The AST Safe-Standing Survey – Please Complete It
Jan 25th, 2017 by 'holic
With a little help from their friends the Arsenal Supporters Trust today launched a survey into current views of Arsenal supporters about the prospect of having a safe-standing trial at the Arsenal.
This is obviously just the first step in a campaign that will take time to come to fruition. As you will have seen on the link above “scoping out the safety, supporter, technical and legislative issues” is not likely to be anything other than a complex task, particularly in relation to the latter.
It doesn’t matter if you are massively in favour or violently opposed to safe-standing. What matters is that your viewpoint is important so please do spare the minute or so it will take to complete.
I have to say it is a subject I have thought long and hard about over many years. Obviously I am of an age to have experienced some of the great terraces in the days before Hillsborough. What is likely to form any trial will bear no relation to those days when large numbers could find themselves being carried some distance by swaying crowds. Today’s all-ticket controls should also prevent tickets falling into the hands of visiting supporters.
The biggest single factor though will be the likely introduction of rail seating and the expectation that the standing areas will replace the current seating on a one for one basis. That will maintain the capacity of the stadium so any decision on pricing will be interesting. Large numbers of fans stand at home, and particularly away, matches today and have to pay full price so that suggests supporters are prepared for such an eventuality. That’s a battle for another day.
I am very much in favour of the trial, although I would also expect that the club should ensure people in all seating areas remain seated should the trial take place. I know from personal experience that ageing parents and young kids don’t appreciate missing half a match because the thoughtless in front of them keep standing up to watch moments of heightened tension. There are great sight-lines from every seat at the Grove so there really is no need.
Anyway, please to click on the link above and then take the survey, please. Thank you.
Heart4More Cookery Challenge
Hector Bellerin, Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain, Chuba Akpom and Arsenal Ladies and England forward Danielle Carter have taken part in a cookery challenge, in aid of Heart4More Foundation’s healthy eating campaign and the club have published the video on YouTube.
Heart4More were the benefactors of a grant from the Arsenal Foundation last season. They are a charity which uses the power of football to raise awareness of cardiac health. Do check out the video. I’m not thinking you will get any cookery tips but I’m pretty sure Chuba has just come up with his new catchphrase. Great stuff all.
Classic Football Shirts
A reminder of our new partnership with the excellent classicfootballshirts.co.uk who can be reached in just one click here. I’ve been checking their site out again tonight and there are still some bargains to be had. Check out their clearance section as well as just the Arsenal pages. If you are a collector of ‘different’ shirts then their new line of Sheffield FC gear may be of interest.
Thanks for reading. Roll on Saturday!
45 Responses to “The AST Safe-Standing Survey – Please Complete It”
Having spent many years swaying, I’m for sitting now. Stand if you like, just not in front of me. Please.
Ooo, look! A (fairly) new post. Must go read it.
Happy Birthday, TTG.
(Small) Sigh, off to read the survey now…
Agreed BtM, hence why I support safe-standing as long as those who prefer to sit now (the majority) are not inconvenienced.
Exactly, Btm.
My experience is that people stand anyway, when it gets exciting, and block my view compelling me to stand as well. If everybody stayed seated we could all see, but they never do. It would never happen in a theatre, so why at football?
If they want a standing area so they can pack more people in, fine. But presumably they’d charge people less to stand, so would there be any extra revenue … more people at less = less people at more?
I read that Manure are planning to extend their seating to 88,000. While we are constrained by regs to 60,000 with no possibility of extending, is that right?
I’m with the Guvna and BtM on this issue.
I would have thought that we could squeeze a few more standing fans into a section of the Emirates given the ample size of our seats, possibly an extra 25% allowing a commensurate reduction in price.
Good luck to your grandson and many happy returns TTG. That’s no age at all, these days. You’re still in your first flush!
Spot on bath. 😉
Hmmm. I’m not convinced. I distrust anything that smacks of a Silver Bullet and I suspect that Safe Standing is one of those things.
Reading between the lines of the survey, “Improving the atmosphere” is something that the Safe Seating is intended to promote. I’m not certain that the atmosphere at Arsenal home games requires improvement. I was fortunate to be at the Bayern game last season when the atmosphere was wonderful. I doubt that it would have been better if there were standing areas and I doubt that wonderful atmospheres like that would be more likely to happen spontaneously and so would happen more often if they were introduced.
Until memories of “better days” fade – either because of the return of “better days” (unlikely) or fans cease to be reminded constantly that past days were “better” (even less likely) – I believe that there will always be suggestions that their return will be more likely if “something is done”.
I incline towards the view that standing at football grounds is just one of those things that older people hanker after as something that happened in the good old days when summers were long and dry, Arsenal won the title every season, there were no foreign owners of football clubs and you could have a good night out, treat your best girl to a chip supper pay your tram fare home and still have change from a tanner. Younger people believe in those days because they have grown up hearing tales of them from their elders.
Having said that, I see little harm in the suggestion, so am not actually opposed to it; I’m simply unconvinced.
One word of warning, though. Whilst I cannot but approve on principle the idea of conducting a trial (i.e. experiment) to determine the truth of a proposition, there will be expense involved in providing a safe standing area at football grounds. I can imagine the howls of anguish in the season the trial starts if Arsenal have failed to sign every single player with whom they were linked in the previous window and one of the players is injured – “Why are we wasting money installing rail seating rather than investing in the squad?”
Anyway, I’ve completed the survey, hopefully coming over as somewhat lukewarm at the suggestion but not being downright against it.
COYG
*Retires to bed, anticipating a lively debate and hoping to emerge better informed and relatively unscathed*
‘Night all
I see that others have said similar things, rather more briefly, while I was honing mine @9. Still think mine was more elegant 🙂
Job done,
although I can’t stand surveys it’s safe to say ?
Yours was the essence of elegance, Pangloss, if a bit wordy. Mine was written from the assumption standing would only ever be seen again if it meant more gate revenue. I’m sure I’m right, however inelegantly expressed. 🙁
Surveys don’t sit well with me either, Trev. 🙂
Cheers H!
Times change. Was different before, not better or worse but definitely different.
Ttg from the previous drinks: many happy returns for yesterday. And good luck to your grandson.
Thanks Holic!
First time video evidence used in Dutch league it didn’t take long at all, probably less time than Rooney shouting at the Refs!
https://streamable.com/lba5h
Correct decision too! Bring on technology in football! If we want this game to stay fair this is the only way to go. Van Besten was a great player but his change visions are just plain dreadful!
Van Besten = Van Basten 😀
Thanks for the good wishes chaps. Together with that young whippersnapper Holic I have stood on terraces all over the country as well of course at Highbury where the North Bank was my position of choice. It may well be that Holic and many others of you were standing shoulder to shoulder with me as we urged on the team!
I last stood for a whole game at the Villa final where I had paid £90 for a ticket but I would not have seen anything if I hadn’t. I found it a pleasant experience largely because of the result.
But my standing days were when I was much younger and I find I can get just as involved in the game from a comfortable seated position! Frankly looking back I avoided disaster several times purely by luck as the crowd surges ebbed back and forth. After Jon Sammels’ goal in the Fairs Cup Final my ecstasy was coupled with naked terror as I plunged maybe 15 yards down as the crowd overspilt behind me. It was very dangerous and I tend to agree with my friend Pangloss that nostalgia isn’t what it used to be.
Still I shall complete the survey as my contribution towards democracy
Filled in the survey – Supportive of it as long as handled properly – Hopefully if it comes to pass it would be very different to the old days and be more akin to what we see in Germany today. And who wouldn’t we all love the noise of a Dortmund or St Pauli standing section at the Emirates ?
This has also made me remember my first time sitting on the North Bank – a freezing cold 1-0 loss to Everton in the Rioch era roundabout this time of year. Was absolutely gobsmacked when the posh bloke behind me told me to sit down as Wrighty bore down on goal. My neighbour for the afternoon turned around and told him to “feck off to the theatre” – maybe it was one of you lot ?
Always think of it as the moment I realized football was changing…
Safe standing can’t happen without changes in the law and I don’t think those changes are happening any time soon. Imagine if they brought back “safe” standing and there was some sort of accident with lives lost. Can standing ever be truly safe? In this world of health and safety dominating everything, I don’t think they have a chance.
I don’t like sitting at football but standing was always a fucking pain as well and I wonder how many people will enjoy it if they pay through the nose for a ticket (I think cheaper tickets if people stand is a pipe dream) and get some massive tree trunk of a bloke right in front of them?
Sorry TTG,
Forgot to add my best wishes.
Hope it was a good one. ??
Took the safe standing survey. Watched the cooking video. Conclusion?
I would stand in Danielle Carter’s kitchen any day. 😉
Completed the survey as an away member and said yes to the safe standing. I liked the option of doing it in stages so that should solve any grievances before it goes live.
Arsene advocating Xhaka to learn to tackle or not go for it was unnecessary. He could have put that more subtly but then he wont be talking about him in the next 4 games for sure.
Talking of games, saints away is a pain and we have been poor and mostly outplayed by them at St.Mary’s. With Arsene set to rest alexis, it could be a tall order unless the support case step up. Time for danny and lucas to show what they are made off and more importantly ramsey and coq to work in tandem. Aaron needs to cut down his drifting for discipline is the key.
Finally, side note; Roger Federer enters the finals of the Australian open. At 35 he still showed some class against the classy Stan.
ATG, thanks for the video on the video replay.
Question: why not give the fourth official something to do and have him/her do the review, as they are standing near the monitor? Much of the time is taken up with the match official running over to look at the incident and then running back onto the pitch. Were it John Moss doing the back and forth, that would add at least four minutes of stoppage time.
One of my favourite memories is of Lee Dixon scoring a penalty in front of the Clock End – 11 y.o. me getting moved 20m down the stand by the jubilant crowd after it went in! I would love to see a version of that again… as I think of it, modern matchdays seem anodyne in comparison
I think I’ve voiced before how much I prefer to stand at football (and I’ll be 60 before the end of this season). I have certainly enjoyed the Emirates much more since I moved from block 32 (two rows in front of the press box on the half way line) to block 7 (in the North Bank). Much less grumpiness, more singing, more camaraderie (sp?) and much easier to turn around and talk to the guys in the row behind. Of course mainly it’s the luck of the draw who you get around you.
Now I find that when we do sit (usually for EFL matches and friendlies like the legends game last September) usually because of a higher than usual proportion of smaller children in the ground, I am much more tired after the game because instead of standing for 90 minutes we have probably been up and down 20 times!
I’ve filled in the survey and hope it happens.
I’ve completed the survey and am not in favour of any form of standing. Have people forgotten why all seater stadiums were introduced?
Perhaps it’s my age (mid 70s) and having experienced the very worst of standing at football in the “good old days” at grounds in all divisions.
I love going to away games where there is no choice but to stand if you want to see the play and at Citi it was dangerous in the upper tier. The next time there is a serious incident at an all seater stadium and there will be one, the authorities will have games played behind closed doors for months and the Club will find themselves in the courts.
I enjoy a decent seat with like minded folks around me and long may it continue. I think this issue is a generational one with the younger fans in favour of”Save Standing”. Believe you me the older you get you would rather have a seat and make full use of it.
Sorry “safe standing”
Thanks Trev
You sounded very busy on recent posts
Hope all is well
I’d prefer to sit now I think, but having said that I’m on me feet a lot of time, probably annoying people like ‘holic.
Standing atmosphere were certainly more vibrant to me, than is now. What really pisses me off the most about it, is the ticketing aspect. I meet with boys I now only see once a twice a season, when I used to go with them every game in times past. Can I go in with them now and watch the game together? Can I fuck, without a huge slice of luck and much tedious arranging of tickets.
Not to downplay the achievement of Roger Federer, who by winning his semifinal reached his first major tournament final in five years, but Venus Williams by winning her semifinal yesterday reached her first major tournament final in eight years. And all the while contending with Sjögren’s syndrome, which she found out she had in 2011.
Slight delay in Elneny’s return from Africa, as Egypt won their group after defeating Ghana yesterday. Oh well, at least Xhaka is getting a winter break.
Why doesn’t Rooney get booked for mouthing off to Moss?
I don’t mind our players being booked but be consistent with your job application that is all rant over ?
Being an optimist,when i saw a headline on the Arse website that the start time of 3pm for our big match at Liverpool on 4th March had been changed,i thought the powers that be at Sky had moved the time back to a 12 or 12,30 kick off to give us more time to recover for our big game against Bayern at the Ems on the following Tuesday.
Silly fucking me. !
The arseholes changed it to a 5.30 kick off giving us even less time to recover. !
So by the time the match is finished and the boys get back home to London,it will be the early hours of Sunday morning before they get some kip.
What’s the betting the Bayern league fixture that w/end will be played on the Friday night.
Spot on re the tickets Esso.
One sadness of the current situation is that you don’t get people deciding on the spur of the moment to see matches like you used to. Before I was married, when I lived in London , the lads in the office or my other friends would often decide on the day of a game to go to one of the London grounds to see a match that we liked the look of ( this is aside from watching Arsenal) . I often went to Chelsea, QPR,West Ham , The Scum and Crystal Palace as well as virtually every England game at Wembley .
I never do that now but I’m not sure if standing places would not be ticketed . The possibility for fan violence if they weren’t is obvious
As quoted in The Sun, Brede Hangeland on Emmanuel Adebayor: “he would sit in the gym with a cup of coffee and a muffin. He was being paid by City, Tottenham and Palace at the same time, and he was sitting in the gym drinking coffee.”
Sounds perfectly reasonable to me. 😉
The entire “lazy eleven” article is worth some laughs, including Hangeland’s comments about his managers: Hodgson, Magath and Pardew.
Four match touchline ban for Wenger. He was lucky.
http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/38777152
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Harsh if you ask me. Out to get him the FA are indeed.
Consistently inconsistent. Just like Moss and Taylor.
Times like this are opportunities to show your love for your manager and your club. The boys should go out there and win every single game in solidarity for the manager. His love for his players and club fetched him this.
The first is with beating the Saints tomorrow in their backyard.
COYGs!
Mourinho says he hasn’t pushed a manager.
But he will.
And when he does, you can be sure he will get a two match ban.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.