DVD Competition Winners, And Welcome Andre
Jul 3rd, 2012 by 'holic
Well if the response to the competition is anything to go by this is one sought after dvd. I’m not surprised. For all that the season just gone was a mixed bag, the high points warrant repeated viewings. I will certainly be watching the five goal performances against Chelsea and Spurs for years to come.
Now, to be in the hat for the prize you had to tell me the name of the team against whom Mikel Arteta scored a memorable winner. The answer was of course Manchester City. I don’t think many of you even needed to check the video. Well done to all of you, because not a soul got it wrong.
Now, the winners were Paul Cotton, Julian Shulman, and Jonathan Hurrell. Congratulations, and could you all please send me your address to competition@goonerholic.com and I will arrange for the prizes to be sent to you.
Thanks to all of you who entered, and especially those who left some great messages at the same time. Grovelling did not improve your chances of being plucked from my Panama, but it was much appreciated all the same. I was also amused at some of the descriptions applied to the new Premier League title-holders. Great stuff.
Those who were unlucky this time, but still want to own the dvd for those interminable international breaks to come, why not order it from the online Arsenal shop, here.
Welcome Andre
Arsene Wenger must be looking forward to greeting yet another hapless soul appointed to the managerial swivel-chair at that laughable little club up the road. Andre Village-Idiot, fresh from a successful nine-month stint at the bus stop in Fulham, follows Gerry Francis, Chris Hughton, Christian Gross, David Pleat (three times), George Graham, Glenn Hoddle, Jacques Santini, Martin Jol, Clive Allen and Alex Inglethorpe (twice), Juande Ramos, and of course Rosie Redknapp, as Tottenham managers that Arsene has faced up to.
What odds on AVI not being in situ when we visit the Lane in March? Good luck mate. You are going to need it with that hire-and-fire bunch.
435 Responses to “DVD Competition Winners, And Welcome Andre”
like ollie said over the post – “The poor man’s tnuc” – i reckon
Oops – pardon “The poor man’s special tnuc”
Indeed, AL.
Although, posting a link quoting Glenn Hoddle, ‘holic?
Oh the shame ;D
I demand a recount.
The point being even their messiah thinks he’s another waste of time, Ollie.
Can’t stop laughing here π
No, I got them all, H2H. Even Alex Inglethorpe π
Over the post: to be perfectly honest GT – i was referring to both of us (me and him, that is). Reckon LG’ll be lapping up the kind ones from them folk the ‘orrible fuk is unduly fond of. To a rip-roaring season as you say – when it finally bloody well begins… ho-huuuuuuuuuummmmmm!
Up The Arse!
Congratulations to the winners, enjoy.
Aston Villa Boss will soon find out it’s pretty cold in the shadow of the mighty arse, and I’d like to ask him to give my regards to the Pope.
The son of a working girl.
@5 You did indeed ‘holic, looking at that list and just the sheer number of losers on it, just makes me even more glad with what we’ve got.
None of them could hold a torch to our Arsene.
Shame on AVI. I somehow did not dislike him. Until today.
Here’s looking forward to many antics by AVI that are worthy of his name. π
That’s unbelievable that list we are blessed to have our boss.heh@9she will be busy down the lane..
He’s just a naughty boy, ‘holic π
The Spuds are the gift that keep on giving. There we were worried about Mourinho, Guardiola , Moyes and even Martinez and they manage to dig up the failure of the 2011/12 season! Classic Tottenham bungling even by the standards of the uber-bunglers!!
I wonder on what basis they decided to choose him?
Sheer incompetence, delusions of inadequacy, a late April Fool? All are possible but my money is on them trying to find a young Wenger and the only possible candidate who would come is someone who failed with the riches of Abramovich at his disposal . Quite a stunt to take a team good enough to win the Champions League to 6th in their home competition-and it might have been worse if Di Matteo hadn’t taken over.Tactically he’s up with the Ardiles era. Five attackers and no clue in defence.He madeeven defenders of the quality of Cech,Cole and Terry look inadequate.
Ever since (and including) the days of Alan Sugar THFC have been well-run financially and chaotically run in football terms. Their obsession that they are back where they belong is based on a fifty year-old image of a truly great team–but they have no more right to call themselves a really big club than Burnley,Wolves, Newcastle and other giants of the black and white era. Every time a new chapter begins they have a chance to sort it and then they revert to type… picking a loser.
If they didn’t exist we’d have to invent them!
Great piece holic Andre Village idiot love it yes he’ll be seen off like all the rest. I should have won a DVD.
I wish I could share you guys’ confidence.
I reckon AVB is a decent manager – and a decent bloke, which is probably why he couldn’t deal with the overweening egos down at the bus stop. Of course there’s a chance that he’s going to have to deal with a load of only slightly less overweening egos at SHL and will have almost as much of a problem. On the other hand, there’s also a chance that he will turn out to be son of AW.
I sincerely hope that the Totts crash and burn once more, but I can think of dozens of managers whose hands I’d rather see on the tiny tiller.
OG@17: You write wisely. AVB could turn out to be a terrific match for the LWCs. Not good.
That said, you can get 8/1 on him being out on his ear again this year, which doesn’t strike me as that long odds for someone who is barely through the door, 5/1 on him not lasting through 2013 and 3/1 on him getting his P45 in 2014.
So I didn’t win then?
Boo! Corruption in high places.
What do you mean I needed to formally register, to win?
That’s not how things are done in these parts π
NBN and all – I look forward to your all saying you told me so. How long until the proper football starts again?
@Holic am absolutely gutted not to have won one of those DvDs.
@Fellow Holics am slightly afraid AVI might actually do something good with the Totts,here is to hoping for a false dawn and ultimately a major collapse from them.
AVB: “From Stamford Bridge to White Hart Lane I’ll keep my mushroom flag flying high, I’m so hiiiiigh up in the sky so feeeeed my head, feeeed my head….”
I can’t wait, I really can’t. Please, make room for illusions and delusions
Evening all. Holic, OG’s opinion struck a cord in my powers of reasoning (scary). Wish the wee lad luck, as much as a Gooner can, without getting into hot water. Now Trev, last post re talk of our injured warriors (Jack, Diaby, Theo, Arteta…), talk about a wake-up call! Season right around the corner and I’m wringing my hands already!
I will say this about little Andre, I am not sure the players at the bus stop ever bought into his philosophy and style of play. He wanted free flowing attacking football that required a full team commitment and a defensive high line. Terry and company didn’t really suit that style and to prove the point they didn’t even try ( other than to “slip” when they messed up).
Will it be the same at the lane? I hope so but it is hard to say at this point. I am optimistic that the poor performance of Chelsea will give him added pressure and self doubt but we shall see. Not sure the tots center backs are any better suited to play a high line. Eh, screw ‘Em.
Not to rain on anyone’s parade lads, but I think AVB is a far better manager than his stint at the bus stop in Fulham suggests. There, he was faced with an entrenched clique of players who quite simply refused to buy into his ideas on how to play, his formations, etc. They spread huge amounts of discontent and finally, sabotaged him by refusing to play to win.
Ultimately, he got the sack, and once that happened, they suddenly rediscovered their abilities, and thanks to an insane amount of luck, won the CL.
If the Sp*ds board has learned from the failings of Roman, they might give him the authority he needs to be a success and not hamstring him by dancing to the tune of any group of players. I dare say he might turn the Sp*ds into a good team, with no Swiss bank account owning dogs to distract them.
Whew! Pint of Stella if you please, barkeep. I’m parched.
I’ve always found Andy House Snakes intensely annoying, from his stupid bloody mac to his Rimmer from Red Dwarf hair and ginger stubble, that ridiculous touchline frog bouncing and that utterly grating voice, clear your throat man! so phlegmy it’s like he’s been rinsing with a particularly viscous money shot of llama cum, I really didn’t need another reason but this takes the bloody milk choc digestive! what an absolute wanker.
I’m starting to prefer the drinks that lift expectations for AVI because it gives us the best of both worlds. If he does well then it’s no more than we expected, and if he implodes it’s like an unanticipated gift from God.
Ergo, AVB (an alias for AVI) for Manager of the Year!
Comp was clearly a fix.
With regards to AVI. I can’t work out if at 34 he is the manager or an emergency centre half???? I can see him playing after Christmas.
Deluded twats the lot of them.
Evening Holics…..
Stats saying that in the Euro finals that Spain had over 800 passes. The nearest the Spuds would ever get to that would be if Defoe went on Mastermind.
Just saying like.
Heh @29. π
Good luck with that high back line at The Lame, sorry, The Lane, AVB.
Can’t wait to see Legless King and Gallas racing back trying to catch Theo and The Ox as they burst through the offside trap !
Maybe they’ll be helped out in the speed department by a fit again Tom Hundredstone sprinting fron midfield.
How long do we have to wait for this to begin ?!? π
I have had few disappointments in this life more shattering than not winning one of those DvD’s! I was so sure that I would win that I started composing my ‘thank you’ letter to Holic! Now here I am stuck with this piece of paper (8″ x 4″) with scribbles all over it and I am at a loss of what to do with it – any suggestions chaps?
π
GoonerTerry. I think ‘holic can be corrupted. Sounds like you’re the fourth winner to me. π
At the risk of irritating some of the Spain and Cesc haters on here I watched Spain v. Italy again this afternoon, and have to say that it was one fab final for Fabregas. π
I agree 8Ball. Spain played wonderfully and Cesc was the best player on the pitch. Had they played that way at the start Le Boss and I would not have had to blast them for being boring…Mind you had they attempted to play like that throughout the tournament they’d have probably ran out of steam like the Germans!
SteveT@29: π
GT, bt8b, fourth is a trophy. Oh, yes!
Glazers’ proposed listing of Man Utd on New York Stock Exchange reeks of desperation for cash. And what is with setting up a holding company in the Cayman Islands that lets the Glazers retain full control while siphoning off shareholders’ cash to clear their debt? Makes our financial transparency seem so much classier. But then that is us through and through.
NBT@35
I agree. The whole thing is weird. Give us your money, you can tell your mates you own the team but you will probably lose your money and have no voting rights. I’ll take our model any day. They should just sell “certificates” in the gift shop that says: “I gave Manure my money and all I got was this piece of paper.”
For me, these are the two key quotes from this UTD SE story.
“our indebtedness could adversely affect our financial health and competitive position”
And on FFP
“could negatively affect our business”
They’re essentially admitting that they can no longer spend like mad with the 423m debt they have.
Anyone who is wondering what future AW sees for JW and who he thinks should fill the AM role… This is from 2008.
http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/wenger-wilshere-can-fill-bergkamp-role-
And just a little reminder to anybody who forgot his abilities.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ynf0AJuha7g
Three Snir posts in a row: he’s back.
In other news, The Beast is injured.
GoonerTerry. I think βholic can be corrupted.
Bt8 32, somehow should try and look at ‘holic’s neighbours’ names π
NCA36 heh, true π
Morning ‘Holic & ‘Holics
Great ditty on the new ‘Village-Idiot’ ‘Holic. I am always grateful for the continual source of mirth and general c*ntiness served-up at SHL as no matter how bad things get, we can always say at least we’re not LWCs.
Long live The Arsenal and I wonder how many more Sp*rs managers Arsene will see off before he finally decides to do something else?
Independence Day drinks for all please Mr.Barman.
So, I didn’t win either? Clearly, it was Phil Dowd who refereed the draw π
Kidding aside, congrats to the winners of course.
Trev@30: while I too would enjoy that sight, Legless and Gallas won’t be there this season since Legless has hung up his prosthetic knee and iirc, Gallas won’t get an extension to his contract.
Given time, I think AVI could be very good for them but short-term a lot depends on who will replace Adepaywhore and if they can keep Modric and also keep him relatively happy. And if he chooses to play with a high defensive line, that will be a problem for them initially at least. I don’t think their current squad is any more suited to playing like that than Chelsea were because playing a high defensive line is simply really, really difficult.
Whatever, time will tell.
8ball, Cesc was perhaps the best player on the pitch in my eyes. And as I said during the game, he gave a certain little Russian a masterclass in how to act when played in an unusual position.
Ned@35: it certainly has a stench of panic and desperation to it. I just read about it in the Guardian, and they have paid over Β£500 million in interests, fees and bank charges since 2005. Thats five hundred million for which they got absolutely nothing! For that amount of money, we got ourselves a brand spanking new stadium, redeveloped Highbury and still had cash for a cuppa and a bag of crisps. If this doesn’t work for them, they are in serious trouble.
Our Belgian boss is visiting from the US today.
If I bump into him, I hope he’s not asking me if I’m from Belgium;)
Ned, Lars –
Heard a radio report that deep inthe 300 page prospectus for the share sale that was submitted to the New York exchange, is a paragraph saying that should the shares not be taken up, it could impact on Man Uts’s ability to buy new players, and to keep their existing players and coaching staff.
Spuds fans are already bemoaning the rumours that they will be the next petro dollar club, as their super rich Kuwaiti waits in the wings to buy the club. Now that (cant do italics) would be stupid.
Enjoy another great day Arse fans. π
Man U going bankrupt would be quite pleasant.
A-V-B
And Leeevyy,
Will fail together in perfect harmony,
Side by side in the dugout, boardroom, Oh Lord, what folly!
We all know,
That Spuds are the same wherever we go.
They always boast about their crappy team,
We learn to live,
By ignoring those classless spivs,
We will be splitting our sides,
Watching them on Channel 5!
A-V-B
And Leeevyy,
Will fail together in perfect harmony,
Side by side in the boardroom, dugout, Oh Lord, what folly!
I didn’t win? Bet Rosie was pulling the strings π
But still, congrats to the winners, enjoy John Terry chewing the cud again and again and again… π
On the matter of AVI’s appointment… Little bit worried. Just a little bit. I thought he could potentially of taken over from Arsene in 5-10 years, no way that’s happening now but I think that he’s a good manager that got screwed over in the same manner Avram Grant did (John Terry’s fault) and now that he’s got Β£100 million to spend (:lol:) supposedly and a team of less prentenious fuckwits, he might be able to better his last position in the league of 5th… And finish 4th 8)
While the Arsenal stroll like the Arsenal Gent on Twitter would to the League Title at Home to Man United in April or so.
Now where’s a surgeon in this bar, might need to get these Rose Tinted Contacts removed… π
(For the record, I don’t wear contacts, my eyesight is amazing π )
http://deadspin.com/5923264/sorry-mario-balotelli-didnt-really-make-this-german-fan-cry-how-tv-lied-to-you-during-euro-2012
And this makes me sick.
From today’s Arseblog:
…whereupon 99,9% of all readers under 25 just went “no what, a two hour what with a picture what???” π
heh Lars π
Losing is of course very hard to take. I feel that my preparation for this competition was exemplary. No stone was left unturned in my quest to win.
To lose on what amounted to little more than a lottery is tremendously unfair . However I will learn from this defeat and come back stronger,of that I’m certain.
I will move on and get better for this experience, a bad experience though it is.
My performance in this competition is not a true reflection of where I consider myself to be but I accept that I have not been able to produce the form that I show on the training ground, day in day out. I remain fully confident that if I keep working hard , better results will follow.
In any case, this was, by any definition, a bit of a Shitty competition .
π
I cannot be bought!
I can π
Heh Tabs.
I am indebted to Le Groan for putting me right about Arsene again. I never realised he had cost us trophies because he kept faith in Robin.
Maybe in a parallel universe it really is me who’s the cunt?
Apparently we have signed Lu-lu-lu-lukas Podolski.
Well it’s official now, he’s not just ‘agreed to sign’ π
First Myles, now le Groan?
You should just stop doing this to yourself, old π
Heh consecutively @ tabs, Holic, H2H and Old.
Changing subjects – Everton have just signed a bigger diver than Ashley Young and Nani combined. Bet you never thought that possible. π
Everton signed Tom Daly?
Everton have signed monkey-boy Bale Dr Z ? Didn’t see that coming .
Worse than Bale.
Trust me.
Le Grove preaching life lessons at Arsene Wenger is like Einstein being lectured on Physics by an ant.
I see England have moved up to 4th in the Fifa rankings.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18703497
Now, I may not be the sharpest pencil in the box, but even I can work out that if you are elimanated from a competition at the Quater Final stages, then there are at least four teams that are better then you and that’s only from one continent.
Ah the Rangers exodus begins.
What do you reckon to us signing the Rangers keeper on a free Dr Z ? Good enough as a back-up ?
Does anybody understand what’s going on at Rangers ? My knowledge of Liquidation/Administration Law sketchy at best, so does anybody know the answer to, or at least have a link for , the following questions :-
1. If Rangers are liquidated why aren’t all the assets of the club, players and especially Ibrox, not being sold off to pay off creditors ?
2. Why were the assets allowed to be sold to a purchaser at surely an undervalue of Β£5.5m ?
3.What is the advantage to the Revenue in refusing to accept the terms of the proposed CVA when to my limited understanding they would have got more money than through a liquidation ?
Heh, post of the day from tabs@54!
H2H@66: that FIFA ranking is completely broken. It places far too much emphasis on international friendlies, so a country that consistently plays crap teams in friendlies will get more ranking points than a better team that plays more difficult opposition. You get as many ranking points for scraping a 1-0 win against San Marino in a friendly as you would if you tonked Spain 5-0.
tabs,
Macgregror is a good keeper, but attracts trouble off the pitch. Craig Gordon is a better keeper and as far as I am aware, out of contract/ available. π
The other stuff – check out a blog called Rangerstaxcase – (google it) – best way to understand the whole thing it is go back to the original early blogs of March last year and then read forward. There is wuite a bit to read, but it is fascinating, if you have the time.
There is some serial corruption going on up here which is sickening.
Depending on how it unfolds I suspect I will have spent my last Β£ watching football at the “top”level up here.
Wuite = quite π³
Cheers for that Dr Z – I will give it a whirl.
Does your last sentence mean that you think the whole of scottish football will go belly up, or simply that you are just so monumentally pissed off with the whole shebang that you won’t bother going any more ?
Was Gordon at Hearts before Sunderland ?
Cheers Lars π
‘Holic cannot be bought – sorry, how many bottles of Bushmills was that ?
Having said that, I cannot see how I failed to win that competition ‘cos I just knew the answer instantly without even having to look at the ……. send what email ??
Have just seen in today’s Daily Fail – it’s a cafe copy, I’m at lunch – a picture of the newly installed Andre Village Idiot standing next to the Spuds emblem of chicken-on-a-basketball with the club name underneath.
So what, I hear you say.
Well, the chicken’s head has been chopped off in the picture, and the name underneath has been carefully obstructed to leave showing only ‘Tottenha’.
As rivals they just couldn’t give you any more …. π
Off all the opinions aired on this site from holic himself to all the bloggers one thing that is never missed is an opportunity to have a laugh at the spuds long may it continue.
It seems I was wrong about the FIFA ranking, you don’t get the same number of points regardless of the opposition but just the fact that England are fourth is enough to prove that it is broken anyway…
My last sentence means that I won’t pay money to watch a rigged competition.
The governing bodies are not prepared to enforce their own rules.
It is contemptible.
Oh and yes, CG was at Hearts.
Hehs @Lars and Tabs, 52 and 54.
Lars, Legless King is to undergo a fitness test on what’s left of his knee before the issue of a new contract is decided.
Now will you please stop prematurely cutting short my mirth at the neighbour’s misfortunes ? π
Zico – is the Prem now financially rigged ?
And don’t forget Dean and Webb. And Dowd. And Mason.
And Ferguson.
Oh dear.
Will have to have a look at that Trev will not buy the paper of course will just flick through it in the shop it really pisses the newsagent off.
Back to work, playmates. Laters. π
Trev@76: ok, the last I read was that Legless had given up. But that was a few weeks ago. And I will make sure to check my FACTS better the next time!
zico@75: allowing Rangers into the first division would be a travesty. “Oh, but the TV deals will fall through” is apparently the main argument for not putting them in the bottom tier which I think is a) bollocks (presumably the deals have been written in such a way that the tv companies can’t just walk away) and b) irrelevant if you want to keep any sporting credibility. They have gone bust, and the same rules that apply to other clubs should apply to them.
My two cents on AVB.
I don’t rate him at the mo, he didn’t do anything at the Chavs to make me worry in the slightest. I see here that some are saying that he can’t be judged by what he did at Stamford Bridge, sorry, but that is bollox, if he can’t be judged by his failures, then by the same logic he can’t be graded on his success either, but just to be fair, lets have a look at what he achieved.
He won the Portugeese Super Cup after being only two months in the job, so if one were so inclined, you could argue that he won that with his predessors team, because you can’t build a team in approx eight weeks.
His next season was a good one, he won the Yourhopeless League and domestically he went unbeaten. which as we know is a tremendous acomplishment, while winning the league and also snagged the Portugeese Cup, excellent…….
Until you consider he was the manager of one of the three teams (Porto, Benfica , Sporting) who have won the competition since the end of WWII (except 2001 Boavista)
Plus, Porto had won all those competions the two years prior to his arrival and still managed to win the league the year after he left. Make of that what you will.
Back to his failure, we all know that there are a bunch of self serving fucktards at SB, but HE was the manager, it’s his job to pick the team and get them playing how he wants, not how Frank, John or Ashtray want to play. As management, and this applys to whatever industry you’re in, it’s your responsibility to rally your troops, marshal them and get the best out of them, if you can’t, well you’re in the wrong job. Maybe because he’s too young, maybe because of the fact he wasn’t himself a football player or maybe it was the language barrier (JT only speaks mong), what ever it was they just didn’t listen to him or respect him and that is fatal.
My opinion is that a manager is only as good as his last appointment and that makes him a bit of a Roy Keane (but without all the playing experience), he’s also taking over a team of deluded individuals (eg Fanny Fart) who think they are a lot better then they are, a defence that’s falling apart and a few that would rather be somewhere else. And lets not forget ladies and gents that this is the S**rs we are talking about, a club that has supposedly had more new dawns then a porno actor that works for a company that only employ chicks that are called Dawn, Just like said thespian, I’m sure they’ll find a way to fuck this new dawn too.
Next…….
H2H haha . excellent π
Lars @ 80
Exactly.
All the rules are being twisted/ignored for the benefit of one group of cheats.
It’s disgusting.
@H2H re AVB – AV’ it!
Afternoon Holics. Who’s in the bar, and more importantly, what are we talking about today?
π
Loads of people talking about ‘shit’ it seems, GT.
lars,
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18703183
It is now down to the other 30 clubs in the tiers below to do the right thing and insist that Newco apply to rejoin in the bottom league.
Lars@44: if “they” are the Glazers, they didn’t exactly get nothing. They got a football club without having to use their own money. If “they” is Man U, they got the Glazers and f*cked over.
Trev@46: There is a certain irony in the fact that all the Glazers’ financial engineering counts for nothing in the face of Citeh’s hard petrodollars. Cash is king.
Tabs@54: π You just need the mental strength to succeed, and a way to restrict the other entries to no more than two.
‘Holic@55: A million bucks say you can.
Tabs@67: If the creditors agree to a voluntary liquidation, which is what is happening in Rangers case, it means they all take a hair cut on what they are owed so the company can continue, but reorganized on a more solid financial footing. That is what often happens if the club’s ‘bankruptcy’ is because of cash flow problems, and especially since 2002 when changes in the law made it easier for a company to go into administration, essential a restructuring procedure under a court appointed administrator, similar to Chapter 11 bankruptcy reorganization in the U.S. (for any American ‘Holics who have lasted this far). Creditors reckon they’ll do better that way in the long run than undergoing the costs of a liquidation and risking getting next to nothing from the assets being sold off. If it was a forced liquidation, all the assets would be sold off to clear as much of the debt as possible and the company wound up.
Well after an extensive back-drink I can say that all the members are in fine fettle. Multiple :smilythingies: for Lars, Tabs, H2H, Trev & Hurricane.
For what its worth I hope that AVB does well with the teeny tiny totts. My logic is that what ever they do we will always do better so I hope that they finish in 2nd place in the Premiership!
No seriously. Its seemed that our manager & board (not to mention a few thousand Gooners) got the fright of their lives last season and that is why we are seeing the kind of decisiveness this closed season. Whether we like to admit it or not, it is Tottenham that gets all our blood boiling. Nothing is sweeter to us than seeing them suffer when it all falls apart at the end. That is why St Totteringham Day is so special to us all.
No I want them to do well but fall just short of being better than us…
π
Bounces one off the heel of AVI who has been standing just inside the touchline as he berates the referee before turning back toward the bench. The ball deflects into the path of the onrushing …
H2H who stumbles in from the beer garden falling over the ball which trickles towards…
Lars@74: one big point of brokenness in FIFA’s rankings is that you get zero ranking points if you lose, regardless of the opposition, another is that because the rankings formula is done using rolling 12-month averages, the recentness of tournament games, like the Euros, becomes significant.
Also, if I did the arithmetic correctly using FIFA’s ranking formula, losing to Italy in the Euros in a penalty shoot out, rather than in the game itself, made the difference between England ranking fourth and ranking fifth equal with Portugal, with Italy leaping from sixth to fourth.
Stood up but sat back down as his hoodie is rather challenging to remove..
….who deftly deflects it with his slide rule to….
..fucking hoodie…
help you guys..I . am . having . some . trouble . here..
thanks for nothing you cunts… ok Boss I am ready now..
zico 87, I have just e-mailed a mate who supports East Stirlingshire, and he is also convinced that they will play Rangers next season.
Scottish football nearly scores a goal, extraordinarily.
First touch, top corner … can’t keep a good man down π
Bamm
Predictable goal from GT π―
..and H2H for the runners up prize ..heh π
Well in Tel.
Once again I tabbed it. π
er thanks Ollie .. π
ah well I better get on with my life until time to score the 200 – God this closed season is killing me..
π
zico: “The third option, I was keen to stress yesterday, would inflict massive damage on the whole of the game in Scotland and effectively punish 41 innocent clubs for the misdeeds of one.”
Yeah, right. Short-term, maybe. But not long-term.
And besides, a reformed Rangers starting in the third division would, unless they are run by a bunch of massive cockheads, be back in the SPL in three years and then they can have their cosy little two-team league again.
H2H: interesting thoughts on Village-Idiot. I too am starting to feel that this “he was never given a chance at Chelsea” talk has taken on way too large proportions and doesn’t really work as an excuse more than to a certain extent, as you say it is his bloody job to make the players follow his guidelines and if anyone thinks there aren’t tricky characters at Spurs too I just point you in the direction of Fanny-Fart, Asshole-Risotto, Gallas (if he will still be there) and quite possibly also Bale who last season showed clear signs of believing his own hype a bit too much so he’ll have his work cut out for him there too.
Ned@88: by “they” I do of course mean ManU.
H2H @ #81 – Truly splendid reasoning and very funny to boot. You nailed it! π
Canons @ #48 – Wonder-Paul. I’m sure it’s not the last oppty that we’ll get to laugh at that combo next season.
That’s that then another big player who won’t commit to us,sad..
Not signing a contract then.
http://robinvanpersie.com/2012/07/04/update-for-the-fans/
Well in for the ton, GT. All that guff about the hoodie was clearly some advanced neck stretching warm up routine so you could make that first touch count…
Lars and Various@above: My guess is that Abramovich thought he was getting a more malleable version of Mourinho in AVB, while to Terry and the others in the dressing room, no one could measure up to the original. Abramovich was wrong. The LWCs will prove whether the Chavs were right or not.
The elephant in the room we’ve all been ignoring is now sitting comfily on the sofa with his feet up and his pipe lit, I’m afraid π
http://www1.skysports.com/transfer-centre/clockwatch
Cheers Ned for the explanation re Rangers .
Seems ur hunch was right tabs and also zico,what’s most worrying he doesn’t think he can win trophies with us that’s a kick in balls if ever.
LArs 107: spot on: as usual, you speak for me π
From the man himself …
http://robinvanpersie.com/2012/07/04/update-for-the-fans/
I see links above. Is there still time to kill Darren DEin?
Lars,
The situation is really quite simple: there are rules and to date those who govern them hve tried to suggest that these should be overlooked due to special circumstances.
The fact is that if it were any other club (perhaps bar one), let’s say Hamilton, their arse would have been kicked out, and if they were to reform and reapply for membership, there would be no vote, no debate, just “them’s the rules”.
I woud prefer not to discuss this any further on Goonerholic’s blog, due to the attraction of trolls with the intelligence of a garden fork, and only got drawn in due to tabs asking the question originally, so apologies to all.
Happy to discuss via back channels with anyone though, should they be THAT bored π
SG@110, so the only question is whether RvP goes now or waits out the end of his contract. At least we have a replacement strike force in place. And the announcement explains why we do. It would be nice to dream that RvP at least sees out his last year with us. Perhaps a trophy in 2012-13 might change his mind at the 11th hour.
I guess that link is saturated though, can’t open it.
Seeing as it’s there before on .con, a lot of cuntery at stake.
I’m starting to hate every football player more and more.
Although I can’t open the link so don’t know what he says, but I just don’t like the message.
WEll time to go home, maybe that link will open.
And maybe someone will have shot Darren Dein in the meantime and the message will have changed.
Wow,
That’s that then,
Always a gooner, yeah, fuck off Robin.
The king is dead (again),
I posted a while back that Robin would not renew his contract. I also thought that he would play on and see the final year out.
I am absolutley gutted to be right about the first bit. From reading his official statement, I think the chances of him staying on until the end of next season are remote.
Robin is a wonderful striker (best since Titi) and was a great captain (best since Paddy).
Upset does not even begin to describe it. Laters ‘Holics, I need to compose myself π
Its not about money?
We’ll see.
So we have to keep him at all costs says, AW, so what is the club’s next move then?
The guts of RvP’s post was that there was fundamental disagreement about the direction of the club that came out in the meeting between him, IG and AW before the Euros. He says it was not about the money, which wasn’t discussed in detail. He has decided not to sign an extension to his contract. He will meet IG when he returns from holiday to discuss he what’s next.
Can’t believe money didn’t come into it somewhere. It usually does. But the remarks about the disagreement over the future direction of the club are troubling. The Podolski and Giroud signings show serious intent. There are probably other deals in the works. We all know there are gaps to fill. But beyond new signings, what else could there be that would fall under the rubric of the club’s future direction that RvP would be unhappy with?
It all casts the AW and PHW comments over not selling him in a new light.
So, Robin will not renew his contract after all.
First of all, let me be very clear on one thing: I wanted him to stay.
However, I am not at all convinced that losing him is neccessarily a disaster. We have brought in two new strikers and while there are no guarantees that even one of them will score a decent amount of goals for us, we still have to build a team that will not be as reliant on one goal scorer – and that starts with conceding a lot less than last season. If we don’t then we’d probably be screwed anyway.
All I am now hoping for is that he leaves England, it would hurt too much to see him at another Premier League club.
– to discuss he whatβs next
+ to discuss whatβs next
Ollie – his site is down, I’ll copy the announcement.
I was in the keep him at all costs camp, but I just can’t look at him now.
Can’t look at him.
That is one rude announcement. Who the fuck does he think he is?!?!
Not only does it reek of disrespect, but it also knocks a few million quid off his price.
This is also why I have “99 GUNNERSAURUS” on my Arsenal replica shirt. He’s the only one we can trust not to be sold to a competing team…
This is an update for the fans about my current situation. I have kept quiet all this time out of respect and loyalty for the club and as agreed with Mr. Gazidis and Mr. Wenger, but since there is so much speculation in the media, I think it is fair for you guys to know whatβs really going on at the moment.
As announced earlier this year I had a meeting with the Boss and Mr. Gazidis after the season. This was a meeting about the clubβs future strategy and their policy. Financial terms or a contract have not been discussed, since that is not my priority at all.
I personally have had a great season but my goal has been to win trophies with the team and to bring the club back to its glory days. Out of my huge respect for Mr. Wenger, the players and the fans I donβt want to go into any details, but unfortunately in this meeting it has again become clear to me that we in many aspects disagree on the way Arsenal FC should move forward.
Iβve thought long and hard about it, but I have decided not to extend my contract. You guys, the fans, have of course the right to disagree with my view and decision and I will always respect your opinions.
I love the club and the fans, no matter what happens. I have grown up and became a man during my time with Arsenal FC. Everybody at the club and the fans have always supported me over the years and I have always given my all (and more) on and off the pitch. I am very proud of being part of this fantastic club for the last 8 years.
As soon as Mr. Gazidis is back from his 2-week holiday in America further meetings will follow and I will update you if and when there are more developments.
Robin van Persie
Very often professional sports players sign their biggest contracts once they are past their peak. This happens frequently in professional baseball in the U.S. Players have a career season, then get offered a ginormous new contract, but can not rescale the heights they achieved before. Owners buy for past, not future performance. With RvP’s 2011-12 season, we may have seen him at his peak.
I think it’s pretty disrespectful as well Snir and I think it it has been timed abd worded specifically to antagonise the club, to hasten his departure.
Off you go Robin.
All about the fuckin’ money Im afraid .
His statement as valedictory as it gets.
Sell by auction, reinvest and move on .
In the meantime ,announce new Captain.
Thank you for posting the announcement in its entirety, Snir. If nothing else it sounds like utter disrespect for “Mr. Gazidis” as well as a just vague enough indictment of Arsenal’s current strategy so that all the fans won’t know what to think.
Won’t know what to think other than Mr. van Persie just went one step too far.
Ned@131: I agree with you and forgot to add in my post (but I’ve said it before, I think) that Robin is highly unlikely to ever repeat this past season and the final months of the one before it so even if thing feel a bit shit right now it is entirely possible that in a couple of months we’ll once more sit here and say “that was a great piece of business”. I know that is a very optimistic way of looking at it, but I am and forever will be an optimist. And players come and players go, but the Arsenal remains.
NBN – Player power in the US isn’t as close to what it is in the PL (albeit it does exist somehow, but not as much, just ask Wes Welker).
Zico, Tabs – Not only does antagonize the club but he’s got all the fans on his back now, everybody wants him sold.
If he goes to City, he’s worse than Nasri in my opinion.
Nasri didn’t have 6 seasons on the treatment table, Nasri wasn’t captain, Nasri didn’t need for us to have his back while he was in prison.
It makes no sense idolizing modern footballers. I agree with Snir @128 regarding such announcement. It strikes me as arrogant and thus may enervate our negotiating strength as it relates to selling him. There is no way he can stay at the club now with a statement like that.
It’s also very hard right now for me not to write something that could potentially land me in prison about Darren Dein and his “advice” to players.
I am fucking gutted, I didn’t think I would be but I am.
What a crap Wednesday this has turned out to be π
Well, that’s a bloody shame about van Persie. A couple of thoughts:
i) I don’t understand why anyone should consider it disrespectful to disagree. Thus, why won’t he go into details.
ii) Reading Snir’s reposting of the statement I had the impression that van Persie was addressing “his fans”. I believe that they are few and far between – now, probably fewer and further. The statement will actually be read by Arsenal fans; a very different criterion.
Oh well, water under the bridge; time to move on. I’m with tabs, name the new captain now.
Ambition my ass.
It’s fucking 4th of July. The transfer window has been opened for 3 days.
This announcement reeks of DD writing it, making it impossible for us to keep him.
I’m glad he talked, because I’m no hypocrite and every single one of us wanted Cesc to come out and say something, but not like that.
This is disrespectful, and you know what I feel towards people who disrespect AFC.
Shocking news, and brutally announced. But I am not angry at RVP, not at all.
Fabregas, then Nasri, and now RVP. Bentner and Arshavin will follow. It can’t be that all of them are bad an greedy people, going only for money or glory or whatever.
You can’t blame the players agent(s) also, the player is the one who decides in the end.
There is something rotten in Arsenal FC, that’s for sure.
I have read some pieces in the past, about the way Arsenal FC is managed this last 15 years or so. And I have came to conclusion, maybe naive, maybe a bit rash, that as long that PHW guy is around our club, these things will happen in the future, and we should all be aware of that. What Arsenal FC became in this 6-7 years is firstly a company with economic interests {they sell departments FGS, although having a rich owner(s)}, than a football club. It is all debatable of course, but that is my opinion.
I am not Dein advocate, but I can see him sitting in the armchair, with his drink a cigar, and laughing.
Whatever happens, I see us as a force next year too. With or without RVP, as long as Wenger is there, he will find a way to make us combative and will find a way to make money for the fuc…ng board.
his eyes were always a shade too close for my liking
If the rumors turn out to be true and he did it without notifying the club first, then he’s one hell of a cunt.
Sorry, but he wants selling ASAP after comments like that.
Total lack of respect.
Can’t say I heartbroken – sick of having this drama hanging over the team and a club with our financial limitations (self imposed or not) should not be paying 150k a week to a 29 year old with a injury record longer than my dick.
Take the money, but a couple of players, move on. If van persie wants to play for City then fair enough. He can explain it to his wife and then we’ll see if they’re prepared to hold a place in the team open for him for months on end after he takes the inevitable knock. It will end in tears, which is a great shame. For him.
Nowhere near the blow that losing cesc was, in my view. Big diff between losing a 24 year old future world beater and a 29 year old.
Really shabby way to treat Arsene.
Come on Ivan – get this mess tidied up quick so it doesn’t drag on into August. Likewise Theo – someone needs to drag him into a room, point out the massive faith the gaffer has shown in him and tell him to either sign his new deal or cock off quick smart.
Would love it if the club would now impose a policy that key players with two years left on their deal either sign an extension or leave.
This captain’s curse thing is getting a bit too much now.8 years I think? Since Vieira..Damn
Cba π π π Brilliant !
I’ve always thought the way he flicks forehead sweat away with an inverted thumb rather than the back of his hand to be the act of a ponce and a charlatan.
Anyone who still thinks he won’t be at Shitty this coming season needs their head tested I’m afraid .
Back home. Cheers Snir, I shall read 130 now.
Lurky oliva
Spot on re: Wenger.
I said to the many who doubted us last August that there is only one man whose departure from the club would cause me to shit myself. The man in question is a French genius with even more grey hairs than our grasping wantaway skipper.
He will sort this out and next May we will celebrate yet another season of ramming the critics words back down their throats.
That said, I see absolutely no way we can win the league in the current financial climate. It’s simply too great a handicap to overcome.
I just remembered that we have Walcott talks in the future. Will he sign now, under these conditions? Anyone has an idea? I do.
132 zico indeed.
And the ‘message for the fans’ type of thing.
It really really badly smells of the hand of Dein.
Well, Robin, never thought I’d say that, but I think you’re a cunt.
I shall of course, stay away from tweeter even more than usual π
tabs, there really only is one place he can go because neither Real nor Barca want him and then it’s bascially only the oily money at City left.
I still have a very remote hope that he’ll leave the country but quite frankly I’d be very surprised if that happened.
Ah, fuck it. Let’s go bowling.
Any chance someone hacked his web page and twitter? If not then this is absolutely shocking. Not that he decided to leave but that he would announce it in this manner or with the excuse that the club isn’t ambitious enough. A slap in the face really from a player who could have become a legend if he had led the team back to glory as captain. Either way if this is true then there is no way he should be forced to see out his contract. Sell him and give the captaincy to TV or Arteta.
Very disappointed to hear this, but I respect him for making his position clear and giving the club time to do the necessary in the remainder of the transfer window.
Two other points:
I agree with the view that its almost certain that he will never come close to repeating his form of the last year, and so hopefully we will get a fee that will look like very good business a year on from now.
I think he is probably speaking the truth when he says that his prime motivation is to win some silverware, not get more money. It’s 7 years since we won anything and I don’t see this drought ending anytime soon.
How on earth does he want us to strengthen more than we have already by the 3rd day of the transfer window.
It seems to me that this was never about ambition and he just waited till Podolski was on the .com
Also, I get the feeling, AW told him to shut up and play his last year because there is no way he’d be sold so he’s forcing his way out.
Classy, real classy.
Really enjoying the online reaction I’m seeing from Gooners.
Most appear to be quite prepared for him to leave but annoyed by the statement, which is about right in my view.
Eighteen months ago I heard fans saying he should be sold as he was never fit. In 18 months time he’ll be all but forgotten and the press will be telling us we’d be nothing without Jack and the Ox. Sunrise, sunset.
We improved last season without Cesc and the chinless wonder. We can improve next season without Van Persie. Let’s just get our shopping done a bit earlier this time.
Not even going to bother dissecting his statement. It’s the usual self-justificatory bullshit from another footballing merc.
Yes, the club has things it needs to sort out, but today’s not the day to worry about that. Today’s the day to usher Van Persie towards the exit and tell him not to let the door hit him on the arse as he passes through it.
COYG
Already starting to feel better about this, to be honest. I can’t say I’m particularly angry at Robin, a bit sad that he is leaving – yes, angry – no.
N7 – Agree with every word .
I’m furious at him.
It’s rude in the extreme.
Releasing a statement without your club knowing .
Releasing a statement which forces us to sell, and more importantly at a lower price.
Releasing a statement 3 days into the transfer window when all he talked about was ambition.
He can do one.
Well, go fly away Robin, you’ll never have it as good as you had it with us.
I’m not angry or hurt in the slightest, I’d already had him down for leaving when the contract wasn’t signed before the Euros.
If he doesn’t believe the club are trying to match his ambitions then it’s his right to move on, we should accept his decisiion, thank him for last year and wish him all the best for the future…..
Unfortunatly fandom doesn’t work like that and many will feel betrayed. I just think it’s a shame it all had to end like this but on the other hand no matter what he would of said wouldn’t really of mattered as long as the fans knew he was off.
Like Lars, I just hope he leaves the PL. I’d rather take the 8mill from Juve then 20mill+ from the Middle Eastlands.
There will be time enough to get angry when he waltzes out at Eastlands.
Can we just kick the next bastard who “loves the club, loves the fans….”
Because as sure as eggs is eggs, he’s probably just another cunt…
Evening Holics
Just caught up with the RVP news. We can’t afford to have another Captain in situ in his final season, experience of the recent past says RVP must leave this Summer for as much as we can extract from City or whoever and appoint TV5 in his place.
I am not surprised at this turn of events but am dreadfully disappointed. Our Club has backed him during his lean spells and lengthy periods on the side lines due to injury . Loyalty to Arsene would have put him amongst the legends , now he will be seen in the same light as the despicable little Frenchman, as another mercenary out for what he can get.
The chances of lightning striking twice with another remarkable scoring season , without a spell out with injury, are IMHO zero! Lets all move on .
As always COYRs
I have said before, and i see no reason to change it;
Stay, and you are a legend in the making.
Go, and you were just another player.
So, see ya! DonΒ΄t hurry back.
Whatever. We move on.
For the record, I said at the end of the season RvP could leave with my respect because (unlike Nasri) he demonstrated his worth on the pitch.
However, I didn’t think that Van Persie was either stupid enough to act like this, or duplicitous enough to be manipulated like this, and that’s why I’m angry.
Wenger has a difficult enough job with the hard of thinking over at Le Groan etc, without being undermined further by someone he has shown such faith and loyalty to.
Fucking gutted.
But, I agree with a lot of what’s said above. Sell him, to the highest bidder
Christ, and to think that only this morning I was trying to get a handle on the Rangers situation.
Geez, who gives a f*ck about them really.
Lars 154, he could go to PSG π
http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/club-statement-robin-van-persie
N7 158: great post, thank you Sir.
Snir: give some of your anger to Darren Dein too.
RvP’s last season at Arsenal would be worse than Adebayor’s. He’d be booed like crazy after this statement.
Ollie – I’ve got plenty of anger towards that cunt, but seeing that RvP is a family man, and not a kid looking to get his big move, I was expecting a bit more from him.
Arsenal’s response is weak. Once again the PR department caught on the hop .
Mark Gonnella confirms that Ivan Gazidis is not on holiday.
RvP – Go fuck yourself. Lying tit.
Very true Snir 174. I had a lot of time for RvP, I kind of trusted him.
tabs: Arsenal’s response is normal.
They got caught completely unaware by the statement while all probably on holidays (notice how it’s Ken Friar who did the pics with Podolski).
They just HAD to put something out, but wouldn’t surprise me if a lengthier statement comes out.
Don’t think you can beat them with that stick. It was either this or nothing at all. For all I know, it might have been Djourou or the tea lady who had to write the statement.
SG@137: depends how you define player power. Collectively players in the U.S. major leagues are more powerful than in the EPL. Individually they probably aren’t, except when one wants to leave a club, it is hard to prevent them doing so as the EPL is not a near-national cartel like MLB, NBA and the rest.
N7G@146, LO@151: without RVP, Theo might well clear off. I am not sure that would be a wholy bad thing. After six seasons, is he really the top, top player he promised to be when he joined from Southampton? Play Gervais on the right, LuLuLu on the left and Giroud down the middle and there is plenty of speed there; perhaps even a decent final ball or two, too.
I would like RvP to come out and say where he disagrees with the club “on the way Arsenal FC should move forward”. It shows no respect to the fans to say he won’t go into details. If there is more to it that buy player X or sell player Yβand I would understand keeping those details confidentialβit would be a healthy conversation to have. Is it the governance of the club? The commercial and sponsorship strategy? Training and player development? Coaching and tactics?
Or was it just his agent putting words in his mouth, and the only disagreement was over the club’s pay structure, and particularly his cut of it?
Was the club’s statement written by the random platitude generator?
He’s indubitably going to the Etihad as he’ll not move to the Italian League .The Spanish teams don’t seem interested. I don’t ever want to hear this ridiculous cliche about loving the club and the fans from another modern day footballer. It’s bullshit.
Ok – Unpopular post alert.
I hate Nasri, I hate him a lot. But at least he shut the fuck up enough time for us to get 25m.
RvP’s statement limits our negotiating power and we’ll get 15m tops.
I also feel, that RvP came out with this statement because of AW’s “we must keep Van Persie at all costs” in his Eurosport blog.
The club responded to his response.
Will he respond? Hmmm.
This could get interesting, and messy.
Ollie – Gazidis is not on holiday, Mark Gonnella (head of communications at AFC) confirmed that, so RvP is a lying tit.
This shows two things, firstly either RVP is a lying manipulative mercenary like so many to leave us recently
or
Arsene Wenger is a lying untouchable manager who has become bigger than the club he represents.
Either way is anybody really surprised by this?
Evening all. What a strange day indeed.
From the comments above and on Twitter, I think I may be in a minority here, but hereβs what I think, having re-read what is clearly a very carefully written statement.
I donβt think for a second RVP is having a go at Arsene Wenger. In fact he refers to him as βthe Bossβ, and later on refers to having βhuge respect for Mr Wengerβ.
I think his real target is Voldemort and the Board, who were pointedly not included in the “huge respect” sentence. And if he is accusing them of a lack of ambition I entirely agree with him. PHWβs fatuous statements, and Gazidisβ endlessly smug self-congratulation have become rather irritating. Of course we all want a club that is financially stable and will endure. But I think weβd all rather have one that can win things occasionally.
Last summer Arsene gave the distinct impression of a man at loggerheads with his Board colleagues, and Iβm fairly sure they were briefing against him in a big way. When he said he could write a book about what happened, I donβt doubt it. Iβm fairly sure that if Arsene is under instructions to make Β£40million before heβs even allowed to start spending on new players (as I believe he said earlier this year β apologies but the ailing memory is failing and I havenβt gone back to check) then heβs really being given a shit deal which is neither fair, nor visionary. And itβs certainly not what I would personally associate with anything like βambitionβ, particularly in the ugly face of the petro-dollared and financially doped world of the Premier League.
Dein senior is alleged to be a great friend of Wenger. And whatever one thinks of his unctuous son, he has certainly done his bit to ensure the Boss has a few quid in the back bin from player sales to help his Β£40m pre-season target. Of course I donβt know, but I certainly suspect which side the pair of them are on.
So rather than seeing it as RVP disrespecting the club, I think heβs giving a massive two fingers to the people who have been making the Bossβ life so difficult. After all, what have the Wenger-Dein axis got to lose by starting a war with Board? If they force the Boardβs hand, the Boss gets his way and RVP stays, we have a pretty effective striker who knows the club. And if RVP goes, weβre quids in.
Let battle commence π
NBN – What does he expect? Having us buy a trophy and sink into debt, while we are repaying a stadium?
Yesterday, we saw what could happen when debts go out of control.
I knew he was not re-signing (without wishing to come over all Mystic FunGunner on your asses, I had one of my prophetic dreams two months ago) but hoped I was wrong. Now that it has happened, I am in the sell-him-and-be-done-with-it camp. He obviously doesn’t want to be here, so let’s take the money. That may be an over-emotional first reaction but not only is that statement of his arrogant, there is something gratuitously offensive about the fact that he couldn’t even let the club issue a joint statement with him. As for matching his ambitions, puh-lease. Get over yourself. Arsene: A football club works best when everyone does his own job and no-one else’s.
@ tabs
I don’t think the club’s response is weak, we’re just too classy to sink to his level. Most important thing at this stage is not to say anything which could come back to bite them, I feel.
My worry is that Theo and Song will not extend, now. Or that Podolski/Giroud will start to have doubts. Is that unnecessarily pessimistic?
RVP always had this speak-what-I-want-don’t-care-about-others street urchin streak. As much as polishing the player, Arsene had polished the person into the respectable, and even sometimes classy, persona. But the lure of easy money and easy glory is as hard to resist to him as to the rest of us.
Not for a moment I buy into this ‘ambition’ thing. RVP has enough intelligence to realize that Arsenal doesn’t and cannot operate like buy-trophy-at-all-costs clubs, the ranks of which now include the petrodollar fueled obscene nouveau riche.
I think RVP has been played, so to speak. He didn’t want to sign as double his wages and almost guarantee of a few trophies in other clubs (read Manchester City) wait for him. And as Arsenal were initially rejecting the paltry price quotes for him some ‘well-wisher’ wanted to make things easy for the bidding club. RVP might himself be feeling morally ‘whole’ expressing his righteous dissatisfaction, but I think the sentiments themselves and the manner in which they were expressed were born of ideas planted in his head.
And I won’t be surprised if another once-great-Arsenal-captain had played his part. He needs to earn his keep, we should do well to remember.
Bye bye Robin, you will not be missed.
And Arsene should really reevaluate the role of player loyalties in his managerial approach and make it more of a stick-and-carrots. A rather quotidian and vulgar approach, but surely this loyalty bit has been amply demonstrated to be more dysfunctional in today’s climate and culture than worth the effort.
Snir, I don’t think this statement makes the slightest bit of difference to how much money we might get for him. Clubs who were/are interested (OK, ManCity) already knew he was leaving anyway because that parasite Darren Dein will have let them know weeks ago. I would almost be willing to bet that Man City knew about this statement coming out before it was published.
Can I sign a pact with Dr Faustus?
@ snowy
I really can’t agree with most of that. And as for Dein doing AW a favour by making him money, we had to sell Cesc at a cut price and RvP will now surely go for less than he would have, or nothign at all next year. In any case, which would AW rather have, the player in whom he has invested 8 years, or the money?
@ Lars
“I would almost be willing to bet that Man City knew about this statement coming out before it was published.”
That is a horrible thought, but you could be right.
I wonder if post 200 will now go completely unnoticed π
Lars 187 I suspect you are very right.
Lars – That makes it even worse, cause AFC surely didn’t know about it.
The way he worded that statement is disgusting.
He’s like a little kid that’s running away because they won’t run the club he wants to run it.
Fuck off.
Fun, Ollie ,
Sorry but just don’t buy it. So some people are on holiday – so what, Arsenal are a massive corporation – deal with it .
Make it clear what price you’ll sell at and to whom you’ll sell, make it clear the Club were not told RVP was going to release this statement, make it clear that the Club feels let down by his action, make it clear a new Captain will be appointed.
Make it clear you are proactive rather than reactive.
Snowy,
Great post and interesting take on events. However, even if RVP wants to get involved in the Boardroom battle (which I doubt – he just wants more cash), AW would have to come out against the Board to provoke a War. Nothing that he has done or said since Dein was ousted suggests to me he will do so.
Theo, Arsenal career stats: goal every 5.2 games; assist every 5.5 games
Arshavin, Arsenal career stats: goal every 4.3 games, assist every 3.8 games.
Just saying.
snowy@183: Though I agree with Arsene-vs-board dynamics in terms of player spending, I don’t think RVP has done Arsene any favor with his comments. I think the reality is Arsenal cannot compete financially with at least three clubs in PL now: Man U, Man City and Chelsea. Board may be overly conservative — and if I read some of the old-timers correctly, Arsenal board has always been overly conservative in financial matters — but we cannot even begin to complete with Man C and Chelsea especially in direct wage or transfer fee biddings.
What we can do is what Arsene has done: buy intelligently and grow from within as much as we can. Is it coincidental that RVP’s disillusion with Arsenal’s ambition happen to coincide with the only full season he played (yes, what a fucking brilliant season he had) for us? He didn’t have these doubts and qualms before? Really? And how would he have liked when in all his years of injuries instead of taking care of him Arsene sold him back to Feynoord (if they wanted him back, which was doubtful) or some Turkish club?
Let us just get one thing straight: if someone is offered nearly the double of his salary, and this is the last big paycheck he can get, and without having to put too much in the field a few trophies are guaranteed, then why won’t a footballer take this deal? He is an athlete, and he is not going to have such a high paid job 5-6 years from now.
I am sure RVP looked at Clichy and Toure — they were close friends — and realized that he is missing out on the gravy train in more ways than one.
That is fine. I just wish it was sorted in a manner that helped us get more money out of him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nPE1UtQLDE
That’s what you are to me.
Ungrateful tit.
Snowy, I really don’t buy this “Arsene is at loggerheads with the board” story?
Why doesn’t he just quit then? From what I gather, everyone at the club including IG acknowledge that the club will go balls up if Arsene were to leave – so why would they restrict Arsene from running the club like he wants?
I just don’t buy it
@ tabs
They have said that they expect him to stay and play.
“β¨β¨We have to respect Robin’s decision not to renew his contract. Robin has one year to run on his current contract and we are confident that he will fulfil his commitments to the Club.
“We are planning with ambition and confidence for next season with Arsenal’s best interests in mind.”
They are not going to sell him. He will have to face the fans and man up.
Oh shoot ffs… π
Cheeky back heel.
Damn you, GT. Well, I claim the unintentional assist – ball bounced of the back of my head as I was tying my shoelaces.
What are we all worried about – let’s replace RvP with top scorer GoonerTerry!
Who got 200?
I was reading the posts, my last refresh had 199 as I realise now.
*drum rolls*
Hahaha, can’t believe GT got it.
Snir, it doesn’t mean RvP knew that City knew. And it still won’t affect the amount money we can get for him in any significant way.
I have to say that I can’t shake the feeling that RvP has more or less been played by Darren Dein here. First and foremost, I find it very hard to believe that he wrote that statement himself and I’m not sure he really understood what kind of reaction it would provoke. Cunts like Dein don’t give a shit about the player, they just want the money they can generate for them.
FunG, careful: a few more goals like that and GT will ask to be transferred to Le Grove.
.. back eel more like FG…
Oh didn’t you get the Memo? All centuries are GoonerTerry’s today sorry luv
π
@ Harsha
I agree – moreover, although there may be occasional friction or arguments about details, on the basic principles of running a club, you couldn’t slide a cigarette paper between AW and the board. AW is SK’s hero, fgs.
Snowy, I think that AW statement is much misquoted. It was that the club has to make Β£15m-20m of operating profit to cover its debt before it has a penny to spend on players or anything else, not that he has a quota to make on his transfer dealings.
You make a good point about AW and the board, though.
Baup to replace Deschamps at Marseille.
Bah, cunt. Can’t believe how many players/managers who had success at Bordeaux eventually go to Marseille.
I know there’s a few who have done the road the other way too.
FG @189 sorry to disagree but Cesc was only going one place and that affected his transfer price more than his agent. I’m sure his agent would have wanted more and an accordingly larger fee for himself. And Dein certainly did OK with Clichy and Na$ri.
And I’m sure AW would want the player, but he’s not exactly irreplaceable. If $hitteh are doing this to drive down the price for RVP, all that will do is resurrect interest from clubs who may currently think they’ve been priced out up until now, and push the bidding back up.
After all, he is only worth what someone is willing to pay.
Yep NBN 209, that’s how I read it, also when I read it quoted in French (or was it a video interview).
Fun ,
Sorry but completely disagree. They have not said they will hold him to his contract next season. Indeed they have been very careful not to do so.
Instead they have said that he will “fulfil his commitments to the club”.
This is much vaguer, deliberately so.
In fact it could mean anything , from a coded warning not to go on strike to turning up for pre-season training.
Depending on how this pans out, RVP may yet play for us in August a la Nasri, but there is no chance he will still be with us when the transfer window closes.
Snir, I would recommend you look at humanity through a more cynical lens and you will be less hurt. π
You might find it shocking but most people have a price for everything they think they own, including themselves.
RVP saga would be repeated again in the coming years. I think the trick Arsenal should now use is not to wait for the last year but sign a renewal two years ahead, like what we did for TV5? Song should be very much in that target now as he has two more years to go.
I suspect Theo’s renewal would play out more interestingly now. In one hand, Arsene can throw him ‘sure, Theo, you will play centrally now and then, why not?’ bit, but whether that compensates for the gap in his wage that the other ‘big’ London club is offering is a different question.
GoonerTerry, you are one sneaky adopted Yaadie. Lol!
Dr. Faustus – I’m a fatalist. I love dearly and hate with a passion.
Can’t change now, eh?
Lars – I give Van Persie a bit more credit than to be completely fooled by Darren Dein. Dein must be smart, but Van Persie is no fool.
This was completely thought out by Van Persie.
This has made it easier to get over him, funnily enough. There’s nothing special about him, he has proved. He’s trying to demonise the board or the club to justify himself.
@ tabs
no, I think it is saying, you are stayign come what may (“one year to run on his current contract”) and what’s more we expect you to give your all (“confident he will fulfill his commitments”).
Anyway, we’ll see in a bit, won’t we?
As for there not being room for a cigarette paper between Arsene and the Board (and by that I mean IG ), one only has to look at last summer’s shenanigans to see that they were constantly and surreptitiously briefing against each other.
Room for one of those duty free bumper packs of fags I’m afraid.
snowy, don’t forget Darren Dein was involved with Cesc at this point too π
July 4th Independence Day…but Robin, you’re not American (big sigh). So just this morning Arseblog wrote “Emotional investments in footballers is a dangerous thing…leads to disappointment and dismay”. Dreaded that this day should come, not just because of RVP. It’s all of YOU, your reactions, feelings, etc. Remember how most of you felt about Robin this past season…and now it has been reduced to this awful discussion of cutting our losses and ‘see ya’. Believe it or not I’m teary eyed…no place for sentimental fool like me.
@ Dr Faustus –
I think the trick Arsenal should now use is not to wait for the last year but sign a renewal two years ahead, like what we did for TV5?
we tried, but he wouldn’t do it. Same with Nasri. It’s not just up to us, remember.
@ snowy
regardless, AW would in all cases have preferred not to sell.
@ GT
No, I did not get any effing memo and I was hugely excited at the prospect of scoring my maiden goal.
How are we supposed to keep up with the rhythm of posting?
All to the Happy Train!
@ tabs
What were they saying about each other?
Lars 205 is also on the money (sorry if backdrinking is in a random order, every time I post, there have been many more posts I didn’t see, even before a previous post from me!)
STOP!
Fun @217, why not be more specific then, if that’s what they meant ? Statement is deliberately vague and in my view obtuse.
AFC know he’s going , and in my view , have known for some considerable time.
Statement, however, is vague enough for some fans to continue to bury their head in the sand π
NED: I thought that we had put that one to bed long ago – thanks for setting the record straight again!
Funny Snir and I discussed this very same possibility long into the night last night on Facebook and I was the one being Mr Angry and he was channeling Mr reasonable! What the fuck happened Snir?
Look this is how it should be after all: Don’t believe in the club? Move the fuck on. All star players get to this point (all except Dennis) – the feel that they know more than the manager. TH14, Paddy, Freddie all thought they could run the club better than Le Boss… RvP should just go now IMO..
The real problem is of course is that we don’t / should not want to sell to City and Juve will ‘low ball’ us like Barca did with Cesc. Hold him for a year and risk him stinking the entire place out. He has a strong personality and won’t keep quiet like Cesc. Le Boss will have earned his salary if he can resolve this one I tell you..
π
@ tabs
and I did say they must have disagreements as well. But they agree on the fundamentals, don’t you think?
Some people seem to think Darren Dein isn’t behind this as he woulda been more quiet and sly about it.
Feels like I have been kicked in my balls.
But we shall move on..
abb why are you ab b now?
Statement, however, is vague enough for some fans to continue to bury their head in the sand π
heh, very true tabs!
@ tabs
Ah well, I don’t think it’s that vague, just carefully worded. It does also leave open the possibility that RvP might end up signing. Unlikely, I know, but look at what Rooney did and said and what happened in the end? The statement is like an adult not reacting to a stroppy teenager.
GT good point: Dennis.
He’s the only shirt name I shall always be wearing with pride.
Maybe in the future I’ll just wait until players announce retirement in their last season with the club to accept to wear the name.
Actually, still happy about my Rosicky shirt, even if he departs at the end of next season.
@Snowy 183
“Last summer Arsene gave the distinct impression of a man at loggerheads with his Board colleagues, and Iβm fairly sure they were briefing against him in a big way. When he said he could write a book about what happened, I donβt doubt it. Iβm fairly sure that if Arsene is under instructions to make Β£40million before heβs even allowed to start spending on new players (as I believe he said earlier this year β apologies but the ailing memory is failing and I havenβt gone back to check) then heβs really being given a shit deal which is neither fair, nor visionary. ”
I don’t buy that for one second. Arsene is too clever and too proud to let anyone get away with that. The board, for all their faults, have also never contradicted Arsene in public. On the contrary, they’ve always given him an unconditional backing.
The RvP saga wounds deeply and unlike the Cesc situation, we’re being played by a number of people here, but we can only speculate who. That statement is designed to do weaken Arsenal’s bargaining position and place the Club on the defensive with respect to the fans and other clubs.
If we’re being cynical, we can pin this saga onto Dein, Citeh or some other external party.
At the end of the day though, this is flat-out betrayal and the worst possible thing anyone could do to Arsenal. Even Adebayor and Nasri, in all their posturing, didn’t go this far. I hope Arsenal have the guts to sell him. I don’t want to see him in our colours again and I don’t want him to set foot inside our beautiful ground, and I certainly don’t want the man who built him into what he is now to have to face him.
Cesc left with respect and goodwill. This guy pissed on the very Club that made him who he is. No one should be allowed to disrespect Arsenal in such a way.
Good spot, Ollie. I think it’s because Nurse is a broken woman.
Tabs @ 194 β thanks, but Iβm not sure contractually AW would be able to be so open. However I do hope he is briefing like mad behind the scenes, and doing a better job than last summer.
Faustus @ 196 β fair points. And I wouldnβt criticise RVP for doubling his salary either. Iβd rather he did it at Arsenal though, although Iβm fairly sure he wonβt be able to. Everyone has a price, Iβm sure his (whether itβs trophies or Β£200k a week) will have been tabled. Itβs up to the club to decide what they do with that.
Harsha @ 198 β I donβt think itβs in his nature to quit. Although I have a suspicion he might if pushed far enough, and as has been said before by many of us, thatβs the one departure from the club that would really have us in pieces.
NBN @ 209 β sorry to have mis-remembered the detail. But I did get a sense at the time that he did rather sound like he was (voluntarily or not) talking like he was taking that burden on his shoulders, and I think I quite disapproved of him having to do so.
Ollie @ 219 β yep I remember :-s β heβs a charmer isnβt he? But if not him, then thereβs dozens like him. Vultures the lot of them. And whichever agent he had, Cesc was only going one way.
Whatever happens, Iβd just like to say I hope AW gets his way. And for Gazidis to f*ck off and paint fences for a living.
Have we signed Bevin yet?
GT – That announcement pressed all the wrong buttons for me.
Fun @223,
Ok you’re testing my failing memory, but a couple of examples off the top of my head .
-AW stated that we could not expect to be considered a big Club if we sold both Fab and Nasri . Result – Nasri sold by board intervention.
-IG Consistently stated that AW had money to spend but chose not to spend it. I leave it to you to decide on the truth of that statement when AW has consistently maintained that he has to make money before selling.
Just a couple of examples but there were plenty of others .
@FunGunner
“They are not going to sell him.”
This is Arsenal we are talking, We will sell him of course. What do you expect they should write, that we are selling him?
And to all people who moan at the reduced price we are going to sell him, I am amazed. They (not just Arsenal, but all clubs) made us all worrying about the price THEY are going to sell or buy. And we bought that idea, like it is our money. I refuse to buy that anymore.
For many fans the season starts when the transfer window starts. Is that football? They do not even watch games. They wonder who is next we are going to buy or sell, and AT WHAT PRICE. Like it matters. So, RVP, or whoever, goodbye, you left as you came.
Wow, this is moving too fast for my typing skills ! π
Just cannot see Arsene and the board not knowing about this statement at all, they had the discussions before the Euro’s and would have known his stance then. With the situation being as it is, the board and Arsene knew they had a player itching to leave and would have had to actually demonstrate a complete lack of ambition by putting him on the market in order to realise any value for him, this way they save face by not doing so and RVP (minus the adulation of fans, like he gives a toss) gets his move away.
Just a thought….
tabs, I’ve given up on the arses today (not just because of the pace, but because there were some ridiculous people), but yeah, the drinks are too fast now.
I am feeling drunk just from the fumes.
Hi holics. I was awakened from my annual (Rip Van Winkle like) summer slumbers by my good friend Asia alerting me to the fact that RVP was likely to be ORFT (off). I couldn’t resist a mid-slumber rambles. With apologies, here it is. See y’all in August!
Robin On The Ropes. The Van Per$ie of 2012?
So, Robin Van Persie has decided not to renew his contract. And, of-course, itβs got nothing to with money. Thatβs a surprise (not). Nor does deoxyribonucleic acid appear to be part of the putrid placenta potion. So whatβs the root cause of this rambling robin rumble from rollypolderland?
Ah β winning things. Shiny silver stuff that he and his many predecessors have been unable to do in the last few years, because they been too busy farting off elsewhere, to do so β but never for the money you understand, only for the glory. Thereβs a lot of iron(y) in that silver laden metallurgical logic, isnβt there?
So whatβs a young Arsene to do? Heβs been around this same track with relentless monotony over the past several seasons. His Addidas pumps must be worn right down to the rubber on his Bugatti rims by now.
The good book (Soccernomics) proclaims that the winners in the long term are not the teams who pay the most for players. The teams who pay to retain their best players are most frequently the winners. Arsenal have either a) not read the book b) read it but donβt buy in or c) read it, buy in, but canβt afford to pay the pipers, who then go off and play merry tunes for teams who can and do.
There are some signs that Arsenalβs woeful commercial wazards are getting their act together, but patently, far too late to βsaveβ Robin. Likewise, the much criticized salary structure would appear to be getting a re-tool, but again, too late to influence the brush strokes around this Dutch Master.
So, back to Arsene and his options. They appear to be twofold.
Option 1 : Risk is with you Mr Persie.
This requires Arsene to play hard ball of the type that heβs never had the sang froid (or support?) to do before. It requires a hearty βThanks, Robin, youβve just saved us 5 million on a signing on fee and 4 million on salary increase for next season. Youβll be in our pool for the whole season, but youβll be rotating with Giroud, Poldi and Afobe who (with Joel Campbell) are the future of our striking force.β (Readers may wish to add A.N. Other procured by combining 8M saved on RVP with 8M for Bendy and 4M for Vela – 20M)
Robin can play out the season and with a very fair chance of winning something at Arsenal. His pay packet will be lighter. He likely wonβt start as many games but will still be really useful when heβs on the field. Heβs not the kind of guy to sulk. IF heβs lucky, he wonβt be injured seriously and see his future income disappear as he plays out his final years with Stirling Albion.
If heβs really lucky, heβll have a good season (unlikely to better last) and heβll still have some suitors for his talents as a just-sub-thirty ageing striker. Itβs not likely that the incentives will reach 250k per week. Indeed, they may not even reach Arsenalβs reported offer of 150k. And itβs unlikely that there will be a rich signing-on bonus as a sweetener. If heβs really lucky, Arsene may keep the 150k salary on offer for another 2,3, or 4 years at The Emirates. Without bonus, of-course.
Option 2 : Arsenal Wins
Arsenal βhype the holy sh*tβ out of the βmiracle that is Robin Van Persieβ the hottest property in the European game (in terms of availability this summer).
All the usual suspects who are prepared to buy titles or cheat their way to glory need to be fluffed up. Barca, RM, Shitty, Manure, Chelski, Juventus (are they back in Italyβs first Div yet?), the Milanese and, of-course PSG, the noveau riche (courtesy of the Milk Shake of Qatari Qatore). Let them have a feeding fest of orgasmic proportions. There are nutters out there (A pantomime horse called Andy Cap Carrol sold for 35M in very recent memory, and a hapless Torres for even more).
Arsenalβs motivation should be to leverage the bejesus out of this deeply indebted brigade and return the best cash or cash plus player swap they can manage. Robin can go off and, hopefully, disappoint in the manor of Toure, Adebayor, Hleb, Nasri, Flamini, Carrol, Torres, Aquilani, and others who have sunk below the depths of memory.
With the combination of 35M from Cesc and similar for Robin, Arsene should add two to three younger world-class godlings. They are likely to provide a better return post-2014 than Robin Van Persie.
But all of this fancy footwork can ONLY be worthwhile if Arsenalβs deadbeat commercial men can improve substantially the revenue stream from that side of the business. If they canβt, the Soccernomicsβ βmust pay to retainβ mantra will never be embedded in Emirates architecture and this annual fiasco of our best players leaving β but not for more money, you understand- will continue unabated.
My heart says Option 1. My head says OPtion 2. Whatever, I’m happy as long as Arsene is around to make all of this stuff good. When he refuses to extend his contract, I WILL be troubled.
ZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
That post is long enough to kill anybody’s posting ‘ambitions’ now, BtM.
But I shall try and read it.
I’m now coming round to the idea of keeping him, sans armband, obviously. I agree that it is likely that his lack of commitment would ultimately affect his perfomances, but professional pride would take him to a certain level. We might get six decent months out of him while OG and LP bed in. I quite like the idea of using him like that. And then out the door he goes.
This has a 07-08 feel to it. Perhaps it’s for the best.
The team had no WC stars in it after TH left, and it responded by playing great until that game in Birmingham.
Fun @227 – yes probably, though I think AW must be becoming disheartened at losing his best players on an annual basis. My guess, and it is only a guess, is that there is little love lost between AW and IG . Strength of Arsene’s relationship with Dein Senior should not be underestimated and we all know who he works for.
Usmanov, it seems , quite happy to play the long game, and the sale of players like RVP intensifies the pressure on the present Board. Arsene stuck somewhere in the middle.
Fun @232- Sometimes a stroppy teenager needs a beating , as Sir Red Nose administered to Rooney.
Snowy @236 – Arsene cannot ,as you say, come out in the open. Not convinced however that any amount of briefing will dislodge the present stasis- two billionaires warily stalking each other- that grips the Club.
@ tabs
I have no doubt that the board/SK wanted to sell the pair from the start, but we don’t know that AW was forced – he could have come round to their point of view. He had a massive emotional and time investment to get over first. But that’s not briefing against someone, as I understand it.
Regarding the money, I recall AW himself saying in a presser that he had the money but he couldn’t find the quality in the PL (talking about defenders, this was). Also on the the sell-to-buy thing, are you referring to the remarks about us having to make the “mortgage payments” every year?
tabs, I thought Usmanov and Dein had severed ties some time ago?
If it was Star Trek all this could be solved by adding a few additional dilithium crystals……..
At least I think that was what BtM was trying to say…..
Still waiting on a response to my last e-mail btw maestro π
Still haven’t read all the posts yet, but let me just add a few things.
We did fine for 125 years without him (counting one injury-free season he had), we did fine with him on the injury list for 7 years, we will do fine with or without him this coming season. If anything, I fear for the psychological blow RVP’s statement and inevitable leaving will have on our players. For this I am truly gutted.
In any case, if we can survive THE LEGEND TH14 leaving, and subsequently almost winning the PL title the following season, I think we will manage without our club captain for one year. Podolski is twice the player RVP was 3 years ago (atleast in international caps and goals), Giroud has a title and topscorer achievement in his belt at 25 years of age, what did RVP have 3 years ago aside from an injury list longer than anyone barring Diaby, and an undiminishing trust from Le Boss that he would eventually spit at? I’m frustrated at his announcement, but anyways let’s get behind the players who want to wear our red and white jersey.
If AW can mould RVP into the player he is today, surely he is capable of making even better players from what he has at his selection now at AFC. I’ll just hope Mancheater Shit is properly controlled by the FA in time to not steal away our future gem.
Blimey this is all going far too quickly to keep up…
Tabs/FG – am liking the stroppy teenager analogy. I think the club with their rather weak statement has just been ‘Mum’, in the manner of telling RVP to ‘just you wait until your father gets home’.
‘Father’ of course, now being … Bouldy! If RVP’s not out the door, the first pre-season training session should be fun. I hope it involves a damn good slippering π (you can take the man out of Stoke, but you can’t…etc etc)
@ snowy
ha
I still don’t see it as weak, though – Supernanny always says that the parent stays calm, makes clear what is going to happen, and follows through. They’ve done the first two, we’ll see if they do the third.
Right, I don’t think there’s much more new to be said or read on the RvP topic tonight, the post-rate is still waaaaaaaaaaaaay too high, and as any sort of pun-fest seems unlikely, I shall log off.
Congrats to GoonerTerry for posts 300,400 and 500, and goodnight all.
FG @ 253 – hahaha! RVP’s not the messiah – he’s…on the naughty step!
Ollie @249, Dein no longer has an official titular role for R&W, but there’s no question he is still an unofficial spokesman for them. Saw an SSN interview with him at start of summer. Usual shit. “Arsenal have no ambition if they sell RVP blah blah blah”. Then proclaimed he was on the “subs bench” if required . Wanker.
BTM – 2nd option all the way . Make him stay and we spend the whole season in transition, and are fodder for the tabloids on a weekly basis .
Fun – Don’t agree . AW an intelligent man , there is a reason behind all his public pronouncements, especially one as strong as that one.As an employee that is as strong as he can get without provoking all out civil war .
As regards the money, seems to me you can’t have it both ways. Arsene says he hasn’t got enough, IG says he has. Both have maintained their respective positions. Whilst AW supports the self-sustaining model, there is no reason why he shouldn’t think that that template could still make more money available.
Wasn’t really referring to the mortgage payments per se, more the constant refrain albeit in coded terms that AW cannot really do any better given the massive wealth available elsewhere.
Anyway, got to make some dinner, offski.
Any chance of RVP doing a 180 a la Rooney with the ManCity saga? And any chance of us Gooners accepting RVP back into our fandom?
@ tabs
But I heard AW say he DID have enough money – plus he has always said that a manager’s job is to make the best use of whatever the bosses give him. But just to be clear, were you talking about the statement about making Β£15m-Β£20m to pay the mortgage?
I really feel this AW/Board split thing is a false trail – why do you feel that IG and AW don’t get along? I’ve seen them sitting next to one another at games when AW had a touchline ban and the body language seemed good to me.
@ tabs
Sorry, I see you answered the bit about the mortgage payments.
But on the point about AW complaining about the massively wealthy clubs, IG says the same thing, and that can’t be a complaint against the board because AW would know more than anyone that we don’t have that sort of money.
The commercial deals are falling into place – there was a certain amoint of investment in personnel and systems which had to be done first to make sure we could “deliver value” – as the horrible marketing term goes – to our commercial partners.
As it is a day of such good cheer, here’s a link to a trip down memory lane: six Scottish clubs that went under, and not one of them is Rangers….
http://caledonianmercury.com/2012/06/27/picture-gallery-six-other-scottish-football-clubs-that-bit-the-dust/0034518
And in Twitter “news” (ahem) BennyGoon wades in…
“Surprise to hear the news about RVP..I think arsenal should do everything to keep him..great guy and great player!”
Evening ‘Holics.
Composure mostly restored, first a little plagiarised humour:
“Chim chim-in-ey, chim chim-in-ey
Chim chim cher-oo
Who needs van Persie when we’ve got Giroud?”
Snowy@236: A Belgian newspaper had the original quote if I remember correctly. It probably lost something in translation, and all truth by the time it got to the British redtops.
BtM@243: Epic post. Slumber well ’till the season starts.
I am deeply disappointed and disillusioned (I’ll learn one day to expect far less from footballers and human beings generally) with his statement. Particularly, as quotes attributed to both his wife and father suggested the opposite and alluded to some payback time (it used to be called loyalty) whilst Arsenal nursed him through injury after injury. As far as I’m concerned, it would be better if he went now rather than have to endure, as a Gooner, another so-called captain (CAPTAIN OF ARSENAL FOR GOD’S SAKE!) walk through the paces during another season. Thank you for one great injury free season, Robin, and, yes you carried the team this season but in the words of a song ‘you gotta go now’! Bring on the next mercenaries. I must remember not to become so emotional about any of them! Goodbye Robin and thanks for one good season! Just remember how S H one T you were at the Euros!
Great post BtM, well worth the extended reading time required to do it justice.
One fundamental issue nags at me….
Whatever the reasons (right or real),
Whatever the motivations,
Whatever the personal situations,
Whatever the financial climate,
Whatever the advices given (good, bad or evil),
WHY is a club as great as ours with its grand tradition, huge fan base, impressive record of success, strong finances, unparalleled facilities, super-talented playing staff, etc., etc. NOT able to hang onto its best players and captains year, after year, after year? In the last 3 years we have been unable to persaude Cesc, TCL and RVP to stay.
Do we sign/nurture naturally dis-loyal players compared to other clubs? Surely not.
The uncomfortable truth for me is that we have a fundamental problem at the heart of the club which makes or allows our best talent to leave before we want them to. This has happened too many times now in the recent past to be a coincidence. It is endemic within. We all have our personal opinions as to what the dynamics are that create this situation but it clearly isn’t very healthy and, I believe, it is the vital and missing piece of the jigsaw that needs to be found before trophies will be paraded again in N5.
By way of a comparison, even that bunch of c*nts from up the road managed to get monkey boy to sign a 4 year contract extension despite the internal turmoil of Twitchgate and the lack of CL football. What makes a bright, young, simian talent like that commit his future to playing in a sh*thole with slim chances of major successes and yet we are unable to get our captains to commit to a first class, big club where, if they bothered to hang around for another year or two, would be highly likely to lift the trophies that matter?
This, I cannot resolve.
UTA!
Haven’t had time to read all drinks yet, but @183 snowy is a great post.
Reading continues……..
Snowy yes, that’s a well thought thru’ piece of writing young man.
‘Out of my huge respect for Mr Wenger, the players and the fans I donβt want to go into any details, but unfortunately in this meeting it has again become clear to me that we in many aspects disagree on the way Arsenal FC should move forward.’
Out of ‘huge respect’ I
Dr Zee: I fail to see how adding a few “delirium” crystals will help this situation. For christ sake if you have nothing serious to ad.. eh? What was it that he said then..?
π
*Out of βhuge respectβ I’ (not sure what happened ;-)) I think us, as fans, might like to know the true reasons as to why he disagrees with the club. And especially with Mr I G. Is Ivan the real reason for our disconsolate players seemingly season after season?
TS 265 dont get fooled by the media spin. Monkey Boy extended his contract by a single year, he already had a contract until 2015
Bodrun @270: I’m not remotely interested in what his disagreement with the club relates to. As I think this is a smokescreen for his move to Man City. Van Persie is an employee of Arsenal Football Club and as such, has no right to dictate how the club moves forward. The arrogance of his released statement is unacceptable and it revealed that he had no intention of renewing his contract in the first place.
OK Ollie, I’ll do my best to listen to you and Roger Daltrey.
But my point still stands.
I’m guessing things will appear a lot brighter when the dust of the announcement settles.
Have to say, I think it’s a real shame the way Robin has gone about things today. It really forces the club’s hands.
Ollie@271: I assume he got a big pay increase as part of it though, and not just for the extended year.
234 Ivan42: Bang on the money my friend: We should sell him to the highest bidder and then buy another striker quick as you like.
But do we really give a toss what he thinks about how our club is run (especially when we’re widely acclaimed as one of the best run clubs in European Football)? Stick to scoring goals and shut-ya-fu**ing-mouth Robin.
Clearly this is a sorry attempt to hide the real motivation behind his refusal to sign a contract.
As so many people have said: we’re bigger than one man and he never, ever reached the heights of any of the Arsenal greats. And given his statement, few — if any of us — will consider him such.
Aye NBN. I guess its a ‘new’ 4 yr contract that replaces the existing remaining 3. Still, the general wording we heard was typical Spud spin and TS got fooled, judging by his words.
Agree about the smokescreen, impeccable.
Good stuff TS – I don’t know either.
So we support a player through years of injury who, prior to last season had not completed more than 30 games in any of his eight years at the club.
Our “true, Robin’s a Gooner captain” just couldn’t keep his vow of silence any more, so concerned was he for the fans’ feelings and a desire to let them know the truth.
Oh yes, all except the details, of course.
So what do we fans, the objects of his concerns, now know exactly ?
Answer: That he wants to leave.
And so does every other club, thus driving down the price that his faithfull employers can extract for him out of his eventual suitors.
Or, more likely, his already very well known suitors.
Nice timing Robin, but please, please spare us any more of this “I love the club and the fans” crap. Utter, utter crap.
People criticise, sometimes rightly, Peter Hill-Wood for the statements he makes. But was he wrong to call the fans idiots ?
We invest enormous amounts of cash and emotion into our club and what we,frankly idiotically, like to think of as our players.
They repay us by walking out after we have nursed and nurtured them through their toughest times, and don’t even have the guts to say why they are going. Van Persie cannot tell us why he wants out, due to his huge respect of Arsene Wenger, the man who stood by a hot-headed boy, had him cared for through repeated years of serious injury, often incurred while not even playing for Arsenal, and developed him into the player who now rates himself above the club.
I very rarely swear in this bar, but please Robin, just fuck right off.
I will gladly apologise if this act turns out to be one of brinkmanship to force action from our silent and absent owner.
At the moment, my season ticket – Β£1,955 – is paid for and the money sits safely in the bank as the club announces the departure of our captain and best player, as usual.
Please don’t insult me, anyone, with any more lies and misinformation, as I motivate myself to get fully behind the team for another season, as usual.
‘Holics, friends both real and virtual, are currently the only thing left that can be relied on to be there 100% as another winter approaches.
Btw, what does van Persie expect the club to do ?
We cannot buy 6 Β£30million pound players. Who was he when he arrived for Β£2.3million.
While we cannot buy Agueros and Tevezes, we have consistently beaten top opposition in securing the best youngsters around like Walcott, Ramsey, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Fabregas etc.
To that, the likes of Vermaelen, Koscielny, Sagna, Podolski, have been added.
If some of our early leavers stuck around and tried a bit harder, they may find themselves in possession of the trophies they crave so much.
What? They’re really after the money ?
Oh do come off it ! π
Fun @253 – that’s just it though, the Club (or Supernanny π ), has NOT made it clear what is going to happen. That we both have diametrically opposed interpretations of what the Club has said rather demonstrates that it is unclear don’t you think ?
Derrick @257 – Fans are fickle – a couple of goals and he would be welcomed back into the fold if there was a Rooneyesque u-turn. What are the chances of that u-turn ? Zero in my opinion.
Fun @258 – Why do I think IG and AW don’t get along ? Well I said it was a guess and that’s all it is . Maybe I overstated the case. I think they have a working relationship but no more than that. IG is at best grudging in his praise of AW, and was ridiculously slow in backing AW last summer when the vultures were circling.. AW rarely mentions IG by name. My view is that they do brief against each other. I accept you have a different view.
Whatever one thinks of David Dein (and I think he’s a self-serving wanker), I have to accept that AW has a very different view. Common sense tells me that AW would rather work with a man he still holidays with, than with IG .
Would I accept Usmanov as a means to keep RVP at the Club ? Nope. Would I accept him as the means to keep AW ? With heavy heart, yes I probably would.
It is fairly universally agreed that last summer was a disaster. That sort of disaster simply doesn’t happen unless the left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing. We can all surmise as to what the Board (IG) thought, and what AW thought. None of us know, but what I think is beyond debate is that there was major disagreement as to the way forward at the highest levels of the Club.
A 30 % owner with no significant say but who snipes from the sidelines and who is able to actively undermine the Club through a self-serving ex Chairman, and strip the Club of its assets through a voracious agent who also happens to be the son of the Ex Chairman (whose side is he on ????), is simply not healthy and cannot be allowed to continue.
Time to bite the bullet. If that means giving the fat Uzbeki slug some sort of role to get him onside , so be it .
@ tabs
Well, I think it’s pretty clear. I think it’s the fact that it is diametrically opposite to what most fans think should happen, that is making it harder for the meaning of the statement to sink in.
It seems to me that IG is always full of praise for Wenger, speaks of him with the greatest respect – that recent 1-hour AST Q&A being the latest example. Arsene doesn’t really talk about his bosses anyway, does he? I’ve never heard him mention any of the board members apart from giving glowing tributes to Friar and of course the late Danny Fiszman, when their memorials were unveiled. They’ve exchanged jokes, been seen together…I’m just not seeing any animosity there. Not buddies like AW and DD, of course.
Arsene said about last summer that if people knew the truth, they would not blame the club. Perhaps you are discounting the effect of the actions of Cesc, Barca, Man City etc. I think it’s jumpign to conclusions to assume that things went wrong because the club was pulling in different directions.
I know people often talk about how it’s better to have someone in the tent pissing out rather than the opposite, but Usmanov and Kroenke/IG/AW have such fundamentally different ideas about how to run the club, I can’t see how having Usmanov on the board would create the unity which you say is lacking.
I do agree that there is something weird goign on, that has to do with Dein, but I don’t know what.
Nice one Tabs @279.
Agreed, agreed.
Would Dein and Son really strip the club of it’s best players and risk dragging it down just to provoke a revolt that would effect the return of Red & Orange to the board.
The longer it goes on, the more it looks like they would – or are.
Whatever one thinks of David Dein, it’s hard to understand why he doesn’t tell his son, if he must be an agent, to piss off and make his money by destroying some other club.
Tabs @279 is that really you?
A tear has just rolled down my cheek. This is like the moment Luke gets the robotic hand and starts wearing black.”….strike me down, I can feel the darkside growing within you….”
I do suspect that the Dein family may hold a slight grudge against the current board and are playing that out with ruthless efficiency until Dein snr is allowed back in the club. I just don’t are it happening with this structure.
Oh well. Cheers Robin. Wherever you go I hope you get food poisoning and your house gets burgled.
@ nb1
ha
could be.
NB1 , well at least you can be relied upon to pop in at the most opportune times.
I would take you on , but a) it’s always a bit of a mismatch isn’t it and b) I’d be slightly nervous i’d trip up on your umbilical chord.
Still glad to see you’re still reading my stuff , even if you do choose to wilfully misinterpret it.
Now run along , I’m sure there’s lots of people out there that you can call a cunt , like you did last time you were in these ere parts.
Fun , yep fair enough.
Trev -Cheers for the kind ones, and yes, I agree that the Deins really would go that far sadly.
cheers, then tabs. half a guinness, is it?
(Plays the ball out from the back to start off what will almost certainly be a 15-pass buildup to an Arsenal style team goal sumptuously finished byGT, damn him)
Sorry Fun – got sidetracked hence the brevity of my last reply.
Your first para I strongly disagree with. Whatever the noise right now most fans are just sounding off and would still want RVP to stay. I would suggest that your reading is based on what YOU want to read π
We will have to agree to disagree. It simply doesn’t say what you keep reiterating it does say. It is a classic case of corporate speak.
2nd para – fair enough – your view is as valid as mine, but the point you make – that DD and AW ARE buddies – is surely the salient point here.
3rd para I agree . Actions of players should not be discounted, but still doesn’t explain entirely why the Club acted like the proverbial rabbit in the headlights.
Yoiur 4th para I agree with entirely. I’m not sure it would either, esp given that Usmanov is such a c*nt – one only has to look at his supporters to know that. Maybe I typed it in a moment of weakness π
All I do know is that the Deins are doing their best to cripple the Club, and its my view that some accomodation probably has to be found.
.
Half a guinness would be lovely Fun- cheers .
Takes ball on chest , plays one-two off RVP’s head , knocking him out in the process , and rolls the ball back to the onrushing Fun.
I’d just like to say that I have torn up my “RVP Dutch maestro” Speedoes , and will henceforth use the constituent parts as dishcloths.
π
@ tabs
Well, now is when the fans are reading the statement, so how they feel now is going to influence thinking, even if opinions are revised in due course. I think it’s a bit unfair to say that it’s what I want to read into it – didn’t you agree on reflection that that was what the statement meant?
I have exactly the same opinion of DD as you do, by the way. I just can’t understand why, given his son’s apparently malign influence, he and AW are still such bosom buddies. It worries me.
(accidentally *ahem* tread on RvP’s nadgers as I run past him, pick up the ball TV-style and loft a massive diagonal to the right wing…)
Well I must say that whatever side of the fence you sit on, or even on it for that matter, that this has the potential to be yet another Arsenal shambles. When will be ever learn? I have no idea why Robin has decided that now is the time to release such a statement. I am not sure if we will ever know. I do believe that this is just the tip of the iceberg though and that there must have been lots of goings on that we are not privy to.
So, is this all about money? Probably. Is some of what RVP has to say about the ambitions of the club true? I would say yes. To be honest I am not sure what direction the club is heading. I am not really sure what the clubβs ambitions are. Year on year we make big profits. Year on year we make big profits in the transfer market. We pay some of the highest ticket prices in Europe. Surely that entitles us all to have some kind of expectations?
I am not going to trash Robin. I do not think he is being disloyal. I hate agents but they are part of the game. An agentβs job is to get the best for his client. Not really rocket science is it. So can we blame an agent fro trying to get the best for his client? I donβt think so.
So that brings us nicely onto the Dein family. I know little about Darren Dein apart from the fact that he is an agent and I have met his dad. David I do know is an Arsenal man through and through. You can love him or hate him. But ask yourselves this. Has he ever been effectively replaced? In my opinion we have not even come close to replacing him. I still have no confidence in IG and the only reason I can see that Stan bought Arsenal is purely financial. Others have eluded to the power struggle between the Uzbeki and Stan. Again, think what you like of Usmanov but the fact is that he is a multi billionaire who owns the best part of 30% of our club. I canβt be the only one who thinks that his lack of involvement considering those stakes is a tad bewildering?
So, back to RVP. Have the squabbles and mismanagement at board level had an adverse affect on the lad? Well, quite possibly yes. I have no doubt that money still has a major part to play but I for one have been frustrated for several years at the direction we have been heading in. I have said for the last 4 seasons now that we lack investment. That we are always just 3 to 4 players short of being a side capable of challenging. That investment has never been forthcoming. Yes, I am excited by the recent additions to the squad, but it will all count for nothing if we continue to let our best players leave and not replace them. Quite frankly I am bored stiff reading each closed season how we are losing players. It is fine saying that we have all sorts to rely on for the future. We have Theo. The Ox will come good. Wilshere is our saviour etc. They are all part of a bright futureβ¦β¦β¦ Until they leave. It is not that long ago that Cesc was the future. He had an 8 year contract. Why? Because we were building a whole team around him? I am sure we all remember how that one ended.
I guess what worries me is this. I have no doubt that RVP does love the club. So if he is saying that he does not want to sign then what kind of a message does that send out? Have we become a selling club? Are we a feeder club to others? Well, recent history would tend to suggest that we have. I for one really hate that. I hate it with a passion. Letβs not kid ourselves here. Yes we finished third last season, but we were streets behind Citeh, lost 10 games and let in 49 goals. Without RVP I dread to think where we would have ended up.
So, what now? Well I was firmly in the camp of keep him for one more year and let him go for nothing after that. Now I must say I am not sure. That scenario is fraught with danger. Will he give 100%? What will the dressing room be like if it all goes slightly wrong? What do we do with the armband? I am now of the opinion that if he wants out then sell him, and do it quick. I really do not want protracted negotiations. Get him sold and reinvest all of the money; and reinvest some of the cash from previous deals as well. Who knows? Just a little bit of speculation may just see us with a captain that actually wants to stay with us for the long haul? Who knows.
Some great stuff above from many. Snowy, TS, Tabs, Trev, BTM etc and many more. All with great points of view.
Whatever happens, keep the faith.
I think we’re running up blind alleys as regards the statement . I have agreed that your interpretation is a valid interpretation. It is my view that your interpretation is wrong, but that is all it is , my view. The devil is in the detail and at no point does the statement say that VP will be held to his contract for its duration.
Run after ball trying not to spill any guinness , swear at the horizontal VP, remind him he was rarely fit , and hoof the ball back to the left wing …
With that statement RvP is trying to force a move, which is presumably because of AW comments on his blog.
This statement will make all teams aware of his situation and the money we’ll get for him will be a joke.
Don’t be surprised if Arsenal choose to keep him. He’s left them no choice making all offers “derogatory.”
Nice post Steve.
I have no doubt that DD is “an Arsenal man”. I agree with you that we have never adequately replaced him.
I also however have no doubt that he is not shy in putting himself forward. Would he try and secure what he considers his rightful position at the expense of the Club ? My view is that he would . Recent seasons would appear to bear that out.
As to RVP – agreed – I see no value in keeping him to his contract.
Snir. I love your passion but donβt kid yourself. I would suggest that there are loads in the game who would have known about this prior to this release. Do you not thing that Dein has not hawked his name around before now? Of course he has. I would suggest that the comments of AW yesterday were a pre emptive strike, knowing full well that RVP was about to put something out.
Better to find this kind of thing out now rather than later, as we did last August.
I get the feeling that DD is mightily pissed off with the way things are going at the club. I thing that when he teamed up with The Usbeki that he would have expected to be running the club by now. He might be slightly pissed that he actually has to pay for his match ticket. It may not have gone to plan.
Ha exactly π
And Knock me down with a feather, itβs only Joel Campbellβ¦β¦.
Right, bed time. Up in 5 hours…….. There’s one on the counter for all who are still up.
NB1: I actually agree with something you said! Not the ill-will against RvP but your theory about the Deins. Those evil cunts will destroy this club unless they get to control it…
Steve – if you believe the noises going around the club didn’t know RvP was about to publish such a statement.
As for the keep him, sell him – I was in the keep him but that’s no longer the case with me. Too problematic to do so.
But, and this is a huge but – do not sell to any PL rival. Selling him and buying Llorente for example would still be strengthening our rivals in relation to us.
I do feel the squad will have a 07-08 feel to it and that we will pick up the 30 goals he scored from other places (Poldi, Giroud, Gervinho, AR, MA…).
This might be our Ewing theory. This time it might work.
It’s all about money but no player will say that. The conspiracy theories are great but RVP wants 220k a week and that’s that. I say good riddance. Giroud and Podolski will come good. I think Gervinho will have a much better season so the goals will come. The real key will be trimming the amount of goals shipped by about 15-20 goals. If that happens then the gunners are in the mix. I’d like to see Lloris join to give some real competition for places at GK. I’d love to see Leighton Baines join and shore up that side with Podolski. M’Vila. Denilson has agreed another year loan. Lose the other 4-5 guys who aren’t contributing, get Jack back and we’re good.
I know it’s dysfunctional (but re the business side of stuff in the premiership what isn’t?); and i know it’s flawed (but so are all the other options) and i’m surprised i’m thinking this. But i want to see my club attempt to change what is becoming a depressingly familiar pattern of events: So I say keep RvP to the last year of his contract.
Get ready to stick him in the stiffs next season and wheel him out on the right-wing for carling cup games until we can be sure his attitude is okish enough to come out and play with the big boys. If it never is – say, luvvie – stay where you are then instead.
Meantime we continue to plan for next season as if he’d gone, or gotten injured – again…
That lot is not entirely based on anger and disappointment, it has a practical aspect too: RvP and city – for it is almost certainly them – think – no – they KNOW that with a little disrespectful coating of our club by its former captain that we’ll sell. Wallop! Wheels set in motion – deal pretty much well on the way to being done etc.
And because of the manner in which RvP’s gone about things both those parties will also be well aware that we’ll probably only get bottom dollar for him now – again suiting them.
So let’s disrupt the pattern and take the financial hit. I’m done with the double-dealing Deins and the double-talking Dutchman and his ilk. Let’s piss on their fireworks for a change, and throw some plagues in the direction of their houses too.
Let’s get publicly pissed off and forget we’re supposedly classy for once. Let’s call their bluff and keep him.
City would quickly move on to another model and probably won’t want/need the almost 30 year old – with the now long-face to go with his even longer injury list – next year.
His options and his value, and consequently his bargaining position will all then be much diminished – and we could then p’raps all think again.
If he wanted to he could fuk orf at the end of the season to s***s or whoever on a free – but the offers he gets then would be unlikely to be as good as the offers he’s getting from us and them right now. (It’ll be a little distracting – but fuck it let’s deal with that.)
And let’s send out a message to players, and agents and other clubs that we’ll not be dicked around in this manner no more.
The alternative (and most likely scenario, i think) is take the 8-12-15 mill, moan a bit, then boo a bit when the time comes, and then sit tight and wait until we go through this all over again (and how distracting is that by the way?) with Jack, or The Ox or whoever else it is that takes their fancy the next time around. Because there will be a next time – and probably fairly soon too.
I’m sure “sensible” voices will prevail and the club’ll take the money and run as hard as it can to try to make sure it doesn’t fall any further behind those other clubs that call the shots these days.
But in a parallel universe, if my club is trying to fight back in a different way than the one i expect it to in this one – i would love to be there roaring it the fuk on.
Up The Arse!
‘ing ‘ell who wouldn’t want to earn 250K a week? – that’s a million quid a month if my math is still holding up … yes its about the money … but its also about the prestige of being among the elite players who can command such salaries. RvP must feel he is way up there with the Messi’s and the preening Fuckwit’s of the world .. and from the evidence of most of last season few of us will disagree with him … But he is fucking deluded if he thinks he’s bigger than the Arsenal Football Club .. no one is. Not even Arsene Wenger.
Interesting discussion above: but I don’t think the problem is really between AW & IG – but between DD and the Board IMO. DD is also deluded if he thinks that he is bigger than the club. We must remember that his demise as a trusted Board Member stemmed from his vehement opposition to the move to the Emirates. It caused a rift between him and Danny Fitzman. When Silent Stan sided with the Board he stomped off and sold his shares to the Uzbec. We may not have replaced his dynamism but in Ivan I believe we have a more professional executive. He stands as a vanguard against the more emotive tendencies of Arsene Wenger. Yes Arsene would have kept Cesc and Nasri and lost money on both eventually. The same will happen with RvP if Ivan don’t put his foot down. If City wants to pay 20 million for him then I would sell – fuck what the media would say about us being a feeder club etc. Twenty million quid can buy M’Vila and a decent GK. .. that would make a huge difference to our chances this season..
Finally as I have said before: Liam Brady cured me of putting a player before the ARSENAL. I actually stopped supporting the club when he left (first time I have admitted this to anyone) but yes, when Liam Brady left it also coincided with my moving to Sicily, and for a year I saw him play for Juventus about 18-times home & away. I watched him in my Arsenal shirts so it never seemed like I was betraying the Arsenal at the time. But I was very disenchanted with my team and it took me a couple of years before my love was rekindled. All that to say that my love is for the Arsenal and I am very clear about that now. No player; no manager; no board personality; no celebrity; no nothing: Just the Football Club..
And that’s my last word on the subject.. π
Morning chaps,
Not been on for a while but never a better time than today to get back into some serious Arsenal debate.
As always read with much interest the views on VPβs statement, & hereβs my take on it.
For whatever reason he has done this @ this time, you have to agree he has opened a very large can of worms.
Think we need to go back to their first meeting @ the end of the season, where AW came out of that meeting saying he believed VP would stay because it was not all about money. Well Iβm not sure how true that was now but letβs go with that for now anyway.
If VP was laying down a marker of intent it seems it was missed or they just did not care what VP thought & AW n the board were not for turning, because we have only secured the services of two 2nd string internationals so far this summer, not I suspect what VP was looking for in the light of what was lost last season?
My take on this is that VP has seen in the last 5-6 years @ Arsenal, the board sell every asset we have every summer making us a weaker side every year. So this was his last chance to change their minds, this has obviously NOT happened has it?
Because again AW n the board are shopping in the bargain basement store, trying with all their might to luck-out again with that strategy (well good luck to them on that).
I said last time I was on here the last time Arsenal got MY money through the turnstiles was our pre-season tournament, well for me thatβs unlikely to change for this coming season again. Because while we are selling our best players n shopping on the cheap, Iβm no longer prepared to have the piss ripped-out of me by this board, good luck to them & I hope they prove me wrong next season but without VP βI donβt think soβ………
Woke up this morning, saw the news and I currently feel like my girlfriend just told me she wants βspaceβ via email. Iβm very disappointed at the moment as Robin is one of the players Iβve enjoyed seeing in the red and white the most. That thing he wrote about βnot being in agreement on the direction of the clubβ is very damning. But also, just vague enough to allow room for backtracking I guess.
Are the players we have that shit? Donβt he not rate the players heβs played with over the years? Weβve added some quality players to the club as well, so what can he be talking about?
Iβve also read all of the drinks and there are quite a few opinions I agreed with and some I donβt. I will say that I think we should definitely keep and take the financial hit.
This is not a money matter, itβs about the respect of our club. If other clubs donβt respect the rules and think they can eye our players, unsettle them and get them to force their way out, itβll continue happening from now until we force it to stop.
One hopes itβs a ploy similar to one with the wig-wearer and ole Red Nose to get the board to free up more money but if not I say keep him, strip him of captaincy, rotate the strikers and then let him do what he wantsβ¦
Meh, maybe I too need to grow up and stop idolizing footballers! :$
P.S. Thanks for the appreciation of my crappy song TS, I thought noone noticed 8)
Don’t=Does
As much as I’d love to keep RVP and let him toil in the reserves, doesn’t make much sense for the club. He could be a problem child in the dressing room.
I guess so….
Ahhh, so frustrating having our captain go all the time.
Maybe we should appoint Chamakh as new captain?
CoR, Park is the man to be captain next, and for years to come. Even if he left, we could never tell.
These have been my moods over the past few hours thinking about RvP:
β:evil:β – when I first heard the news..
Happy π – when I remembered his fantastic goals last season
Sad π – when I think that he clearly doesn’t love us the way we loved him
As CoR, trev, and some others have mentioned, the value in keeping RVP for another year would not be financial, but it would be of enormous intangible value – a statement of intent to keep our best player “at any costs”, as AW recently stated himself. A statement to other clubs and agents that AFC should not be dicked around disrespectfully. And perhaps a statement to our own players that the Club is serious in its bid to win a trophy. Think ManU’s response to Rooney’s transfer request, ffs we only need to look accross the road to how the LWCs dealt with Modric last year. So unless we get super deals, and I’m talking Etoo + lots of cash for Ibra kind of super deal, I’d say keep RVP. We are not in a position to sell, so they said, so let’s not sell for once. Whether or not RVP can achieve the same heights like last season is rather irrelevant since AW bought 2 strikers to lessen his goalscoring burden.
πΏ wtf?
I’m still feeling like —-> π
I’m not for one second saying that the world will end if he leaves but I just feel upset at this moment…
Excuse me while I attempt to put my thoughts into song….
*takes a tequila shot and puts some money in the juke box*
http://www.arsenalvision.co.uk/articles/4088-rvp-a-reaction-to-your-leaving.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Someone else did it for me and put my feelings in writing.
CoR: how about..
Please mister please, don’t play VP10 teen … π
@ tabs 284,
Wow. Didn’t mean to upset you squire, just wanted to express my view. As you articulated rather well that’s all it is, my view. It was meant slightly tongue in cheek. A slight hint of mischief but nothing sinister.
Willing misinterpret what exactly? If you recall our first confrontation stemmed from the fact I thought Usmanov should be given a seat on the board at the very minimum and his views, if not wholly embraced, listened too/discussed. You, and a few others were quite vehement in your belief they you didn’t want him anywhere near the club. Unless I am mistaken that view, however you got there, has shifted towards an argument I was originally making 12 month ago.
The point was then and remains true now that its not always the case investors agree. Trying to find some middle ground however is the minimum that should be expected if this problem arises. Clearly Kronke doesn’t like/respect Usmanov. If thats gte case, buy him out. Failing that get him or a rep round the table and see how best they can come together to move the club forward. Arsenal is not kronke plaything.
As for reading your comments, like I’ve said before I very often come to this bar. Don’t always speak. A lot of the times just listen. Always thought that was the beauty of the comments section. Get a flavour of how fellow fans were thinking. Sorry didn’t realise I had to post everytime I came on though. Will remember that.
And just so we are clear, the last time I dished out abuse on here was because I had the temerity to place a sigh by the name Usmanov. A sigh, that’s all. I then received some rather harsh treatment from a few regulars and so I responded. You might want to redirect your dressing down for the guys that actually threw the first punches.
Finally, I’ll sidestep the petty insult and condescending nature of your response. It was late and at the end of a trying day for anyone who supports the club. I enjoy reading the stuff from Dr F, Steve T, Fun, Snir and even today, GT. Oh and you too Tabs.
I will admit that moaybe the house burglary was a bit childish, but I stand by it nonetheless.
How about this one GT?
Ahem…
So you wanted to transfer out?
Wear some other shirt and get more cash?
Fuck you too!
I want my captain back, I want my captain back, you bitch.
I want my captain back.
And don’t forget,
And don’t forget to help me buy my new club shirt.
I wish we hadn’t paid for your rehab
Right before you dumped us using your twitter account.
I want my captain back, I want my captain back, you bitch.
I want my captain back.
And don’t forget,
And don’t forget to help me buy my new club shirt.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjkMh0tKCZo
Singing this made me feel a little bit better :/
Lots of intetesting comments and I am amazed to read all of those who effectively want rvp in front of a firing squad. All he has said is that he won’t sign a new contract. None of us are happy with that I grant you. But it is what it is. I have no doubt the majority is about money, but do you all think the current board do a good job? Do you have full confidence in their ability?
We can moan and birch as much as we like but it may be of benefit to us all if we actually look at the reasons he gave. You may or may not believe him, but his comments do not make great reading for the future of this club.
And if Gazidis really is on holiday at this time of year he wants Fucking shooting.
The feeling on waking up is : ‘what sort of captain is that after all?’ π
I think someone said earlier that Gazidis isn’t on holiday at this point in time.
According to the message, he says that “we in many aspects disagree on the way Arsenal FC should move forward.”
What way is that? The only thing I could imagine would be the board refusing to break the wage structure. Other than that it seems like we’re pretty well run…
Whether or not this whole thing is a hoax, I think we should do as Alan Davies says and if we see Robin just give him some money if it is the board is refusing to pay out π
NB1: OK I will say it. I actually think I like you mate.. I think you are a cheeky chappie and when you call me an “Idiot Bwoy” the other day it made me laugh out loud because I thought “this guy does not give a shit!” .. I happen to like that in a man … so for the record I take back calling you a Muppet the other day … but if I called you a cunt before I am sure that it was justified … heh
P.S. That was a splendid post @ 319 .. you can write well when you are not pissing people off – keep it up..
π
All Arsenal players must be banned for proclaiming Wenger as their father figure. A brutal kick to the nuts if the do so.
And RVP, if it only about trophies you want to move then why don’t you move on to your new club on the same salary offered to you by Arsenal for your new contract.
CoR: Glad you are feeling better mate..that song tho …erm π
Anyway Its 1:50 AM Jamaica time so I pass you over to the Eurpean Crew to keep things ticking until I get back to entertain y’all later..
Nighty Nite Holics π
I just found this interview where Robin spoke his mind about the team…
Seems like he really didn’t rate a few of the players we had at our disposal
Arsenalβs recent signings have not convinced. Andrey Arshavin was expensive, inefficient and unpopular in the dressing room, Marouane Chamakh a mistake, Gervinho inadequate for the Premier League. And manager ArsΓ¨ne Wengerβs protection of the young midfielder Aaron Ramsey, with his deficient view of the game and meagre statistics (only two goals and four assists all season), doesnβt help much either.
On the positive side, Wenger did buy the playmaker Mikel Arteta, who within six months has become a true Arsenal player, the bedrock of their passing game. Incidentally, instead of Ramsey in midfield, Arsenal could have had Van Persieβs compatriot Rafael van der Vaart. βWould you like to come and play for us?β Van Persie had asked him. Van der Vaart, then out of favour at Real Madrid, had not believed his ears. With Van der Vaart on the left, Van Persie would know exactly when and where to expect the ball. Unfortunately, Wenger didnβt believe in Van der Vaart, even though he would have cost just Β£8m β peanuts when compared with Arshavinβs Β£15m. Van der Vaart joined Arsenalβs arch-rivals, Spurs, in 2010 and has since scored four goals against Arsenal. In one game at White Hart Lane, he put the ball through the legs of his opposite number at Arsenal, Jack Wilshere, twice in 10 seconds, then stuck out his tongue at him.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/49f4621a-aab2-11e1-9331-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1zgWHrAlH
Just finished backdrinking and all I can say is why the fuck Robin why? As said few times above, emotional investment to players is dangerous and I did exactly that last season when I chose to wear RvPs name and number on my arsenal shirt replica instead of TR7s.
I did that because of the way he played, captained us and because I believed that this time I will not have _another_ shirt of former captain next season (yes…I do have TH14 and Cescs shirts), yet as far as it seems, I will.
I am planning my first trip to Emirates for the Chelsea home match this season and I intended to do so while wearing Robins shirt tall and proud but I wont now, even if he stays.
Just have the last bit of class Robin and dont sign for shitty, it would be too painful to see you being booed and massacred by crowd as you run out on Emirates in skyblue….
@ GT,
It wouldn’t be the first time someone felt justified calling me the c-word….I must admit I do enjoy the occasional bit of banter.
@ Steve T,
I am on your page. Have been for a while. I think your question of are we being the best we can be is a valid one. I agree that I don’t think we have and the truth is since Dein left (whether as an act of revenge on the part of his son/family) we have consistently sold the family silver.
I think our problems are a collective of a stubborn/principled manager, risk-averse/static/conservative board, and finally a playing staff that have not bought into Arsene’s vision.
AW has never bought household names. Think of some of the players that left in recent times they have all been generally unknowns when he signed them . That’s not to blame the manager either necessarily but I do think you have to be able do adapt if the market has changed as it has. He hasn’t and I think it has cost us. Also his policy of not giving more than 1yr contracts to those over 30 has played part in the club going backwards on the pitch/dressing room. I understand why he did it, just not sure it was the right thing to do. I think having winners in and around the club can and does bring huge benefits to the collective. It also stops upstarts getting too big for their boots. I don’t think its a coincidence Fergie has kept some of the old guard around at Old Toilet.
As for the board they need to review the clubs strategy. Maybe they will be proved correct over time. Maybe FFP will level the playing field a bit. But to my mind they have been asleep at the wheel and I do agree with the Usmanov view that they have been happy for AW to work miracles, spend no money, achieve champs lge, all the while their equity value increases.
The players need to have a long hard look at themselves. They should all by now be aware of the managers philosophy. It hasn’t changed. They were all signings based on his doctrine. TH, Overmars, and Arshavin aside, they were all ‘nobody’s’ when signed (nasri wasn’t a household name outside of France).The problem is they all start to believe their own hype and forget the level at which they entered the club. All of a sudden we are no longer good enough when this certainly wasn’t the case when AW signed and put his faith in another ‘no name’ player as all our recent departures seem to have conveniently forgotten.
I don’t think there’s a magic wand but there’s certainly a lot we could do better at board level, in the dressing room and on the pitch.
Arsenal is like my old Cortina (or Ollie’s car), always needing parts replaced…
We better hurry up and win something quick, seems like the only way to stop it from happening every year
Agreed on that part CoR, the thing is that if those players were not constantly leaving we would probably have won something by now. Which creates all the vicious circle of constant rebuilding. Oh well..and I was so looking forward to superjuicy attack made of poldi, giroud, rvp and feo..
In terms of concerns about how the club is being run: yes, I’m sure we all have them, specifically (in my case) the balancing of the wage bill and the inability to play hard ball over player sales.
That said, does anyone on here have a suggestion as to how we can compete on and off the pitch with City (whose top players now earn three times what ours do) without taking Usmanov’s dough?
Personally, I don’t think it can be done. I think our goal, for now, while daft oil money is being spent and we wait for new commercial opportunities, is to keep reaching the champs league. I agree that a club like Arsenal should be competing for the title, but that’s in a fair world and on an even playing field. The landscape has shifted dramatically in the last ten years and with it our place on the map. I agree that we could be more efficient, but I don’t think the available efficiencies would make us champions.
Every time a new sugar daddy shows up we’re pushed down the pecking order in the view of potential transfer targets. Where once we were first or second choice, now we’re fourth. The situation was manageable when it was only Chelsea doing the huge spending, but with two petro-clubs we really are up against it.
Personally, I hope we hold our nerve and stay the course. Football can’t go on like this – not with banks falling over and whole countries bankrupt. The board aren’t perfect but they’ve been correct to prioritise the long term over the short term and it’s extremely annoying that some sections of the support will now use as a stick to beat them the fact that they’ve not been able to hang onto a player being offered double money elsewhere.
That’s the lay of the land as I see it. It’s not pretty, but there you go.
@ Snir 317,
powerful piece. Might be worth a read Steve T if you are not sure why some of us have got the hump.
Not sure if it was you snir, but whoever it was I agree that would rather sell him to Juve for Β£8m than Shitty for Β£20m.
He can play in Seria A or La Liga for all I care. Just no way in perm lge.
So this begs the question: Who will be our next captain? In other words, who will be leaving us at the end of next season?
@ Snir 317 – great link. Sums it all up really.
@ North Bank 1 336. I agree that we should sell him to Juve for Β£8m rather than to $hitteh for Β£20m.
Either that or keep him for a final season and use him as an impact sub. He would have to play well to maintain interest in him.
We must NOT sell another player to $hitteh. If we do that all credibility (left) will be gone.
So, the writing on the wall turned into the writing on twitter,myspace, facebook and the web site.
This isn`t news to Wenger or any of the higher management as we have brought two strikers before the window opened. Would they have done that if RVP said he was signing ? I think Not !
Every summer Arsenals best players are leaving for pastuers new were the feilds are paved of gold and injuries and miss fortune await them. The list of players who have fell foul of the leaving Arsenal because everything is better else were is too long to list.
So leave ! But dont insult the fans that you are only leaving because Arsenal dont match your ambitions.
AW : Robin we never want to win a trophy ever again and do not want to sign any players.
RVP: Really ?
AW : Yes ! we are hopping to get relegated this season are sure you wont reconsider signing ?
RVP : WTF !
AW : Ok thats not entierly true, Heskey is signing on a 5 year deal !
RVP : You have left me no choice ! I will not sign a contract !
AW : AAHHHH Shit ! I knew I shouldnt of let him in on our cunning plan !
So please don`t insult us Robin !
Good luck RVP were ever you may end up, but leave with dignity like Clichy did. Bigger players have come and gone and Arsenal still remain !
Gooner for life
After months of inactivity on this blog, Iβm pleased to read some like minded responses Steve T, aside I sometimes felt like I was in a minority of one whenever I posed here.
So please to read other now are seeing through this board, (& I have still not worked them out yet) mainly because they speak with fork-tongue the majority of the time, but for me they have spent years doing the old magicians trick of showing the right hand, when the trick was actually going on with their left.
Oh before I go off on a tangent thanks Steve T, for your clarity on this most emotive of subject I.E. the VP statement, I could not agree more so far all he has done is given his reason for NOT resigning. Donβt know about you guys but I too am very vocal in my work place, when a directive comes down from some suit that makes NO sense to my working conditions, n let me tell you sometimes they actually listen.
Donβt see that happen with our bunch of self-opinionated/financially-motivated board members…….
DO YOU????.
I see the fixtures list are out.
Not many changes to home games, but Cuntski early saturday is a bit of a bugger when you have to juggle it with a wedding in the Cotswolds on Saturday.
Gooner wedding though, so cleverly planned.
Psed – the one thing that’s made me grin these last pretty grim 18hrs or so is GT’s story @ 306 of going overseas and flirting with an attractive fancy foreign sort for a time – still in his Arsenal shirt mind – before returning to the arms of his true love – 4ever.
Top o’ the shop tale ol’ son, and a sweet reminder that in the end of course it’s the club we care about waaaaay beyond any player, board or even legendary managerial great.
Schtill don’t think we schould schell dodgy-dealing DD’s Dutch payday to schitteh under ANY circsh, mind. Just schayin’
Snir 317 many many thanks, great read.
Shteve AL?
How interesting that comments stirring the pot have appeared on multiple blogs from occasional visitors this very morning.
Holic @ 344
Very true. It’s almost like there’s a single pallid, flabby hand at work behind all this.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/jul/05/arsenal-investors-reproach-kroenke-van-persie
AL@305 –
Damn good stuff AL! I think I’m with you on that.
Conventional wisdom will be to sell him now to the highest bidder and then, as you say, next summer it will be The Ox or Jack.
Van Persie and / or his agent have calculated to do maximum and unnecessary damage here. A year in the stiffs would be a great message to the next club or player planning torepeat the trick.
At the moment we are stuck in a situation where, because we can’t compete with the petro dollars, we grow or recruit young players and develop them into some of the best in the world,only to then have them bribed away as they approach their peak.
And let’s not underestimate how successful that development process is.
There is a reason why year after year the richest clubs want our players.
At some stage it has to stop. Right now seems good to me.
There was a rumour some time ago that the club were going to play hardball over van Persie’s contract – seems it was correct. Best finish the job properly then.
The Dutch do seem to have a talent for causing grief around a football team. Let’s give this ungrateful little chap something tomoan about.
I was gonna post – “A OL?” then i gottit – duh! (better late than never)
Double heh OL!
http://news.arseblog.com/2012/07/full-text-of-usmanov-letter-to-the-arsenal-board/
Sorry to link Blogs but I don’t know if you’ve all seen this yet? Looks like an open battle between our shareholders. Certainly not pretty, and honestly just plainly, freaking sad.
Trev @347: That’s the same way I felt after reading AL’s comments. AL might be onto something from a theoretical perspective but I don’t know how feasible it might be. I really like the idea though ,as at some point we have to take a stance and stop being a slave to the petro dollars. Time to stand up and see how Van Persie and his advisors like that.
Impeccable –
How feasible it is depends on one thing to my way of thinking.
Do the board want to stop this annual destruction of the latest team under construction, keep the best players and win something, or are they content to just keep banking the extra Β£20 – Β£30 million.?
Have to make your own mind up onthat one.
Good link @317 Snir.
All comes down to principles which i thought van Persie had. If anyone owes this club, he does. But when did that count for anything ?
@ 305 And Lester
*clap clap*
I agree. And I think that is what they are planning.
Who would have thought Robin would make Cesc and Nasri look classy?
@ 306 GoonerTerry
Great points
@ 335 N7 Gooner
brilliant.
Cheers Trev @347: it’s a risky strategy fraught with problems but i’m sort of warming to it. Let’s draw a line in the middle-eastlands sand.
After all they’ve been targetting and tapping up some of our best players for some time now – as a matter of double-edged, win-win policy. (Strengthening themselves, of course, and weakening one of their nearest rivals. And before anyone scoffs – their defeat at The Emirates last season was widely regarded as the moment they blew the title at the time. Before manku gave it back to them – v Blackburn??? – i wasn’t really paying attention.)
Keeping RvP from them is a policy that could probably only work, i think, with a player of about RvP’s age/stage in career. (A younger player with much greater sell-on value could more easily sit out a season and not damage their career so much.) So if there’s a time to try such a strategy, that time is almost certainly now.
The Dutchman and his “team” have loads more to lose than we do – in the short-term, for schure. And in the longer term i can only see one one winner – Us/The Arse.
I want to see us try and change the game, or whatever you want to call it, re that sheik and vacuous “project” up there nicking our best players like sickly rich sugar pumped poorly potty trained spoiled oil-drunk brats whenever they want.
Players who, as trev says , we’ve done the dirty work on and developed over years. We’re not obliged to sell anyone to our near rivals – FACT!!! IMHO!!!!!!!!!!
Go abroad (maybe, if the deal suits us) or go and train with the stiffs.
It may not be the Arsenal way – but the football world has well and truly shifted on its axis and i think we need respond to that – in our own, slightly revised, way.
Do i think the club’ll do anything like that lot i’ve gone on about above? Nah. I suspect Arsene might be tempted (going on what he said about na$ri and ce$c last year and RvP this). But in the end i think the board will insist we cash in on this “asset” too. And the next one, and the one after that.
NB1 ,
Glad to hear your post wasn’t “sinister”.Not sure what a “sinister” post looks like, if I’m completely honest, so I’m grateful for your confirmation that your post did not contain any sinistery undertones.
How would I cope with even the more mundane tasks of the day – popping out for a few groceries, having my nails done etc – if I had an Usmanov supporter lurking in the undergrowth admiring my Speedoes with sinistery intent ? It is not a pleasant prospect I can tell you.
Glad to see you acknowledge your post was, though “with a hint of mischief”. In that case, you presumably got the sort of response you were looking for,you mischievous imp you. At the end of what you acknowledge was a trying day, I’m afraid I was silly enough to give you the response you undoubtedly sought. Hey ho, I’ll live with it.
You will have noticed my hitherto flippant tone – best we keep things light eh- but alas I must get serious for a moment.
I read somewhere (probably The Daily Mail π ) that in this modern, pulsating, here today gone tomorrow age , that the memory of the young is not what it was. Doctors are very concerned at this growing epidemic, (or at least they would be , but sadly such is the youthful age of most Doctors these days, they too are unable to remember from one day to the next).
I only raise this matter as I think you might be showing some early symptoms and obviously I am desirous of you nipping it in the bud at an early stage . Selective memory, (or to give it its full latin name βblankitus βtardiusβ) is Iβm afraid rife .
Without wishing to go over old ground, our first βconfrontationβ (haha), was based not on our disagreement over Usmanov β you are entitled to your view β but over the fact you saw fit to imply I was a racist simply because I expressed a strong distaste for a man who happened to be a foreigner. Now I understand why you might have forgotten this crucial part of our last debate given how ludicrous your position was, but I can assure you ,it occurred.
Now then , has my argument βshifted towards the argument you were making 12 months agoβ. Err , sorry to disappoint you, but no.
I shall, without your permission, quote you from that happy day back on Feb 19th.
Arsenal fans should get off their βsanctimonious high horseβ and look for a new breed of Board who aren’t “nobel prize winners”.
Justification for this approach – easy .
βOr maybe it could just be that Iβm from a different generation. A generation that doesnβt see a foreigner with a lot of money and think criminal, gangsterβ.
Now then me young whippersnapper, I think even you can see that that “head in the sand , I donβt care what the manβs done, skeleton-ignoring give him the keys to the kingdom” approach is rather different to mine , donβt you think ?
Context is all dear boy. If you had read the drinks leading up to my post you would have seen that Fun and I were exploring the possibility of a rift between IG and AW . I thought there might be , Fun articulately argued against. I hope she is right.
What I did say was that IF there was a rift and IF the only way to keep AW was to make peace with the Deins, I βprobablyβ would βwith heavy heartβ try and find some sort of accomodation.
A half-hearted call to find βsomeβaccommodation made at an emotive time,based on a purely hypothetical premise which may or may not turn out to be true, and which was quickly withdrawn.Hmm , rather distant from your βFuck it, heβs got a big wallet, bring him in nowβ approach, wouldnβt you say ?
Iβm afraid weβll never be on the same page NB1, but donβt worry , you probably wonβt remember that in about 20 mins.
Chin chin.
oops pardon “wee sulky/strikey wikey cesc” not “ce$c”
Trev, are you sure they “keep banking the extra Β£20m-Β£30m”? I thought we had a rolling balance which always seems to be about Β£30-Β£50m to cover things like getting one big player or dropping out of the CL (while still having salaries to pay). The cash balance is bigger than normal at the moment because we made a big bid for someone during last year’s transfer window and didn’t succeed.
***
@ tabs,
I forgot to mention that what IG said was that we were not sitting on a pile of unspent cash and that all the profits go to the football club. That was reported by some media and blogs as “AW has the money but refuses to spend.” They both agreed that he has enough money to buy non-superstar players and they both agree that we cannot compete financially with the oil money clubs.
And ta for the kind ones FG @352 and Impy1 @ 350. Guess we’ll just have to wait and see which way the board blows now
Fair point Fun .
Read the R&W holdings/Usmanov letter and can’t understand why so many are getting all panicky about it. That’s more rational information we’ve received than from the clubs directors and board themselves.
I can relate to the R&W letter and it makes sense from a business perspective.
On a performance level, our current board have royally screwed the pooch. We’re fortunate to have finished 3rd last season, have sold off our best players, are still in debt, have done nothing to improve finances on the commercial front, cannot compete with our so called “rivals” on financial terms, have communicated no vision for moving the club forward and have a high degree of uncertainty about our future.
The R&W letter stings because there’s much in there that’s true. The biggest benefactors of Arsenal shares have been the old board. The club saw zero pounds of all that investment, where it could’ve erased our debt had the board wished it to. Stan has done nothing in the year that he’s been here, and we’re nowhere remotely close to competing for any title at the moment.
From the top team on the continent close to a decade ago, we’re now a shambles on the corporate and football front.
P(is)SED – fuk it, fink i might just go down The Tollie tonite and have an unofficial board meeting with anyone who’ll listen. Schurely some of the pre-season playing/coaching staff’ll be around getting lashed and that, and i’ll make my feelings known to them already – no? No. Well, the admin mob then – they’ll do. Ollie, how long’s that unhappy train of yours take to get there???
@ 358 tabs
so where’s MY drink, then, ya tight bastard? π
Trev@351: I agree with you completely as it relates to the board making the decision. However, my thinking regarding feasibilty was along the lines of the potential disruption that an unhappy player may cause to the team and our season. Particularly, as we are talking about a big player who is very vocal with a conspiciously strong personality.Thus, they’ll have to look at the cost/benefit ratio and decide accordingly.
Ha, apologies Fun , fancy cocktail with an umbrella on the Bar for you π
Derrick 349, I will not see it until I get home due to arseblog ban π
Now before I catch up with the last few drinks so is it that the direction Robin wanted was to give a board seat to Usmanov? :s
Baffling.
Let’s shoot 2 Deins for the price of 1.
Thanks, tabs. Yum. That umbrella is crunchy.
Oi Oi Saveloys, Hope all is well with you lot of raving holics !!
My Take – Money Talks Players walk – Could really do without another summer of discontent but im afraid with all thats happened in the past two days that looks like what we will have, Was all going so well to lol, The battle lines are now well and truely drawn and whatever side of the fence you sit on this is going to be messy, in an un Lionel way,
Im sorry but that statement from Red and White has not been drawn up since last evening someone somewhere close to VP (And ill take a guess who) has pre briefed them about last nights statement its all far to well timed in its execution,
The only people fucked over by it all again tho are the fans and thats the big shame of it all,
Ive said before that Kroenke needs to speak and to be honest its now or never
I now get the feeling this whole RvP thing is truly down to Usmanov and the Deins trying to force a riot and fans to back them.
Possibly a slight extrapolation, but fuck them.
I don’t think I could accept any sort of compromise that involves these individuals.
I just can’t believe RvP’s involvement in that, sad.
14.21: Denilson has extended his loan spell at Sao Paulo for another year. First RVP, now this. When does it end?
In the middle of all, this made me laugh.
Ollie,
Couldnt agree more and my money would be on VP staying if Usmanov got his hands on the club , Its all far to obvious in its timing.
There goes my thoughts that this summer will be just full of expectations for new season. I hate to say it but I wholeheartedly agree that we should keep RvP for the last year of his contract.
Should the situation be different and there would be offers from abroad, I would be sort of okay to see him play elsewhere as there always was possibility that he will go.
But as things stand now, with shitty being the most probable destination hes heading to, I think that that lad deserves bit of reality check while training with reserves. I am sick and tired of seeing our best, hardly nurtured players going to our direct competition just as they hit the peak of their performances. It is not the fact that hes going, but the manner in he tries to accomplish the move and where which is making me lose respect for him, especially after he proved to be great captain and leader during last season (have to give him that that hes been pretty much fantastic in that role and inspirational to whole squad, which left me really pleasantly surprised).
It would be much easier to receive the message if he simply said “Look, I am 29, I have 4-5 years tops on top level left of my career and they are offering me that much money that I am going to go, while letting Arsenal make great money in the process.” Mercenary-ish but understandable and at least honest and I am sure that he even wouldnt be compared to certain chinless twat. But the way things are unfolding now, its just classless act of a man who suddenly thinks too much of himself. That said, I still will have no joy from seeing him being booed and jeered by the crowd next season, whether it will be in red and white(and blue:S) or skyblue…
Eandy, I think many of us are assuming a degree of self-awareness from RVP’s part that performers — athletes, actors etc. — simply do not possess. I don’t think the obvious Machiavellian-ism of RVP’s statements were truly originated from him. The players always think too much of themselves.
Anyway, thinking about this, Arsene and Ivan can actually pull off a rather un-Arsenal like but yet compelling PR success in two possible ways. Both are radical and may involve a bit of financial hit.
One, offer RVP what Man City is offering. And some bonus if we win anything. Captaincy remains his and he will definitely stay in that case. But then he would be also be polity asked, as a part of the condition, to release a statement to ‘fans’ that would praise the current vision of club, will accept his own previous lack of understanding about such nuanced matter, and will espouse the strength and uniqueness of that vision and strategy. I think with sufficient financial offer this can be done.
The obvious problem with this approach is of course not the money spent on RVP then, but the precedence it sets in terms of wages and how it might skew the wage structure. So maybe the gap needs to be then covered as purely a hefty sigh-on bonus. Which would make the books look bad for the next year a bit.
The second option is to play real hardball. Don’t sell, strip him off captaincy, and treat him as any other player. If he throws tantrums, Reserves it is for him. Arsene might find it difficult to be such a type of manager, but for once doing this will set a precedence and would be a warning to players and their agents in future. This would surely mean RVP would leave at the end of next year for free and we would lose out on good money, but maybe join forward this example would be a strong enough deterrent against the repeat of this type of players shenanigans.
But to be honest, I don’t see either of them happening… π
Doctor Faustus is my double. Well I share his thoughts.
…a hefty ‘sign-on’ bonus I meant… sigh!
and …’maybe going forward…’, not ‘join forward’.
DG @ 372 — Glad to know our collective cloning experiments were such resounding successes … π
And the plurality of it all simply blows our minds…
@ Dr Faustus
The trouble with your option 1 as I see it is a) we don’t have Β£250k a week to offer him and b) even if we did, City can add another 10k onto our offer. And of course c) he doesn’t deserve that sacrifice from us, any more than he deserves the armband. If he gets crocked on international duty in September, will we be patting ourselves on the back for that deal?
Hmmmm a wages bidding war with citah – that should work
Right, back-drinking finally done.
AL @305 great stuff, but it ain’t gonna happen, more’s the pity.
GT @306 – Can’t disagree with you there. Support the Club not the player. Trouble is ,we always get sucked in don’t we.
Snir @317 – Cheers for the link. A bit over-dramatic for my taste but the guy made some very good points .
Arseblog’s blog was the better article in my view.
N7 @335 – Perfect post .
Holic @345 – Anyone would think its choreographed π
Trev, Impeccable @various – Would love, like you, to take a stance but I think we all know it isn’t going to happen. VP’s swimming pool in his cheshire pile is being dug as we speak.
Ollie @367 – Totally agree. That letter is transparent and pre-conceived bollocks. What sickens me most is not the patently simplistic half-arsed criticisms, but the utterly false protestations of “fandom” and the we wouldn’t do anything to hurt the Club shit, when it is clear that the welfare of the Club is being sacrificed at the altar of personal ambition. Their statement could be taken apart line by line, but its just too easy so I won’t bother. It sickens me that RVP has allowed himself to be used in this way. The more significant question however, and one which I posed last night, is what side is Arsene on ?
I can’t believe I wavered in “accomodating” these people last night. Despicable chancers and egotistical cunts. Lets go to war and grind these fuckers into dust.
Fun @367 – My pleasure π
Erm.. On signing his current contract, Robin said βMy heart is with Arsenal and I just canβt picture myself in a different shirt. I just canβt see it now because I love this club so much. If you look at the last five years, look at the steps I have made every season, if you look at the support the boss and the whole club gave me, the fans gave me, my team-mates gave me β this is the right decisionβ.
FG & AL, the number 1 approach is absolutely fraught with danger of financial repercussions. And significant financial repercussions. It is not a percentage approach and not an Arsenal approach, but if it works then it would be really a great success. I am not saying we should gamble, but simply pointing out that if the club is willing to gamble then the returns might be high.
The option #2 is — despite its relatively benign appearance — is equally problematic, with image of Arsene tarnished to prospective players (and let us be honest, many player choose Arsenal because of Arsene). And hence may have other long term implications. However, it might also be a resounding success in terms of quashing this type of player behavior in future.
The option # 3 is to sell, and that is what we would of course do. But we also need to ask ourselves the question at what point of time we can stop selling the best players. Five years from now when the new commercial deals are all in place? Never in the current financial climate? I think the club as a whole — and we fans particularly — haven’t really come to terms with this most fundamental of a football club’s existential questions: how do we become good enough to the players that we create to become world class? If the answer is, well, never, in this financial climate, which I think is the answer, then I am fine with it.
But the problem with an answer like this is it automatically reduces Arsenal’s profile, and drastically. So, once in a while, we need to have to pretend to be something that we are not and carry the pretension to its ultimate end.
What I am saying is, the club needs to devise a strategy to maintain a strong front of ambition — even if it is but a facade when challenged in this finically doped environment — when presented with this type of players’ remarks and call the players’ (his agents) bluff.
tabs, drink for you on my tab, I see you have recovered full sanity π
And yes, I thoroughly enjoyed arseblogger’s offering today and found myself nodding to it a lot.
If I may dare a pun, I think it was ‘on the money’ ….
The Goram account has 2 tabs, I’ll have you know.
So let’s use Lars’ tab, it will be easier.
Back to normal.
It pains me to admit this but when he released that statement, Robin dropped right down almost to the level of MoneyBuyWhore and the Chinless Wonder – bearing in mind that he’d earned himself such a high position in the eyes of us fans previously.
Let’s face it guys, loyalty to the badge just doesn’t exist any more: this sorry saga has convinced me of that once and for all. However ‘nice’ or committed a player seems, there’s always the possibility he’ll eff off – to Barca, Real, Shitty, the Chavs or Manure.
Hello Holics near & far. Just a couple thoughts after a quick back-drink:
1). I am glad that I threw my lot in with TABs when I first joined the Bar – I don’t ever wanting him prosecuting me any time in the future .. “heee’s deadly” (in my best Mick Bendner voice) ..
2). Am I the only one not particularly worried about the the so-called wealth of City & Chelsea? Why? Well I have seen it all before that’s why! Football runs in cycles, not by years or seasons. City is still on the Up Cycle so all is rosy in their garden. But they will soon run up against the hard wall of economics when they try to move on players that have inflated values & salaries.
**********
This has happened before in Italy. With Juventus. Angelli was the Sheik Mansour of his day and Juve was the Manchester City but even more ruthless. They took any player they wanted. They attracted them with ridiculous salaries. Soon their team was packed with all the top Italian Internationals. Then soon after that all those stars started to dim a little and so other stars were brought in. Juve had two full teams of glittering stars. But they could not sell any. Their wage bill got so high that they had to maintain a serious revenue stream and so Angelli arranged for FIAT to pump millions (but in Italy you had to count their money in billions) into spurious commercial deals. Then came a time when they couldn’t win anything with the players they had so they started to “buy” match officials and opposition players to secure results … well we all know how that plan worked out for them …
In Jamaica we say “Time is longer than rope” and we Jamaicans seem to use that as an excuse to sit out anything..
π
GT, I like that Jamaican saying. Give a man enough time to hang himself.
GT @ 383 : I agree with you that eventually the buy-trophies-at-all-costs approach would hit the wall of financial reality. No fund is endless.
However, in the short term Arsenal needs to maintain this delicate balance of financial self-sufficiency and appearance of ambition. I personally have accepted the idea that a PL or a CL win in the next 5-6 years would be a great achievement, and not just an expectation that should be (or must be) fulfilled. But how do you accept that reality in your operational model but yet present a believable story of ambition as high as any other top club in Europe to attract and more importantly for us, retain the best players? I think that is a question that club hasn’t handled very well.
All this back drinking is getting me hot and bothered. A round of Gin Rickeys β “air conditioning in a glass”β for all the usual suspects.
Tabs is deadly indeed. Time is longer than rope for sure GT. Preach the gospel my Jamaican brother.
One thing I don’t understand is, how can Arsene not see that Robin is being used by Dein/Dein’s son to further their motives?
If he is best friends with David Dein, isn’t there a fundamental conflict of interest in the way they think that the club should be run?
I don’t understand this
ta tabs…I think if the will exists the club could straightforwardly refuse to sell the ex-captain to shitty and any other premiership club. what that might lead to: A stand-off and get thee to the reserves to rot, aging long injury record one – OR abroad and out of sight out of mind.
But as i say i imagine the board’ll sell to the highest bidder
@ Harsha
It has been puzzling a few of us. The common denominator in all of the high-profile departures has been Darren Dein, whether as agent or “advisor”. AW has talked about his work being destroyed. How can this not affect his relationship with the father? Maybe he doesn’t blame DD, perhaps he takes the view that the players can’t hide behind their agents, their decisions are their own in the final analysis. I don’t know. But it makes me uncomfortable.
Can’t believe some people are entertaining the thought of trying to sort this. I only want players who want to be gunners. One thing I instantly loved about Koscielny is that in his first arsenal interview, he looked absolutely overjoyed to be a gunner. Sell him off now ….
Initally, I said: “Robin can get stuffed and jog right on”.
This is because when I was playing Call of Duty: Black Ops with one of my good mates (a West Ham fan) and another good mate (a fellow Gooner) a few days ago, maybe a week, he told me his mate just texted him saying RVP was angling for a 225k pw deal with a Β£22 million cost from Man City and that his mate had heard it on talkSPORT, and I was like “Nah they chat a lot of shit anyway, no way is that going to happen π ”
And now its happening. And I didn’t see it coming. π
Not gonna say he’s a cunt or anything like that, but he’s currently pulling a bitch move right now with that letter to the fans and I currently feel right now even if AW and IG knew that Robin wanted to leave and put the media embargo on so the Podolski and Giroud deals could go through smoothly with Robin’s approval and with Wenger’s latest statement saying he wants to keep Robin at all costs (backtracking on what RVP and AW/IG agreed), Robin was forced to release the statement’, even if all of the above is true, the wording of the statement is wholly offensive to me as a fan as it disrespects the boss even if it says its not trying to.
‘Financial terms or a contract have not been discussed, since that is not my priority at all.’ = No intent to sign before the Euros and probably after.
‘in this meeting it has again become clear to me that we in many aspects disagree on the way Arsenal FC should move forward.’ = Looks like he hasn’t been confident in Arsenal for sometime now π And he’s only the bleeding Captain! Happy with the way he’s forced positive signings to be made but it looks like another one of our players has been convinced that he’s bigger than the club π‘ And probably by Dein Jr, who I will say is a cunt.
I’d be happy with two things that have already been posted on this bar, 1) Robin is sold abroad hopefully after a bidding war (don’t want him being sold to anyone in our league, weakens/keeps us the same, strengthens them) or 2) us holding him to the last year of his contract, he has a spell in the reserves if need be and the club keeps their respect over selling their top players (if flipping Tottnum can do it, we can too) Maybe we win a trophy or two and Robin decides to sign on with a bit of a U-Turn after we give him the trophies he craves.
For all I know as someone else also has suggested, it could be the Rooney tactic of yesteryear or something similar to that like Robin and AW/IG in collaboration but the Rose-Tinted are firmly off as of late with the release of that Red and White Holdings around the same time of Robin’s update, this is very very unlikely.
This fear of players leaving the mighty Arsenal in this way is why I have no-one at all’s name on any of the two (soon to be three) Arsenal Shirts I currently own. 2008-2010 Home will always remain blank, my first one, sentimental value in abundance there. 2011-2012 Home will bear Arteta’s name on it with the number 8, I play football like him and I feel like he’ll finish with the club. 2011-2012 Away will be the full kit and will have Henry 12 on it, he’ll never leave the club, the king of Highbury in all his pomp. *sheds tear*
Cesc’s transfer had me in a state (Nasri’s was also upsetting), not going to let Robin drop the sucker punch on me unawares as well π so I’m preparing myself emotionally early in the summer if he does depart us, gotta be careful if you let yourself form emotional attachments with any player, no-one but themselves know their true intentions in the end.
Vermaelen for Captain, Arteta for Vice-Captain, and the Arsenal moves on π
I think… that is my longest drink ever π
And I feel a lot better for it.
Fun, maybe Darren Dein and David Dein doesn’t have the best of relationships? I have no idea if that’s the case, but it’s not exactly uncommon for fathers and sons to fall out – especially when mega-big money is involved.
For my part, I have already moved on. I can’t even be arsed to read the R&W letter because I know it will only be the same claptrap we’ve heard before. I don’t want Usmanov at the club, end of.
A blow out, Wind.
Great views from the end of the bar,holic a jack please,i say let him rot in the reserves.ducks a glass and runs for the door.
Wind @ 392
You play football like Micky Arteta?
Sign him up Arsene, sign him up!
I took that to mean that when Wind plays there is never a hair out of place….
Thanks NBN.
Snir @ 317, that Arsenal Vision article is good and honest but its too raw for me, I prefer arseblog’s more refined one ‘Rotten Gone Persie’, + its less brutal on Robin.
I’m tired of players stabbing Wenger in the back after he’s pretty much raised them into the men and players they became and are now, what a man our manager is, honestly.
It is all about the style, Wind.
…and thanks for the stylish assist.
Quality goal mate, looking good too π
Quite.
Moving on. We should make Denilson or TGSTEL captain. Surest way of getting someone to buy them.
24 hours later and a little dust has settled.
I find that my attitude has changed from yesterday’s “So he’s off. That’s a shame – a bloody shame – but it was always a possibility” to “Why has van Persie allowed himself to be manipulated like this?”
I’ve read the “Red & White” letter on Arseblog and don’t feel that it reads well at all. It appears to me to be self-serving and without any credible basis. Whilst I believe that others are entitled to their opinions, I’m sad not to be able to see any justification for them.
Myself, I have no argument with the current board’s “so-called self-sustaining model” (to quote from memory, and probably without accuracy, from the R&W letter). It strikes me as obvious that if an organisation – in this case AFC – sets itself up to be completely dependant on a single individual – compare Chelsea FC and R Abramovitch – it deprives itself of a long-term future. Sooner or later, that individual WILL cease to support the organisation. They may continue to support until their death, if the organisation is lucky, the successors of the individual may support it too, but it comes down to luck.
As a fan, I’m here for the long term, almost certainly until I die. I cannot imagine anything, short of death, that would cause me to stop supporting Arsenal. On the other hand, I can imagine dozens of scenarios that might cause any sugar-daddy to decide to stop throwing money at a club, any club. Please will someone tell me what’s wrong with my analysis and help me to understand why we should be happy to rely upon some passing billionaire to keep pouring in as much money as some new marquee manager might desire?
The next “point”, from memory, in the letter was that there is widespread disagreement with the development strategy. Once again, not from this manor. Ten years, or so, ago the Club decided that it couldn’t continue to compete with Manyoo with that club earning so much more in every match due to their bigger stadium. They decided to build a new stadium even though that would mean that there wouldn’t be much money about for player purchase for a few years. Despite several unpleasant and unforeseeable developments (oil money, property price crash) the Club has built the stadium and, judging from activities in this transfer season, the money has begun to come on-stream.
And finally… a rose-tinted thought to cheer you all up.
The current consensus appears to be that van Persie has somehow been manipulated by an unholy alliance of Red&White holdings and one or two people with the initials DD. Consider as an alternative that he is a willing part of a conspiracy with Arsène Wenger, Ivan Gazidis and the club.
I’m not sure I believe it myself, but unless you subscribe to the “the club and Wenger are a bunch of incompetents who couldn’t organise a boozy party in an alcohol manufacturing plant” I can’t see any reason to discount it any more automatically than the “taken in by R&W and the duplicitous Deins” theory.
Roll on football, and (much) shorter drinks.
CCMUED
Well in Ned .
Dr Goram – cheers for the drink π
GT, Impeccable, – Thanks … I think π
GT, take your point about things moving in circles.I have often made the same point myself. The problem is is that the mob at Shitty have so much money the age of the sugar-daddy might last much much longer than it ever deserves to.
AL – I imagine you’re right π
FUN @390 – And therein lies the rub. Something doesn’t stack up. As Arsene skirts the increasingly thin line between his duty as an employee and his friendship with Dein, does he regard the current goings on with indifference, hostility or implicit support ? And if it is the latter , should that alter attitudes towards R&W/Dein ?
Nice one Wind .
Tabs@405; sorry to disagree. If Arsè supports the current activities of R&W/Dein, implicitly or otherwise, it should alter attitudes to AW.
lots of backdrinks i agree with, a few i don’t.
not that it matters after so much has been said, but my take is that we should keep robin. we should strip him of the captaincy, and if his performance on the pitch doesn’t merit him being an everpresent, then we’ve already made two moves to cover his lack. *no matter what*, next year will be a difficult one, bedding in these two and whoever else we manage to convince to come play for the arsenal; if rvp acts like a cunt, he can sit on the bench, or not, play in the reserves, or not. in any case, next january he can go where they’re winning trophies. his deal may or may not be as sweet (if he’s a cunt, is injured, or doesn’t bag a goal every two games, more or less, he gets less; if he’s a prince and bags another 35 goals he’s going to be as rich as he wants elsewhere).
the biggest problem i have, as written eloquently by arseblogger, and various here, is his two-facedness. he has spoken in a variety of ways over the last seven years: the way of the artist, of the thoughtful individual, of the thankful son, of the proud captain. and none of that comes though in his missive. he sounds (as i think someone said here) like he’s throwing his toys from the pram because he didn’t like the park to where he’s being pushed. the implication that arsenal is not interested in challenging for trophies, or that other clubs are more interested, and so he must go there, is as damaging as it can get, precisely because he is captain and our star. and this to a club who has nurtured him through his various issues, and for whom until this statement he portrayed himself as a loyal and devoted servant.
i won’t get into the usmanov issue; i think that was a bomb made and ready to go as soon as rvp handed them the lit match. i don’t know if it was made for this situation; i rather think it was made as a response to the IG comments of a few weeks back, with rvp’s missive a last-minute addition that gave them a chance to create a perfect storm. fuck the fat bastard, and fuck him again.
Damn, so pleased with myself about the grave accent, I forgot the ‘ne’.
Arsè -> Arsène
On a side note (and a trivial one I admit):
*checks which teams we have to play during the Africa Cup of Nations next year*
*sees Man City a week before it starts, and Chelsea/Liverpool during it*
*notes that Cameroon are almost certain to qualify this time*
Damn, that’s annoying.
Stylish goal, Ned!
On 403 though, I fear there’s a flaw in the plan, having your captain on loan for another year….
well in, ned.
oxon gooner @404, care to expand on this further? “Consider as an alternative that he is a willing part of a conspiracy with ArsΓ¨ne Wenger, Ivan Gazidis and the club.”
and gt, it’s like a taoist verse:
Tao Te Ching – Lao Tzu – chapter 2
Under Heaven all can see beauty as beauty only because there is ugliness.
All can know good as good only because there is evil.
Therefore having and not having arise together.
Difficult and easy complement each other.
Long and short contrast with each other;
High and low rest upon each other;
Voice and sound harmonise each other;
Front and back follow one another.
Therefore the sage goes about doing nothing, teaching no talking.
The ten thousand things rise and fall without cease,
Creating, yet not possessing,
Working, yet not taking credit,
Work is done, then forgotten.
Therefore it lasts for ever.
(credit to jane english and gia-fu feng for the translation)
408 Oxon, haha :D, I laughed at Arsè
And I agree with your point.
In completely different news, FIFA allowed goal line video technology. Will be officially used for first time on Clubs Worlds Championship this December.
Oxon , don’t think we’re disagreeing. I just threw the question out there
Ultimately, and sad though it would make me, I feel your @406 has much to recommend it, such is the contempt I have for R&W.
Good post @404 btw, though I don’t really get the conspiracy theory outlined in your last 2 pars. What possible motivation could the Club have for sanctioning such a letter ?
My approval was of 406 too, 404 is a bit too far fetched I feel.
Anyone else having problems with the site being rather slow today?
scruz@412 I’d love to expand on the possibility but my conspiracy-theory construction resources seem to be all used up.
Essentially, the received wisdom seems to be that this is all a put-up job by the forces of darkness to flush out the board.
I was merely suggesting that a counter-theory that it’s a put-up job by the board to flush out the forces of darkness seems, at first sight, to be approximately as credible.
I can’t see what the board would have to gain, but I’m not absolutely certain what stirring up fan discontent delivers for the FoD.
ollie@417, yes!
og@418, you mean to force them to show themselves as scumbags in public, writing letters that have only scant basis in fact even though couched as completely factual?
Ollie, me too. I keep meaning to mention it.
Conspiracy fans, I don’t particularly believe that van Persie (I might consider reverting to “Robin” or “RvP” if and when he is proven blameless) might be in the pocket of someone other than the Deins and Red&White. I felt that mine @404 was becoming somewhat doom-laden and the marginally more hopeful scenario popped into my head as a possibility to lighten the mood.
I seem to recall something in an earlier drink suggesting something the Club might have to gain, but I can’t remember what that was, and I’m buggered if I’m going to re-read them all to try and find it. (Back, Wolfie)
tabs @ 405, thanks π
So, anyway chaps, I have been a bit busy at work these last few days, head down, getting stuff done etc…
Anything going on in the world of Arsenal I should know about?
All those “Neverlands” blokes are a bit sketchy… always have been (even the Lord and Savior wouldn’t fly)
But who am I to begrudge the man. Sure we got one full season out of seven, but please someone hold up their hand and tell me he/she wouldn’t say their current employer is the best thing since sliced bread and then jump ship to their current rival for a three-fold pay raise?
Honestly, now. Just who? Anybody? Not all at once, now…
Sell him, tomorrow. I don’t care even if it is to Merc Citeh. Get the most money you can for him and reinvest it. (or not…again, why care?)
I’ll be watching and supporting the TEAM (as represented by the guys on the pitch next year) like I always do. I’ll cheer when we’re up, curse when we’re down, and always hope for the utter destruction of Manure, Chavs, Spuds, Stoke, and Barca.
The men wearing the shirt are, and always have been, mortal. Nothing is worse than grown men idolizing boys (or younger grown men) who can throw, catch, hit, or kick a ball. Come on folks, we’re better than that.
Drinks on the bar.
BMBD
TABs: The “hard wall of economics” I was thinking about includes squad size limitations, inflated egos (like the Tevez saga last season) and a host of things I can imagine agent Balotelli getting up to this season…
π
lonestar@423, if i had spent the last five years talking about how i loved the company, our customers, and being supportive of the way things were planned for the future, *then* taken a threefold increase, i certainly wouldn’t have done so after saying i was leaving because, while i loved the company and our customers, i suddenly didn’t like the way things were planned for the future *in an open letter to our customers*. i’d say, when asked, in public, i am leaving because the new company offers a way for me to be financially secure, to take care of my family, and to set up a way to be retired in comfort and security, rather than be disingenuous and say it was because of the direction of the company.
Hope you’re right GT, and financial fairplay kicks in. Patience is a virtue as they say.
Ollie – huge problems here on the site.
Have a proper post to chew over and spit out >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
tabs – only if the board show a distinct lack of the aforementioned imagination – mind
Heh scruz @ 407 re the fukwit russian gangster tnuc
Fair point, Scruz. I just operate by the Sun Tzu propaganda paradigm:
If someone says it’s not about money… it IS about money.
If someone says it’s not you, it’s them… it IS you.
If someone says they’ll never leave you… they WILL leave you at the most inopportune time and in the messiest way possible.
And finally, if you ever find yourself patroling a jungle path with an AR-15 in hand and you happen to see something dangling from a tree in an attempt to lure your gaze upwards… look DOWN… IMMEDIATELY.
BMBD.
So,
Nobody found any dilithium crystals, then?
Do I send Dr Feelgood for some Crystal meth?
Right, back drinking has taken about 6 months.
FunGunner – if you don’t mind, for the sake of my, and everybody else’s sanity, I don’t really want to get into a protracted debate on Arsenal’s money and where it goes. There are far more able accountants in the bar than I, and all have their own interpretations.
What I was shocked to see today though, is that in the last 5 years, Arsenals net spend on players is -Β£21 million. Just to be crystal clear, we are Β£21,000,000 in profit on our transfer dealings in the last 5 years.
If we are spending less than we are receiving I presume money is being banked. Since we are supposed to have a ring fenced Player Transfer Account, what is being done with the profits. Add to this our annual operating profits, and my brain becomes confused.
Impeccable and Tabs –
Keeping van Persie, if necessary in the stiffs, may not be ideal. It is a gamble and could possibly have a negative impact if he decides to play up.
However, what is the negative impact, anyway, on the rest of the squad who every year see the best player/s leave the club and then have to try to motivate themselves to believe they can win something with what is left.
On Usmanov / Kroenke, I’m honestly not sure what to think.
It’s hard to believe that David Dein, for all his self serving interests, wants to see the long term destruction of the club.
I don’t know what the current owner plans for the club either.
When he took over, my welcome was with ‘cautious optimism’. There has been little since to be optimistic about, that’s for sure.
As has been stated ad nauseum, our move to Ashburton Grove was supposed to make us one of the top five clubs in Europe.
Since those plans were hatched the sugar daddies have bowled into town and distorted the whole picture.
Our spending however, has apparantly remained consistent.
Net spend over the last 5 years: -Β£21,000,000
Net spend per year since Prem formed: -Β£4.1,000,000
Has Kroenke improved our position?
To my mind, not yet.
Would we be better off with Dein back in tandem with AW, using Usmanov’s money ?
Would we see Usmanov’s money?
The mega rich tend to want to splash their cash to show off and be noticed, so we may well do.
Would Dein / Wenger / Usmanov be a better option fot the club ?
Danny Fiszman didn’t think so. What would I know ?
@ tabs 354,
Maybe I have got a bad memory. I thought our confrontation stemmed from our disagreement of Usmanov and his role at the club. If I recall the slanging match that then ensued lead to BOTH of us trading some unsavory insults. Ofcourse it could be misinterpretation but I thought it was both ways. Lack of balance in your presentation I see. Not for the first time.
The little bit of mischief and tongue-in-cheek nature of my earlier post was not meant with the intention of getting you so riled. It obviously did.
Funnily enough though I remember at the end of it agreeing to disagree, offering a drink and having the equivalent of a cyber handshake and moving on. I didn’t think that to mean syntaxing the date and providing cut and paste quotes of the incident in question. That’s shocking behaviour and says a lot about the man (and I use that term very loosely) you are I guess. No more takeabowson for you. Takeacurtsy suits this type of behaviour better.
I still think the high horse opinion applies. That is unless you have executed the same level of due diligence (ie google search) for all the board members and can offer a balanced view?
Make it about the size of his wallet if this makes it easier for you to understand but this is really about the two parties communicating. He owns 30%. If the board don’t like it, buy him out!
The shame is that it becomes ever more apparent the Arsenal board share this “fuck Usmanov” attitude and this is why we now have a public airing of club linen. Rather than open dialouge you would have us think its better to ignore him. That’s acceptable from you because I doubt you know better. The board however should know better.
Thinking that closing your eyes really tight and squeezing your arsenal pillow will make Usmanov go away is, well quite stooopid. But is that really the case? I suspect the truth is somewhere in that attic or cellar that you tap away on your fujitsu you know what I say makes sense.
I find it laughable that you have to hide behind so many layers of bullshit just to admit I might have had a point and perhaps the two sides should talk. I guess some of us find it easier to admit when we’re wrong than others.
My grandad always told me to never argue with a fool. So I guess it stops here.
Adios takeacurtsy.
See ya Nob End1.
Have read a few drinks.
I as with every other gooner is gutted but not surprised by RVPs decsision.
If you all remember Rooney did and said the same thing and within a month of being offered a quarter mil a month he stayed and went on to be named PFA player of season and won the league and feat in the CL final.
There seems to be a pattern with clients of Darren Dein which makes it hard to believe he is related to the business manager who participated in bringing Arsenal so much glory 10 years ago.
If RVP was happy to see out the last year of his contract ( a la Drogba) then he would have said so in his statement. He obviously wants to leave. I am of the notion that an outbound captain is an issue for the dressing room and as such should be allowed to walk.
Obviously it would be nice for RVP to stay and walk for free, but the club will have to decide whether they want money or trophies next season because if our attacking line up were to include a content outbound Van Persie, then who knows? (could be a la Gerrard)!
Sorry in advance for any I-phone typos!!!
The self-sustaining model is it still working? If yes, fine. If no, how can it be modified and made fit for purpose without putting AFCβs long-term financial future at risk? Or is that impossible?
Is it reasonable to expect more from our newish owner – SK? The property portfolio is more or less sold up and we still have 2 years to go re renewing our long-term, front-line sponsorship deals. The full FFP thing is also still some way off and none of us knows for sure how effective it will be anyway. (We do know though that the clubs most likely to be detrimentally affected by it will do what they can to get round it.) Could/should SK β who clearly believes there is money to be made from Arsenal β help the club out financially during what promises to be a particularly tricky couple of seasons even by the standards of the last few seasons? A bit of short-term speculating in the knowledge that plenty of accumulating is likely to be done further down the line β so long as AFC is still in pretty good shape. The club with its debt burden increasingly under control could also borrow from other sources, though the owner would obviously need to ok that too β should he?
Is Ivan Gazidis up to the job of Arsenal CEO? Last summer he and AW contradicted one another in public on several occasions on issues as fundamental as the size of our transfer budget and the consequences of non-qualification to the champs league proper.
Were these blips, unimportant slip-ups, ordinary easily resolved workplace tensions etc., or indications of a working relationship that isnβt working? His absence fro the champs league AC Milan match-up (skiing in Barbados apparently) was p’raps suggestive of a chap that doesn’t seem to quite get the gig he’s landed