Soixante Neuf, As We Say In Wiltshire
Jun 1st, 2011 by 'holic
The discovery of Bobby Gould on Twitter brings back memories that are never far from the surface. Those of my generation can probably guess how many times I get reminded of the 1969 League Cup Final now I am living in Swindon. What should have been the best day of my short life to that point turned into the first lesson that football can sometimes be a very hard and well-aimed kick in the Royal Alberts.
I should put it into context for the majority of you, fortunate to be much younger! I was not exactly born in a golden era for Arsenal Football Club. I was eleven when finally we reached a Cup Final, and ‘holicdad was as mortified as I when he realised it clashed with us moving house. Denied my first taste of seeing Arsenal at Wembley I had to content myself with the highlights of our single goal defeat to Leeds United. I can’t remember being too gutted. Leeds were a team on the rise, and we hadn’t won anything in fifteen years.
A year later we were back at Wembley for a second consecutive League Cup Final appearance, and this time it was supposed to be different. For a start we had tickets. Better still the opponents were a third division outfit, Swindon Town. The memories are obviously patchy, the detail dimmed by the pint or two that have passed my lips in the ensuing 42 years. I do remember the first thing we bought were bright yellow and blue rosettes. “Arsenal won’t lose a Cup Final in yellow, son”, ‘holicdad assured me. “We beat Liverpool in 1950 wearing yellow, it’s lucky.” Indeed that had been Arsenal’s last triumph at the old Twin Towers.
The omens were in our favour. All week Swindon fed us with gloomy injury news. This was going to be a stroll in the park now, surely? The trouble is they were being less than truthful with their press releases, and fielded a full side built around the pace and trickery of the winger, Don Rogers. Arsenal, on the other hand, had covered up a flu epidemic that had raged through the club in the lead up to the match, not wanting to give their opponents any sniff of a weakness.
Let’s get the second excuse out of the way as well! Prior to the game the Annual Horse of the Year Show, normally held in the Wembley Arena, had been staged in the stadium itself. Under grey skies a sodden pitch, churned up by an army of horses hooves so recently, turned into the sort of surface that clung to weary feet, and sucked the life out of heavy legs. There is no doubt that Arsenal tired quicker on the day, supporting the illness stories, but to be fair they should have won the match comfortably enough in ninety minutes.
A check on reports, even in the Swindon press, confirm my memories that Arsenal largely laid siege to the Swindon goal, but in between the sticks Peter Downsborough simply played out of his skin. John Radford hit the bar, and Bobby Gould the post. “Never like it when we don’t score when we’re on top, son.” The ‘holicdad, as usual, was right. Ian Ure, an expensive but limited centre-back, hit a short back-pass against Bob Wilson’s foot, and Roger Smart applied the finishing touch in the scramble that followed.
Arsenal simply poured forward in the second-half, but the magnificent Downsborough was equal to everything that was thrown at him, including one astonishing save from Jon Sammels that I will never forget. It looked as though the minnows might hang on for an unlikely triumph, but with just four minutes to go persistence finally paid off. Bobby Gould burst onto a through ball, and as it looped up off Downsborough the Arsenal striker ran on to head home whilst taking a fierce kick to the chest for his troubles. The front of his shirt was soon covered in mud and blood, but we were ok now, weren’t we?
In extra-time though the illness caught up with the Gunners, or so went the theory, anyway. There is no doubt that Swindon grabbed their chance with a wonderful counter-attacking display in that half an hour. A break produced a corner from which Don Rogers restored the Town’s advantage. The brilliant little winger then latched onto a long clearance with all of the Arsenal side bar Wilson in attack, took the ball half the length of the pitch, and achieved the rare distinction of rounding Bob before side-footing the clincher.
In the Wembley seats a young ‘holic was in bits. The journey home was my first lesson in coping with gut-wrenching disappointment. I remember we stopped for some chips, and for a couple of years after that day I would not touch chips, associating their taste with that of painful defeat. On Monday morning at school a hundred comedians kept on calling out, as Brian Moore did in his commentary on the third goal, “that is that!”
I’m glad I suffered that deep, deep cut prior to the triumph that followed a year later, when I was one of those privileged to witness Arsenal overturning a 3-1 deficit to lift the European Fairs Cup against Anderlecht at Highbury. Seventeen years of nothing made that taste so much sweeter.
I hope the really young among you will feel the same next year, when once again we will try to end a bit of a drought in the wake of a painful Wembley defeat against the odds.
194 Responses to “Soixante Neuf, As We Say In Wiltshire”
Lovely stuff, Holic. The history lessons always bring extra appreciation for the depth of this club.
Dear God, is there nothing that isn’t on YouTube?
I won’t embed it, but the strong of heart can witness the goals here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQ-rJx13s9g&feature=related
Holic, 42 years of pints haven’t dimmed your memory too badly in my estimation. At least reading your posts is a memory enhancer on this end. π
What parallels to this year’s League Cup defeat, especially in the mixup between defender and keeper. At least this year we didn’t have the excuse of the pasture of a pitch that one was played on.
Wonderful post holic. Another man of the match performace by a goal keeper, some things never change. I remember the early 80s and the best thing about them was Arsenal players on world cup duty for the great 82 and 86 finals ( I think Anderson was with us then ? ). Some great posts around this week I must say.
Wow.
you are wonderful holic….wonderful.
One love…
Oh, and before one of my ‘mates’ turns up and says it, yes, I have more than made up for two years worth of missing chips in the last forty years π
Holic – That is in my opinion your best post (at least for those that I read).
I actually felt as if I was there.
The other funny thing. Don Rogers is still in town, and I’ve had a couple of pints with him down the years. Class act, the fella.
He went to Palace, and I remember one televised game he ripped United a new one at Selhurst Park. I still reckon if we didn’t have George Armstrong and Peter Marinello we might have gone for him when he made that move.
Great post Holic , missed Swindon 69 by a couple of years , but I understand my late father was also deeply traumatised by events of that day ( though I don’t think he gave up chips as a result ! ). Ian Ure should have stuck with Quizball …
Wiltshire in Belgium, that would be? π
Still no drunk until friday for me, so a herbal tea please π
Lovely piece holic. Am fairly new to the blog but have appreciated it loads these last few tricky months. Just watched the youtube pictures of the ’69 losing to Swindon in the league cup final game – we were all dodgy centre-halfs, crap at defending corners and full-backs getting caught out up field on the break – history repeating itself? Hopefully – ‘cos there was the bulk of a great side in there, and the rest is, well – history. Ureds!
bt8bbnn
And this year both Brum and Swindon went down. Which is not really a parallel but there you go π
So true how the pain of defeat (or prolonged absence of victory) makes success so much sweeter. I’m convinced that I relish our victories over Man U that little bit more because of the memories I have of the 6-2 defeat at Highbury in the league cup in the early 90’s. Great post as usual. Keep us going over the Summer…
Was behind the goal for the Leeds match.Saw Jackie Charlton obstruct the goalie.Ref didn’t. Jack boasted about it many years later.
Was in the depths of Saskatchewan for the Swindon defeat and never knew the whole story till I read it here.
Was changing an engine in my garage when Swindon did us again in the league cup.
Was teaching in Luton when We contrived to lose the League cup with dozens of misses and one sad mishap which caused years of abuse to be aimed at the player involved. I’ve just realised I’ve finally forgotten his name.Maybe this past season’s muck-ups will completely submerge the errors of the past. But the pain..Oh the pain. Love your stuff, fellow supporter/sufferer.
Heh Ollie.
So pleased to see the Small Heath Alliance return to their rightful base π
Interesting the Swindon situation. Made the Play-off final last year, and blew it against the ‘Wall, but if you bought a season ticket for this season before those play-offs it would have been Β£250, potentially for Championship football.
I’ve just paid over a grand to lease a ticket for next season at the Grove. Next season, the Town’s start at Β£269, with a pay monthly option!
Shame I don’t give a shit about ’em π
northernbof, the game we lost at Swindon 4-3 was my first trip to this town.
Brady tried single-handedly to win it for us with no help whatsoever.
How did I end up back here?
And I don’t want to bring back those bad memories, so I won’t mention Gus fucking Caesar again π
Good evening ‘Holic & ‘Holics,
Have just caught up with the backlog of drinks from the previous blog. I see I missed some A1 banter.
All I can say is that stories of my demise have been somewhat exaggerated and it feels very good to be back in the bar.
All this talk of Armstrong, Gould, Maranello, Radford and co has reminded me that I had a strange dream last night about Richie Powling who had a twin brother ‘Willie’ and I was chasing them in the desert to sign for Arsenal. Clearly, I had been raiding the freshly stocked CMC before I retired.
The key are with the barman, my tab is open and I heard that lady Savage has now been well and truly worked over by Carlos Valderrama.
Right, off to purchase the rights to half a season ticket. Not sure if I can justify 13 games next season esp. at Β£50 a throw but it’ll be fun trying.
‘Holic,
Fancy doing a 10/11 season awards thingy? Some categories could be as follows….
Most improved player (Like a new signing award)
Most disappointing player (The sideways award)
Managerial tw*t of the year (The Pubis award)
Stoopid player of the year (The Eboue award)
Biggest media muppet of the year (The Gray & Keys award)
etc., etc. Just an idea and just for fun, maybe…. π
Great post ‘Holic
“…..lesson in coping with gut-wretching disappointment”
Not sure I ever learned how to cope, me.
Pints, pills and baccy for the respective patrons – they know who they are.
Ha, he’s back. (And no suntan!)
Glad you gave him his full name ‘Holic , he should never have played at Wembley – i remember Waddle making a fool of him the season before , at Highbury in the first leg of the semi , when he played right-back . O’Leary on crutches would have been the better option .
Good to have you back , TS , now tell us about Renata ….
Don’t know what’s more worrying TS , your 3 day absence or the fact that you’ve been dreaming about chasing Willie
Wiltshire in images renders http://preview.tinyurl.com/3g9qovy for your viewing enjoyment. The London bobbies seemed pleased, at least.
TS, a few more awards worth considering…
Referee of the season (the Phil Dowd and Massimo Busacca award)
Most expensive dud (the 50 million pounds of Russian money award)
Biggest positive from the season (the mental strength award)
Best business strategy (the six and a half percent award)
I know it’s probably bullshit, but if this happens, I’m probably the happiest person on this planet.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1393281/Arsenal-Spurs-Man-City-target-Gonzalo-Higuain.html
The history posts are always excellent ‘Holic but, bloody hell, I was just clawing the scars of this season back together when you hit me with effing Swindon.
I was at both of those games and it is fair to say that the defeats that went before, made the Fairs Cup win at Highbury the maddest night I can remember ( I wasn’t at Anfield ’89).
Out of adversity, and all that . . .
Getting noisy in here again, TS must be back. . .
Thanks ‘holic. My first Arsenal Cup Final experience, also my first Arsenal experience, was not a good one either. In 1978, when I was nearly 7, my Dad told me about this great football team he had supported while living in London in the late 60s and early 70s. Here in Sydney the Cup Final kicks off at midnight. I had somehow managed to get to sleep as usual and was woken up at about quarter to midnight. I remember staring in awe through Abide With Me, the presentation of the players and the marching band.
I was told that Arsenal were an established First Division side and Ipswich only newly up from the Second. In my six year old eyes Arsenal were a shoe in.
So I share your view about the deep personal pain – even in front of a TV screen in the dark hours on the other side of the world – shaping your Arsenal support for years to come.
Mind you, the pain they put me through in ’79 after blowing a 2 goal lead was nearly too much to take.
Seems Arsenal don’t like being favourites in Cup Finals.
cheers
what an absolutely brilliant and Lovely lovely post, holic, i really love reading ur blogs..
Class as usual ‘H!!!
Have you ever thought of taking a trip down to our Republic? you should!
Some gooners down here could really use your perspective on things…
Hi Holics,
Enjoyed reading your post ‘holic, as always. I’m convinced we will win big things in the next couple of years. It’s all about patience.
…and TS, there has been a turf war erupting in your absence on MC keeping/supplying duties. You might have to keep an eye out for your competitors π
Tea for me please, since I’m at work
Tremendous post ‘holic.
I was one of those shiny eyed youths who had his hopes dashed in ’69. A devastated 15 y.o walked back from Wembley that afternoon and met my new girlfriend at Golders Green Station. Her first words were “Don’t be in a bad mood, it is just a game” I turned around and walked home. Last time I ever saw her……
Heh TS: so you gave the winners in the name of the awards? ;O
In other news, with the Qataris now in place and the silly rumours starting to fly about, maybe it’s not a bad thing that we can’t play PSG in a Champions League qualifier.
Thanks for the memories.
I was also at Highbury when we won the Fairs cup. I even remember getting in for almost half price as the gatekeeper was doing a 2 for 1 deal and pocketing the difference.
Anyway, this win was the catalyst for the double. Oh why couldn’t we beat Brum
Holic
I was also at Wembley for the Swindon debacle and your Post had me rummaging through my old programmes of that and the following couple of years when we actually won some trophies.
A really interesting point to raise is the following,
The Arsenal side that lost that day to Swindon was as follows.
Wilson in goal
Storey and McNab the fullbacks
McLintock,Ure and Simpson
Sammels and Court
Radford,Gould and Armstrong.
The following year when we beat Anderlecht,
The only change at the back was Eddie Kelly replacing Ure,and further up the pitch,Charlie G and ” Stroller ” replacing Court and Gould.
So only 3 changes from the Swindon debacle to our success against Anderlecht.
The following Double winning season,there were only 2 additions to the team,being Ray Kennedy and Pat Rice.
So from the Ashes of the Swindon firestorm,the Core of that team stayed together,and with a couple of additions over the next 2 seasons,they went on to great triumphs.
Can history repeat itself.??
Can the core of the side that gifted the CC trophy to Birmingham,go on and win Trophies in the coming season with 2 -3 additions in the summer.??
If AW makes the right acquisitions during the summer,i really believe we can.
Cheers
Clive
Blimey Clive, you raided the MC MkII for the Happy Pills?? Great stuff
TS, you’re back! We were starting to wonder if zico had somehow “eliminated some competition” in the field of medicine cupboard supplies…
Raddy: you were probably much better off without her!
clive, spot on re: our chances of winning something with just a few changes in the right area. I firmly believe that even one player, provided he gives us something a little different from what we already have, coupled with an improved attitude and focus might very well be enough to win the league. We’ve seen what the team can do when their minds are in the right place, “all” they need to do is do that a bit more often.
Clive @35. Interesting to note that there were no big name/big money signings among the additions. Arsenal was the first club for Charlie George, Ray Kennedy and Pat Rice, and George Graham joined as a 21-year old.
All’s fair in love and war, Lars π
Besides, tabs had suggested that TS was “playing away from home” with “the Blonde” *
* [said young lady not yet back at work tabs, but TS is, so how do you like them apples?]
@ Clive – interesting comparison – think we need more than 2 or 3 signings meself. I think a change in philosophy despite what AW appears to be saying, in addition to a change in personnel.
Fantastic post senor Holic, it’s pictures like these that you paint that give me a true flavour of goonership in years past. You see, footballistically, I’m something of a late bloomer having only been into football for about 13 years (i.e. since I was 20) so if I moan about this or that, I truly don’t know what it was like back in the 80s.
Also quite shocked to read about opposition goalies from inferior teams playing the absolute game of their life, the only thing missing being a 30-yard wonder strike into the top corner of the Arsenal goal from a no-mark journeyman who subsequently retreats back into the mediocrity that has previously, and will for ever more, be the trademark of his game.
*lights candles, wafts a rabbit’s foot around and pours vat of salt over right shoulder, saying to himself, “For the love of God, PLEASE don’t let me see that next season!”*
Afternoon ‘Holic & ‘Holics,
I believe some replies are in order…..
Dr. z @ #20,
Hailing from north of Hadrian’s Wall as you do, I would of thought you would have some sympathy for those gifted with freckles and red hair π
tabs @ #22/23,
Indeed I was a worried man both before and after that very strange dream. I blame you partially…. didn’t you write a drink a couple of posts back that mentioned Powling and some other 70/80s Arsenal ‘heroes’? I’m sure Lady Savage will report back on Renata via the tabloids when he/she has recovered.
Joshua @ #25,
Nice one, much better than mine. How about…
Title contenders in the back pages only (The LWC Award)
Most successful mutant player ( The Huth-Sh*wcr*ss Award)
Trev @ #27,
Apologies for disturbing the peace π
Harsha @ #31,
Turf war? Do I need to dig-out my Soprano’s DVDs? Keys were recovered without the need for Paulie Walnuts and are in the oh so safe hands of Dr. z and the barman. I always keep a spare set should the need arise which is probably even more worrying.
Ollie @ #33,
Shame about PSG, that discounts the possibility of an ST trip to Paris. I’m sure I went past their ground last week but it was late and I was tired. Come August, you’ll be desperate to get back aboard the ST π
Clive @ #35
Great post thanks! I have that programme too but was far too young to attend that game (sorry!). In fact, I don’t think my old man went either but his cousin passed it to him who passed it to me. Love the positive thinking. I shall raise a cuppa with you to history repeating itself. I think even Arsene will buy 3 players this summer, whether or not they are the right ones we shall see.
Catch you all later, hopefully….
Lars @ #37
Competition? What competition? π
Your time to play at The Ems must be close. Looking forward to seeing those photos.
Dr. z
Ah, the Sainsbury’s Girl. A gentleman never tells….
For the record, I remain faithful to this bar π
Big Raddy @ 32 – sounds like “disappointed love” as in
“For our fans the frustration was that we were so close to convincing everybody of how football can be great, but in the end not being able to deliver.
I would call it disappointed love. It was cruel and sometimes you get excessive responses to that. I share that and understand it”.
No Arsene, not disappointed love – being cock teased into near demented frustration is what it was. For me anyway π
Big Raddy @32 – treat ’em mean that’s what i say !
Clive @35 – I don’t think we’re far away either , but the big change from ’69 is the advent of 25 man squads , and the financial muscle of our nearest competitors to attract top players from around the world . Stellar centre-half please Arsene .
Dr Z @39 – Now i realise that Goal.com and The Daily Star are less than reliable sources , but TS , though happy to tell us of dream fantasies about Willie , remains suspiciously reticent about blondes , yachts and grapes . Until he comes clean , and to quote AW , i rule nothing in and i rule nothing out !
Apples ? I’m a Melons man myself
TS @ 42 – a gentleman, with red hair and freckles? Hah!
(Note to self – watch out for tabs raking through the tabloids for rumour mongering scandal where it doesn’t really exist)
How do you like them melons, Dr.z?
tabs @ #44,
Heh! Despite what you my think, I’m trying to get those images out of my mind.
How about a Guinness striker to go with the Stella CH?
OK – that’s it.
The Blonde is going to be found and we will get to the bottom of this, even if it means that I have to move my attentions from fruit to the Deli.
Like Scott, “I may be some time…….”
PS – I’ll be back if we sign that Stella fella π
Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury , before you retire and consider your verdict (of Guilty ) I would ask you to concentrate fully on the following points :-
1. The accused has not seen Lars photos in the last post and this would appear to be at odds with his contention that he has ” caught up ” with all the drinks in his absence .
2. The Accused gave confusing evidence as to his dealings with ” the Blonde ” and ” Renata ” , and didn’t appear to know that these appellations concern one and the same person .
3.The Accused seeks to blame other morally upright individuals for his very disturbing dreams .
4. The Accused failed to deny that he has been on Blog’s yacht .
There can be but one verdict , ladies and Gentlemen , Guilty on all charges .
π
I could have one very key material witness tabs……
Oops, you ain’t seen me, roight?
TS heh , i hear we’re in for a CF called Lagertop , from Finland i believe .
Dr Z – Stay clear of the Columbian Sausage
Dr Z i hear ya guv
Has anyone even thought to look in zico’s cellar for said Sainsbury’s employee?
The defense rests. As does Asrene’s.
Good point well-made TS . Dr Z ?
Tabs, I would say to send him to the naughty corner for appropriate “punishment” but I believe that’s where all the attractive blondes are waiting with their whips, and I’m not sure he would exactly consider that punishment of the sort we feel is appropriate here. π
Dyslexia rules KO
‘nasri,
I am well acquainted with the corner that is naughty. Just ask our esteemed barman.
Can I take my punishment like a man AND lying down? π
My doppelganger has told me that his cellar is off limits to all.
(I think that’s where the stash is – no fit state for a Blonde though).
Lars
Have seen your piccies now. Didn’t spot the link. Nice job. Looked like a fab day out. SF’s and you choked? Sounds familiar….. π
Nasri , a good point , i think the Populace at large ( the North Bank Massive ) are demanding an altogether more severe form of punishment .
48 hours listening endlessly to Lady Savage expound on her football theories should do the trick and bring TS back into the fold .
tabs a.k.a jj&e,
Way OTT mate. Something gentler like facing a firing squad formed of Bendy & Vela would be more appropriate. I’m only actually guilty of missing a link on Lars’ drinks.
Re: Tabs @49 Your final summation is so convincing in this case that I believe a new category of guilt must be invented. Shall we call it Absolute Guilt in Extremis?
Multiple hehs.
TS – no-one said it was gonna be easy . If you can’t do the time …
We will however consider a plea of mitigation in regard to a lessening of time .
Nasri – I’m with you just for the extra dramatic effect , though in this court a plea of Not Guilty has never actually succeeded .
TS @ 62
“I’m only guilty of missing a link…..”
Yep, the missing link π
Well, not sure we choked – we just couldn’t produce the goods when needed π
But it was a very good afternoon. The atmosphere was great from start to finish.
zico@48, I’m sure you’ll happily go from the Blonde’s melons to her bottom!
z’s d @ #66,
I’m not the one who frequents the fen lands. That’s like Eboue turning round to Diaby and calling him stupid.
Jury (you know who you are),
I respectfully request a mis-trial. I think you’ll find the real guilty party is away hiding in his cellar, fondling melons and administering a large consignment of Columbian sausage.
Lars @ #67,
Brilliant! That beats an AW pressie every day π
Ooh err, Colombian sausage.
The fen lands visits were merely for scientific reasons. Darwinian.
z’s de,
…. as in re-tracing your family tree? Admit it dammit! You’ve got 6 toes and webbed fingers.
Doesn’t everyone?
A stroll down a very muddy memory lane
Ian Ure was a leg breaking hooligan who would last about five minutes in football today
The strange thing is he ended his working day’s as a social worker in a Scottish YOI
OK – just back from Sainsbury’s.
She’s still missing – time to come to terms with it – the Blonde has gone.
Long live the Brunette.
anicoll @ 72
And not too talented either, if my grainy black and white memory serves me right.
Dr z
Has anicoll possibly uncovered your missing link? π
I think we all need to calm down a bit now (esp. me) before The Barman returns and shoots the lot of us for misappropriation of an internet site.
The drinks are on me as is a freshly stuffed GT supplied from PIK’s finest home grown (wikid).
z, tabs, Lars & zico. Thanks for the banter, I’m off to murder a few more Sainsbury’s employees (the Stoke voices in my head told me to do it) and watch my Psychoville backlog on iPlayer.
TS@68
Request Denied .
Excellent news – i’ll get my pipe
not ‘z’ meant naz
Lord tabs,
Chill and take a chug on what’s coming out of the GT π
Ahhh…. I see you have. Excellent!
Anybody want to talk about The Arsenal?
TS – its a slow news day – I’m sure the boss will understand.
Suggest you murder a pint instead though – some of them Sainsbury types are all right……take that redhead for instance…..
TS @ 79 – see mine at 43 – tried and failed miserably to “talk Arsenal”.
Bring on the Emirates cup….
Capital (punishment) idea Dr. z
Is it going to be like this until the season starts or just the first ‘like a new’ signing?
or EC even….
zico, re #43:
Unfortunately the over-developed double-entendre piece of my brain produced more hideous mental images based on what you had written. I fear more dreams of Powling proportions may haunt me again tonight.
But thanks for the reminder π
Ok Chaps – now we’ve got the Californian out and we can relax , let’s turn to all things Arsenal l – name the worst Arsenal side you’ve seen – players must have played 30 games to qualify .
Wood
Vivas , Blockley , Caesar , Powling .
Carter , Nicholas(P) ,Jensen Mcgoldrick
Hawley , Hornsby
In other news i see young Jack has been tapping up Cahill on Twitter .
F*ck me tabs you’ve got some memory!
I’d replace Wood with Barnett
And Sylvestre as a CB seems fair.
Both good calls TS
Beautiful blondes and brunettes and redheads… Think I need to go find myself a Sainsbury’s to visit next time I’m in London!
By the way, I think I just heard zico singing this to the tune of “My Darling Valentine”:
“Oh my Sainsbury’s
Oh my Sainsbury’s
Full of lovely gorgeous girls
Fuck you Tesco
Fuck you Waitrose
‘Cause my Sainsbury’s all I need!”
Your grainy black and white memory is not so bad Zico regarding Ian Ure – not a football more an accident waiting to happen
Best bit of business we probably did in the 60’s flogging him to ManYoo – the equivalent today of unloading Squillaci on the Mancs for a hefty fee
TABS – Hornsby?? Please enlighten me. Frightening if he’s keeping Rafael Meade out of your starting line up. Lee Chapman??
Expect Mad McMad fi Govan to be too streetwise for that one anicoll – but if he’s looking for cover for Vidic……
Steve Gatting – why no Steve Gatting ? And Raphael Meade – Hornsey Rise’s finest – a good shout
I think lovely Jon Jensen could be suitably replaced by David Hillier, also…
That’s Mark Hughes gone then…. shame! Lovely bloke π
Catalan @90 – Brian Hornsby – understudy / strike partner for Brian Kidd in the mid seventies .
I could be without a strikeforce as i’m not sure that either Hornsby or Hawley played the requisite 30 games . Chapman definitely didn’t . Raphael Meade nabbed two at the Lane one Boxing day so that saves him imho .
anicoll5 @92 – Fair shout but worse than Peter Nicholas or JJ , not convinced . Gatting played in victorious semi against Wolves in ’79 , deputising for the injured Brady .
Fair enough about Rafael. How about Clive Allen – so bad we sold him before a game (obviously detected Sp*d DNA in the pre season testing!)??
I know … not enough games (!).
John Devine – any redeeming features??
Dr. C @ #96
Devine…. good call! *takes another toke*
Anicoll @ #89
Squilly to Manure, now that would be the deal of the century.
Dr. z @ #91
Surely Alumunium would be better cover for Vidic than Squill?
tabs,
What about a CB pairing of Big Willy Young and Terry Mancini? *winces*
Makes Squicielny look decent doesn’t it? π
TS – surely Big Willie is redeemed totally by THAT foul against Paul Mad Dog Allen??
…. and ‘Cup Final Mode’ Supermac as CF. Would make Vela look like Messi.
Dr.C @ #99
I find it hard to forgive him for Ipswich ’78 and for his perfomance at WHUFC ’80, my first cup final.
The memory of the short journey on that hot summer’s day back from Wembley to Edgware is still painful.
That and Swindon ’69 puts this year’s B’Ham disappointment into some form of perspective (for me anyway).
TS – Ipswich 78 (although not present) was the first brutal lesson for me as a 9 year old too.
Valencia in 80 hurt more…
I’ve seen the tape of that ’69 Final, and even in black and white that pitch looked like nothing but mud. At least Arsenal didn’t blame their sickness and poor performance on lasagne, oh whoa, lasagne, oh whoa whoa whoa.
In one of his books, Watford fan Dougie Brimson has a glossary which includes several clubs, including Arsenal early on (the alphabet is a nice thing sometimes), saying that too many fans are gloryhunters — like his club would know. But when he gets to Swindon Town, instead of saying what kind of club they are, who their best-known players have been, or even what the name of their ground is and how good it is, he simply says, “Snigger, snigger.” No explanation. This was in 1998 (which turned out to be a much better year for Arsenal). He also said unkind things about Spurs and Man United, which shows he does have taste; but kind things about Chelsea (although not Ken Bates), which suggests he doesn’t have a LOT of taste.
As always Holic a beautifulpost, you bring a tear to the eye, and a fond or horrible memory to the fore, I was standing in the north bank the night of the 6-2 defeat at Highbury by Manure, it still hurts now. I hope some of our wantaway fans read this ~ 6 years is a just a blink of the eye in the Gooner history. You are an example to us all
TS@98: oh my goodness me, a pairing that makes Squicelny look decent? That really sounds scary!
Thank you goonergirl, I wish it were so. I get as frustrated as the next man sometimes. You get out of it quicker as you get older though…
Now, what has been going on in the bar? I think I had better start watering the drinks down a bit. Where’s this MC then? π
‘Holic,
I apologise in advance for any complaints that you might be getting regarding the nonsense that I tend to proliferate.
In my defence (I’ve been doing a lot of that today) and using an Apprentice analogy, if I was to be called into in the boardroom with that bleedin’ Spud Lord Sugar I’d be bringing in tabs and zico with me.
Please don’t water down the drinks though. The CMC is open and the GT is stocked with California’s finest. You don’t need to ask, just help yourself.
Cheers π
Lars @ #105
Not sure if Willie Young & Mancini ever played in the same side. No doubt someone here will be able to verify that or otherwise.
If they did, it was certainly ‘StoolsRus’ time for the watching faithful π
TS is in great form.
I’m guessing the new MC and GT are a MASSIVE upgrade π
Ollie
I’ll take it you’re not one of the complainers then π
I’m on-call until tomorrow though so have to wait until I can see what it’s all about :p
TS, there was indeed a year in between the departure of ‘Henry’ and the arrival of ‘Big Willie’.
Take the mick we may, but signing Mancini saved us from relegation. Limited he most certainly was, but unlike our prize defenders today he stuck his nut on crosses into the box and hoofed it when we were in trouble.
Plus, how could you not laugh at the clown, when he laughed at himself?
‘Holic,
I stand corrected and bow to superior knowledge.
‘….he stuck his nut on crosses into the box and hoofed it when we were in trouble.’
I don’t know many Gooners today who aren’t crying out for more of that today from our back 5.
I think it’s fair to say that he was of his time. I seem to recall the odd appearance on The Big Match too as a presenter but my memory is very hazy on this.
We sold Frank to QPR, they became title contenders, and we had to buy the fella he replaced at Loftus Road to save our arse.
The selling off of the 71 double side was premature, and almost fatal.
Indeed. Even as a young’un I remember thinking why was that side broken up so quicky? Listening to PS4 on the radio last year he gave some interesting insights as to what was going on at the time but it all seemed a terrible shame when it was going on.
Frank was a real leader of men and loved and respected by his team mates. Oh how I’d love to see someone with his type of personality brought in over the summer. Maybe those types of players just don’t exist anymore?
Yeah. Don’t want to speak ill of the dead, so my thoughts on the end of that era will have to remain in my head.
Catalan @96 – John Devine , redeeming features ? Played the guitar and shagged Miss Ireland 1980 .
TS @98 – Willie Young and Terry ” Henry ” Mancini eh ? Mancini long gone before we signed Big Willie so unfortunately we never got to see them as a pairing . I agree with Catalan – Paul Allen was a c*nt even when he was 17 . In addition , Willie contained spud coach Joe Jordan in the ’79 final , and was capable of the odd volleyed screamer . Limited Defender but i think we’ve had a lot worse .
As for Mancini , he had a certain comic charm , and scored a home goal against Wolves to allay relegation fears , so I’m sticking with Caesar and Blockley .
TS @107 – comedy gold , keep em coming , but in the Boardroom , it’s every man for himself !
Man , this Californian Green is good !
AH i see you’ve already been discussing Henry . Apologies . Must hit refresh button . TS i hope you,re not buttering up the guv’nor prior to the boardroom appearance .
Harsh on Peter Nicholas, TaBS, Especially as Powling was largely played in midfield and you have him slotted in at left-back π
To be fair I am struggling to think of a really poor left-back we have had, and there isn’t one!
McCullough, Mcnab, Nelson, Samson, Winterburn, Silvinho, Cole. Clichy may be the dark sheep in that collection in my lifetime.
tabs @ #118
As if….. π
Yep , Holic , as you say , struggled for a left- back . Caught a recording of The Big Match on youtube of a game in 76- 77 where Richie deputised for Nelson at LB , so that was the reason for that . Toyed with Rostron who was a winger for us but then became a LB at Watford i think .
Wasnt Richie a CB , before a few games in midfield at the start of 77-78 , until he got injured and was replaced by Price ?
Boardroom you say?
Its obvious Lord Holic – TS was a very poor Project Manager…..even went AWOL at one point π
Peter Nicholas ? maybe a tad harsh , i remember going to Selhurst Park one year and losing 1-0 to the ” team of the eighties ” containing Nicholas . Never liked him much after that . Also remember Souness exposing PN’s hardman credentials in a league cup tie at Highbury one year.
Personally Dr Z , i think we’re home and dry …
Heh, Powling at centre-half. Yes, he was a couple of times. Painful days. John Matthews was shoved back there a couple of times too. I was going home and away, week in week out then.
Jebus I suffered π
I think my Dad lost a bit of interest in that period and in 75-76 he only took me to 6 games . I didn’t see Arsenal score a goal in that season !. The signing of Supermac brought him back to the fold and i don’t think we missed a home game the following season .
Dr. z – I may have gone AWOL but it appears I have gotten away with murder PLUS I haven’t had a chance to show my true potential yet….
Drinks are on me and a few yourself Lord Barman. Ice cold Guinness for me please. Thanks for continually providing us all with this lovely bar which some of us continue to mis-use and trash regularly. At least we know how to clean-up after ourselves π
tabs,
Do you have a photographic memory or something? You’re the same age as me and you can recall how many games you went to in a season in the mid 70s. I can’t remember what I had for lunch a week ago. Life’s just not fair….
TS – when it comes to the Arsenal – yes pretty much – though funnily enough much less so , since i’ve been a season ticket holder from ’97
Mid seventies, no problem. Every game. Mid eighties, more difficult, bastard mortgage.
TS, Thanks for coming back and taking the guff. π
May have to lease my tickets this coming season – will be strange .
Hey Nas pull up a chair and light your pipe
Off to sleep off this bloody manflu. Have a good one all.
Top tune Holic – cheers – see you in the Boardroom !
Tabs, Must contend with 7 year old daughter whose mother is out of town until tomorrow so just time for a few quick puff and groove.
This bar is alive and kicking…I miss a couple of hours and it seems as if I missed a crazy party π
Gervinho is being talked about as being our first signing on Monday according to twitter.
I was at the 1968 League Cup Final. There were no highlights!
Dear Coach TABS;
A name for you to consider (at either CB or CF);
Chris Whyte.
Holic; I’m with TABS – thought Nelson Vivas was pretty rank, and certainly far worse than Clichy.
Catalan ,
Chris Whyte made a pretty promising start , if i remember rightly , before losing his way . Went on to win a Championship medal with Leeds , so couldn’t have been that bad .
However , actually went to the trouble of looking up the stats on Hawley and Hornsby last night , ( oh what an exciting life i lead ! ) , and neither reached the 30 game threshold , so my strike force has been decimated . If you can assure me CW played centre-forward at some stage , I’m happy to slot him in there .
CW definitely was played up front at some point – anyone else care to confirm?
If not, maybe the drinking has begun to get to me…
HOW DOES STEPANOVS NOT MAKE THE WORST EVER TEAM!
RE GJ@142 – I thought the same then realised that his awfulness was so awesome that he didn’t get close to 30 games.
TABS – my brain is okay!! http://www.facebook.com/pages/Chris-Whyte/112418158772817
Now, I really must do some work!
Bloody Hell , Catalan , good shout ! CW at centre- forward it is then .
Needs a strike partner . Brian Mcdermott ?
@ Snir Geuli
From what i have heard Gervinho has gone to newcastle, and arsenal dint even bid for the chap, anyways its all rumors till rumors till anything i see on that arsenal.com website
I was going to suggest Jeremie Aliadiere for a spot in attack, but then checked out his stats and he only did 29 games…
Lars …. spread over 23 years!
Catalan, something like that π
But I re-read the statistics on Wikipedia. The 29 games were apparently only league games, so if we count cup apperances he is, after all, eligible for a place in the team!
What is a the definition of a slow news day? You might say it’s when Arseblog’s main topic is his offer to give RVP swearing lessons. On the other hand, Friday has arrived which can only be qualified as real progress. Can our next champioinship be far behind?
Definition of a slow news day is discussing the merits/demerits of Nelson Vivas.
The merits of blonde/non blonde on the other hand……. π
3rd June and no new shiny players – I’m on the verge, I am.
Catalan and Lars ,
Alliadiere not that bad surely ? I think choice boils down to Meade , Groves , or Mcdermott . For something out of left-field , i’d go for the late Paul Vaessen RIP , club had high hopes for him before injury struck , but i always thought he was slow and ponderous . Reached the thirty game mark . Lee Chapman 7 games short , otherwise he is a shoe-in .
Nas and Dr Z ,
Definition of a slow day … when TS doesn’t make the tabloids !
A sophisticated man like you should avoid the tabloids, tabs π
No mention of Cygan so far among the all-time worst? Is history being rewritten in his favor? With no memory of his competition I must bow to the rest of you on this one.
TABS – can’t remember McDermott play (just a big ‘tache in my Paninin sticker book), but Perry is redeemed by TRYING!
One goal by Paul Vaessen against Juventus is enough for me.
and Rafael has already been forgiven by you….
so… a McDermott / Big Chris Whyte partnership ???? Goals galore…
Catalan – the mcdermott / Whyte combo will terrorise Defences the world over .
Dr Z – i’m a very sophisticated chap ‘ i’ll have you know , off out for a 7 course meal tonight – a kebab and a six-pack π
Hurrah , luddite that i am , just found out how to do a smiley
tabs heh
kebabs – food that is worn, not eaten (or shared with the pavement as the 6 other courses take their toll)
As for your smiley, just wait till we both work out HTML π
Did you know that it is only about 57600 minutes till Arsenal’s next fixture ? *
* (not adjusted for Malaysian time difference etc)
Nas – Cygan positively Bobby Mooresque , when compared with Caesar and Blockley – count yourself lucky you never saw them play !
I had obliterated all memories of Gus “fucking” Ceaser from my brain through years of over-indulgence in alcohol until this thread.
It’s not really good for my state of mind being reminded of some of these numpties and you’ll note that I have avoided engaging in the debate – suffice to say that Squillaci/Silvestre/Cygan/Stepanovs etc are positive world beaters compared with some of the dross served up in the ‘lean’ years.
Now I will have to go on another 57600 minute binge to purge myself – it’s a dirty job, but……
Dr Z – Eating and Walking at the same time is a much-underestimated Art form , in my book .
Just as a matter of interest Dr Z , how long did you take out of your working day to work out the minutes countdown to first game ? π
Oh and mine tabs, almost as rare as thinking and speaking simultaneously, (or a shiny new player).
I want, I want, I want wah wah wah….
tabs @ 162
Its a slow news day as agreed previously – you weren’t expecting me to do some REAL work?
It took me longer to find the date of the bleeding fixture on Pravda than anything else.
Anyway, we are having one of our two sunny days of the year in Edinburgh today, so I’m off – see you when I’m less sober!! π
Have a good one Dr Z – watch out for that sunburn !
Afternoon All!
Just been checking the tabloids…..
Has ‘Holic emerged from his man flu yet? If he does, there’s a box of Lemsip underneath the GT. It might be past it’s sell date though, a bit like some of the players mentioned above.
Definition of a slow Friday? When I botehred to stop and read a headline about Simon Cowell and fixing allegations.
How long ’til the footie starts???? The TT will keep me occupied for a week or so. Then what? Wimbledon????
tabs – how about a three course breakfast consisting of a ciggie, cup o’coffee and a cough? Too sophisticated?
Project for the summer – get our American cousins following the cricket. Zico will explain the rules to you…
Use this to get yourselves started… http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/cricket/england/9503269.stm
Afternoon TS , i generally forego the coffee π
Catalan, My first question: Why is it always “the” cricket, rather than other options such as “some” cricket, or better yet “jiminy” cricket?
This might help Nas
The Rules of Cricket
You have two sides, one out in the field and one in.
Each man that’s in the side that’s in goes out, and when he’s out he comes in and the next man goes in until he’s out.
When they are all out, the side that’s out comes in and the side thats been in goes out and tries to get those coming in, out.
Sometimes you get men still in and not out.
When a man goes out to go in, the men who are out try to get him out, and when he is out he goes in and the next man in goes out and goes in.
There are two men called umpires who stay out all the time and they decide when the men who are in are out.
When both sides have been in and all the men have out, and both sides have been out twice after all the men have been in, including those who are not out, that is the end of the game!
tabs – genius π
Catalan, so far Tabs is doing a better job of it than Zico, and by a fairly large margin I should say. π
I agree Nas – just remember that when its over its not really over
I can’t claim authorship of that little beauty Dr Z
@ tabs
nice plagiarism then – made me spill my first beer of the day π
Anybody notice that zicoinexile subtly became iziconinexile?
TS @54 – “The defence rests. As does Arsene’s.”
Excellent little gem, mate.
tabs @85 – the one and only George Johnstone would seem to be an omission from your team. I’m not sure if he played the requisite 30 games, and have no way of finding out, but he was, thankfully, a unique talent. Scored a hat-trick vs Leeds in a 7 – 0 home cup win, and never did an other thing I can remember.
‘Holic @119 – would Cygan qualify as a left back? He did play there a bit, including some games in our CL Final season in 2006.
Snir Geuli – you have mail – again – good news this time!
Trev , – George Johnstone before my time . Sadly ( or happily depending on your point of view ) , a quick peak at the records reveals that George failed to reach the completely arbitrary 30 game threshold imposed on the team , ( he only played 25 games ) . Records seem to suggest that his 3 goals came in a 2-2 home draw with Everton , a 2-2 away draw with Leicester , and the winner in a 4-3 victory over Leeds .
Just call me Statto !
tabstatto,
Your wish, my command
Trev @ #177,
Cheers mate, always nice to be appreciated.
nasri @ #176.
He must have one of those i-phone thingys for doing his dirty deals on the road, the scoundrel. There was plenty of name changing going on here y’day BTW π
Blimey, George Johnstone. Came from Cardiff if I recall rightly. That winner against Leeds was greeted like a Cup winner. They had a real hoodoo on us in those days.
Tragedy – Jimmy Carter only clocked up 29 appearances . Do you think Glen Helder would be averse to a late call-up ?
TS – that’s a very dangerous proclamation ! π
tabstatto,
I like living dangerously, as you can probably tell π
Evening ‘Holic,
How’s the man flu? Did you find what you needed in the CMC? π
Not that great, if I’m being honest TS. On the old wives tale of three days coming, three days here, and three days going, I am smack in the middle of three days here π
Miserable old scrote I am.
Get well soon, barman!
Nas – I have NO idea why it is THE cricket rather than SOME cricket. Never really thought about it. I would Eden a guess that perhaps that at any one time there is really only one game that anyone is going to be interested in – the international most likely.
But the same would apply to a cup final etc.
No idea. ‘Holic? ayeZico?
In the meantime Nas, here’s a nice little summary of today’s play;
A little more prosaic than your average footy report….
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/cricket/13630370.stm
Where the hell is PIK?
slightly worse for wear, smartphone dispensed with as no longer on the move (for the most part) izicoinexile is now plain old zicoinexile again and just wants to let you know …..
I love Arsenal, me.
And I love summer sun and beer, what a combo (as Bt8bbbnn would say)
PS – sorry to hear about your ailments Holic – sounds like you’ve a bit to go before you can come back down here amongs us dipsomaniacs.
@ 181 tabs – we had an American president play for us? Amazin.
‘ Night all – Management is on the premises ;_
TABS @181.
Good news… Glenn qualifies!!!!
http://www.arsenal.com/history/profiles/307/glenn-helder
With a strike rate that Rosicky would kill for….
tabs @178 – thanks for the George Johnstone stats, but I am now seriously worried about my memory. I was at that Leeds game and I really thought we scored all 7 goals and GJ scored a bloody hat-trick. Well, it was easy to get distracted from the football in those days.
Anything in that MC for memory loss?
Can anyone remember where the MC is ?
Catalan @188 – excellent news , Glenn’s in ! I think Pik is busy harvesting the new crop for 2011-12 .
Trev@189 – My pleasure . Perhaps one of the good Doctors in the House should give you the all-clear , before further partaking of the MC’s pleasures ? π
Dr Z@187 – It was a tight run thing but Jimmy Carter just got the nod ahead of Bill Clinton for a place in the squad . Bill Clinton’s propensity for going down too easily in the box , went against him π
Going to spend most of the day watching the test match which is really relaxing.
Then gonna watch the paradoxical Switzerland game. The trouble with watching England football team is that, yes, I want them to win, but of the 16 players selected tonight, I actually hate 14 of them, albeit to varying degrees. Best result, 2-0, one each Wilshire and Walcott, Rooney sent off.
Morning gents. Further gobbledygook tonight, but not sure what yet. You have destroyed my piece on the life and times of George Johnstone π
Afternoon ‘Holic , I see you’re feeling a little better π Tommy Coakley perhaps ?
Soixante Neuf. Isn’t that French for sixty-nine, and if so what is the connection to the above comments about TS and the Sainsbury girl, i.e. zicoinexile @#39:
“Besides, tabs had suggested that TS was βplaying away from homeβ with βthe Blondeβ *
* [said young lady not yet back at work tabs, but TS is, so how do you like them apples?]”
Last question: Where is the Goonerholic editorial staff when you need them, and why are they obsessed with endless discussion of the GT and related matters?