Arshavintage Arsenal Denied In Kop Thriller
Apr 21st, 2009 by 'holic
How on earth am I not minted tonight? I told you beforehand I had no option but to put the ‘holic pound (and several of his mates!) on an Arsenal victory. We should never be four to one against anyone, anywhere. The emotions ran high and swung this way and that through ninety-six minutes, and yes, where did all that added time come from?
I digress. I know before tomorrow morning is out I will read in various places criticism of Fabianski, of Silvestre, of Gibbs, of Denilson. Sometimes however a game just takes on a life of its own, and is so astonishing, so breathtaking, that you have to forgive the players for getting caught up in the emotion of the occasion.
Sky did their best with their remarkably scouse-tinted bias from the opening of the show through to the final seconds to put me off Liverpool for life. Well, despite all the crap spouted by Keys, Gray, and Redknapp, I just have to say that the home side contributed to the pure theatre of the evening, as both sides mixed pure farce with absolutely sublime skill.
Going forward, this is the best Liverpool side the Premiership years have seen, which made for a difficult night for Arsenal’s under-strength, and under-fire back five. Am I being too one sided if I make the observation that they appeared to be aided by most fifty-fifty decisions going their way. We have had experience with Howard Webb before.
Despite that Arsenal grabbed an unexpected lead when Andrey Arshavin took advantage of the persistence of Fabregas and Nasri on the right. Quite how that lead remained intact was something of a mystery, but a great deal of praise should be headed Fabianski’s way for the opening half. His form and fortune did not survive the second period.
Within eleven minutes of the restart he had been beaten by Torres and Benayoun as the four in front of him fell apart. To be fair to them the protection in front of them was virtually non-existent. Who needs protection when you have Arshavin. The man of the moment struck twice in three minutes as Arsenal decided, quite rightly, that the best form of defence tonight would be counter-attack.
The lead lasted barely a couple of minutes before Torres once again humbled Silvestre and saw Fabianski unable to prevent his goal-bound effort. At this point I informed the management that the next goal would win it, and I rather thought we would get it, and secure my punt.
Several neighbours will confirm this was definitely my feeling when Arshavin produced his fourth, and best, finish of the night in the ninetieth minute. Those who know me will know that the ‘holic bellows can be a noisy weapon, but the additional five minutes, that turned into six (again, where did they come from?) saw one last dramatic twist and another soft goal conceded to Benayoun.The wind was well and truly blown from my sails.
Any summary has to acknowledge Liverpool’s contribution, but must focus on the amazing performance by Arshavin. The wider view would suggest without him we really do need to get a goalkeeper and a couple of defenders back before considering what may happen against Manchester United in the Champions League. We cannot hope to outscore them if we are as porous as we currently look. That however is for discussion another day.
For now, I am off to raise several glasses to a little Russian genius, and to drown my sorrows at what might have been. Nasdrovia!
56 Responses to “Arshavintage Arsenal Denied In Kop Thriller”
It’s a bit late on a school night, but I’ll sneak a double Jamesons as a night cap! Cheers.
PS. I hope you hedged your bets…
I need a nightcap after that.
Good write up, Senor Holic.
the ref was a disgrace.. the Bendtner goal was good and he gave every bit of doubt their way. as for the 5 minutes.. it was just icing on the cake for liverpool concerning the refereeing.. who decides that anyway???
however we were dire in defense and Song and Arshavin were the only reason we came back with a point. I´m very worried about the champs league ties with this defence..
wouldn´t have started denilson or Bendtner. what the hell have they done to deserve this endless loyalty from Wenger? and why the hell does he persist in playing 4 -5 -1 ? And what´s with playing Fabregas out of position in order to play Denilson in the Fabregas position.. they are too similar to be able to function together..
I think Wenger is overcomplicating things.. he should just find his best 11 and start them every chance he gets.. what happened to Eboue, playing him would have made sense tonight, he´s got a good work rate
gud post, crazy game of football. but I’m sorry, denilson doesnt offer anything to this side. I’ve tried to look for good points in him all season. he cant tackle. cant pass. is not a defensive midfielder at all. every game it looks as if its his debut and he looks nervous. Alex song really is making the position his own and should partner Cesc all the time. Arshavins a little genius. if only he was eligible for champs league, am sure all the gooners would be confident of winning it!
Well, I’ll never be able to sleep after that, so a G+T for me please.
On the injury time front, we don’t actually have any complaints. It has bugged me for ages that injury time isn’t as long as it should be – you are supposed to get 30 seconds per goal or substitution, which rarely happens.
Tonight, seven goals and four subs in the second half meant there should’ve been five and a half minutes without other stoppages.
Of course, it is a bit irritating they chose tonight to follow the rules!
Let me set the record straight on where I stand on the question of Denilson. I cannot understand the volume or vehemence of grief that has headed his way for much of the season. I think he has done a fantastic job for us most of the time. Granted this was probably his worst performance. He was anonymous throughout and provided little or no cover, but despite some of the nonsense spouted, this is unusual for him.
Bendtner too deserves a little better treatment. Barely 21 he has been asked on numerous occasions to plough a lone furrow up front. Twelve goals in 25 starts is more than we might have expected from a young reserve at the start of the season, so think on that if you would.
Thanks.
Halli, Wenger was forced into 4-5-1 by injuries to Ade and RVP. Eduardo isn’t match fit so that leaves only Bendtner. Who else could’ve played there?
It is a little strange though that we have so many players willing to sit in the hole behind the striker, and we play Cesc there.
Arshavin is a top class player but sorry we would need him for the champions league
‘holic – I agree on Denilson and Bendtner – the former is developing nicely (although into a completely different player than I though, when he initially arrived I thought he’d be a mini-Cesc, not a mini-Dunga), while the latter needs time.
Denilson was slack tonight, but so was Song, and he had form coming into the game. I just don’t think either could cope with Liverpool’s ferocity coming forward, but it’ll be a lesson for them.
People say Bendtner hasn’t come on much this season, but they were saying the same about Walcott almost exactly a year ago, and look at him now.
Sometimes I think Bendtner gets stick because he is unfavourably compared to Adebayor, who is excellent at holding the ball up when playing the lone striker role. Yet Ade himself is then slated for a lack of ability. Odd.
this is a joke right? if’s and but’s, if thats the case then liverpool should have been 3-0 ahead in the first 10 mins, however, this isnt my main point, fair enough we only got a point, if arsenal had matched us in terms of attempts and attempts on goal and corners, which is a good indication of the game, but they didnt, we dominated. we should have won really. but thats a liverpool point of view, but didnt you as arsenal fans wanted man utd have to put as much effort in as possible before the semi’s next week? if man yahoo win tom, they can rest there top players and lose on sat and still be in pole position to win the league. but now that you rejoice in getting a point, man yahoo win tom, they can rest there top players at the weekend and still lose, but have a equal chance of knocking you out next week, whereas if liverpool won tonight, then no matter what the result tom, they would have had to win on the weekend and therefore putting there full team out whereas you could have rested as 4th is nearly there? its not about your team selection tonight but more of that man yahoo having less time to rest there top players?!? gutted liverpool fan still hoping that you beat united in the champs league and prem. Jag
I think we are in a world of snap judgements, Pete, and we can all be guilty at times.
I believe there are players who will always get an easy ride (are we really happy with Bacary this season?) and those who will get grief regardless. Denilson and Bendtner are two in point.
I’ll own up to wanting Gallas gone before he was stripped of the captaincy. Now I think we definitely miss him as a player (and Silvestre has become the latest figure of fun).
‘holic,
I can only speak for myself, but my problem with Denilson is two fold. Firstly, often when he tries a pass that’s slightly out of the ordinary (anything other than a square ball) he gifts the other team possession far too often. Secondly, he dilly-dallies near our box much, much too often. That is actually my criticism of his offensive game. His tackling is horrible.
I agree about Bendtner though.
I’m certainly guilty of it at times – I was wrong about Song, certainly, I just couldn’t see how someone so slow could ever be a holding midfielder. And then he transformed.
I guess this is the difficulty with blooding youngsters. The minute we see players in top games, our expectations of them rise to unfair levels.
I had fears for us tonight and I thought we looked tired which is perhaps not surprising as we played a draining game on Saturday while Liverpool kicked back and had a rest. Add to this our terrible plight with injuries and the likelihood that Liverpool would throw the kitchen sink at us and this was a good time to be playing Arsenal. Yes, they had more possession and created more chances but I thought Torres and Kuyt’s diving around was a joke. Arshavin’s first goal was onside but Gerard was the only person not to agree and Bendtner’s goal was also onside but,as per usual, Sky chose to ignore that fact. Webb was appalling yet again. Every time a Liverpool player threw himself to the ground it was a foul yet he played advantage after the worst and most dangerous late tackle late in the game from Arbeloa. And where did 6 minutes of extra time come from? There were no injuries that I can remember. Finally and to round off the general moan, what the hell was Redknapp on? He kept saying that all of Arsenal’s goals were mistakes by the Liverpool defense. Weren’t all their’s mistakes by Arsenal defenders? He was absolutely sick that we got a draw and Keys never balanced his bias out with too much from Smith either. Sky sucks. Big time.
Diaby or denilson. WHo is better in a 4-5-1 squad? 4-5-1 os said to offer a better defensive cover. Which is true, if used correctly.. but Arsenal’s biggest strength is passing and sumtimes its our weakness when we should easly clear the ball. But offence is the best defence. we are not a defensive team. We are a team that out plays, or possess the other team and score goals to win matches. If they dont have the ball, then we cant concede.
But diaby or denilson? who offers more. Our squad must be big/powerful taht Both should not be a starters.
I cannot understand why chelse wil field the same team mainly, match after match wit a few changes, while our players have to get so many breaks. Gone are the days when you know the line up. Henry always playing, viera and the back 5. pires, and the next players. We need consistency.
great result, but in the scheme of things , so what ………….i would much rather had beaten chelsea on saturday and lost tonight , 4th is in the bag already . aa proved tonight exactly what we all knew saturday …….wenger screwed up big time by not playing him , its been a wasted season and im not happy , 4 years without a trophy and counting , as 4 denilson i think he is squad player at best ,
If he played tuesday.. we probably wudnt get 4 goals from him… and he probably wouldnt have stared tonight.
BUt we did not lose because of his presence or absence. The fa cup was going to go in extra time. But 2 goals mad e by mistakes and lack of experience i guess. the last goal should not have been scored. And arahvin would be on the pitch in extra time against tired chlesea legs.
Plus hidink knows arshavin’s game.
Should have started Arshavin against Chelsea. In the big games you have to start your best players. Saturday was a bigger game than this one for us.
And I have to concur with those criticising Denilson, I don’t want to be a hater but he just constantly gives the ball away, barely ever makes a tackle and his positioning is terrible.
But from tonights performance, the back four is a major concern. We need Djorou back.
Can’t wait for the Champions League, hopefully its an epic tie. We are going to need massive games from Cesc, Nasri, Kolo, Ade, Song….hopefully Eduardo can come in and pinch the decisive goal 😉 Love that man
Great quote from Arseblogger:
“Arshavin himself must have been upset not to start, particularly in a game against a team managed by his national coach. He doesn’t strike me as a sulker though and the perfect response tonight would be the kind of performance that says ‘Next time, Arsene, pick me’.”
And how!!!!
Ar – Ar – Arshavin’s over from the Russian scene
Another Arsenal legend is born
Ar – Ar – Arshavin Russia’s greatest goal machine
And now at Arsenal he’ll carry on
Shocking defending etc etc etc. I agree. Any 4-4 is great for the nuetral. Sloppy at times from both sides. Really upset with the 4th. They had 2 left unmarked on the edge of the 6 yard box and we had players just ambling back.
Thought we looked tired at times. 4 fantastic strikes from Arshavin. How much of an asset will he be????? Gibbs has grown up a lot in the last 4 days and will be better for that. He has been given a hard time in both games. But in both games he has battled well and deserves credit for it. Did not hide once.
I hate all of this Bendtner and Denilson bashing. For both this has been their first full season and both have played more than would have been hoped. Denilson has played well and I am convinced there is loads more to come from him. I was disappointed with Bendtner tonight. I thought this was a golden opportunity for him to show what he believes he is capable of. For me he went missing a bit tonight. But he was not the only one. Injuries have left us looking a bit unbalanced tonight.
We have had no luck this season. We wait for all the attacking players to come back from injury. Then we lose the defence. My opinion? If Gallas and Almunia play the last two games we do not lose either. Thats the way it goes I guess……….
Keep the faith.
You must be kidding me, since when did Densilson play? I didn’t see him!
I hope Diaby and Densilson get some lengthy injury, seroiusly. If not, they gonna ruin us big time!
Fanner, you are a disgrace. Wishing a serious injury on any player is shocking. You want an Arsnal player to get a serious injury then you really have no place at this club in any capacity. You can not even get DENILSON’s name right??????????
I am not surprised you have never seen him play. I would not be surprised to learn that you have never seen anyone play. You need to re-evaluate your thoughts.
Arsenal were lucky today, Liverpool created over 20 chances and had they been better at finishing, we would have been down quite a bit in the 1st half. We need to get our defense sorted. Thought Cesc was sloppy today. Need more urgency from the lads. Thank f*** for Arshavin. Gibbs and Song were solid today.
Good write-up, Mr. ‘holic.
Spot on about Den and Nick. The former had a poor game today, but he has been very good overall.
“I cannot understand the volume or vehemence of grief that has headed his way for much of the season. ”
Some people don’t actually watch football, they just rant against 1 or two player. Just take a look at the Arses!
Just another quick point regarding injuries…every year we seem to have a spate of injuries leading into the crucial time of the season. Obviously, some of them cannot be helped (such as Eduardo’s shocker), but with so many others occurring I think we need to have a serious look at our conditioning coaches, because it is just getting out of hand.
Injuries have killed us again this season – we can’t keep blaming it though, either we need to invest in more depth or better fitness coaches…or both!
So what is it that the Denilson defenders think he does well?
Also, if anybody get’s a chance, watch the final goal and see what Diaby’s doing, aka NOTHING.
It just goes to show how baffiling it was that Wenger didn’t START Arshavin in the more important game against Chelski especially when we’ve been starved of trophies and him being cup-tied for the CL.
Would have been the perfect night for Arshavin if it wasn’t for Arsenal’s embarrassing defence. . How many chances did they need to clear their lines?? Wenger seriously needs to look at that atrocious defence in the summer even if we were missing a few defenders with injury. They’ve been bad for a number of years now. They’re throwing away games time and time again..it’s pathetic! It’s costing us points and trophies!
However, I have to say it’s not just the defence. I noticed the players in front of them weren’t doing enough and they kept losing the 2nd ball and giving away possession again in dangerous areas. I mean the 4th goal was the worst of all…ur leading and hardly anyone tracked back to help out! The amount of times liverpool players found gaping holes in that midfield was embarrassing. Song was only player who looked solid but he was doing his own and Denilson’s job at same time. Denilson for me i hate to bring it up again seriously what does he offer for the team?? His presence today and in many other big games is detrimental to the team sometimes. If he’s young ok but he’s certainly not ready to play in the big games like Chelsea and Liverpool where he was out of his depth and found wanting.
ARSHAVIN what a legend!!! I must also give a mention to Theo Walcott…what an amazing young talent..he looks stronger and better as a player now! He’s frightening defenders from every team!
Finally you might aswell call SKY Liverpool TV..WTF was that?? The coverage was completely bias and Jamie Rednapp is a muppet!!
CANT understand people defending Denilson…But Bendtner yes – He has potential to play in the position he plays in & as a target man but still to develop…so hes fine & on track to develop…
BUT Denilson..not saying hes a bad footballer…But the positon he plays in..hes not good enough for it now when CESC is in…hes wasting “a position” in the team because he makes the team playing only 9 outfield players…and stifles CESC’s play….best eg- against Villareal…Song-Cesc worked well…
So Denilson maybe in the future but not good when CESC is on…sorry….
ArshaIVn was magnificent!
But as breathtaking as the game was, there are still some points to make.
– The ref was a mug. Every time a player lost a ball (does not matter which team), it somehow ended up being a Liverpool freekick
– Denilson does not offer anything really to us
– After the game one of the positives I had was – well, with this attack we can win any opponent, bring on the Mancs!!! Then I remembered that Arshavin cannot play in CL this season. Why, Why, WHY AW did you not play such a line-up against Chelsea?
What if Arshavin had played on Saturday?
What if Arsene had started with Song?
A few questions that will forever come back to haunt us.
What a night for AA23. 2nd goal – a right foot screamer and the 4th, a left foot piledriver.
The sign of a world class player.
19 unbeaten games in the EPL, we’re still the Invincibles of 2009! That’s quite a feat after a game at Anfield with the best Pool team in years that was fighting for its best shot at the title in decades. They were insanely motivated to get a result and I feel so proud for our youngsters for weathering the onslaught.
3 players really impressed me today:
– Of course AA is a phenomenon, never seen a player who spent his entire life playing in the same (lower) league make an impact at the top level in the EPL so soon after his transfer. This guy truly is a pocket wonder.
– Young Gibbs is the future of Arsenal. He was our best defender today and on his current progression curve he will be a contender for a starting position next season.
– Walcott has definitively matured, even if his second season was marred by injuries it’s very telling to see how much he is becoming a player that makes the difference on the pitch. Hopefully Denilson, Bendtner and Song will mature as well in their second season with us.
To the people commenting to slate our players after such a game says only one thing about you: you are supporters in name only.
Nice write up ‘holic.
I’ll just have a cup of tea this morning please.
Hello ‘holic and anothers!
A little point on Denilson (whom I sometimes am angry with and sometimes like, we all know emotions runs rampant during games!)
He is actually the top Arsenal player on the Actim Index (on 14th place, all players, all positions) and the 5th highest ranking midfielder in England this season.
Of course the Actim Index is far far far from perfect and doesn’t tell you anything about how well a player fits into an idea or tactic, but it is a sign he is doing something right.
“Actim Stats are a collection of team, player and match statistics. They are derived from all the actions that take place during a match, including goals, shots on target, corners, assists, clean sheets, fouls, off-sides, passes, tackles, blocks and clearances. The raw data can be used to generate a wide range of tables and statistics such as player profiles, team and player head to heads and form guides.”
http://www.premierleague.com/page/ActimIndex/0,,12306,00.html
Bendtner was willing and played manfully in a role he is not suited to.
Denilson is and has been a good player for us this season but had a poor game last night with him and Song trying to occupy the same part of the pitch most of the time. Song was better after Den went off and he played well I thought, although he needs to take more care with his passing. I am sure this aspect of his game will improve with more experience.
Sylvestre was – well – Sylvestre and was good in parts but isn’t as good as Senderos who was, unfairly, much maligned in his time with us. Sylvestre is only third choice however. Don’t put too much weight and expectation on Djourou’s shoulders, he is young and inexperienced but does have much more pace than Sylvestre.
Nasri and Cesc were both good but not faultless. I particularly like Nasri’s intelligence and strength on the ball.
Theo definitely added something to the game and of course set up one of AA’s goals. AA was outstanding once he scored but fairly anonymous for a lot of the first half.
Gibbs was very good and looks to be a brilliant prospect. Understandably his inexperience showed at times.
Terrific but nerve racking game to watch and a great shame we conceded the fourth goal. Come on the Arsenal.
Can’t really add much more to what has already been said and cannot pass up the opportunity to heap more praise on the shoulders of the diminutive yet gifted Andre Arshavin. Even though he scored 4 goals I kinda feel he has been let down massively by the rest of the team…..particularly Liverpools final equaliser! A win was there for the taking!!
A win against Man U and thereby progression to the CL final would be a great boost but, given our defences frailties, am certainly not counting on it. As someone esle said, we also can’t be putting too much expectation on Djourou in coming back as he still has much to learn.
We have little choice but to look now to what further side strengthening acquisitions AW will make in the transfer window as surely a wholesale change in central defence is the much needed option going forward?! Gallas will likely leave and after that we’re very much left wanting. Two defenders would be a real boon!!!
Super post, ‘Holic. Almost as good as watching the game first time around. Appreciated your comments on Denilson and Bendtner. You know how much I admire the former Brazil Under-19 captain and look forward to seeing him become a regular in their national team.
19 games without defeat. Pretty good stuff and only one Arsenal player has played in every game…..DENILSON. (Yeah, but that’s just a coincidence, right? He got lucky in all 19 games because he can’t tackle, can’t pass, can’t score…..bollocks.). Arsenal’s next captain when Cesc eventually goes back to Spain.
To the game last night. I can’t add much to your post and the volumes above. Frankly, a draw was a fair result, although, at 4-3, it should have been all over and we should never have lost the fourth goal.
Positives. Great experience for Gibbs, Fabianski, Bendtner, Song, Walcott who are still learning their trade and need this (and Saturday’s) kind of experience. Brilliant AA.
Areas for improvement. Manure didn’t let Silvestre go without a reason. William Gallas’ injury has had a much bigger impact on the outcome of the last two games than any of the Boss’s selections. I’m hoping for a fit Djourou pre-Manure.
To Fanny above. You are a disgrace, son. Anyone who wishes for an injury should hope that his own next shit is a hedgehog and that he falls back on it. “Holic does excellent work here, take your bile elsewhere.
Newcy Broon, please Mr Barman.
I don´t quite understand your level of tolerance for bad performances from these youngsters.. you would think that a youngster who is given a chance to earn his place in a team of Arsenal´s stature would be over the moon and would work his socks off.. but not these guys..
I think some of them may have an attitude problem and are taking it for granted that they play for Arsenal. Does anyone really think that Denilson compares to Petit Vieira Flamini Parlour Silva or even.. Grimandi??
Give me a break.. being a good player isn´t just having the odd good game.. it´s about performing every week.. and if you´re not as good as the other team you better work harder than they do..
as for last night, Denilson was not as good as Alonso and Mascherano.. and didn´t work nearly as hard and that´s why I think it´s very fair for us fans to get angry with such a performance. As for Bendtner most of the same criticism goes to him, I think he´s a star in his own mind and that he doesn´t think he has to work to get the goals.. Adebayor has gone through patches when he didn´t think he had to do the work and the result for all these players is always the same.. they are shit when their attitude is off…
Halli, if you will berri your head in the sand for 7/8ths of the season then you wont see Denilson’s season long contribution to the team.
Snail
we are fourth in the table.. we just scored 4 goals and didn´t win.. Denilson was thoroughly outplayed in every way..
what the hell are we talking about here? Is this club about giving young players experience so that they can go play for AC Milan and Barcelona or is it about winning titles?
Arshavin´s performance should have won the match and I think the other players – in particular Bendtner and Denilson – let him down.
bottom line: the team shouldn´t play 4 -4 -2 , at all, and should play Song alongside Fabregas in every game possible to make a strong partnership develop between them. Denilson has potential but is nowhere near ready and was absolute rubbish last night.
Halli,
I have just listened to the u-18’s reach the FA Youth Cup Final. I have been lucky enough to see quite a bit of the youngsters this season. We make considerable investment in that youth programme for a reason.
If you look around it is astonishing that often the people who are calling for the Jack Wilshere’s and Jay Emmanuel Thomas’ to get a chance are the same people spouting nonsense about those who were in their shoes a year or two back and needing games to further their development.
Denilson and Bendtner are above-average performers for their age who have perhaps played more often than we might have anticipated for a couple of reasons. The level of injuries sustained by their senior colleagues has been one, and of course the financial climate that prevents us buying internationals wholesale is another.
Now I understand people getting frustrated, but frankly I would rather be watching a young side develop right now than watch a team of hired hands fail to deliver. Too often in the past this club has spent money rather than give kids their chance, but the two eras when the kids were given their head brought us our first double in 1971, then our best ever defence in the late eighties onwards.
Yes, adding world-class players like Arshavin to the mix when they become available, and we have the money, is brilliant too, but it is a mixture of those approaches that will bring success back to this club, and sooner than you may think, if you will only stop worrying just about who was out of touch in the last match and look at the bigger picture.
I completely agree on homegrown players..
is Denilson homegrown? I think we can hardly state that he is… did he ever play for the U18´s?
No, Denilson was bought and I think a big problem for us these last few years has been the quality of the players we buy. I agree that it serves no purpose to buy average players ahead of homegrown talent and that´s exactly my point. We should buy top class players but the squad players should be home grown.
however I appreciate everything Wenger is doing for the club but I don´t think it´s unfair for the fans to have an opinion, not everything he does is golden and he admits that from time to time.. a lot of these young players need patience in developing and it´s a matter of opinion how much should be given. Fabregas for instance was ready from the start but Song has taken 2 years coming on to look like the real thing.. how many points has he cost us in the meantime and how long will he stay??? The problem with these guys that he buys is that as soon as Real Madrid comes knocking they are gone
to clarify I think the Man U model for doing this has been the most successful.. to buy top quality like Rooney and Ferdinand and mix it with loyal homegrown players. I really envy them for having Giggs and Scholes there to help the young players and teach them that winning mentality.. our squad´s longest serving player is Kolo Toure I think..
If you call a business model that requires running up an operating loss of $40M a year and only being able to survive on the basis they do courtesy of the Glazers, and STILL get booted out of the FA Cup by an average side, you’re welcome to that version of success. (Including the purchase of the $33M penalty missing Berbatoss).
The beer cup final was interesting too. Old Red Nose promised we’d see his new babes, who did we see. Scholsie and Giggsy and and a very poor bunch of hopefulls who were very lucky to beat Spuds on pens.
And talking of defections to bigger clubs, are you betting against Ronaldo being a Madrid player by August? Tevez still being there? Your arguments really don’t hold water.
Read again ‘Holic’s very polite post 41. States the case better than I can. One thing I will say is that I feel very proud of the way Arsenal’s young talent is developing. It’s a pleasure to feel part of the growth of this young team. No doubt this squad will emerge as one of Arsenal’s best ever. If you’re really an Arsenal fan, enjoy it too.
The problem is not in developing youngsters but that once these youngsters have developed they often look for greener pastures. We are not able to hold on to our best talent.
Flamini, Cole etc. Yea, I hate them but that doesn’t change the fact that they left us after learning their trade here.
I never quite get the point when peoplestart talking about Flamini. He was with us for something like 6 seasons. He had one decent season. Before that we could not give him away.
I went to The Grove tonight to watch the U18s. They controlled a game that they managed to effectively end by half time. They knock the ball around like the first team do. There is some real talent there, believe me. I was particularly impressed with Coquelin. He looks a real one for the future. Frimpong also looks a good prospect in the midfield.
To be honest they all played well. The back 4 looked solid, midfield had the right balance and we were always a threat up front. I just hope that in the next 2/3 years when these lads have reached 20/21 that some might be just a little more forgiving of any short comings. I hope that fans have more of an understanding of their youth and give them the time to develop. That for some reason seems for some of you to be too much to ask for the likes of Denilson and Bendtner.
There is for me another issue here. My personal analysis of Tuesdays result is that apart from Arshavin, Gibbs, Walcott (when he came on) and Fabianski the below par performances were not only limited to Denilson and Bendtner. My point? There seems to be a stock default position of ‘blame the same old player/s’ everytime we experience a scoreline that doesn’t quite go the way we expect.
Did Sagna play well? Did Toure play well? Did Cesc play to his usual standard? What about Nasri? I’d say no to all!
As has been said, Denilson has had a long season pf playing many games. Yes, he has weaknesses in his game but he is an extremely talented and tireless worker whose abilities are not just limited to Arsene Wenger. Are we forgetting that Denilson has captained his country at every age group between Under-15 and Under-19 and received his first call-up to the senior Brazil squad back in 2007? This guy is no mug. Perhaps his only ‘crime’ is being surrounded by more flamboyant players whose technical skills and contribution are more abvious to the naked eye.
Re Bendtner, this kid interests me. In short, I think Arsene is right to exercise patience because different players progress differently. I think he will flower over the next season. If not, Wenger will sell him for a pile of cash.
Finally, please don’t compare us to Manchester United. Their business model has seen them haemorrhage cash on a bunch of wasted hopefuls….I’d confidently guess more than Wenger has.
Halli, there’s nothing wrong with having an opinion and expressing it here – that is what this blog is for. However if your opinion seems wrong or ill conceived to others they will disagree with it.
It is nonsense to compare Denilson directly to Alonso and Mascherano because they are both mature and seasoned internationals whilst Den is still young and comparatively inexperienced. However I don’t think anyone can fault Denilson’s effort and commitment over the past year or so. His performance hasn’t been faultless by any means and there have been mistakes but his attitude is good, he is talented and he will continue to improve.
I think perhaps that Bendtner is a bit cocky but he does work hard and has talent. The cockiness should diminish and be replaced with confidence with experience and maturity. He is still a very young player, both Henry and Drogba weren’t at their best until their mid twenties.
If you doubt the potential of talented but seemingly flawed players to improve you only have to review the recent ‘change’ in Song who was being castigated by many ‘fans’ only a short time ago. I always thought he was a decent player but that he would end up in central defence rather than midfield where what I perceived as a lack of pace would be less of a problem. I am glad to be shown to be wrong on that count.
Players will always move about from club to club and maybe ‘home-grown’ talent is more likely to stay than bought in mature players are. I agree that it is frustrating waiting for the young players to come through and then watching and waiting for the rough edges to be knocked off and the youngsters to gain experience and mature into what we want and expect them to be – some never do make it and disappear off to the Championship or some other club prepared to wait a bit longer for them to reach their full potential.
It wasn’t a complete performance from us on Tuesday evening because we conceded 4 goals, but so did Liverpool – who were at home – and I bet they are fuming about that. Our team will be aware of what needs to be done as will Wenger and what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger. I predict this team will get better but they need our support and patience.
There seems to be a stock default position of ‘blame the same old player/s’ everytime we experience a scoreline that doesn’t quite go the way we expect.
Very fair comment, Don. I was very nervous in my preview suggesting Sagna might not automatically return in place of Eboue, and earlier in the season I took some stick for suggesting Cesc could do with a rest. Players are human, and have their good and bad patches. Even the very, very good.
Alright, I agree that a lot of other players didn´t have a good game last night and to have Denilson shoulder the blame would be unfair but I stand by my opinion on their level of commitment and attitude, they are taking it for granted. To see someone like Diaby come on with a few minutes to go and just stroll around is awful. What really got me mad is that it felt a little bit like last years champs league ties against Liverpool where we showed a complete lack of ability to shut games down once we had the lead.. we usually concede right after gaining the lead and that must be down to a lack in concentration, I don´t believe in that much bad luck.
Good response, Halli and we’re ALL feeling the frustrations you’re feeling, man. Keep the faith though, Arsenal is on the verge of taking the footballing world by storm. It might begin to happen in the CL this season.
‘Holic, some good stuff here. You should be quite chuffed that your blogs inspire a good quality of comment and follow-up, quite uncommon on other sites.
Spot on BtM. I don’t want everybody to sing from the same hymn sheet, just to put their point of view across succinctly.
Halli, you are a welcome visitor, even though we may not agree.
…and thanks everybody. Some good debate as ever, from the ‘holics!
I concur….definitely! Real high quality discussion from contributors who know their Arsenal and clearly want the best for our team – apart from the fanny ;).
Thanks for setting the tone ‘holic.
Best
Yes, I agree, although I am more than willing to try and lace the place with the odd pun or too, even if 9 times out of 10 they go completely unnoticed.
*joins in*
My mind’s turning to the weekend and I’m trying to get inside AW’s head on team selection. An impossible feat, of-course, but none the less interesting for that. Middlesborough have everything to play for and, one way or another, they’ve managed to be a thorn in recent games. Nevertheless, Arsene must have penciled in “home win” in his journal for this one.
With the prospect of Manure in mid-week, I’d go with the balance of enough wisdom, leg resting, match sharpness and cup-tied considerations and field:
Fabianski
Eboue, Toure, Silvestre, Gibbs
Ramsey, Fabregas, Diaby, Arshavin,
Bendtner, Eduardo
IF I had an option, I’d rest Kolo, but with Senderos in Milan and Gavin Hoyte on loan, the cupboard is bare (isn’t it).
For the away game in the CL, Sagna, Clichy, Denilson, Song, Nasri and Van Persie would replace Eboue, Gibbs, Ramsey, Diaby, Arshavin and Bendtner. I’d keep Eduardo who’s more likely to nick an away goal than Ade.