Video evidence that Chambers played his first game for Arsenal as a central defender against Benfica, in the Emirates Cup I imagine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4V5HPV7cFA
According to the commentator he didn’t put a foot wrong. And Bellerin played right back.
The worry is playing Chambers against Swansea if we decide to do so. As pointed out earlier, he had a nightmare against Montero and who will he face up to on sat, yup Montero again. It may just destroy his confidence or make him the player he potentially can be.
We have a terrible record against the swans recently and the last thing we want is trying out permutations and combinations. I know we need to fit in 1 player on either the left or the right so who will it be is the question. Gibbs is a big no no for me, for he is positionally naive on the pitch but that just maybe it. We cannot disturb the defense or can we? Chambers as DM? is that an option to be tried against the small matter of swansea/bayern and spurs?? Oh how i miss jack now.
Options on the right according to the Boss http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/20151029/team-news-walcott-ramsey-and-the-ox
[Campbell and Alex Iwobi. Santi can play there as well but he has become very important centrally. The problem sometimes is that you can destroy two departments if you move one player out. We control the ball better with Santi in the middle.
]
I think we will see minimal disruption to the core partnerships all over the pitch, but will sacrifice a bit of quality for familiarity. Unlikely to have Bellerin play up front. If Campbell starts the only attacking sub we can then bring in is … Iwobi.
Exciting week ahead.:-)
Debuchy is still ahead of Chambers in the right back reckoning I imagine. As for shuffling things around, I have more confidence in Gibbs on the left than either of the other two at right back at this point in time. Chambers is fourth choice centre back and I hope Wenger isn’t thinking of shuffling him anywhere else in the team. Keeping Bellerin at right back has a lot to say for it. Wenger says so much on arsenal.com today so ‘holic’s prediction of Iwobi is not so far off:
“on his right-sided options at Swansea…
“”Campbell and Alex Iwobi. Santi can play there as well but he has become very important centrally. The problem sometimes is that you can destroy two departments if you move one player out. We control the ball better with Santi in the middle.””
Very astute, Dr. Faustus. 🙂
It’s always a good sign if the boss calls you by your first name, which he did with Iwobi but not with Campbell. A relevant tea leaf factor?
@138: I have been told — in real and virtual lives — that I read too much into things. I got nothing on you. 🙂
However, let me prognosticate nonetheless: Alexis is going to have a one of those weeks where he would simply be unstoppable. I think Swans and the Spuds are in for a shock. 🙂
@bt8
What does it mean if your boss calls you “that lazy c**t”?
Asking for a friend.
Gnabry to be recalled in jan??? Pulis feels he is not good enough for WBA so can we not have him now instead???
Iwobi wide right gives me nightmares, no offense to him but there is no way he can cut the ice in the premier league right now. Bellerin at right wing maybe? with debuchy behind him. Somewhere montero will be licking his lips in anticipation. Never mind we will score one more than them.
140
?
I’m not to worried by it all to be honest, Yes it’s not ideal but put any of the side in from Tuesday as one offs on Saturday and they will be made to look far better by those that are playing around them – We will be fine as long as no one else gets crocked before the international break,
Up The Arse,
*stands down*
.
.
.
*maintains beady eye*
NBN. That would mean “lazy” is your middle name. 😉
oiche shamhna
near han
so beer reduced
12 stout for 12 euro
half price
scary
ooooooOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHH
gotta love cheap gargle ?
[eee-ha-how-na]
how i pronounce it
oskar
Joe may have a different one
being from the other end of the country
just as valid
but
mine is the best
*fires up the drill*
“LAY DOWN BEFORE ME PUMPKINS”
@N7.
‘Lazy’ is not good, of course, but the rest sounds like discrimination in the workplace to me…
There is nothing wrong with being a Celt.
Howya CBA
Pronounced the same way down here ye big Northern Jess 🙂
Just for you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xos89Q0jg60
NBN. “Your” in the sense of “one’s” or “his” or “her” or “its” to be more clear about it. “Its” if your friend is gender neutral or a Chelsea or Tottenham supporter. 🙂
bt8@145: i trust that was for N7G, not me. 🙂
Play Ramsey on the right?
ditto@150
Correct you are, Ned.
Ramsey on the right as soon as he is uninjured which should be mid-December at latest. Arsene now looking into whether Kim Kjallstrom has recovered from his injury to contend with our midfield injury crisis?
Dr. Eva continues to fight the good fight. This could last a few seasons, at least. Hope so anyways.
http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/34671600
It seems you and Joe both have the best, cba. Not that I have a clue what you’re on about. I just assume that by the right of Poetic Licence you’re claims are unimpeachable regardless.
Oskar
There is a theory that the Kim Kjallstrom transfer kicked off our run of FA Cup success . I know because I’ve just started it. ?
The man is an unsung hero. Stuck his penalty away at Wembley and cost us bugger all. Better loan signing than many .
***Begins to hum the Kim Kjallstrom song.***
How does it go again? 😀
http://metro.co.uk/2015/10/29/can-you-guess-which-arsenal-legend-has-been-carved-into-this-halloween-pumpkin-5469974/
149 Joe ?
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=9FMjCB5-xw8
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RnrHaMa4xnE
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=58ZIdyd3rjg
?
@Lars: Chambers being home grown is certainly is a big factor if not the big factor.
@Doctor Faustus: Great article! I remember not falling too hard for the Fran Merida hype at the time, I thought he was very gifted but too slow for Arsenal. Regardless it’s a reminder that high-level football is is a ruthless heartless environment for many youngsters. He seems to have recovered well and hopefully will get back to his best soon.
bet they don’t say opprobrium
over on le grove
or indeed feckin l’anywhere
right bunch
ye’ve assembled ‘hol
?
it’s a good morning MOOOOOOO
to early uppers
dark when ye leave
dark when ye get back
fuck that fer a lark
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Pra1yh1Xesw
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SM2f0YWhP9o
That you just leavin’ the pub, then, cba?
Quite a lock in. 🙂
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dEYYI1ii0AU
howzaboutawaltzthen ?
cam on Z
knees up !
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JGyDJsDG9BM
Barking, that one.
Or bevvied. 😎
165
i rescind that incineration !
ya cheeky wee skitter
tis a full days work
i’ll be puttin’ in
over the course o’ this week an the next
another feckin scot stirrin’ the pot
i’ll never understand ’em
never
who does ?
CBA bevvied?
How very dare you?
His creative juices are flowing?
zico @169.
Surely both?
@ 170
My wife doesn’t understand me……
which is pretty rich since she spends most of her time in the company of pirates…..
😎
I can see why, Dr Z. Surely it takes a large number of ‘pieces of eight’ to maintain that fleet of fine shoes?
Abramovich hit squad appears out to make referees afraid not to award penalties to Chelsea. Mourinho hasn’t been doing a good enough job of it so his position is “under pressure” or so they say. Another factor is this lawsuit which does not appear to be going away no matter who is the Chelsea manager. One way or the other it is bound to eat away at the stomach tissues of both Abramovich and Mourinho. Not to mention the distractions for the Chelsea players. Whoops! I did mention it. So Sorry ….
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/598018/Chelsea-crisis-Roman-Abramovich-Jose-Mourinho-doctor-Eva-Carneiro
Pieces of eight aka Mastercard
bt8,
Chelsea already have the biggest possible penalty – that tosser as their manager for another five years.
Unless Roman wants to fork out yet more millions to get rid of the scumbag sooner.
Is that what’s called a double negative ?
Makes me laugh anyway 🙂
At least a double negative Trev. 🙂
‘Avin’ an hearty larfff at the Chav predicament. 🙂 🙂 🙂
Evening all. Just a four pinter this week. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>