A Strange Day But Hammers Eventually Hammered
Apr 22nd, 2018 by 'holic
The ‘farewell to Arsene’ tour started with a flattering 4-1 win over a West Ham team who battled hard for eighty minutes before falling apart in the final eight minutes of the match.
There were still some empty seats, but fewer than has become the norm of late and the crowd gave the departing manager a warm round of applause as he came out and a chorus of “One Arsene Wenger”. However the raucous celebration had to wait until the tail end of a strange afternoon.
It’s fair to say that the visitors seemed the likelier to open the scoring in the opening phase of the first-half. A number of long balls into the channels once again caused us concern. The surprisingly recalled David Ospina denied Mario, then Arnautovic who as ever provided a physical threat throughout. Kouyate looped a header onto the crossbar and it was clear they were in the mood to spoil Arsene’s day.
Gradually the Gunners knuckled down and settled into the contest. Danny Welbeck was unfortunately wasteful with both head and foot, and Granit Xhaka’s long-range effort was saved by Hart. Worse was to come when Mohamed Elneny turned his left ankle in a challenge with Noble and after a lengthy stoppage was stretchered off. The manager said afterwards that it didn’t look good but we will have to wait for the result of the x-ray. He certainly looks a doubt for Thursday at very least.
The match and atmosphere picked up at the start of the second-half. Nacho Monreal had already had one shot saved when, six minutes after the break, he connected with Granit Xhaka’s corner to volley the ball just inside the post. At last the home support could vent their lungs.
The Arsenal 1-0 West Ham United
The Gunners were in a purple patch and the shots rained in on Hart’s goal. Alexandre Lacazette, Alex Iwobi, and Aaron Ramsey (twice) got shots away as we picked holes in the Hammers defence. West Ham were forced to make two attacking substitutions to try and get back into the contest. Lanzini and Chicharito came on for Mario and Fernandes. They worked. Four minutes after coming on Lanzini teed up Arnautovic to crash a drive inside Ospina’s far post, and it was all-square again.
The Arsenal 1-1 West Ham United
With West Ham now looking the more dangerous it was time for the Arsenal too to respond with a game changing substitution. Iwobi, having one of those days were his youth and inexperience is exposed, was replaced by Pierre-Emerick Aubamayang. Xhaka and Welbeck saw goal bound curlers superbly saved by Hart. At last we were responding.
Eight minutes from time Aaron Ramsey opened the pressure-release valve of the home support when his cross curled untouched inside Hart’s far post. After the match Hammers manager David Moyes hammered his young defender, Rice, for ducking under the cross. Certainly Hart was stranded as a result.
The Arsenal 2-1 West Ham United
Three minutes later it was three, and a typical Wengerball goal as a series of quick passes carved open a shattered Hammers defence. Aubamayang fed Lacazette who moved the ball to a tight angle and smashed it past Hart who had appeared to have covered his near post. He was absolutely beaten by the power of the finish.
The Arsenal 3-1 West Ham United
Astonishingly it was party time for those who had not departed the stadium early when Lacazette struck for the second time in four minutes. The Frenchman was set-up superbly by Ramsey, so influential in the second-half.
The Arsenal 4-1 West Ham United
Rather selfishly I now wanted one more to pull off a miraculous ‘holic pound. Xhaka had it laid on a plate but put his effort over the bar. C’est la vie.
Arsene’s post-match press conference was full of humour and poignancy, and despite his efforts to the contrary some controversial headlines have resulted. Asked if the disunity among fans had hurt the club, Wenger said:
“I am not resentful and I do not want to make stupid headlines. I am not resentful with the fans. It is nothing to do with the fans. The fans were not happy and I can understand that and I have to live with that and I can accept that.”
Again he refused to be drawn into expanding on the reasons for his sudden announcement on Friday, smiling as he suggested he did not want to lie to the assembled journalists as he had done before, which drew giggles from his audience. He did acknowledge the good wishes that have rained down on him, and joked about not needing to die anymore because he knows what people will say!
The man faces a tough task escaping the same line of questioning over the final weeks of his tenure. He will have to maintain a stiff resolve and word his responses carefully as those who know he is click-bait attempt to seize on the sensational. Their chances are running out.
138 Responses to “A Strange Day But Hammers Eventually Hammered”
Good result, bad “journalists”.
Same as it ever was.
They would argue I am doing the same, Dr z, but I believe they are totally misinterpreting what he actually said because they know they don’t get to ride on his train for much longer.
look uh…
IVAN OUT!
H – You have mail…
On the train home. Bath’s capacity for fine vin rouge has no limits it would appear. With minutes to go and a 4-1 score line our thoughts were on nothing other than the HOLIC pound. Xhaka ‘owes you one’. Missed you for the afters. Thursday for me is a function of Mrs Bath’s interest in Bath family social welfare aka ‘it’s in the balance’. Fingers crossed. Hoping I’ll be able to catch up. Are you on an early train?
We live in a world where we can choose the media we choose to watch or read. Many want continual controversy and argument and are fed by the likes of TalkShite, Sky Sports and the tabloid press.
Others want to read objective , quality writing or comment . I would venture they are the sort of people who prefer this site to Le Grove or Arsenal Truth.
Wenger has to face them all. He is very well- remunerated for doing so but those lines on his face bear witness to how gruelling that task can be. I hope his leaving will be civil and respectful. Opinion today seemed divided between those who believe we owe him a massive debt of gratitude although this is definitely the time to go. Others seemed resentful that it has taken this long for him to leave the stage.
It has been a turbulent time and emotions have run high, maybe too high. Today we beat a rival 4-1 ( the score was very flattering as was the 3-0 v Stoke ) and many seemed too mired in apathy or resentment to enjoy it. I hope on Thursday they bring their best game faces because we need a raucous and united crowd on our side.
‘holic nearly knew
Great report Guvnor, pretty much how
I saw it too.
I read AW’s comments, it seems he
will say more after he leaves which
will be his right but there’s nothing
sensational in what he said yesterday
after the game. Our image has taken
a hit and there is disunity – in other
words exactly what generally happens
when the team doesnt do well.
My thoughts were with you during those final few minutes, ‘holic, when 6 goals seemed as likely as 5, but the 4 remained unaugmented. Bad luck!
I hope he says lots more, Matt, in a tell-all book. I’m keen to hear the inside story on the Suarez bid for starters. If one ever eventuates it will be only the second book I have ever read (after Fever Pitch) with a football theme. In fact the only other sport I have books about is horse-racing.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, TTG, and we might now be well into a revival had AW resigned, say, 5 years ago when some of us started brooding on it. But it would be churlish to make too much of his delaying the inevitable now. I thank him for the great years, and forgive him the (relative) disappointments that followed. If anyone needs a bone pointed at them it’s the owner and his minions who allowed him too much rein for too long.
Let’s hope we approach Thursday’s game with the swagger we finally managed in the last 15 minutes today. More of the first 75 and the tie will be over before we reach Madrid.
Sad for poor El Neny, I thought he was our best up until he was injured.
‘Holic, my son had put down a fiver on a 3-1 score at 10-1, and he was ecstatic at that point; had to remind him that the Arsenal was just as likely to go to 5-1 or 3-3, so don’t count them chickens. You and he succumbed to the dreaded middle….
We would need good defensive organization and resolute defending against a very good technical team like Athletico. They will look to stop us from scoring and nick an away goal and approaching the game with swagger could just hand the game to them. But we never know which Arsenal will turn up.?
It’s our kind of ‘defensive organisation and resolute defending’ that got us into the mess we’re in, ksn. I view the chances of beating Atletico over two legs as slim, but perhaps we could win the tie by simply outscoring them.
Chris,
I’ll certainly read that one too.
But I’m a bit doubtful he’ll ever
write it to be honest.
I’ve read more books on horse
racing too 🙂
It’s a long time since I read it
but I remember really enjoying
The Rae Johnstone story.
I wouldnt mind a cagey 0-0 at
half time against Athletico and
then looking to nick a couple
of late goals before they can
get back at us. We’ll need to be
patient and disciplined as they
certainly won’t roll over. We’ve
managed that before and our
chances are good I think.
TTG
Blimey is Arsenal Truth still going? That dude needs serious help.
The fella behind the blog you mention ain’t much healthier to be fair.
Atletico aren’t exactly tearing down trees at present. They’ll still be well organised solid and very cheaty mind.
11. Chris.
You wanted Wenger to leave 5 years ago? So before any of the 3 FA Cups we’ve won in the last 4 years? That’s cold man. I think it might be a year or 2 late personally but in terms of timing it could be spot on. There are a number of excellent coaches available and/or gettable if the board are decisive.
Dexter,
“if the board are decisive”
?
As I’ve idled away the day after celebrating
my daughters birthday a bit too
enthusiastically yesterday I dutifully
read Arsenal Truth to see what TTG and
Dexter were on about.
Blimey, it’s sad. Dexter was 100% correct.
It’s days like this when you have to walk into the bar and say:
His body’s still warm and people are already talking about Rodgers, Howe and Benitez!!
In the words of Claude from Arsenal Fans TV:
“I don’t want any of dat Brendan Rodgers or Eddie Howe Rubbish”
Right, what’s for lunch?
🙂
OM/ Dexter
I went to Arsenal Truth to see what you were referring to and got into the comments section….Blimey! I’d forgotten how bad it was . The Arsenal Universe is certainly broad stretching from the Untold nutters and conspiracy theorists to these guys. Frankly neither remotely represent what I think about my club. I’d need serious therapy if they did.
Concerned as I was by Bob Wilson’s very emotional broadcast which several people kindly appended , I dropped Bob a short note on Friday and as is his way he replied shortly after. I won’t go into specific detail because he wrote this as a private note but he made the point that Wenger was an intensely human individual, someone who provided enormous solace when he needed it and who cares genuinely and intensely for people. This doesn’t make him a great manager, in fact it may be a weakness in some respects, but it does mean that our club was steered by a very significant human being who had intense respect for what Arsenal Football Club stands for and who ‘got’ what the club was about as soon as he walked into the marble halls.
The records may show that Jose Mourinho , for example, might be a more successful manager in terms of the trophies he has won, but has football benefited from his work and values in the way that we have under Wenger? I think we have a rough idea of the answer without thinking too hard.
thunder T
no stranger to nonsense me ?
but fuckadoodledoo the bullshittery on show
in their comments
a bit special alright
.
.
and everybody don’t forget the documentary clive mentioned
is on ch5 tonight
Well remembered CBA. Thanks
I shall watch it with interest.
TTG,
Quite agree with all of #24.
I actually felt sorry for the
bloke when I read his blog.
Matt and TTG
You’re braver than me venturing into the recesses of Arsenal Truth!
TTG. I think your point about Wenger being a more successful human than manager bears fruit when you consider the animosity Mourinho engenders. Not just from opposition fans but decent footballing people.
Wengers weaknesses as a manager may well stem from his inherent humanity as lauded to by another lovely fella Bob Wilson.
As infuriating as his tenure may have got we will hopefully cherish and celebrate the fact the club was in the stewardship of a thoroughly decent and genuine person and not a win at all costs self serving twat!
Feo
Feo
Feo
Feo
Oops wrong website.
For anyone who is interested tonight on Channel 5 at 10pm
http://www.channel5.com/show/fergie-vs-wenger-the-feud/
Well put Dexter!
Atletico Madrid away tickets now on sale to Gold, Silver and Red members with zero credits if anyone fancies a trip to Spain.
what a joyless wee cunt scholes is
33 1/3 ought to be on offer for specialty numeralogists.
Well if we believe Sky Sports (I know!) Were ducked as all the club hierarchy want different people to replace Arsene.
Luis Enrique at 3-1 seems to be the bookies’ favourite at this point, followed by Carlo Ancelotti at 13/2. Brendon Rodgers slipping to where he should be, out of the frame.
TTG might know the answers to these, but if Gazidis and Josh Kroenke bought in Sanllehi and Mislintat to restructure the footballing administration at the club wouldn’t they have had the final piece, a new head coach, at least pencilled in? And would not the timing of AW’s departure — mid-contract — be well explained by the favored candidate being available to take over this summer? If it is true that AW was told four or five week’s ago that he was out at the end of the season, and that was kept under wraps, very successfully, is it too conspiratorial to think that his replacement was a done deal at about the same time and is similarly being kept under wraps for announcement at the optimal moment, which is probably after the Europa League is either won or lost? There is something about the way this is all unfolding that smells of careful stage management.
Dexter (#20) … I didn’t say I wanted AW gone 5 seasons ago, I said I started brooding on it. That the club was going nowhere and nothing was changing, that we must inevitably find a new manager and that, possibly, it would be better sooner than later. As it was I gave him the benefit of the doubt for at least two seasons more. And yes, the FA Cups, were very welcome, while not actually changing much.
In retrospect, had he left five seasons ago, or four, or three, I don’t think it would have made an iota of difference to my belief that we’d be in a better position today as a result. None of which alters my opinion of the man as our greatest ever manager to whom we owe a huge debt of gratitude. I would love to see both a statue of him at the Grove and an honorary position ‘upstairs’ at Arsenal for life.
Sorry, ‘holic, make that an honorary position ‘upstairs’ at the Arsenal for life. 🙂
…so that would make it Enrique or Low then, Ned?
Rae Johnstone was an interesting character, Matt. He looked shifty and was known for his mastery of the dark arts of race-riding. He was also accused of not trying after refusing to apply the whip to horses that had no chance of placing. His Epsom Derby win on Lavandin was one of my earliest Derby memories (I saw my first aged 12 with my mum!). It was bucketing down with rain and I can’t recall seeing a thing.
My favourite jockey of the era was of course Lester Piggott, the greatest of all time, but I also had a soft spot for another Aussie, Scobie Breasley. They used to say “Scobie Breasley in the last”, meaning, if he had a ride in the last race of the day it could only be because he was sure it could win. Otherwise he preferred to leave the course early to avoid the rush. Tbis cost me a fortune once, when I added his mount (in the last) to a trifecta making it a 4-horse accumulator … and the first three won at long odds. Breasley’s mount called, would you believe called, Miss Fortune, could not get out of a pocket until the final furlong, then set off at a 45 degree angle to get a run, and finished 3rd beaten two short-heads. That cost me more than £20,000 in 1962.
All that said the horse-racing books I read have more to do with the history of the sport than individuals in it. “Eclipse first, the rest nowhere”.
Re the Breasley story I should add that betting tickets in those days used to have a number and codeword on them, and to this day I still have that losing tickets which has the following code on it … ‘123FLOP’.
Chris@40: Or Ancelotti.
Low would be an interesting choice, but a good philosophical fit for the club — favours fast-passing attacking football and likes to bring on young players. Been out of club football for more than a decade, though, and has arguably been more successful at international level than club.
Paul Le Guen (ex PSG, Lyon) is out of contract in the summer, too, I believe. His is a name never mentioned in connection with the Arsenal job, however, though he would be a lot more qualified than many of those who are.
Scobie was a bit before my time
Chris, but he was one of my Dad’s
favourite jockeys. I know that as
my Mum told me he wanted to call my
older brother Scobie 🙂
My mum refused but I used to call
him Scobie sometimes when we
were kids to wind him up.
Johnstone was certainly shifty but
it did make for an entertaining story.
Lester was unique and the greatest
ever as you say. Of the other jockeys
I saw I thought only Cauthen ever came
close for a few short years.
Great racing memory on the 20 grand
– though must have been heart stopping
at time !
In a way it might be ok if the
board has various ideas about
the next manager. At least that
would mean a good discussion
about what we want and who
fits the job criteria best among
the candidates. I don’t really
trust any of them making the
decision on their own.
Of course it’s quite possible that
Ned’s thought that all may be decided
already is correct. I’m not sure in
this day and age though that they
could really keep something secret
for 4 or 5 weeks. Time will tell and
as long as the new man is announced
by or just after the last game of the
season then that’s fine I think.
Thanks Chris.
Personally I wanted a change of manager several times during Arsenes tenure!
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I hope it has already been decided. Would be rubbish if it dragged on all summer giving the impression the club are indecisive ditherers! Haha
Apparently Ivan wants Arteta. Sven wants 2 Germans (not Low) and the Spaniard wants a Spaniard!
Cauthen was after I left England, Matt, but his reputation has to have him in the top 5. Many experts rate Gordon Richards as their #1, above Piggot, and perhaps his record supports it, but I never saw him live so I’ll stick with Lester.
It’s the same with horses, I can’t believe there’s been a better one than Ribot, but Timeform rates Frankel, who never contested the classics or Prix de l’Arc de Triomphe, best ever with four others also ahead of Ribot. I was also fortunate to see Sea Bird II, rated #2 by Timeform, totally destroy the Derby field in his day, and whether he or Ribot deserves the ‘greatest’ tag has always been a toss-up for me.
AW himself used to suggest Dragan Stojković would be his successor. Haven’t seen that name mentioned recently. Considered football royalty in his homeland I remember Stojković as a tough, uncompromising midfielder of the type we could really use today. If he brings the same talents to management, who knows?
Currently managing Guangzhou R&F FC, whatever that is. Formerly with Nagoya Grampus, where he played under AW’s management, and later managed the club himself.
If it is true that the new guy will only be given £50m to spend, that suggests a clear out of at least one “big” player.
I suppose the most vulnerable will be Mustafi and Xakha, who we might be able to get a few quid for, although nothing like what we (over)paid for them.
And if that story is true I reckon you can rule out a really top top manager coming here. Who’d want to do a job with his hands tied financially.
IF it is true (and it’s being reported in more than one paper so maybe the board room is still leaking like a bastard and also divided – scenario : Board member X doesn’t like Wenger being forced out, so a negative story like this gets leaked. Just conjecture but I do wonder…)
Personally I’d prefer Arteta out
of the board’s candidates but I
admit it’d be a gamble as his first
managers job.
Never saw Ribot or Sea Bird II
Chris and haven’t seen most of
Timeforms top rated – I did see
Shergar destroy his Derby field
and he was certainly brilliant.
I rated Alleged better personally,
to win two Arcs was a great
achievement and he won them
well too.
£50m isn’t going to buy a GK,
2 CBs, and a DM/CM 🙁
Apart from Mustafi and Xhaka,
I think we might be vulnerable
to a big offer for Hector.
Course, then we have to buy a
RB too.
I think we have to recognise that the dreams of a dynamic young coach coming in and spending the untapped millions that Wenger was happy to leave in the vaults will be exposed as a pipe dream. The only way we will bring in top level ready made fixes for our deficits in CMF, CB and GK will be if we sell Rambo and Hector.
Some home truths:
Arsenal have always been parsimonious with funds compared to the likes of Manure and even the Dippers.
This Arsenal is run by money-men. Money is the most important thing.
We need to find another coach who can make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear.
That’s what they are looking for. Failing that, they will appoint an inexperienced coach whom they think they can push around.
The noughties were great. It was a privilege. It’s over.
bath
i fear your beside manner may be on the wane
oops ?
my medicine tastes bad 🙁
can i have a second opinion 🙂
chuck d in there
is the flavor flav bad
hip hop references at this hour of the day
well , did you evah
To sell Hector, Rambo and let Jack go
in one summer would require some
pretty good signings to keep the
fans gruntled.
i just learned who Chuck D is.
I’m not sure if anyone has posted this, but just some food for thought. I looked up the list of the 10 most mooted candidates but have included AW in the list just as a reference just to compare their win ratios.
This list should be looked upon with caution as there are certain surrounding circumstances for all of them such as career duration, personnel, budget and league but here goes:
1) Luis Enrique- 59%
2) Carlo Ancelotti- 58%
3) Diego Simeone – 56%
4) Joachim Low – 55%
5) Arsene Wenger – 54%
6) Masimilliano Allegri – 52%
7) Brendan Rogers – 52 %
8) Rafa Benitez – 50%
9) Thomas Tuchel – 49%
10) Patrick Viera – 43%
11) Eddie Howe 43. %
Interestingly enough in comparison to the top 5 managers in the league the list was as follows:
1) pep guardiola – 71%
2) Jose Mourinho – 65%
3) Antonio Conte – 58%
4) Juergen Klopp – 49%
5) Mauricio Pottechino – 44%
To me these lists make me be careful what I wish for, as Wenger does stand pretty high up on both lists.
Rumour has it, Allegri is the boards first choice. I’m not averse to that idea either!
cba @58, it is that.
Death is inevitable. Get over it.
and how not to spell be’d’side
everyday’s a schoolday at ‘holic’s bar ‘n’ grill
? bath
I’ll be amazed if Allegri is our next coach.
Nobody thought we were going to sign Aubameyang and then pop!
There has clearly been a transition the club taking place over the last year.
First there was a catalyst for change, now Ivan is talking about going bold with our new appointment.
Interesting times ahead!!
70
not if only to hear
massimiliano knows
What’s the win percentage for those managers in the last five years, King GT? Or the last three?
Ramsey has almost no value, moving into the final year of his contract. £20m tops?
Jack going on a free will save us around £5m a year in wages.
Mustafi and Xakha going might raise £40m for the pair, if we’re lucky.
Chuck out Welbeck for £10m and a saving on his wages and we’d have a few quid to do as we like with.
It’s also possible the new guy might not see Ozil and Mkhi in the same side and may want to sell one of those. Hmmm.
I don’t think the board will be brave or imaginative enough to go for him, but Julian Nagelsmann looks like a very interesting candidate. Seems as out of step with the rest of them as Arsene was when he arrived at Highbury.
Cynic
Sorry I couldn’t find percentages per season/over the last three seasons. Only either per club or career wide. I could have averaged out per season but that would not have given an accurate reading.
Nagelsmann has a win percentage at Hoffenheim from 2016 of 42%
The two young German coaches are at the career positions that Martinez and Coyle were at when they were being touted as inspirational young coaches who should replace stale old Wenger. Go figure.
Wenger had considerable experience (7 seasons) at Monaco and had built a team that won Ligue 1 and the French Cup and was cheated out of a second title by corruption by Marseille. In a couple of seasons in Japan, he won two cups. Neither the two young Germans, nor Vieira, nor Arteta can hold a candle to those achievements so they are total punts. If we go down any of those options then we know that Stan’s a gambler. Might work, probably won’t.
Find a manager who is a big enough c**t to want to win every game and employ the tactics required to do so, yet still not be so much of a c**t that we are embarrassed to have him around.
George Graham, come on down 🙂
I must admit Bath’s description
of Arteta as a total punt is more
accurate than my own “bit of a
gamble”
Early Graham yes Cynic. Those
teams played good football, late
Graham, no thank you for me.
Well then, OM… Graham and Wenger – peas in a pod 🙂
I know we have our youth football fans on here but nobody mention the U18s please.
@77 or maybe it’d tell us Stan’s a cheapskate (resists a “there’s me attempting to fish-finger the fella”, type pun, for fear of near catastrophic misinterpretation) … either way, reckon without A.Dubbya around to deflect the blows we’s bound to find out a whole lot more about the nature of the ol’ carpetbagger’s regime, real soon… yeeeeeeeeeeehaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
Rev AL @81. The shield will soon be gone and the rats in the corners will be exposed to the sunlight. It’ll be interesting.
vividly put @82 the mighty BG – hats orf.
bath@82, as in the supposedly old chinese insult “may you live in interesting times”, i reckon.
Seeing Salah’s two goals in that first half, I can now proclaim that he is better than Messi.
What a signing Md Salah has been for Liverpool. He has scored two more in the first half today against Roma. I hope one of our players shows similar prolific form against Athletico on Thursday.
At the current time.
At least he was good in that half.
Or at the two moments when he stuck the ball in the net.
The two best players in the league, Salah and De Bruyne, are Mourinho rejects. Staggering.
It really hurts seeing Liverpool doing so well at this level.
SG@90, better now though.
Have to say, really enjoyed that game. Salah is the best I’ve seen since TH 14.
Ned
Your conspiracy theory is very credible. I think it is clear Gazidis had a plan probably exacerbated by the farce that was the summer transfer window and by the next window had Sanllehi and Mislintat in place. Arsenal would not sack Wenger mid- season so he has been eased out but I suspect that much work has already gone into identifying the successor and there will be a hierarchy if not a favoured candidate. I’m wondering if Arteta is being lined up as coach to an older head like Enrique, Allegri or Ancelotti But I’ve heard no whispers just as I heard nothing about Wenger’s departure before it broke.
My favoured choice would be Allegri but there are many good candidates . I would not want….Rodgers, Henry ( as manager) , Favre, Howe, Dyche, Rangnick or even Loew. But Gazidis is showing a very clear head on this. For the first time he is in control and he is making very good appointments……so far. I sense he wants to win not just make money
Thanks for the above, TTG. Arteta as apprentice to a caretaker like Ancelotti would have a certain logic to it and avoid the risk of Moyes after Fergie syndrome. I think Allegri or Enrique would be permanent appointment, in as much as there is any such thing these days.
TTG, I think Gazidis has been playing a long game for a while and suspect after all the shenanigans of last year’s contract renewal, he managed to get agreement for the new executives and perhaps even a results based review for AW after 1 year. I’m sure he understands more than most that a winning team makes money both in terms of match revenue but also importantly sponsors ( = Stan happy ).
Perfectly…….
Set…..
Up…….
For…….
Well, I don’t mind if I do…..in perfect cba style. Unbeatable ?
At my age, you grab an opportunity whenever you can ?
Good work Uply!
The test of whether Ivan is making
very good appointments will be the
next couple of seasons.
I imagine he wants to win – who
doesn’t? But does he hate to lose
enough?
I live in hope personally but it’s too
early to tell just yet.
It would be interesting to know the terms of Gazidis’s incentive bonus. Are there any playing results objectives, or is it all short and long term financial goals and project deliverables?
Bit of keepie Uply from 95 to 101.
Keepie Uply, Ned? In my ignorance I tried the self-feeding century trick when I first came to this site, and got roundly condemned for it! Yah Boo Uply.
As for all this percentage schmentage, it has to be marginally easier to get wins with a Messi/Suarez/Neymar front row than your average Prem attack, surely? I wonder how Enrique (and he’s only an example) would go managing Stoke.
Like most stats there’s no level playing field here and ‘comparisons are odious‘ (John Lydgate in his Debate between the horse, goose, and sheep, circa 1440).
Did you know that Alleged was a grandson of Ribot, Matt? In fact no horse since WW2 has sired more classic winners than Ribot, on both sides of the Atlantic. And no horse has had more progeny which themselves have sired classic winners. Ribot was a breeding freak as well as a racehorse. His two Arc wins alone should rate him #1, the ‘official’ distances he won both by were clearly wrong according to photos of the finish otherwise his Timeform rating would have been higher (this is an old debate amongst afficionados). In the latter he beat the world’s best by a conservative 8 lengths, the greatest winning distance for the Arc.
But enough I hear the regulars muttering, who is going to win the only race that matter, the Arsenal managerial stakes? My vote goes to a virtual unknown, as an interim, but since I don’t know any unknowns I haven’t a clue.
“As we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don’t know we don’t know” – Donald Rumsfeld, February 12, 2002
Ned,
Ivan’s total remuneration is
published I think as are the
club’s FY results. I suppose
if we looked at his salary/bonus in
winning / non-FA Cup winning
years and factored in the
annual profit / league position
in those years then we might get an idea
of the contract incentives, albeit unclear,
and whether winning trophies /
final league position makes a
difference.
Rumsfeld was a moron of course. A dangerous moron, but one nonetheless.
Virtual unknown.
Is that a known virtual unknown, or an unknown virtual unknown?
I didn’t know that Chris, but you’re
right we’ll soon be told this isn’t a
racing blog
🙂
I don’t know enough about Stan’s
choices of managers for his
US sports teams to know whether
he prefers knowns or unknowns.
I know his teams don’t win much
and I know most US gooners think
he’s a c**t.
Okay, I guess you said an unknown virtual unknown. I think.
Rumsfeld totally ignored the fourth category though, the unknown knowns. That is the category where he should have been looking for Iraq’s nonexistent “weapons of mass destruction” and if he hadn’t ignored the category maybe he could have “unknown” the weapons.
Watch out for Gazidis and his unknown “bold” candidate. Unless it is Steve Bould, in which case you should question his spelling.
Or the spelling of those who transcribed his remarks.
Why do peopke want to believe the Torygraph when they say the new guy will have a £50m budget? Wenger spent nothing this season. Let’s wait and see.
Cynic why is Ramsey only worth 20 mill when the Ox was worth 40m?
It’s silly season already!
Of all those names mentioned above and in the media one seems obvious for many reasons.
He’s available
Knows the league
Has won stuff
And wouldn’t be affected by replacing Wenger.
Ox is odds on to be in the CL final, Dexter, while Rambo is odds against to make the Uefa Cup final. That has nothing to do with relative ability, just the way things are in the crazy world of football. I would value Rambo at double Ox.
Nothing wrong with Ancelotti’s credentials, Dexter, but I’d be disappointed if he gets the job. He just seems a bit retro to me.
Oxlade Chamberlain won’t be in the Champions League Final or the World Cup after that injury sadly IMO. I think he may have done knee ligaments. He is very injury prone and quite a slow healer but I think this is his first Liverpool injury.
I didn’t know he was injured. Tough luck for the lad.
Cynic why is Ramsey only worth 20 mill when the Ox was worth 40m?
Oxlade Chamberlain had longer to go on his contract and moved in January, when players are harder to pick up and carry a higher price. That six months extra on his deal bumped up his value, although Liverpool massively overpaid IMO.
If you move in the summer in the last year of your deal, clubs know you are six months away from agreeing free transfer and the longer you don’t sign, the value you carry to your current club plummets.
Liverpool were willing to pay twice what OX was worth (IMO) and at the end of the day a club will pay what it pays. In my view, Ramsey is a £20m player in a sensible market, especially in his current circumstances.
Actually, bollocks to my memory.
He left in August so ignore all that 🙂
I’d also quite like to see Max Allegri down the Arse an’ all:
First up, he has massive pun potential; he also out-thunked the savvy Poch & his tiny totts beautifully in one cannily conceived 10 minute spell, to boot that lot outta the Champs League (could there be a better way to announce yerself to the Arse?); plus he looks a bit like peak era Charlton ‘Athletic’ Heston (obvs before any of us knew C’A’H was to become an NRA wing-nut), and that’s not to be sniffed at – an impressive touchline presence is surely a bottom-line requirement for yer modern-day top of the shop, technical area strutting all over the TV type manager, and looking like an admittedly second-ratish, goldenish era Hollywood god is surely gonna get you the nod over say Brendan ‘sock puppet’ Rodgers & Diego ‘psycho’ Simeone – no?
But would he leave Juve for us? And would our board have the bottle/will/finances to go for a powerful foreign manager, who might not be willing to keep his trap shut re the machinations of the club (which Arsene, for all his latter day failings, was surely doing) when/if press/fans start to get on his back for not working immediate miracles El Cid (i think – can’t be asked to look it up) type stylee? And finally, should you put flour in gravy or does that almost certainly lead to lumping … ?
Ewwww, there’s bundles of imponderables at the mo, which i must admit is already starting to make supporting the Arse more fun. Having something other than when/if/how A. Dubbya should go, to bunny on about feels good, though one can only imagine that some poor folk may find themselves all existentially stricken and that, for the mo – nevermind …
to whet the appetite, re the next ridiculously well remunerated so & so to get the job we’d all love (and some of us seem to believe should be offered to us), here’s a bit of footage of my man Allegri ripping it up big time, somehwere down old Italy way …
https://youtu.be/frE9rXnaHpE
UTA!
If Aaron left in the summer, he’d
have a year left on his contract
and as it hasn’t been a sensible
market since I don’t know when
we’d probably get 40m for him
from somewhere – I don’t know
why but anyway.
Would we / Should we sell?
I would but unlike me many do
rate him highly and he has done
well for us at times in the past.
Depends on the new manager
a bit. Xhaka first mind.
It is bad luck for The Ox but the
story of his career sadly.
Heh Rev AL @127. I’m sure that I’m not existentially stricken but I have a growing realisation that the Arsenal with Ivan at the helm is likely to be, at least for me, a significantly less attractive organisation than the Arsenal with Arsene at the helm. My annual investment of circa £3k is very much in the balance.
There are some reports that the announcement of AW’s departure happened now because Club Level renewals were down but in so doing the Board members have given themselves another cross to bear. Renewal notices are about to go out. They will find that not a few ST holders delay their response until the successor is announced. The Board need to make an appointment that inspires supporters to make that large commitment not just financially but moreover to turning up fortnightly with regular short notice adjustments to other diary commitments to see the fare on offer.
I understand that there will be many who are more motivated to renew simply because the man they regard as the source of all their problems will have gone and there are others who will renew come hell or high water, I find that my own relationship with the Arsenal has become much more that of a ‘consumer’ than my previous life-long role as a supporter. I will never support anyone else in England but I will not unconditionally renew my commitment to a club run by Stan and Ivan without a coach who inspires me to dream.
Relationships have changed and not just that between the Club and its longest serving manager.
Word, the bathster.
Rev AL @127: Can we write it into Allegri’s contract that he wears that gold Roman gladiator helmet on the touchline? 🙂
Why not, bt8 … and maybe Little Vic Akers in the gladiator, shorty, little skimpy skirt thingy, if he’s still around ??? (This could well be a tiny glimpse into the Arse future (especially in them skirts – oh stoppit).)
If it were to happen 8ball, I for one would certainly get my replica Roman gladiator helmet order in early at The Armoury (phew).
(I’m not sure I’ve got the legs for the skirt, any more – though such considerations don’t seem to concern Little Vic, so who knows.)
UTA!
Entirely new merchandising possibilities in store, and a perfectly named Armoury already in place. What could go wrong?
“if he’s still around???”
Firing Vic is just unthinkable – I
might have to hire a light aircraft
and sharpen my best banner writing
crayons if that happens
@134 Entire empire’s have been built uponst such as that and have thenceforth prospered & flourished on a whole lot less (soz, i have absolutely no evidence to back that lot up, but i quite like the sound of it).
@135 agree re Little Vic; ahem … entire empires have perished and thenceforth slid into the sea etc., for a whole lot less than that (soz, i have absolutely no evidence blah, blah, blah, etc., etc. re thingy, but quite like the wassername of it, etc.)
Onward & in another direction (sideways, maybe?)
pardon, went all fruit & veg there : “empires” (someone less vain, or vein or veighn or whatever the eff it is wouldn’t’ve bothered, but that sure aint me, babeeeeeee *winks, bares/bears him’s teeth & blows himself a cheeky, quite seductive wee kissy – i still have it, i just choose not to use it, alright – in the computer screen* Over!
?
What are the odds of having Tuchel at the dugout come next season? Does any of the drinkers here have a comparison between Allegri & Tuchel?
Meanwhile can we take the horse racing antiquities somewhere else? It’s disrupting my football bar.
Great to see you in AL. ? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>