The Post Mortem Overshadows Crucial Braga Trip
Nov 22nd, 2010 by 'holic
Unlike Paul, I was not on the road to Damascus when the possibility of conversion hit me. Just after half two on Saturday I was standing in row 27 of the faux-Clock End upper. Koscielny cleaned out Bale on the left, in not entirely dissimilar circumstances to his red card offence against Newcastle. Luckily Phil Dowd is a better referee than Mike Dean. Either that, or he knew the damage had already been done. Like umpteen times, in umpteen matches before, the set piece was lofted hopefully into the box, and everybody around me let out that same expletive they let out every time we face a set piece.
Kaboul. Really, Younes Kaboul!
Words I remember uttering pre-season hit me, and hard. Regulars will know I have been a vehement defender of the boss for the way in which he has single-handedly kept us in the Champions League places in the wake of the move to the Grove. Some obviously have a different perception of what has happened in that time that differs from what I am persuaded is the case. Money has been tight, and yet the football side of the business has been maintained at a remarkably high level under severe pressures, both financial and in terms of the expectation of those incapable of working out the situation for themselves.
However those pressures have eased considerably in the last financial year, and during the summer just gone it was widely accepted that funds were available for finally investing in what should be regarded as the core of the business. A relatively small outlay secured the services of Marouane Chamakh, and Sebastien Squillaci. Rather more was required to sign Laurent Koscielny. We sat through the embarrassing gentleman’s excuse me with Fulham for a goalkeeper marginally younger than Gunnersaurus’ ancestors, and waited in vain for further strengthening.
Even so, I recall being bullish at the start of the season, as is my nature. I do recall the proviso however. Should progress not be made this season it would be entirely down to Arsene. For the first time in the Grove years, I am led to believe, funds were available in excess of what was spent. The squad we have now (ok, with the exception of the goalkeeper Arsene obviously tried to sign) is one that the manager was entirely happy to go into battle with.
So as far as I am concerned this season our performance is less dependent on outside forces, and more under our own control. In my opinion, and this has not altered since the summer, the manager is entirely responsible for our performance this season. I remain a firm convert, but a distinct lack of what the man himself calls ‘mental strength’ is blighting our performances at home this season. The latest example of that would have hurt had it come against Blackpool, Aston Villa, or Fulham. It didn’t. It came against the worst possible opponent. Worse still it came in a contest that should have been over bar the shouting before the half-time bananas and energy drinks were laid out.
Ultimately the buck now very much stops with the manager, and to those who did not see the drinks earlier I would commend the excellent Arseblog piece today which saves you from having to read a lot more repetition from me on the issue. Now let me also make it clear I still believe, deeply, that we have the right man in charge. In the years prior to necessary frugality he did assemble two of the finest sides I have ever had the joy to witness. This team is not far from it, but needs I think some real character adding to it in January. Some cojones, if you will.
We’re not asking for much more, in all honesty, Arsene. Someone who can win the ball in the air at the back is not an optional extra, as we discover all too often. Someone capable of protecting that defence when Song gets the idea into his head that he is Lionel Messi would also help. A couple of grizzly buggers who will lead by example and lift the workrate of those around them when the going gets tough please. We are not all begging for trophies like spoilt kids in a sweet shop, but a degree of progress is essential. This lot is close, but needs dragging over the line, and the leaders don’t appear to be in place yet.
That is your responsibility, boss.
All of which leaves me short of space for a Braga preview. Now we will not be at full strength for what became a very important match when we fell in Donetsk. Don’t tell me finishing top of the group doesn’t matter. Everybody would prefer to be facing a group runner-up at home in the second-leg of the last sixteen. Thereafter I will agree you have to meet and beat a quality side for sure.
Clichy, Arshavin, and van Persie miss out. Are the latter two being saved for Villa? Quite why the brittle van Persie would be ‘rested’ otherwise is something of a mystery. Those who saw Braga at the Grove will need persuading that they will offer more of a threat at home, but surely they will. Gibbs will surely step up at left-back, and I would also recall Djourou in the hope of a bit more aerial stability at the back. Am I alone in also hoping Theo might get a run out on the left? Have you seen how many goals he scored in his Southampton days cutting in from the left onto his stronger foot?
The ‘holic pound is posted nervously on what would be a killer of a score after the events of the weekend. Fancy us to hold on to a 2-0 lead? It is the topical bet, and a nice potential little earner at around eights.
Those who are making the trip, or already there, will be in our thoughts given the strike action in Portugal on Wednesday. There are worse places to be stranded for 24 hours I guess.
Like the road to Damascus, maybe?
219 Responses to “The Post Mortem Overshadows Crucial Braga Trip”
First, first?
1st?
True storey
Damn you!!!!!
Sobering words ‘Holic.
The buck surely stops with AW, no arguments. His players and captain have their part to play in it too.
More balls and steel would be a very welcome addition in January. I wasn’t expecting much at all but maybe in the light of recent results it will be the purse strings that will finally be loosened as opposed to our bowels everytime we attempt to defend a lead.
Let’s toast a reactionary victory in Portugal tomorrow. The old one-nil will do us just fine.
Cheers all!
And a very good evening to you too usama…
True storey
HAHa just kidding mate! and a good morning,evening day and night to you.
A win for us on tomorrow and a 7-0 win for Bremen will be a reasonable tonic, I think.
I’m still at a loss as to why the back four was changed on Saturday. I’m not his biggest fan, but Djourou had been steadily improving and had been instrumental in the determined defensive performances in the two away wins at Wolves and Everton.
Kos is not up to it as yet and his stupid challenge on Bale gave them the opportunity they were not likely to get. As Holic says, it was the same as his sending off challenge against the Geordies.
These boys just don’t learn, do they?
Still pissed off, but COYRRR’s.
i think we should at least cut kolcieny some slack the lad is still finding his feet. no one(including himself and arsene) knew or wanted him to play this much. he should have been eased in but……
Ts, well in my man, a drink of ts’s choosing if you will holic. A man with cajones you say holic, I happen to think you could be right there, most people seem to be searching for a world class dm to strengthen our side, however a name keeps coming to my mind from days gone bye a player who came into George grahams team of youngsters who provided them with the nous and a calming influence to help them to a title their talent deserved. He came to the club mostly with comments from the fans of who and why but boy did he do a job. Kevin Richardson, probably largely forgotten by a lot of fans but someone just like that would be just fine by me
I agree about Walcott – his best position is coming from the left. Thats why at times he has looked half decent when wenger has used him in the middle because he takes every opportunity to drift to the left and then use his stronger foot for shooting (what about the Henry goal v Shaktar – wow). When placed on the right he looks awkward and and for me he is not improving enough. centre forward is not really his position in a 4-3-3 either. I think the left would suit him. But wenger is very stubborn.
*Henry STYLE goal of course.
you left me wondering there gazzap
I hate to say this as I love Arsenal to my bones. Is anyone watching Sunderland play Everton. I see committed players, playing the game with hunger and desire not like the prima donnas who regularly break and crush my heart wearing that noble red and white. Fight for the shirt, boys
Great call on Kevin R, Glenn. Won us the title in ’89 some would say.
I bet if you told the arsenal players they had to win every game 1-0, not 2-0, not 3-0, not 2-1, I bet they could do it. I bet they would win lots more games if they had the right attitude towards defending. they need to learn to love defending and that a low scoring win is not something dirty to be ashamed of.
Glennw – cheers and one for yourself mate.
Joshua – it will be enough if we win and LWC’s lose but it still won’t encourage me to type utter b*ll*cks on one of their blogs, the muppets.
usama – hugely offended 😉 so join me in a drink and it’s all forgotten…. unlike Saturday
Martins
i am i see them running like dogs biting and snatching at their heels that’s the spirit we are missing!
true storey
Im with you mate please don’t remind me of saturday only if we played with the commitment sunderland are playing with.
We need to sign somebody with big game experience, positive attitude and leadership qualities. It hurts to say this but somebody like Van der Vart. Glass of port for me please barman.
There wont be any change,there wont be any progress and Wenger will keep making the same mistakes as of the last 6 years.He cant see it,he cant understand it and he is bereft of ideas.There is a reason why this team keeps coming up short in vital games and keep making the same mistakes over and over and over again.Wenger has stood still tactical and squad wise for so long,he keeps thinking that replacing Bergkamp with Rosicky and Song with Vieira etc is logical but that would be the equivalent of me repacing my Lamborghini with a Wartburg there will be suffering along the way.In the summer the inevitable sale of Cesc will bring a shitload of cash…………will he bring in the needed replacements….will he fuck !!!!
A very good write up Holic
We have shown ‘cojones’ in our away games it has to be said so much hard work has been put into it, then what we do at home we fall apart. I agree Arsene is responsible for them, he trusts them and has been with them for some time now but I also believe the players have let him down big time and I hope they will pull their fingers out and start showing some balls.
I think you are spot on Holic, there are no real leaders on the pitch “Vermalen” I think is but whats the point talking about him when we don’t even know if he will play again this season. Other than that there are no true leaders there perhaps not yet this a young squad don’t we forget. Cesc perhpas should be more voacal too who knows, for me Arsene still knows and I’m sure he’s aware of this and I’m expecting him to beef it up in January.
I will also have to say this is one strange season so far, we are still in the mix there’s no question about that. Braga will be a good test, away from home in Portugal, our record is not very good there so it’s a perfect opportunity for the lads to change this and showing some ‘cojones’ as Holic would say.
I’ll drink to that!
Danish Gooner popping up after a shit result to deliver his usual rants? Big surprise there.
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Wenger should sign that Vermaelen guy. He’s looks to be a quality defender.
@True Storey, Indeed. It won’t make up for Saturday, but I’ll take it none the less. The only thing that will make up for that is a long unbeaten run, a win against Chelsea, and a thrashing of the LWC at WHL (you can throw in the League title while you’re at it).
both sides could have nicked it only if they had shown some composure. good game though. And its a good night from me all.
I hear you Charlie. My big fear is I am inviting that kind of negativity because I don’t accurately reflect what I’m feeling.
After Saturday, there is bound to be a fair amount of negativity around Holic.
These players have a lot to make up for – even Arseblogger appears to be at the end of his tether – “if we can’t learn our lessons maybe we need new teachers” I believe were his parting words.
I have nothing but respect for everything AW has done for our great club, but I am getting really sick of the same old excuses about lack of focus. You can bet your last dollar that Ferguson would have emptied a few of his squad by now if they had shown the same frailties over and over again.
Whatever happens tomorrow night, the players need to understand that every game counts, and they last 90 minutes plus. The second half performance on Saturday was not acceptable against any team, but given it was THEM, the rancid taste is going to last for a while yet I’m afraid.
Incidentally, WTF is it with Van Persie this time? Broken sweat glands?
Zico – Excellent mate, spot on and made me laugh too. Barman? A large one for Zico please.
Joshua – You don’t expect much do you? 😉 Somehow, The League Cup and runners-up to Chelski or Manure in the league isn’t going to cut it this season. Do we expect too much?
‘Holic @ #27
So are you harbouring some darker thoughts? Do tell….
No TS. Just concerned above is too dark. Maybe the emphasis isn’t right.
I don’t know ‘Holic, we are very negative at the moment could that be a reason?
No, not too dark. The more I think about it, it is a management issue.
Like you, fundamentally I’m an AW fan.
Perhaps, like the rest of the squad, even he would benefit from a little competition for his role? Pat Rice, hugely loyal servant to The Arsenal that he is, isn’t a manager in waiting. It is good management practice to have your successor hired and trained before you move on. Just thoughts….
No, I don’t wish for too much. Just for the team to fulfill their potential.
There really is nothing surprising about our troubles this season. Each season has been a microcosm of the last; an amazing lack of consistency that undermines the team’s ability to progress and grow. The problem does seem to be mental.
Wenger has to take responsibility for this. Last season he was widely reported saying that if the team failed to win any silverware he reboot his project. This never happened. He stuck with the same team, yet he is surprised that he is getting the same results.
Few players have truly progressed from one season to the next. Nasri is on the cusp of greatness, and Wilshire has been a revelation. Song has added some goals to his resume. Though I do not yet consider Song a world class DM, he may get there.
Most of the other players have not progressed at all, or are too inconsistent to be considered reliable. Diaby, Denilson, Clichy, Walcott, Vela, Almunia, Fabianski and Arshavin all fall into this category. Sagna is an excellent defender but offers too little going forward. Van Persie and Rosicky are excellent players but are too injury prone.
It is unfair to blame Squillaci and Koscielny for our defensive woes. It is their first season in the EPL. Defensive partnerships take time to be formed. Vermaelen is the captain of the defense and he is injured. And none of them were reponsible for the ridiculous errors that cost us the NLD. Nevertheless, it seems odd that Wenger would build a defense on non EPL tested defenders. Squillaci wasn’t even a regular starter at Sevilla. Lightning does not strike twice, and Vermaelen’s quick first season adaptation success was fortunate.
Wenger should have offloaded some players and brought in new ones – with a focus on players with experience and leadership qualities. I’m sorry, but players such as Denilson, Diaby and Almunia have had enough opportunities to impress. If Vela isn’t going to be utilized, he should be sold or loaned out.
Arsenal, for all of the technical brilliance of its players, has also become a shockingly one dimensional team. Which is FINE if you’re Barcelona.
Wenger needs to change the script.
the main thing is we qualify for the latter stages of the champions league . it would be heart breaking if our beloved directors who love money more than trophies were denied a chance to make more. lets not worry about actually getting a world class keeper or CB who would solve our total inability to defend simple long balls down the middle……..lets make sure these money grabbing champagne swilling bastards can avoid their lifestyle…COME ON YOU GUNNERS
Another great post, Holic.
Like you I am a fervent supporter of AW but cannot avoid the obvious fact that the “mental” problem with this team is down to the manager.
I prefer to read common sense criticism of AW rather than the ranting and raving from some of our more rabid bethren who call for a wholesale change.
AW achieved his initial success by building upon an excellent defence which he inherited and from whom he was able to obtain several more years of useful life and fronting those with a wonderful French midfield to support the finest signing we have ever made, Dennis Bergkamp.
AW is a very single minded individual and whilst that is not necessarily bad he does seem to be surrounded more by sychophants than challengers
Being “Head Boy” is all very well provided you have a support team who can keep you on your toes by presenting challenges, otherwise complacency creeps in; and I think that is where we are at.
I hear Gilberto Silva may be available in January. Now there was a defensive midfielder! Not pleasant on the eye, but effective.
Oki dokey sounds like your licking your wounds mate
Question: Why do we have to win at Braga?
Answer: because we blew up our lead in Donetsk.
When shall we ever learn?
And once we learn this specific lesson, what stupid mistake shall we make then?
Apologies ‘holics if I sound a bit negative, i realize that no one needs that right now, but the humiliation and anger I felt on Saturday left me speechless, it is only now that I’m more or less recovering from it.
Come on you gunners…please?
I’ll just have some hot chocolate barman, had enough alcohol during the weekend.
TS, not sure we want to follow the Chelsea plan of ditching the assistant based on subsequent results over there. The Ray Wilkins curse is alive and kicking and working in our favour, as well as in Pat Rice’s.
Love the post mortem. I think we sing from similar song sheets again. It is interesting reading the posts of others. Various threads emerge. Lack of experience, leaders etc have been mentioned by me and others. I often read of clamberings for new signings, but I would like to throw one further point into the mix. Why oh why do we let players go so early? Surely, even if they are not the players they once were that there is still both a playing and a mentor type role for them at the club? My thoughts go to players like Paddy, Gilberto, Kolo, Bobby and the like???? There are many others that would fit into the same category. Surely the increase in continuity would ensure those making the grade now have the true club values firmly engraved on their hearts?
Braga? Time for players to stand up and be counted. After the embarrassing shambles that was Saturday, this is a time for those to show how much it has hurt. I guess only time will tell if it means as much to them as it does to us.
Extract of wild boar cojones please, mr. barman. Also a glass of Patrick Vieira vineyards red, vintage 2002.
Just can’t get over Saturday. I have never seen a team score more goals than the number of attacks they had. They absolutely did nothing and yet they won.
Shattered, absolutely shattered.
Holic, somewhere in there did you actually suggest that Wenger’s time was up? 😉
Hi all,
I think we should wait till the end of the season before we can conclude/suggest that Arsene should go.
The optimist in me says that the law of averages caught up after 17 years on saturday. They had to win sometime, the C*nts.
But then, I’m really not that optimistic 🙁
Braga? Rather sounds like portuguese cuisine than a football club to me;)
Come on Arsenal. Come on Arsene!!
And what is this I hear about Fabregas’s hamstring? Hope he’s not carrying an injury still.
Any news on that holics?
Very good post.
The Wenger “way” puts vast numbers of high-paying bums on seats but also leaves us wide open to counter-attack. Until Wenger refines his tactics to include the option to close down a game and defend a league then what happened on Saturday will continue to happen. We will simply win some, lose some.
There ARE some players complacent but for the most part it is a very talented and strong group; it’s not the satellite navigation equipment that is wrong, it’s the route we are putting in it!
I can scarcely believe my eyes that RVP is being rested. Time for him to retire from International football or move on. And if there is ANY doubt as to Cesc’s long term commitment to the club he should go as well; that hamstring ain’t gonna get much better, he’s played too much, much to young – time to profit take and REINVEST in the playing staff not the debt reduction column.
My final name for the clear out is the maverick who is clearly a square peg in a round hole.
PS I agree with the guy writing about Sunderland; there’s a team playing to the absolute limits of their capabilities week in week out. The contrast couldn’t be greater.
So, tactics and complacency/under-performance; sort out those two factors and we’ll stop losing the battles and end up winning the war.
Sorry, “defend a lead”.
The maverick being Arshavin – writing this on my phone en route somewhere, soz.
You read nothing of the sort, Sajit. As usual. People like Danish and yourself are referred to in the piece however.
In case you hadn’t noticed we are two points off the top of the table, and very much in all competitions. The time for judgement is May, not November. In between now and then is a transfer window which can be used to address weaknesses which presumably the boss thought resolved.
What I am saying is that merely scraping fourth place and nothing else, with funding available, should for once cause the debate to happen.
Can I make it any clearer for you?
Morning all! A Bloody Mary for whomever is up and running.
I’m back after a 4 day fugue. I had an awful concoction of cheese, wine and chilli on Friday night – sent me into a coma. I remember some really weird hallucinogenic dream, where we were 2-0 up at half-time, and then….. ah, not to bother; you’d never believe it without the aid of mind bending drugs, so I won’t trouble you with it.
So… having lost 4 days of my life, I’m now looking forward to a decent Champions League performance. And then the Ashes.
Marvellous.
Good piece mate. God knows the likes of yourself and WST have paid your dues over the years. Say what you see!
‘I agree with the guy writing about Sunderland; there’s a team playing to the absolute limits of their capabilities week in week out. The contrast couldn’t be greater.’
I don’t know about that, they managed to be even worse in their local derby than we were for the second 45 minutes on Saturday. Maybe we have more in common with then than we think!
Holic and Holics know me for speaking my mind and having waited long enough I feel I should say this is the third post in a row and some of the comments they draw I strongly disagree with, I don’t remember it ever happened since I started nurturing my cirrhosis at this fine bar.
The call to arms didn’t resonate well. It’s hard to put a finger on it but it sounded like the football equivalent of crossing the line between patriotism and nationalism, an unwelcome dip in absolutism not in tune with the kind of love I have for Arsenal. It’s true I was expecting a tale from the past involving a remembrance of past derbies mixed with an acknowledgment of our exceptional streak against them instead. Unfortunately it looks like for many our historic achievement fueled a sense of entitlement beyond mere bragging more than anything else.
Unfortunately extremism is not compatible with objectivity as the funny jokes have made way for contemptuous belittling. The DVD meme is mightily enjoyable, even more so the VHS version but the misunderestimation of our foes’ team is completely out of touch with the reality. Not only does it make it sound totally hypocritical to be guilty of the same sin the players are accused of but if anything Spurs have come a long way since Juande Ramos and they will be more of a nuisance in the seasons to come independently of our own trajectory. They have spent more (much more) than any other club bar Citeh in the last 5 years, it’s not like they have qualified for the CL by chance (where by the way they perform better than their European counterparts like Valencia or Roma). Despite being ridiculous `Ary has a good chance again this season to qualify them again. More importantly their finances are in good shape and it looks almost certain now they will catch up on the gate revenues sooner than later. As it is today they have as much potential than Citeh or Liverpool for causing headaches and much more once they rack in twice as much money in their new stadium. There are no grounds to assert that a game against them will be the walk in the park it used to be.
The previous post was an understandable knee-jerk reaction but I’ll point out that this tone is guaranteed to attract the usual bunch of Arsenal haters who had been fearing so badly to have to shut up longer had we won. No defeat is reason good enough to read their bilious tripe.
Until this season there have been doubts that the team had the talent needed to win silverware, this season there is absolutely no doubt as the first half has proved again. They are certainly good enough that’s not where the problem lies but that’s what makes it even more painful to witness. We are losing games that we could win easily. We can’t fault the talent, the depth, the injuries nor external factors. It’s within the team and that’s where the deliverance has to come from.
jonesmalo
You talking about selling most of our players and replacing them with fresh ones for me that wouldn’t work and I will give you two blatant reasons why:
1. It would too expensive to do this yet we would sell but we would have to spend more, so very unlikely. Arsene would not jump on that wagon somehow.
2. We would head exactly were Citeh is now, great teams are built not bought. You do need a backbone to build on don’t get me wrong and quality players are required to do that.
We have quality players but this ‘mental strength’ is a big issue to me, Steve T is spot on, we did let players go early they never had time to pass on their leadership to others next in line.
I blame Koscielny for his mistakes and I think we have had enough evidence that perhaps too much was expected of him, I blame him as much as I will blame Clichy, Cesc or Fabianski for that matter, anyone in the team.
We need leaders and strong defenders if you look at the last drinks section someone has posted some great facts on our defence. I don’t want to hear we need to score 6 to beat a team it’s total nonsense, we need stand tall at the back and fight for every ball.
It’s not just our defence that needs sorting out, certain players need to be reminded what position they are playing in! Song you are not an attacking midfielder when you are two nil up you sit back a bit and give support simple as. We weren’t even holding on to our two nil lead we gifted them goals like there is no tomorrow, this is why negativity is amongst us.
It’s time for them to step up, if this will continue on happening certain things will need to change and certain players need to be told the truth.
I trust Le Boss will make the right calls!
Now bring on Braga it’s time to stop fucking about and show us if they truly believe as much as we do!
The darkness of the blog is fine.
It reflects what we all feel inside, completely empty. Our guts have been torn out.
Tonight might as well be Aldershot away, it matters little. We still have a home game against Belgravia or something who are basically goat herders and we only have to turn up to win.
And right there, contains the crux, in my dry throat from not enough coffee way, the *complacency*.
How come we can see it, and the best manager in the history of Arsenal FC can’t?
“Leave it to me” said Le Prof.
No probs Arsene, see you in May.
@55 Matt
Thank you, Matt, for that comment. In these dark and brooding times, we Gooners definitely needed a quick shake by the collar when we fall too deep into the abyss.
The wound is still fresh but your words are a welcome balm.
Morning Holic and Holics…
…I also agree that the buck stops with AW to an extent but here is something I prepaered earlier in repsonse to Holics main course…
…enjoy!
Holic and Holics…
Do we need a ruthless acquisition to the squad or a ruthless attitude?
This question has been asked since the disbandment of the Invisibles and cannot be ignored any longer!
I also read AB argument regarding the ruthlessness of AW, but as Winston pointed out, if he literally built the Invincible’s from scratch, then this may indicate a change in attitude regarding AW state of mind rather than an actual state of mind.
Since the youth policy I have noticed AW tries to be a little easier going with the youngster’s and the inexperienced. He tends to not want to knock their confidence (See: Fabianski).
So how about adding ruthlessness to the squad?
We have the pressing (Chamakh) the play making (Nasri Arsahvin etc), However the tricky thing could be where in the squad would this ruthless character play without displacing someone else, or stunting the development of another future star!
How about the attitude of the squad?
There is an argument that SAF doesn’t take gobshite off of his Manure’s young or old. So is it the players or the attitude of the players?
As stated, grinding out a result at Goodison and indeed against Man City would suggest the players can do the job, but their attitude has changed during certain games, namely home games.
So this season the question to address would be why the lacklustre attitude at home this season? Away from home in the PL there has been only two defeats, Shakhtar, their beautiful home record was at stacke in the CL, whereas, with Chelsea the players are now starting to believe that getting a result against Chelsea is far away and Chelsea must also think this about us too, hence the last few games. Although we all know Chelsea are not the same animal without their key players too! (See their last two PL games). A debatable issue for another time.
For sure Keowns point re: complacency is vital because until our players find a cure, their complacency disease will effect them for many games to come.
Sunday is supposed to be a blip by our standards and the attitude of the players should understand that but also act upon it, breath it and sleep it!
Great posts Matt and Goonertown
Barman drinks for them are on me!
Now we will hurt for while we all know that one deluded LWC brought his scarf into work to just to wind me up, would I do that? I don’t think so! Just goes to show how intelligent they are.
To ease the pain a win tonight is a must and I expect nothing else, and the a nice decent run in the league.
Come on Arsenal!
Arthur –
Thanks
Oh dear on your work colleague.
Thankfully for me I no longer work in Haringey (I know). But there were more Gooners there than there were LWC’s.
The few LWC’s where I am now are quiet and too confidently crushed to even be deluded enough to even believe that Sat was more than just a momentary blip. Which it was!
Although, I do have sniggering Scousers sniffing around me for some reason, as usual! (Puke) They seem to believe that by the time we win the PL another 5 times they would have won it again and kept their outdated record of more championship titles than us (sniff!). Whatever dudes, whatever!
As I said, I expect a win tonight and Saturday and to at least to progress to the SF of the Beer Cup!
Saying that, I will try to go lightly with complacency and nurse the anxiety generated from watching our matches nowadays, especially if we are not at least three goals up!
Okay with that said, we also need to bare in mind that December will be as much a test for us as November has been. Hence the following fixtures:
Manure away and Chelski @ home.
Other than that it will be the same old fixtures which would should win but…
…But yes, lets look forward to doing the business tonight.
I’m not betting on the outcome (of course), although I expect a win. But I will put a few quid down on over 2 goals. If Nasri is playing at least a goal from Nasri tonight should tide things over!
Talking of Super Sami- A win on Sat would have re-written history in regards to his reception toward Bill pre-match!In the meantime it provided valuable insight in to the current state of the mighty french contingent!
Cu’mon youuuu Goooners!
Nice piece Matt but some of the words are a little to long for me to grasp 🙂 I do agree with some but I dont think it was the defeat to Tottenham that has sent some over the edge although it certainly didnt help im still in a very very dark place i now know how those chilean miners felt – But it was the straw that broke the camels back with regards a few – To be complacent against your biggest rivals when you have a chance to go top is completly insane- Look at todays reports of Mclintocks spat with That fat oath Barry Dennis to see what it still means to him and hes hitting 70 🙂
Matt, as usual you explain your points well, but some brief responses are probably in order.
The ‘call to arms’ as you put it, was an explanation of what this match feels to large numbers of long-standing supporters born in close vicinity to each other. It is something that is asked of me by people who are distant from the event every time the derby comes round.
You seem also to confuse the banter of ‘belittling’ opponents, an integral part of interaction between us and them since Noah was a shipbuilding apprentice, and recognition of the fact (in my words) that “I’m expecting the visitors, at their strongest for a while we must admit, to come and have a right go too. “
I’ll ignore the highly doubtful bit about them surviving the new stadium construction (hence more than a passing interest in the much cheaper option of Stratford) because they are not my concern, but I will say if you think we had it tough with income from other property deals helping out, they face astonishing hurdles in reconstructing the swamp.
Finally, the ‘knee-jerk’ as you put it. I too worried about that, as you will have seen in the other drinks. I have explained, but obviously not well enough, why I don’t believe it is knee jerk. This side has proven nothing but it’s capacity to shoot itself in the foot.
For five years that has been understandable as an inexpensive creation of Wengerball mk 3 has taken place, while the great man has had one hand tied behind his back. That hand is now free.
We could make reasoned excuses for Hull, Stoke, Sunderland, Wigan, etc.. No more, I’m afraid. Fundamentally you and I still agree, I suspect, that Arsene is the best man for the job, and pray he does make progress this season. That means sustaining a challenge for the big prizes beyond March and April where we have run out of steam in recent campaigns. As I have said I don’t make the ‘silverware’ proviso.
Where we appear to have our first difference is that I now feel the situation has changed. We have resources that surpass those available to all but Chelsea and Citeh, and should they not be used then people have every right to question why. Arsene is certainly now accountable in a way I don’t feel he has been to this point. We cannot bury our heads in the sand and deny that irrationally any longer.
I am not fully recovered from Saturday’s loss yet. is it safe to come out and read blogs now?
Holic. Your last para @63 sums it all up for me. It is the point I have been trying to make since April. The question is as a club, do we maximise our potential? Do we get the best that our resources can give? Can we improve our playing staff with the money we have available?
I think we can improve and have the funds to do it. I trust AW implicitly with my club. I also think that it is not major adjustments that need to be made. But I will be devastated if we fall short again, when for the first time we actually had the means to deal with the weaknesses that seem to be aparant to almost all of us.
Up the Gunners…..
Hi All
I think the solution is something AW will not want to contemplate. A new assistant. Being in my late 50’s I have an inordinate love of Pat Rice as the 71 double was won when I was 17 and the entire squad will always have a special place in my heart.
However I think PR has to move aside and AW needs a strong assistant with his own ideas who will challenge him and if necessary have a real ding dong with him when things go wrong.
AW needs to be challenged on his decisions both on and off the pitch on a regular basis and asked to explain them by a person with a comparable football knowledge to his. Someone he respects. If this happens I believe he is an honest enough man to respond positively to constructive criticism.
What should’nt be allowed to happen is for him to be left to continue in his own cosseted executive bubble making all the important decisions in isolation and presenting them as a fait accompli to his staff and players. We have had that for the last few years and quite plainly it stopped working some time ago.
The man needs to be challenged. We all need to be challenged to do the best we can and until that happens there will be more Saturdays like the last one and more seasons like the last one
Van Persie is not in the reserves squad playing Wolves this afternoon I wonder why Arsne wanted to rest him?
Ramsey and Almunia are playing it will be nice to get Ramsey back just off the topic.
Good points Holic, there is nothing stopping us from investing in the squad now, let’s be fair we don’t need a spending spree just few adjustment in my opinion.
‘nasri @ #41
Ho! I’ll explain myself better. Wasn’t suggesting we get rid of Pat Rice, far from it. His loyalty and skills would should surely merit an alternative coaching/management role at the club.
What I was suggesting is that AW could benefit from a strong foil whom he respects and listens to when said foil disagrees with Arsene. Pat, allegedly, isn’t that kind of character. AW is with us for 4 more seasons as manager. He will want to help hire his replacement – he made a public statement about that around the time of his contract renewal. My thoughts, no matter how flawed, were that it might benefit Arsenal (and therefore AW) if we have a strong No.2 i.e. a No.1 in waiting.
Barman? Whatever ‘nasri’s drinking. I think he always argues his points well 🙂
‘nasri again,
It appears Neil C and I have similar thoughts. A close Gooner friend of mine planted the seed in my head last summer.
Everyone needs to be kept honest one way or another, even great men like like Arsene.
Barman? More drinks please for ‘nasri and whatever Neil C wants too.
Cheers all!
Spend how much Holic? You actually think its a problem with quality in this side? We have invested sufficiently in the squad – and with some good luck, our GK situation also seems to have been resolved.
On paper, we have one of the strongest squads in the premiership.
Irrespectve of how many points united or chelsea drop , Arsenal just dont have the fight or desire to win anything.
I’m not for one moment suggesting that Wenger has lost his hunger to win..But as it is obviously apparent he has lost it in him to inculcate any sort of discipline / fight / whatever you want to call it into his team.
Arthur,
Wonderful to see Rambo back in action. Hope he has a good game. He’ll get a huge and emotional standing ovation when he returns to the Ems. That’s something else to look forward to after Saturday’s nightmare.
PS: I had a quick Skype chat with on an old Gooner acquaintance yesterday. I asked him how he was coping with Saturday. His reply “it didn’t happen”. Complete denial! Made me chuckle….
Barman? A drink for ATG as well please.
Sajit,
Your glass is half empty friend. Would you like a top up?
I’ll have one TS I really need one now….
Er, bad day at work Arthur? 😉
Cheers True Storey.
TS,
Something like that yes…nothing I can’t handle though
ArthurTheGooner is ‘deleting all LWC supporters computer accounts from active directory’ he he
Excellent, it’s back to the swamp for the marshmen….
…. The air quality in the bar is already fresher. It’d be nice to be able to close the windows again, as it’s November.
Were any of you able to watch or follow live commentary of Ramsey’s match? Apparently ATVO doesnt support linux.
And I coundt hear it.. A pity.
http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/ramsey-free-video
Sajit
There is no live commentary or video feed there is only live text updates from ATVO
For those not on Twitter:
Arseblog:
Worrying reports of Robin van Persie being spotted out and about wearing one of those big medical boots. Will try and confirm.
Thanks for the link TS 🙂
Gents, here’s a type of explanation that i’ve not heard before.
An army friend (a medic), just back from Afghan, reckons that a good few of our players have a type of post traumatic stress disorder.
It goes something like: Having seen a few of your team get broken legs/ankles etc in supposedly honest open play, the stomach for a ‘fight’ is diminished.
Interesting.
Evening ‘Holic, ‘holics! Pre-match Guinness, please. I’ll have to pay later, times are a bit sparse on fronts other than the beloved Arsenal.
The bar- and excellent posts, thank you- have turned reflective and very thoughtful of late. I greatly appreciate a place such as this to turn to as the shit seems to be hitting the fan (especially coming from Oakland, where we’re ranked high in murder and extremely low in Arsenal support).
A thought to share: I do believe, as many including Arsene, that a collective mental block is our primary problem. He has said many times before that at this level, mental strength is often the primary difference between winning and losing teams. It strikes me that in our team’s youth we have creativity and a certain freedom of play at times, but a non-belief born of non-experience in being able to pass our opponents and arrive top of the hill first, and strongest. While our players are young, it is true that many of them were much younger when they arrived, and have grown together from boys to men, literally and sportingly. Yet in their ranks there has been little contact with those who were already men and already knew the test of being a champion. I don’t think this can be overlooked in the slightest, particularly at this level. I think a subtle but incidious oversight of this on Arsene’s part is playing no small part in our current struggle.
I remember as a boy who loved BMX biking the first time riders started doing backflips off jumps. It was an amazing and courageous thing to watch those first few experts overcome the challenge of something that hadn’t been done before and accomplish it. They were the elite. Two years later, I watched 12 year olds from the neighborhood doing backflips as easily as they ate grilled cheese sandwiches. A barrier of understanding of what was possible had been broken, and for those kids who got to have leaders before them, they followed with no mental block at all.
I hope this isn’t too cryptic or boring for you all (if anyone’s still reading my little rant), but it strikes me that our players literally do not know true success. (I understand the obvious contradiction of having World Cup winner as a captain, but their are clear, problematic issues with translating his role at the WC with that Spanish team to leading us at the Arsenal- some time later.)
Whether we need to bring in folks who had not been raised with our boys and know something else they can bring to the mix, whether we should have been keeping our players longer as was mentioned- the Gilbertos, Edus, Vieras, Pires’s’s(?), or Arsene needs to turn up the pressure on them rather than fatherly supporting them- I don’t know. All worthy suggestions. But I think the lived understanding of Championship as a reality does not exist in this team, and we won’t achieve it until something changes. In other words, the ‘attitude’ won’t change until something else more dramatic does.
Thanks for the space, ‘Holic, and to everyone’s thoughts. Barman, please fill a round of whatever everyone’s drinking. From oakland, with love.
Arthur, apologies. Got home to find your last post in the spam filter. There is absolutely no reason for that to have happened. I’ll keep an eye on things later.
84 Mark the Spark
Wolves 0-2 Arsenal
🙂
Evening all.
I wouldn’t worry too much that your posts may be percieved as dark Holic, any Arsenal fan worth his salt would have an adverse reaction to Sat’s result.
Matt, you’ve made some good points, your a great and loyal gooner, not sure if you fully grasp the magnitude of “hate” that surronds the NLD though, a bad result against your local rivals can totally fuck up your year. I don’t mean this in a disrespectfull way, but this is a feeling that only people from the imeadiate area truly understand.
As for our shortcommings, I don’t believe that this is an attack thing, a midfield thing, a defence ineptitude or so called lack of a decent keeper problem. It’s not what we have, it’s what we lack and its a thing that no amount of money will get you, imho what we lack is a killer instinct.
We had the spuds on the ropes, for 45 mins we battered the crap out of them and left them bleading on the roadside after a hit and run, but instead of doing the right thing (i.e reversing and driving over them a few more times, before stepping out the car and whalloping their lifeless carcus with a big stick)we let the paramedics (Arry’s alf time talk) patch em up. So there was still life in them to come back at us.
Get rid of the complacant attitude and instill some ruthlessness, then and only then will we be completly ready.
Lets get back to business tonight COYRRR.
Pint for me, one for Matt, your goodself and all who care to join us.
Cheers.
I’m in for one. Cheers, Holland.
No worries Holic
I kind of gathered Akismet had issues with me.
Come on you Reds!
Away support is awsome !!!
@Steve-O, Arthur & chippy: thanks for the kind words, like all of us there’s a maelstrom of conflicting emotions in my head and I found it difficult to write this comment, I’m still not very satisfied with the way it came out but that’s the best I could come up with.
@Holic: My wording was poorly chosen to describe the preview, as I said I found it hard to pinpoint my thoughts. To make sure my hurting brain was not playing games on me I read again your earlier introductions to the Derby (posts 63, 298, 368, 432, 1353, 1540, 1914, 2338) and certainly the last one was a significant departure from what you got us used to. You mention you feel the situation has changed but from that post alone I would venture your epiphany came before the game, or at least it was already lurking.
I was never even remotely interested by the Spuds but re-reading your old pieces made me curious and a bit of research reminded me that the last team to lose against them in the league is the exact same one most of the critics put forward to underline the progress our current team has yet to make. I’m sure the irony will not be lost on anyone when rediscovering the team’s composition on that fateful day of November 99: Seaman, Dixon, Adams, Keown, Winterburn, Overmars, Petit, Vieira, Ljungberg, Bergkamp, Kanu.
Luckily for us we then went on for a record-breaking 20 derbies without a loss until last Sunday. It was historical for another reason: before this extraordinary run courtesy of Arsene Wenger, we actually had lost more of those derbies than we’d won. 45 losses for 43 wins just after the `99 defeat to be precise. That fact certainly puts the unbeaten streak in perspective and the extraordinary achievement it represents.
I’m certainly guilty of conflating your post and the holics’ comments while making my point but the irrational confidence they exude are not a figment of my imagination as everyone can check for themselves. Undoubtedly the 20 unbeaten derbies record explains a lot of it.
As for the other points, I have the feeling we ought to wait a bit before delving in an healthy debate as the emotions are still too raw on all sides.
Away support is fucking awesome.
Eboué isn’t very good though, is he? :-s
Great points Matt, you’re a mine of information and always a good read from my perspective.
Barman, a pint for Matt please and one for yourself.
PS: Chavs are 1-0 down at home – heh!
Come-on Arsenal, we’re bossing this game – just make the net bulge…. lots.
@Holloway2Holland: I flatter myself in understanding the rivalry and the feelings it generates even if I’m not sharing all of them. But as you’ve surely noticed by now, the rational part of my brain tends to reassert its control pretty quickly when it loses it (still too often for my taste).
Certainly if the season were to end tomorrow it would be a terribly bitter memory but we’re one third into it and I can’t prevent myself from acknowledging we still have an outsider chance, probably more so than when the season started. As I’ve said too many times already this is a rocky/bumpy season and we’ve not seen the last of it.
Eboue is making me nervous!
Matt any time my man!!! 🙂
Yes the away support is unbelievable!! Up the Arse
Ok Holics
Not a bad first half considering this meantal shyteness! Braga are trying their best and I think it’s fair to say the are second best at the moment.
Ohh boy am I scared for the second half….only joking!
Focus, Focus and Foucs please lads….
Eboue and Denilson are having torrid time!
What a shit 1st half. Theo needs to get into the game more. Not great though. Need to turn it on a bit 2nd half and put this to bed once and for all.
Djourou is playing well. We so need to win this just to right the ship. First match of a long long unbeaten streak….we haven’t had one in ages.
Drink. I need drink.
It can only get better 2nd half right?
In control but creating very little. Need to sharpen up 2nd half. Must say arthur i thought denilson was doing quite well. It is in the final third where we need to sharpen up.
Steve T: Indeed, time to release the handbrake.
On a side note, many thanks to the oligarch for pushing the self-destruct button on his team. Let’s hope he will rehire Grant for the final touch.
First C. Ronaldo, then Nani, now the whole Braga forward line.
Is it encouraged to dive and cheat in the Portuguese league? Really disgusting stuff.
Oh, and Eboué dives sometimes too. He really should stop doing that.
Where’s our friend “Eboué’s hand” when you need him? 🙂
Braga shirts make this far too much like Arsenal vs Arsenal….. the red shirted ones look like our 1983 offering both in shirts and ability
Rip roar rip roar give us a song.
Oh…..Chelsea losing again….to Norwich, sorry Zilina Rovers…
Come on you REDS!!!
YELLOWS !!
Come on you YELLOWS!!!
😉
They are diving bastards, aren’t they. Side note: Captain’s frustrated, eh?
What the hell is going on???
erm….as Bendtner said he’s “in the form of his life”…..
We seem rather… unfocused.
What’s going one ‘holics? I thought Cesc would be on the pitch tonight. Where is he?
Shakstar are 2 nil up as well and they will top the group if we wont win this one!
Not as in Wenger: ‘we lacked a bit of focus” but as in they don’t know why and what they are playing for.
Come on Gunners!!! Wake the fuck up and show us what you got!
Cesc crocked himself again….shit
The commentators and fuck off about the hamstring- this goes deeper than that, it seems quite clear to me.
Cesc is off Hamstring! AGAIN!
Bendtner’s first touch is a pass. Why does theo go passed people and then stop. Looks like a good decision to play cesc. Can someone explain to me why van persie needs a rest???
@ ATG 110:
I think that our boys are defending their 2 goal lead against Sp*rs, that’s why they’re taking it easy and running down the clock.
Oh wait, wrong game…
We need to win this, Shakhtar are 2-0 up.
Fabregas off injured (hammy)
We’re not creating much.
Not really what we were hoping for….
Come on Arsenal!
I know probably based on my posts of late it may come off like I don’t deeply respect who Cesc is and what he’s done for us. But I actually think it may do us some strange good to have Nasri step back in with Wilshere in the middle and let their passion and skill drive our game while Cesc sorts out his hamstring and mental hamstring.
Come on…score from the corner Gunners !!
That was better!!!!
I say Theo to Chamakh for one nil… come on Gunners!
Rosicky to score….finally?
Vela for Theo? Interesting…
Brilliant call… FFS.
booked Vela for being fouled in the box…unreal !
FUCKING REFEREE!!!!!!!!!
WTF? It’s a blatant PENALTY!
Dirty bastards!!!! That was a red!!!!!
How the fuck has the ref missed that? He has had a shocker tonight. What the fuck is the point in having officials behind the goal line?
Nothing, Steve T, nothing. It’s fucking amazing how useless they are. Unbelievable.
Finally we WAKE UP!
COME ON YOU ..err..YELLOWS!
I think the ref is trying to make us feel better – just proving that it is possible to perform worse than Arsenal! This is shit. Apathy is descending once more.
PIK @ #122
Fair points, it would be good to reduce the dependence on Fab4. Villa away might just be the perfect setting to test your theory out. Drink?
Foul on Eboue and he doesnt book him WTF?
as I was saying….
And look at that….
h-o-l-y f-u-c-k
FUCK NO!
TS, my friend, I need a bottle right about now. Cheers though. Let’s have at it, shall we?
JUST FUCKING GREAT !!!!!
a long ball leading to a conceded goal….us?
Where’s our defence?
I will personally fly to fucking where ever and slap this ref in front of his children. Diving cheating fucking Braga.
painful…..
COME THE FUCK ON ARSENAL!!
We need the point less than we need to stop them from three!
And would you believe it? Another unbelievably basic error at the back costs us again. But all is fine. No, really it is. We are just about to dominate the world remember?
Definition of stupidity; Doing the same thing time and again, and expecting different results.
Enough. Roll on the Ashes. This shower of shit has lost me for the time being.
Vela was fouled again….this is a farce really
Stece t, I’m just as pissed as you are, but get a grip man.
GET A GRIP. Support the team during the game at least.
@TM 153- our ineptitude combined with this fucking ref’s is WAY too much to stomach.
Come on Arsenal dig deep…
COME ON ARSENAL! COME ON ARSENAL! COME ON ARSENAL!
This REF IS TOTAL FUCKING DISCRACE!!!!
It’s okay Gooners, if we mix up our away form in the league with our home form in the Champions league, we may be about to win the double.
COME ON YOU GUNNERS!
Loud and clear, Arthur!
Rvp. I assume you are trying to be funny? Make light me the situation?
COME ON ARSENAL COME ON!
Now that is a finish. God fucking damn it.
Hahahhahahahhhahhahhahahahahahahaha.
Absinthe please.
OH MY FUCKING GOD
I have had enough of watching yet another pile of shit!!!!!!!
Catalan, we need something stronger. Like a bullet.
I’ll have a bottle of Clan Campbell please.
wow……we really are in shambles……
and why do we tend to lose two on the trot so often?? Can the Denilson experiment end now please?
That’s a well deserved loss.
Nothing can beat the feeling I had on Saturday though.
i’m losing focus
Fucking hell – Richard Keys is having an orgasm. What an end to the night.
Forget the penalty – more bullshit tonite – no urgency shown until we go a goal behind. Fecking nonsense.
Catalan @ 152 – I’m with you – here’s hoping the Aussies don’t let us down as well, eh? 😉
Only bright spot for me tonight: we lost Eboué to injury.
..
What?
yeah this loss was far more predictable
Anything less than a win Saturday is going to be very difficult to swallow…..
If this doesn”t get them an epic hairdryer treatment from Arsène, I don’t know what will.
Barman, a Clan Campbell for me pl–
Barman?
Where is the barman?
RVP. I will bear your words in mind as i head to villa park on saturday. Must remember to support my team.
Not much more to say. Same old same old same old same fucking old. Bored with excuses for it all. We beat that shower 6 nil only a few weeks ago. The ref was shite but that still does not account for glaring errors and creating nothing. Would the pen have made a difference? Who knows. Quite possibly. But yet again we were very very poor.
Pires – a bullet washed down with Absinthe then.
I’ve made an executive decision – not spending my time watching the Villa game. Will play with the kids and then watch the rugby. Life is too short.
I think Arsenal may have stolen the incompetence award from the ref at the last second. I assume that he’ll never be allowed near anything more than Sunday League again?
The worst week in my arsenal life. This is getting rediculous
Tippy Tap Football that goes nowhere – Check
No Width – Check
One Man in the box to aim at – Check
Denilson on the pitch – Check
Uterly Abject at the Back – Check
Totaly clueless – Check
Wenger throwing his arms around like a demented chicken – Check
Arsenal Defeat – Check Mate
lucky I was numb before tonight so that really hasn’t hurt as much as it should.
Goodnight,
what a load of shite
1st half cesc/theo/NB absolutely useless
2nd half ref useless – load of diving ballerinas, nudging foals by the score and 2 (yes 2) penalties for Vela turned down
when eboue went off , putting Rodsicky at right back was idiotic, the defence was stretched impossibly and 2 goals ensued what a managerial cock up
our man of the match was Jack
theres was a Hungarian with a whistle
double Cognac with vodka chaser please barman
@Zico haha! Have a pint on me for cheering me up, you sweaty!
i hate november
What have we learned, people?
I think Didier Drug-Bar summed it up best, “It’s a F*cking disgrace.” You know, the Dallas Cowboys just fired their head coach and are now 2-0 (after starting the season 1-7)…
I’m just sayin’
Very, very, very poor. Arsene has been so depressed about Saturday`s defeat that he has allowed a slight seige mentality to seep in to our play, hence tonight`s result. Forget about penalty claims, 10 men etc., we deserved to be beaten by an intrinsically inferior Braga side. In future Arsene, you`d better keep the negative thoughts to yourself , as you usually do. I am now beginning to fear the trip to Villa, as this could become a cancer that will ruin our season before Christmas.
So, we have to beat Partizan @ home to ensure qualification….
We’ll probably do it but boy are we making life difficult for ourselves at the mo’.
And it all started so well, with 3 wins from 3 and record numbers of goals. That’s football for you I suppose.
Stand firm fellas, it hurts , it pains but it’s nothing like Saturday and all is still not lost.
I think some serious player counselling is called for. Same for us fans!
Barman? Copious amounts of your nastiest alcohol for Tim, PIK, ATG, Rrf, Catalan, Steve and anyone else who’s currently holding their head in their hands at this bar.
and before anyone asks this is not a knee jerk reaction.
Our confidence is in the toilet. It’s a shame because we started playing better with Nasri’s introduction. It will take time to recover from this week but I’m with Pires is King. We need leaders and they can only emerge faster if Cesc is not on the pitch.
Don’t think anyone at the club will take the next CL stage qualification for granted now…
Head is up, TS. Cheers. But this shit needs to get sorted. This is not about being angry that we ever lose. It’s being angry that we ever play like we’re playing.
Standing firm is in order, I agree. Long season to go, we all stomached last Spring’s capitulation, renewal, capitulation. Let’s get behind the boys, screaming as needed, and get them over this fucking hill.
Bottom’s up, TS!
@ BiscuitBum,
I think this team needs some siege mentality. Forgive the link ‘Holic, but here is the medicine that this team needs:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZJcAeJ8YRo
AKB (Not so sure…)
When will we learn that no champions league game is easy especially away and we always play a weaker team when we think we are home and dry time to play a weak team is when you’ve qualified. bad week but as I’m old I can remember worse, you have to support them through tihick and thin. Feel sorry for wilshire he was the only one with a bit of passion and balls and he’s the youngest and smallest sums the rest of them up!!!!!!!!
Brook my friend, you’re kidding right? Do you remember the 70s? We were looking like relegation candidates in ’74. I don’t want to tempt fate but it could be so much worse right now.
so…if shakhtar wins/draws their last match, it’ll mean that we’ll end up 2nd in the group thereby opening up a possibility of facing bayern/barca/real/lyon…
we love to make it difficult for ourselves, don’t we?
I’ll be honest with you holics, I’m not even that disappointed/sad/angry:depressed.
I think I’ve exhausted all those emotions on saturday.
It’s all-right Steve, I realized I made a translation mistake after Holic pointed it out. I meant immediate reaction or on-the-spot reaction. Knee-jerk not only does not mean what I had in mind but is slightly pejorative to boot. My apologies.
Good luck to you RVP. I for one am unbelievably and mightily fucking pissed off.
Just think we could be top of the league by 2.30 on Sat seems unreal after the week we’ve had
RVP,
Yes. like most of us. We’ll have to accept the runner-up spot and a tougher first knock-out stage. Oh well, we might as well start playing some hot teams. God knows the experience will be good for the team and look what happens when we play shite teams like Braga and, er, Spuds 🙂
Talking of the LWCs, I’m expecting some smelly, illiterate gloaters on her tonight after that result.
Barman? Dettol and industrial carpet cleaner at the ready please!
I can’t tell if this is totally petty of me but I agree with Stonroy after Saturday thinking there is seriously something wrong with none of the players standing up after Saturday and taking responsibility/ apologizing to the fans. Am I being ridiculous? It’s not so much that I care personally but it would show we I cannot tell if it’s there which is that they actually really do give a fuck. Cesc apologized for a Spain friendly defeat, but you’re captain of the first derby loss in ages! And not just Cesc, fucking anyone.
AG,
That is my point exactly. It really is that kind of season. Not syaing we deserve it at the moment but it’s a distinct possibility.
Good call, True Storey, but they can Troll all they fucking want. Even at a moment like this they’d prefer to be us, sorry lot.
True Story
We’ll get Real in the next round spank them then lose to wigan at home the next game after being 3-0 up with 10 minutes to go nothing surprises me at the mo
PIK @ # 200!!!
Top man! The sad thing is, it’s true. 50 years of real mediocrity and counting. We feel the same by only qualifying for the CL.
AG,
Heh! And that’s why we love The Arsenal… or not sometimes.
Pint o’ vodka fella?
Matt as far as I’m concerned Nasri didn’t do anything better than Cesc, as soon as he went off went we conceded…. only then we started playing.
I’m sorry to say but Cesc carried an injury and most our squad couldn’t care less if we won or lost apart from very few indviduals!
Jack
Rosicky
Cesc
and at least he tried!
See you boys later in the week. Somehow I have to go pretend to work now (being mid-day).
Come on Gunners, you glorious bastards!
Cesc tried his best but what can he do on his own when players like Bendtner is always out of position!?
True Story
After this week have you got any meths ?
Roll on Sat can’t wait
so so dissapointed but nothing like saturday i think we hit rock bottom that day. just have this sinking feeling.
ps: the refree and his pack of cunts were shitty mega cunt nuggets he should go jump of something…..
AG – that’s the spirit! (groan)
Ref lost our game, Braga did not make it easy for us and that was expected….
I hate to say but I disagree with most of you tonight!
Lads tried the foul on Wilshere desreved a RED! Little niggle fouls everewhere… no card….
We fouled straght yellows now will you please get behind the lads rather than slating them….
Even if we at the time of decline you should be behind them!
Come on Arsenal!
Arthur,
Not sure what game you watched, but as soon as I read references to the referree, my eyes gloss over. It was all there to play for, and, as we have done in the past, we respond with milk-toast attitude and endeavor. Can’t blame the ref – we should have created and finished more. Can’t blame Braga – we should have played them off the pitch.
I don’t like the eyes of this squad right now. Dark clouds of the “BBB” are gathering.
What have we learned?
What really gets me is that i am sure that most of us knew things like this would happen. That is what frustrates. It frustrates like hell. The comments above are right. Where is the heart? Where is the desire? We should have qualified after 4 games. We go into the 6th needing a result. Why?
And do you know the worst part of it all? If those cunts down the road get a result tomorrow night then they go through. They qualify before us. We should not even have to contemplate that.
I for one can not just say oh well, bring on Saturday. It means more than that to me.
@ Austrian Gooner
Great point…we might well be top of the table in 90 hours and the most pissed off supporters in the land.
Lost 2 in a row twice this season…3 times last season (and 3 on the trot once). I see a trend and it’s not Arsenal-like.
I’ll be up to watch at 530am on Saturday because I’m a mug……
Lonestar are you on drugs? cant blame the ref
Arthur. The ref did not cost us the game. He was shocking. A real homer in the full sense of the word. But we were shocking. Created next to nothing, defended like 6 year olds and had the heart of a fly. Ref was shocking but our failings cost us. To believe anything else is clutching at straws.
When we lost last season 3-0 at home to Man U we were well beaten by the better side,same goes for Chelsea at home last season.On Saturday an inferior side best us,same tonight.We have every right to be fucking angry and Wenger and the players need to take a long hard look at themselves and start playing with some fuckin heart and passion.I don’t include Jack in there,he’s the only one who fuckin tried tonight.This kind of inept performance had to stop or people should move on.
Yes, the ref and his mates were totally inept, but we weren’t much better. Unfortunately, a fairly typical UCL away performance.
Three days to get their heads right and remember who they are playing for, because you know full well that the support they’ll get at Villa Park will be deserving of much more than this. Over to you Arsene and Patrice.
Back to basics, start doing the simple things, keep the fucking ball, take some responsibility and above all else, win the fucking game!
Guinness extra cold and keep ’em coming please barkeep. In need of plenty.
Usama,
Please see Steve T @ 216. If you play the game, any sport really, then you realize that blaming the referee is a fool’s errand. You play your game; you play it with comittment; you play it to the hilt. Sometimes your opponent cheats (if he gets away with it – so should you). Sometimes the referee is a dick. Sometimes the breaks don’t go your way.
But I do know that if you play your game (if Arsenal plays its game) with comittment, hunger, and a bit of malice – you win more than you lose (we have done that) and, when you do lose, you don’t lose like we did on Saturday to the vultures.
What have we learned?