Reading Between The Lines
Jun 6th, 2012 by 'holic
@GoonerMan2 “Wow! Ivan has just pulled off a faultless karaoke performance of The Sex Pistols – friggin in the riggin”
So, according to one top Tweeter, I missed quite a performance at the Arsenal Supporters End of Season Q&A with the chief executive. Of course having a day job and living a couple of hours away from the venue excluded me from putting in an application to be present. It has to be said though that everybody else who was tweeting from the event missed that particular highlight.
What I saw was essentially an extension of what was reported from last night’s interview on Arsenal Player, with some added defence of the board and much reference to the proposed Financial Fair Play regulations. That provoked derogatory comments from some quarters to the effect that he had spoken for over an hour but said nothing. With all due respect I think that says that people were not listening, or perhaps interpreting what was being said.
That isn’t intended to provoke, just prompt reasonable respectful discussion. There are lots of things we can do better, said Ivan. I doubt he will get much argument there. The board have proved they are risk-takers with the move to the Emirates, he added. With all due respect Ivan that was a different board, ownership structure, and organisation to the one in place now. The goalposts have moved with the arrival of foreign money in Manchester and West London, absolutely. No argument there.
The FFP appears to be a crutch we lean on and I have to own up to not knowing enough about it other than the overwhelming feeling I get from selective reading that the big clubs most likely to abuse it will ride rough shod over the plan and anybody who dares to challenge their collective bargaining power. We have a delicate balancing act to do in that respect. Better on the inside pissing out, and all that.
Now I don’t know what those who were quick to criticise were expecting him to say. Let’s not forget he has responsibilities that extend beyond keeping supporters as fully informed as possible. If you really took notice there were some honest admissions.
@DarrenArsenal1 “IG…we need to be efficient on how we spend our money, we know we have squad spend inefficiency”
I read that as recognition of an issue that perturbs many and there followed on my timeline a promise to do something about that, although it may take a period of years. That was one of the admissions that makes me believe large chunks of what Ivan has to say. That does however inform me we are getting some things wrong and will seek to rectify those, but on our terms.
There was more, but probably too many column inches will be produced about tonight because there is nothing else going on if you are an Arsenal supporter. Plus the fact I know we all have different views about the situation we are in, and where we may be heading. I don’t claim my interpretation is any more reliable than anyone else’s, providing of course they are interpreting what they hear, and not just blindly trotting out the usual popular dissenting lines.
Some good people have genuine concerns about what is happening at the club at the moment, and it is good to chat with people prepared to reason and debate. Just as long as you don’t mind if I accept Ivan at his word when he says, “we can do things better and have to do things better but are not as bad as made out.” Thanks @10akhil for that one.
Looking forward to seeing the event on Arsenal Player later to see his responses for myself. I recommend you do the same.
The New Kit Launch
Supporters close to the new home of football can attend the launch of the new 2012/13 home kit on Thursday 7th June.
Taking place in The Armoury from 8.30am, the ‘Red, White & Blue Party’ will be the first opportunity for supporters to get their hands on the new kit.
There will be plenty of fun-packed activities to keep the family entertained on the day, including:
- The Rifles, whose track features in the target practice film, will be performing live in-store from 7pm
- Target practice games and prizes
- Bouncy castle
- Speed cage
- Refreshments
- Opportunity to download the amazing new augmented reality app featuring Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
Get yourself down there if you are free, but looking at the weather forecast make sure you take enough money to buy an Arsenal umbrella, the must-have accessory this monsoon season, I mean summer.
490 Responses to “Reading Between The Lines”
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Fack off Dr Zee 😎
‘holic, your balance in these things is so much appreciated.
i’m just waiting to hear from leg rash for the opposite.
Scruz @ 2 – wot that goodfornuffinkgobshite?!?
and z, it taught me that, in addition to being generous with his dosh, lars has a hell of a left foot…
yep, i always find him entertaining…FACT!
Missed the cut off on previous post.
This one to Zico:
But seriously, I agree.
The mega rich will find a way to circumvent the rules and regulations, for example that sponsership deal for the naming of the Citeh stadium for 500milll.
Unfortunatly FFP will probably end up another empty Uefa/Fifa slogan like Fair Play and Kick out Racism.
==
Now to read this one.
played ‘holic nicely balanced piece. popped this over the post just now. It’s the bits i got off twitter and Dr. Z and H2H were getting stuck in too – soooo – if you don’t mind i’m gonna pop down here and now
From what i could glean from the twitterized version of the meeting between the AST and Ivan “the absentee from the big Milan match-up” Gazidis – the most interesting bits from Ivan (imho) went more or less like…
let’s wait for FFP to kick-in and sort out the financially doped blues of all hues – as the football world is turning our way and wants this to happen. And when it does happen (in 1,2,3,4 years?) AFC will be in a very good position.
I hope he’s right and FFP works, though i have me doubts – like many of us – i reckon
But to be fair to IG, big-picture wise, it’s difficult to see what other choice we have at this place in time.
As someone else, somewhere else already said the self-sustaining model isn’t Arsenal’s model, it’s the model by which 99% of football clubs have to abide by; if they don’t have a petro-dollar pumped patron or don’t want to go bust.
A pride please guvnor, and whatever anyone else is drinking
UREDS!
Nice read Holic. I really don’t understand some “so-called” Arsenal supporters. Its as if they hate our club – REALLY HATE.. or they are other fans posing as Gooners.. or they are disenfranchised morons too think to understand simple concepts like running the business aspects of a football club. They have an Isthmian League understanding of today’s game… Ah fuck it I think I might boycott commenting on anything until we sign somebody or something else happens..Grrr
Imagine this to be an angry face 🙂
The drinks above are giving me some serious flash-backs from my last drinking session! 😉
(Time was, you would’ve banned someone like that Terry character for such gratuitous abuse, Holic. Once a Terry, always a Terry I guess….) 😀
Oh and I would love to get along to check out The Rifles tomorrow. The new strip on the other hand…….
** spellcheck: “too thick* to understand… thanx
As you stated in your previous post the proof of the pudding will be in the eating. I get that we can’t go up against the oil injected clubs, but I’ll be happy if we go out and get the players we need within our budget. Which as you well know is a rather large budget compared to almost every other club in the league.
Sorry Dr Zee I just need to shout at somebody and you were right there… you know I don’t mean it 😎
If the abuse gets personal the review procedure kicks in, zico.
Yellow card first offence. Hefty kick in the bollocks for the second. If he gets up after that, I’m off…
I’m with H2H @ 11 above.
Or as Steve T has regularly put it : “Are we the best that we can be?”
This summer is going to be another painful stretch until the real stuff starts again. Can someone break the internet for the whole of July please?
GoonerTerry – I can get all that “Fack off Dr Z” at home 😉
Ivan “the terrible” nickname???
psed won’t be doing the strip thing with Zico either – if you know what i mean
Yes, Holic -it’s your fault.
Where’s me pitchfork?
Oh Holic, you should have kept the troll @ the previous 14 around for a bit. We could have had some fun.
As someone else said in the large set of drinks: The Arsenal are the best non-oil-polluted club in the UK. I absolutely believe in our philosophy at Arsenal. Could be be a tad bolder? Sure. I hope that Le Boss gets angry and have a “fuck all this shit” season. We are not all that far behind the Mancs – but we need a good start. For that to happen we need a couple to three new players. That’s all. I don’t believe that we need to spend multi-millions on wages, agent fees and signing bonuses on some cunt. We just need a couple of solid professionals – they are out there.
In Arsenal we trust – the rest can just kiss my black [self censored]
Apologies Zico.
Like a little response before I cast the garbage into the chute.
What do people not understand about actually reading stuff and thinking for themselves.
It’s my fault.
I was there and admired good old Ivan’s gift of the gab. I have more confidence in him than PHW. It’s all down to FFP and the collapse of the Spanish banks when we can buy Messi off Barca!
Oops pardon ‘holic – my man of the rotten nickname seems to have magically effed orf
And – we do have a big budget, but just now 4 other clubs in the prem alone have bigger budgets than us. A strong position no doubt – but not as strong in relative terms as we have been in recent times – that’s the reality unfortunately.
And i guess there are always things the club could do better – but even if we squeezed say 10 or 20 mill more out of the wage budget it would improve us but not necessarily take us past our nearest rivals
wage bill/budget – awww schucks, who’s counting???
I think the problem with the spin is that it is just more jam tomorrow: when the stadium move is complete, when the players mature, when the property debt is paid and the flats are sold, when 2014 comes, when FFP kicks in (not a snowballs chance in hell), etc. Always a brighter tomorrow. Ahh well fair play to him for fronting up I suppose would never see David Gill do it.
Don’t disagree with any of that Lew, but in fairness everything he says has changed since the stadium move was planned has changed.
Accuse the former set-up of being short-sighted if you like, but that would be a tad unfair I think.
I remain to be convinced by the current structure, but I think they are suffering more than is fair at the hands of the “I want it now ” generation.
Just a thought.
My spelling goes right out the window when I get pissed off… sorry for the bad spelling at various above..
Someone posted a link to United’s website in the previous drinks, so I decided to click on it out of curiosity to read about their mega-millions sponsorship deals. What a crap web site it is! My skin crawled all the time I was on it but I decided to have a proper gander as I was dirty already – I admit that I am biased but I don’t see many clubs with the class and sophistication of the Arsenal. Everything we do is laudable and I don’t ever find myself wishing we are like any other club. Never!
I much, much prefer our site. I much prefer our club. I prefer our stadium. I prefer our players; our manager – even our owner (really would any of you guys swap Silent Stan for any of the Glaziers or Abramnobitch?) … How would you feel knowing that the Arsenal bought the Premier League title or the Champions League? I know a lot of “so-called” Gooners wish that we had a Sugar-Daddy that lavished millions on every available player… but not I…
People don’t appear to like our “professional” approach to running our club. The worse I can accuse the Arsenal Board of being is boring … but better boring than the arse-lickers of $hitty or Chel$ki…nope I will take the A~rsenal over those two any day..
Goonerholic
Ya can’t blame Ivan for a lot of things on that list, things have changed since the sugardaddy revolution blew our compete with Utd plan out of the water but after 10 years of financial doping and seven seasons of waiting for the next thing to save us might be time to change tack. I suppose I’m not blaming them for being short-sighted, I’m blaming them for being unable to adapt.
As for the want it nowers well in fairness there has always been them but now they are being joined by those that have gown tired of waiting.
You should probably ignore me though having a cranky few days 🙂
Ahh ‘holic the “I Want It Now G-G-Generation” – that’s got legs that has. The band releasing that zeitgeist first single listed above might, possibly, maybe be called “The Who The Fuk Are You Not To Give Me Everyfink I Want RIGHT NOW, then!!!” – catchhhyyy – no!? – NAH!
Why,in the line-up there would be p’raps, maybe, possibly – for Pete’s sake give it a rest on guitar; Roger Dulltry on sometimes rather shouty lead vocals and of course Keith “Give Me The” Moon – banging on and on, on drums.
Please note that i make the above playful jests despite being the member of a family who have been unreasonably fond of the actual The Who for several generations – amen!
No, I get what you’re saying Lew.
Still got a buzz at times this season watching a team that lost the title in August. We produced performances that lifted the hairs on the back of the neck.
Then you realise if only they would go that extra yard. We don’t have twenty good players of which we can rely on having fourteen fit every week.
The frustrating thing for me is that for a reasonable net outlay we could have…
…this year?
lew, if it gets to 17 or 20 years without a trophy, call me. there is nothing written in the stars that arsenal should have a trophy sooner than that, certainly. the change in football with the influx of dirty cash has precdent over the years, but only on this round have the salaries and agent’s fees become part of the equation, and the 24-hour news cycle. this means everyone’s “i must have it now” is amplified beyond what is reasonable (i’d say “relatively tremendous” but for the sake of your english teacher :).
i would really be surprised if tottenham or liverpool, or anyone else wanting a new stadium while our current financial crisis is extant will have success, except perhaps for chelsea (and say what you will about their proposed move, but battersea power station would be a KILLER place for a stadium, and if we could get the pig to fly there again, sooooo apropos…”how do you like my pig? he’s not a very nice pig, but he’s a BIG pig”). this means arsenal as a club was able to manage itself into a brilliant new stadium and associated revenues, and are thus still able to have a seat at the top table based on a (more) sustainable model. between the chel$ea/$hitty money and the crash, those are some moving goalposts to which we’ve not *yet* adapted. but having the stadium, and improvements in sponsorship deals *will* yield gradual, and long-term, success.
if we win some trophies along the way while doing the right thing in business, as a club, and on the pitch, well, my veins will still pulse with arsenal blood.
AL: heh, heh 🙂
Lew we are all feeling a bit cranky mate – you make a lot of sense even though I have a different point of view…
Fortunately its football we are talking about. And the Arsenal do football very well indeed. On our day we can be the best in the UK.. but we suffer terrible luck at times.. and sometimes we can’t seem to sustain our best game for too long… We all need a break and I hope that next season will be a big improvement on this…our luck is bound to change sooner or later..
Spot on ‘Holic. That was my point in the previous drinks. If we would just go for it with the money we do have, not incur stupid debts, which I don’t even think we need to do anyway.
To quote Steve T from many past occasions, I just want us to be the very best we can be.
last sentence should read: whether or not we win some trophies along the way… /eyeroll.
GoonerTerry cranky? You cannot be serious ! 😉
I am not cranky now that you are around me old mucker 🙂
what with all the really good young’uns coming through and Rambo, and Jack, and per, and chesney, and Atetetetetaaaa, and pele’s old side – Santos, and Gerv the swerve, and Gibbsy, and the ox, and Theo, and maybe frimpong and myachi – all nicely set to step it up a bit next season , either cos it’s only their second full season with us or cos they’re at round about the right age or both – plus the signing of Poldi, plus we hang on to RvP (hmmmm), then we’re not that far away – are we??? A tough-tackling, ball-playing midfielder’ll do me – if all the other things are still in place of course (Kos, TV, Sagna etc. too)
and cheers GT @ 30. And you…cranky?? Why i won’t hear of it – i tell yer!
Just thinking about my first ever Arsenal shirt that had a white collar, long white sleeves with red cuffs, a cannon that faced the right way, and no names of players or sponsors on it. At all.
That shirt meant the world to me as I imagined I was all the Arsenal heroes of my youth.
And in all the incalculable hours I spent playing ‘3 and in’ in the park, house, school and county matches as a schoolboy, never once did I give a hint of a thought to how many shirts any one of those heroes might be able to shift on the other side of the world.
When was the last time you read/heard/took part in a conversation about football, that did not include the word money?
Dreams used to be quite realistic in those days …………
Trev: I yearn for a conversation about football mate.. as our Kev would say “I’d really luv it”
Excellent stuff holic and some excellent posts both here and during the last session. My day job has prevented me from being engaged as I would have liked but some great and learned comments.
I have not seen any of the comments and my knowledge of tonight’s events are based purely on what I have read on here.
I do think that one of our major problems is still the PR. For years now the board and constantly held press conferences to let us know how wonderfully the club is doing financially. The events of the last 24 hours would appear to be no exception to that. The latest Deloitte’s football rich list posted us as the 5th wealthiest club in the world. When figures like that are made public is it any wonder that the “want it now brigade” get a tad restless? I would suggest not, even if they are slightly short sighted. At times I do believe that Ivan and the boys do not sometimes help themselves.
I am indebted to both Zico and Trev for pointing out my favourite and well worn phrase. I am sure many are bored to death with it by now but I do think that it is valid. I would love to have say there tonight and asked Ivan if he felt that as a club “are we the best we can be?” You will all no my views. I think we are a long way off and if Ivan has admitted that mistakes have been made then hopefully that is a step in the right direction. I, like many on here am not asking us to spend money we have not got. I certainly do not want a sugar daddy approach. But I do believe that we can do a lot better with what we have. Holic @28 is spot on. We have a squad of about 14 top players. A few quality additions may well make all the difference, and that is not just towards dusting down the trophy cabinet. Lew provided a lot of great stuff re offshore investments. Why do you think it is that the likes of Bayern, the Mancs, Barca and Real have more success that us at present in this field? I do not see the likes of Santos, Gervinho, Park, Song, Chamakh being the type of players that will help kick start our foreign investment program. They are not in the same calibre as the signings that the other 4 make. So then you have to ask why, when we have all that cash floating around have we not used it? Surely the benefits of a few quality signings would have a massive affect, both on and off the pitch?
Financial Fair Play. I am not sure anyone really knows what the effects of that will be. I must say I am more than sceptical. I hope I am wrong but I just can not see it working. Regulations are supposed to be in place to prevent monster sponsorship deals, but I just do not see it. If the likes of Madrid, Barca, the Mancs etc all fall fould of the regulations are UEFA really going to kick them out of the Champions League? I do not think so. Surely, if the threat was genuine then this has to be the first steps towards an European Super League? The only logical conclusion would be for the mega big clubs to just break away and form their own leagues? I hope I am wrong but I just see it as a toothless tiger at the moment.
The summer will be an interesting period. My honest opinion is that this is the last close season the board and AW have to get it right. I do not think that failure to bring the required quality in this summer is an option for many fans. Here’s hoping.
Re the kit launch. If anyone is in town The Rifles are more than worth checking out. They are a fantastic band in my humble opinion and if they are playing free at The Arsenal then happy days. Sadly I am not sure if I will be finished in time to head over but you will not be disappointed I can assure you.
Keep the faith.
Some interesting and well put forward comments from those in the bar this evening. IG’s stance is to be expected…he is a COE talking to his
(minority) shareholders. How much of what he said is spin and how much is reality only time will tell. Actions will speak louder than words!
I do not think that all reasonable gooners expect or even want AFC to spend beyond its financial resources but no doubt there are players out there who would improve the strength of the squad within our monetary limitations. What is unclear is what are our real financial resources?
This scenario has a déjà vu scene about it…..let’s hope that this is the summer the powers to be see the light.
Steve T: Not much to argue with you about. The good thing is that some of the big clubs are supporting UEFA’s FFP policy. Bayern and most of the top German, Spanish & French clubs, for example, are pushing UEFA hard. We have to hope that disqualifying clubs from the Champions League is defendable in court or we are all fucked..
GoonerTerry — I fully agree with your statement about Arsenal conducting its business with a relative degree of dignity and sophistication in a world of club football that really has lost all sense of proportion.
And like you, I love our web site, love the way we grow youngsters, love the way we conduct our transfer activities — give or take a Park — and love the way we play football.
There is a lot to admire and applaud about this club, and many of its operational methods can be model for other clubs that do not have a seemingly endless pot of coins of dip their fingers into.
That said, the financial conservative approach — Steve T, I think the ranking of wealthy clubs do not take into account the extent of all debts, and the positions might be misleading in multiple ways; I mean who really knows the amount owed by Madrid and Barca to various Spanish financial organizations — itself can benefit from an extensive PR exercise. to make it more palatable to the supporters.
If I were to guess, the tightfistedness is not only a result of stadium debt but also some worst case analysis performed vis-a-vis the self-sustaining model so that we don’t become easy prey to a takeover attempt. Liverpool and Man U are examples of great clubs — and to be honest, clubs with an overall better international profile — that can easily get into bad debts and a succession of change of hands. While the genius and knowhow of Ferguson has kept Man U at the forefront (and their vast international following and the consequent commercial revenues helped), Liverpool is finding out how easily it can all take a turn for the worst.
I am with GT and Goonerholic that we need 2-3 more quality players to fight for CL and PL this year. And then not to lose any of the key players, which include Theo and Song as much as RVP. It has been evident that all there depend not only on the club’s best intention but all the other parties concerned. All indications are now that the relatively egalitarian salary structure would be revised and some attempt would be made to compete against the crazy money, but I am skeptical that we can really compete where transfer fees and salaries are concerned for all of our targets and we have to continue to rely on the craftiness of Arsene and the strength of our youth program to some extent.
can’t get a wink of sleep
heartburn’s a terrible thing
perhaps a square sausage , egg and jalapeno sandwich will soothe my aged brow , the noo
To the points of our esteemed barman and various above, one thing that has been so frustrating is at we have been just one or two players short of a title-winning squad for so many seasons now. I fear it is becoming a habit, and one compounded by the sales of players before they hit their peak. The team is in a perpetual state of rebuilding. Injuries don’t help, but I don’t think we get worse than our fair share, as horific as some of ours have been. I wonder what the squad could have achieved if say Song and Flamini or even Diaby had anchored the midfield week in, week out over the past three years, we’d had Cashley’s best years and RvP and Cesc both fully fit over the same period.
Barman, What’s in the picture please. 8)
http://0.tqn.com/d/cocktails/1/0/o/7/-/-/bushmills_portfolio.jpg
Looks like Fat Harry is tippling rather a bit extra this summer. It could be a premonition of what’s in store for him in a few months, methinks. 😉
“Amicable terms”: Isn’t that what these slimy clubs always seem to announce?:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18344557
A story about touching and embracing and girls and footballers? This one seems to have more than its share:
http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/3396/euro-2012/2012/06/06/3153968/england-squad-in-store-for-noisy-nights-and-swarms-of-girls
Doctor Faustus: Nicely done. The much talked about cash balance is a hedge against disasters – like not qualifying for the champions league one year. People forget that these margins are so tight. Salaries will still have to be paid even with a greatly reduced revenue.
We were laughing too hard to really think about but not qualifying this year was a monumental disaster for the tiny totts. They still had some of their champions league money left last year to mount a very good bid to qualify this year but they missed out and even winning the Ropy Cup next season will not compensate financially. They will have to try to finish among the top three or four next year. It gets progressively harder each year that you miss out – the gap between the champions league teams and the rest gets wider & wider. The more you think about it the more remarkable our achievement of qualifying for the past 14-years is..
Its late and I have a long day tomorrow. Good nigh all. Night Cap on the bar for all the night owls please barman: http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-43357575186341_2214_151914989
[…] Last night saw Ivan Gazidis speak to the Arsenal Supporters Trust, and while I was far, far away, it seems there was a lot of talk about Financial Fair Play, and interestingly, the wage structure at the club. The Goonerholic has a nice summary of what was said, and reported by people on Twitter who were actually at the meeting, but it seems it essentially boils down to: “we can do better, but we’re not as bad people think” (from @10akhil via The Goonerholic). […]
Holic I think you summed it up very well when referring to the need to have 20 good players on whom we can rely.We’re effectively short of squad depth,there’s always a weak link on the bench or stepping up because of injuries ie Djourou and these guys are paid a fortune! .We need a couple of world- class signings and a small strengthening of squad depth and quality.it’s probably four players and a goalie.We signed 9 last season but the great ‘ next young thing’ has rarely materialised and we have lads like Botelho who has been here 5 years and never donned the shirt.Galindo looks like he may go the same way.
It’s quality over quantity and a fresh look at structuring pay more sensibly.
I took that from Ivan’s briefing last night and I hope he means it.
The car is back at the garage 🙁
reason at last, much appreciated. the ignorance and hypocrisy of some blogs is infuriating.
Don’t know about the information flow in our company, but I feel a bit of sadness when some friends from Switzerland ask for short-notice support, possibly locally, and I’ll have to tell them that I can’t/am not allowed to help anymore and they have to call…..the US.
Bah.
Very nice summary ‘holic, much appreciated. Maybe I will sound naive but I don’t think we need “world class” signing in the mean of a big name, just player(s) which would add more quality and options to the squad we have.
Granted we would have to keep our current one as it is as much as possible. I just have a feeling that should we keep RvP, Song and Theo, adding one defensive midfielder, backup goalie and perhaps another striker (although I have soft spot for Chamakh and I still believe its all about confidence and playtime with him, he was deadly when he was in France and did remarkably well in the start of his Arsenal career) that we are well in for major trophies next year. As Arsene says..its not all about just buying players, but buying quality player who is better than we already have.
M’Villa from what I have seen and read would surely be great addition. With Poldi already signed I personally would be quite okay with these two signings and keeping those named above, since I will rather see player who works his socks off for the shirt than overpaid (although very skilled) primadone who takes Arsenal just like transition club to get to likes of City, Real or Barca.
ak47, some blogs would be reason enough to motivate your name indeed 😉
http://www.francefootball.fr/#!/news/2012/06/07/093512_le-tragique-deces-de-preciado.html
Fuck me: Preciado, named new Villareal manager on Wednesday, dead on Thursday 🙁
http://www.football365.com/news/21554/7798595/Preciado-Dies-Day-After-Given-Villarreal-Boss-Job
In English
Hello all
Interesting points by everyone. In my view, there has to be a level playing field in terms of buying and selling players, hence FFP is crucial
I am totally opposed to sugar daddy spending to increase chances of winning. There are ways we can compete with the rich clubs without compromising on basic human values and I am happy if Arsenal can do that
Trophies will come, if we can utilize the resources we have effectively and build on what we have
A very small thought: This target motif thingy the marvellous Bs and Gs in the marketing dept. have come up with re the mighty Arse (blue hoops and that). Anyone else think they may have handed them in the media – that like to take a pop at us, for they are out there you know – a handy, sharp, sticky, arrowy thingy with which to beat us; should – heaven forfend – we/Arsene cop a coupla bad results at some point in the forthcoming season. I reckon you don’t have to think too hard to imagine them coming up with a kind of Arsenal/Arsene under fire/critics take aim blah, blah, blah – looking bit of photo-shoppy malarkey – no? Nah!!! Oh, good.
oops “?” somewhere else – pardon
Morning all and cheers ‘Holic for keeping a balanced lid on the boiling cauldron of some supporters’ frustration. In a few unfortunate cases, I use the word ‘supporter’ in the loosest possible sense.
Like you, I am looking forward to the ‘Ivan Unplugged’ sessions on Arse Player later this week and will be doing my best to spot the key phrases such as the one you highlighted via @DarrenArsenal1 above.
Having already listened to the full 18.5 minutes of ‘Free Ivan’ on Arse Player, I have to say that (like it or loathe it) I thought it was a masterclass in how a modern CEO should speak and behave. As others have questioned here, whether or not Ivan is a real Arsenal fan or even a real football man remains open to interpretation but (perhaps unfortunately) neither of those two things are what he is paid to do by our great club.
I’m going to try and enjoy The Euros and the end of the fabulous IoM TT Races during this month and forget completely that a transfer market even exists. Nothing of any note that will directly affect The Arsenal’s transfer business this summer (barring injury) is likely to happen until after the tournament so why worry about things that we cannot possibly affect?
Drinks are on the bar for all on the usual tab.
Ollie @ #57/58
It’s been a week of it what with J.Defoe’s father passing away too. Don’t these things normally happen in threes? 🙁
AL @ #60
Naah! They’re just a bunch of old mods living the dream 🙂
AL. 60
In other words our new motif has made us an easy target?
Afternoon all.
Cheers TS, a sneaky BM will do nicely, thanx.
Ah – thank goodness TS @ 64 – i just worry that there’s no substitute for our iconic red and white kit, and when you marriot with blue hoops you wanna make sure us goonahs are all singing off the same jimmy page – before the wider football world has clapton (squeeeaaakkkk!) their eyes and seen it, and we suddenly find ourselves in a tewwibble jam of our own making. Well-er, that’s all from me.
I’ll get me parker
Heh H2H @ 65 – i believe that’s what they call a bullseye
http://www.football365.com/news/21554/7798753/All-Over-Battersea…Despair-As-Chelsea-Bid-Fails
Good stuff, I’d have hated to see the old Power Station desecrated.
http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/arsenal-launch-new-home-kit-pictures
Apparently you can still buy v.Persie shirts.
@ #69 – It’s a sign Ollie, it’s a sign! (No… it’s a shrit TS, it’s a shirt)
@ #66 – A mod pun-fest? Spectacular! Ivan’s search for High Numbers from alternate sources of revenue makes others think we are being lead like Lamb(retta)s to the slaughter. The Secret(ive) Affairs of Silent Stan only add fuel to that fire. The (2-Tone) Tonic that we all crave is a new Direction, Reaction & Creation of a wage structure that will secure RvP plus one or two super quality signings (Who?). Ivan baby, it’s All or Nothing!
@ #65 …followed by a cheeky lager and a downright brazen scotch?
FYI, “Ivan Unplugged” now playing on Arse Player, all 65 odd minutes worth! Some of you prefer a good book…
http://player.arsenal.com/home/player/2181-ivan-gazidis-q-amp-a
*may prefer*
I’m on arseplayer, also available on 12inch vinyl.
The full hour of “IG the directors’ cut” is well worth a watch.
@ 69 Ollie
ha ha – That’s a relief!
***
Are we going for it with everything we’ve got? Interesting question. What does it mean? Does it mean, are we spending every penny we have on players? Impossible to say, because impossible to say how much to the last pound we have available specifically to spend on players and their salaries. At a guess I would say sometimes we do and sometimes we don’t. Sometimes the *right* player is not available at the time that we would like to buy. We didn’t get the rising stars we were after last summer, so we didn’t spend the money we were hoping to devote to those acquisitions. Also, we have to decide, is some of our money better used building a medical centre, building relationships with loan clubs or feeder club? That doesn’t add up to lack of ambition. Fans’ remedy for everything is new players. It’s not the only method of improving your squad. And some of us tend to assume that because we haven’t been told exactly what is going on, nothing is going on!
Also, just to reiterate, Kos or Merts or Gervinho or Arteta, which I presume is the calibre of player those who want just a couple more players brought in, are hard to identify and prise away from their clubs. I doubt if Le Boss doesn’t always want to bring in quality, but it’s a lot easier said than done.
It seems to me that ultimately it is a question of trust – do you believe that the board and the CEO want success on pitch or not and will do everything they can to achieve it? I do, because quite honestly I don’t see why they *wouldn’t* want to.
*director’s cut*, I meant. Gah.
Mod puns – there are many more to come. Make sure your noses
stay pressed to your screens, and braces yourself for the onslaught.
There could be a right reggaelar punfest as the protagonists charge through this blog like Ben Sherman tanks.
Some may try to per-suede them to stop, but there will be no early end to this madness if the usual fun boy three get going.
I have to scooter off now but, as for more puns, I will be back to check shirtly. 😉
Good grief 🙁
If you’re looking for mod puns leave me your cell number and I’ll Quadrophonia later.
Oldgooner: You just mean “grief” don’t you? 😎
Afternoon all you muckers…
@ #78 – There a certain Sting to that one, H2H
I’m out of my brain on the 5.15
Trev, back to check shirtly? Puns like that just blouse every other pun out of the water…
If anyone wants to know where I am they can find me over at the .com listening to our Ivan: Masterful performance so far 32 min. 34 sec into the interview. Recommended.
True Storey 62 or True Agostini?
Evening all. Thanks for the balanced summary Holic. Not sure that I can do 60 mins of Ivan Unplugged despite the recommendations. It’s just too much slick PR for me, much like listening to NHS spinmerchants and politicians. Nonetheless I’ll support Holic’s line as it seems common sense as opposed to my hyperallergic response to smooth talking bar stewards.
!8 year old Benromach all round, barman (smart-talking variety in this bar).
Heh H2H @ 73
A whole day away from the internet and we still haven’t signed anybody. Wagner out!
Ah bath, a pearl among grains of sand 😉
Trev: The High Numbers? You are a mod’s mod, sir. Still got your Zoot suit and parka?
Just for you:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hflF6YCsqbs
Well I watched it twice and he did not disappoint. People (I am looking at you Bathgooner) will have their preconceptions – that’s natural – but I believe that you must judge the man on the things he says and the actions he takes and not on what people say about what he says and what he has done. Holic will agree – and has said as much in these set of drinks – that all he wants is for us to think for ourselves..
So here is how I feel about Ivan’s performance: I feel proud. I am proud of the intelligence of the man in the face of unrelenting hostility from the small but very vociferous “attack-dog” section of the fan base, as well as, the gutter press who no matter what the Arsenal do will always find a way to make us wrong. I am more committed than ever to increasing the couple of shares I do hold by this year again setting aside the couple of grand I would have gladly paid for a season ticket had I still resided in Britain (obviously I don’t anticipate that I will lose money and someday I hope to make a tidy profit) … I really, really believe in this club’s operating philosophy and believe that it has come on leaps and bounds since Arsene Wenger took over the reigns. Its easy to take this for granted in these – as someone in the earlier drinks described it – these “we want it now” times… but consider this:
If we were a city or chelsea fan today could we be confident that our oil billionaire sugar daddy will be with us through thick & thin? Could we be confident that each player we sign actually wanted to wear the club’s shirt or just want to milk our cash-cow? Would we be satisfied knowing that we can buy anyone we liked at inflated prices & salaries when we know it will be hellish to shift those same players out if things don’t work out?
People always cite United’s dominance of the premier league as a measure for Arsenal’s failure. But people always forget about Liverpool. Their dominance was even more complete; even more fearful. But look what happened to them! Its was the Arsenal who helped to bring about Liverpool’s demise (remember 89 folks!) and history is repeating itself with City knocking united of their perch. We are on their coat tails and we have not resorted to the kinds of obscene spending that they have. We must be doing more things right than wrong – I am happy with that..
That is all I have to say 🙂
Right, it’s Ivan time. I’m going in.
Wish me luck…
Good luck, ‘holic!
Nice to have you back, baff.
Thanks for the Benromach
I’ve got your back buddy 😎
Scores when he wants.. so he’s not even going to wait for the 100 this time … laters 😎
I can’t explain why my generation liked a quick one, or what Clive would have called a happy jack, probably while staring at pictures of Lily. And no substitutes. Still, the kids are alright.
GT@89: well said. I walked into a bar in New York once where a Chelsea game was following a Newcastle one on TV. A bunch of lingering Toon supporters started singing, “When your Russian goes to jail, you’ll be fucked”.
Exactly.
Good luck ‘Holic – Ivan idea you’re going to need it.
I think I was just called a grain of sand – no I’m shore 😉
NBN @94 – Jack, Lily ? Who ?
Right GoalhangerTerry has gone, I might just nick this one. 😉
Trev@97: Anyway, anyhow, anywhere.
Bullet header top corner! Se ya mugs later 😎
Sticks his bum out and ……
Bastard !!!!!!!!
..always in my shadow.. 🙂
First 23 minutes I can hear Jerusalem in the background.
Agree, or don’t, but you cannot listen to that and not understand the man’s vision and belief in what we are doing. He is not saying nothing. Rather he has put the way that we operate into perfect context.
I’ll argue we are making mistakes in the detail of our day to day operations, but I’ll applaud where he explains we want to be. It’s what I mean about listening and making your own mind up.
Think I’ll do the hour later… I’m off to sulk about GreedyTerry . . And, oh no, no winky signs around here mate……
Heh Trev 98, how naive!
Underhand tactics, GT, are you a Bus Stop in disguise?
Financial fair poop…Looking forward to see Wojciech, Tomas and Andrei tomorrow. Safety first, lads…
51 minutes…
“It’s challenging to have a sensible discussion…”
Tell me about it Ivan 🙂
Loving the way he is labelling critics “people who care about this club”, because by and large he is right.
Fair play fella.
Evening students. First thing I must say is that Ivan is quite witty. My favorite line along that vein of discussion is when he said, “you can have a room full of journalists, as well as people”. Not bad Ivan, you made me chuckle. He also is self deprecating. Alluding to himself and the board, “Even when we win we’re a complete bunch of idiots.” I bring these examples up, because they tend (hopefully) to humanize him. I found him to be very credible and engaging. My heart soared (ever so briefly) at the start of the Q/A when he began with “People from all over the world admire the kind of football we play”. Perhaps Ivan is a fan of the game, after all. Would have liked to hear him talk more about communication between the club and the fans as well as the transfer season. That being said, he has given me the assurance that the board does not have their collective heads in the sand.
Well Holic and holics, Now that we’ve done our homework, lets have some fun. Can you hear Flo Rida’s rendition of ‘Good Feeling’? What’s that you say. Remind us Abb how that song goes. Be glad too! ‘Oh, Oh, Oh, Oh, Oh, sometimes I get a good feeling, yeah! I get a feeling like I’ve never, never, never had before!’
FFFP?!??!??! FukFinancialFairPlay – it’s for sissies and THE SKINT!!!!! Stadium Schmadium/London Paladium dumdum!!! Petro-Dollar Pumped Middle-Eastlanders and Post-Soviet Spivs I SHIT’EM!!!!!! Spend EVERYFINK, AND spend it RIGHT NOW ARSENAL ON A REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY GOOD PLAYER/ES – SPLASH THAT EFFIN’ CASH COWARDS!!!
Ahhh – rant over i need a drink – is Lars in?
Evening LG 😉
Hello nurse. Not a good night to mention Good Feeling. End of the world outside. Rain and gale force winds 🙁
That’s Sveden for ye Neighbour
Hey there Holic. Buckets of the wet stuff here as well, for days now. But I’ve still got a good feeling about the upcoming season. Going to take Ivan on a mini shopping spree, first stop Brazil. There’s this chap there, plays for Santos. Quite good actually. In my dreams!
I swear some of these people have it in for Ivan to such a degree that they wouldn’t forgive him if he personally detonated the bomb that demolished Tottenham from here to kingdom come.
[…] 昨晚去看了加齐迪斯通气会——的直播。虽然本人跟伦敦相隔万里，但是似乎那里的话题主要围绕在财政公平竞争原则和（非常有趣的）俱乐部薪金结构上。The Goonerholic对通气会有一个非要不错的总结，Twitter上也有人在现场直播（其实百度贴吧也有的=。=）。因为其实一句话就能概括整个会议：“我们能做的更好，但我们做的也不算太差”（from @10akhil via The Goonerholic）。 […]
Re: 116: I couldn’t agree, or disagree, any more. 🙂
Heh, Neighbour 😀
Arseblog now translates into many languages, bt8bbgfg.
‘holic I might be able to recognize Russian, Hebrew and Thaii characters based on my reading of beer bottle labels if nothing else. 🙂
Good balanced post ‘holic!
Not had much of a chance to catch up with the bar and drinks over the past 2 weeks but with some meaningful football about to commence again later this Friday, looking forward to back-drinking in-between!
“Nee-hau!” @ 116! 😉
Wrt the Euros, one of my junior docs pointed me towards a little something in preparation! Particularly like the Gazza celebration! 😀
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dv3FV2N77c4&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Good advice to give Gazidis a full and fair hearing, ‘Holic. One thing that struck me listening to him was how he put Arsenal’s problems/ concerns/opportunities in the context of the game as a whole. We are usually all so focused on the triumphs, trials and tribulations of our team that we end up in an unhealthy introspective bubble of our own.
Morning folks. I woke up with an Ivan hangover after watching the full vid starting at 3 am. Have to say the man looks like a very capable CEO, and I am not the least bit surprised at his perceived intelligence. Hopefully with him at the helm AFC is in good hands…
Being a marketing graduate with a focus on consumer behavior and psychology, I was paying close attention to Ivan’s body language and facial expression during the interview. And he was in general very calm, and looks like he believes in pretty much everything he explained. Except for the part where he rubbed his finger on his cheek a few times, worryingly in particular when explaining his belief that we will challenge for trophies and hopefully win in the coming couple of years.
Facial expressions and uncontrollable hand gestures are the hardest to control, even for master speakers. And usually touching your own face when speaking means you are in some degree of discomfort. The other thing is facial expressions, which is more difficult to control, as split second facial changes are usually not controllable – these are expressions that signify anger, happiness, sadness, etc.
Now I need to explain that I am an ardent believer that RVP will stay. Heck, I really pray he stays. But Ivan’s facial expression when answering the Robin question is worrying, as he genuinely expressed some degree of uncontrollable grief as if he knew something bad, and is trying hard to hide it. That part was rather difficult to watch for me, but I hope I’m an idiot and completely off the mark. Sorry to bring this topic back up BTW.
I am neither a marketer nor a behavioral psychologist, but Gazidis’s body language struck me, too, as being uncomfortable when asked the RvP question, and in contrast to an otherwise assured and controlled performance. My sense, though, was not that RvP’s situation was decided, and he is off, but rather that it is still up in the air but not but not in Arsenal’s control.
NBN, I hope RVP will still sign for us, and it would be wrong to currently write off this possibility. However, it is probably correct to assume that RVP has not decided to stay yet, as you would see a rather different facial expression from Ivan when answering the question. Remember AW’s little smile when asked about Poldi’s signing a few weeks before it happened? In any case this is all mere speculation and shoud be taken with a pinch of salt…
‘holic, are you sure 116 isn’t eligible for a ban? 😛
What dark mutterings are these?
Or is it just the Chinese version of Chanel Neus?
Boutros Boutros Ghali.
Look again at the title of 116, ‘holic. I think you’ll find that “arseblog” doesn’t translate at all, it certainly doesn’t seem to transliterate. His blog, on the other hand…
Speaking of the main blogger man, I attracted some ire hereabouts a week or two back when I made some comments that were taken (not unreasonably) as adverse criticism of the arseblog and arseblogger. This has caused me to review my attitude toward that blog and I have returned to reading it again. There’s a splendid post-post-Ivan blog on there today that I commend highly.
Now, off into the wind and wet to earn an honest penny…
Sorry LeG Rash, I had just gone to bed when you went off on your rant, I hope the barman gave you a drink on my tab anyway!
Oxon: today was yesterday, although today’s not up yet 😉
@123
If what you say is true about facial expressions then I can look forward to receiving my divorce papers, my P45 and my long-awaited audience with the Pope summarily cancelled.
Yours,
Balaclava Man
Going to Rome to see the Pope?
Ollie: quite true, the piece in question was posted yeaterday.
(I’m not sure whether I should say this here, so I’ll put it in brackets, rendering it vaguely deniable. I didn’t actually say that the article was posted today, merely that it was there today. Have a half on my slate while I consider deleting this whole, parenthesised, section.)
I have that chant in my head now.
Off for a meeting now.
Heh Oxon. Yes, you could argue that that post will still be ‘on there’ anyway, just further back 🙂
Morning all
Back from a little trip to Blighty. Great patriotic weekend… really hope that the Olympics keep that going through the summer.
Can´t get too excited about the Euros though…
Next trip has to happen during the season!! Thanks for pointing that out, Zico 😉
@131
He hasn’t moved, has he? 8)
@ Catalan
The Barman tells me the fixtures will be published later this month 😉
Some interesting drinks on the Gazidis interview. For me personally, talk is very cheap nowadays in football when success doesn’t follow in conjunction. Success doesn’t necessarily have to occur on the pitch with trophies but can still occur off it with TOTAL financial prudence and challenging for the “commercial” and “branding” title! That’s where Gazidis and the board should be judged!
Responsibility for the incredibly high salaries to playing staff that are forever absent through injury and unable to fulfil their roles over the years, whilst those that contribute the most are not much better rewarded, has to also be laid squarely at Gazidis’ et al’s door! Arsene too has to take some of the considerable blame.
The club’s loyalty’s fine but it has to be reciprocated from the player both in terms of production and loyalty from them too! After all, if our club is to be run like a viable and sustainable business then any business would’ve reviewed and addressed this basic adage a long time ago; unless of course, those that run that business have some vested interests or ulterior motives for having allowed it to continue till now! Of course though, incompetence or naivety are the other reasons for it having continued for so long! I’m not sure really which is worse for our long-term chances!
As some have said, commercial and brand success runs parallel with success on the pitch. I fear that the wait for FFP will only damage our brand as I now feel that it’s impact will be minimal exhibited by the numerous big spending owners that have joined the game throughout Europe and Asia very recently. No one of that ilk wound pump money into a project if they knew genuinely that it’s success and grist would be curtailed by bureaucrats! After all, these money men run the world and no one like Platini will be able to stop them! Let wait and see what happens with the racism at the Euros! It will take place but as per usual, UEFA will do sweet FA about it!
I must say, I was happy to read that Cuntski failed in their stadium relocation bid to Battersea! Being “Champions of Europe” doesn’t give you everything you cunts! 😉
Zico
If you could please forward that fixture list to care of Señora Catalan, that´d be great! 🙂
A soothing pint for DanC …… he deserves it! Caffrey´s?
Catalan @141,
Cheers maestro; don’t mind if I do! “Downs it all in one swift movement!” Ahhhhh! “Hic”! 😉
Another please bar-keep and 2, concurrently, for my Basque friend! Thank goodness for FFFs!
And not the non-existent FFP!
Basque???
The ultimate FFF…. if only I was truly Catalan!
Well played, sir.
I´ve finished my two… got a bit of a thirst on with all this sunshine, don´t you know!
@144,
Heh! 🙂
An iced-tea for my “Catalan” friend who’s Basquing in the sun! 😎
Who’s the lucky fecker on this FFF?! 😉
I’ll have a bacary and coke and a lasagna
wordplay ahoy!
Got to be better than Coldplay….
Catalan @ 140,
You may be interested in my book
Missing in Action
Chapter 2 provides a list of “excuses” for going down the Arsenal…..
Dr F
Will you sign a copy for me??
How terribly exciting!
PS… can I tell her that it was all your idea??
Dr C under the Tolly Brolly?
I ain’t scared of no Spanish broad – tell her all you want…..
Afternoon Sun Worshippers,
I see old ‘Arry has secured the lucrative and prestigious post of Chief Tipster for BetFair during Euro 2012.
In was in this capacity that ‘Arry was persuaded to take part in a Q and A session on Twitter for BetFair’s would-be punters.
Questions that ‘Arry had to field included :-
a)whether he feels that “Dutch girls should be punished for having big boobs” and
b)whether he agrees that he is a ringer for Deputy Dawg.
There is much to dislike about Twitter, but sometimes you’ve just gotta love it. 🙂
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/england/9317586/Harry-Redknapp-goes-from-the-fans-England-choice-to-a-man-reduced-to-offering-tips-on-Twitter.html#
The return of the tabs, nice one.
Being unable to read and write good n stuff, I would of thought twitter would be the ideal outlet ffor Yappy.
He can go through life as @THETWITCHYTWITTERER#
Ollie
We´ll have a cracking good time. See what I did there? Genius.
Dr F… this is no ordinary Spanish Broad….
TWITCHER new (anti)social media
tabs, there you are! Haven’t seen you in this bar for a few days, was starting to wonder if you’d been locked in with Frank McLintock in your away juicer 🙂
Heh H2H , you could be right. Twitter might be the natural home for ‘Arry given that , as you say he can barely reed and rite .
😉
Hey Lars, chance would be a fine thing 🙂 .
I have been busy comforting poor old Wolfie on the brevity of the Speedo season. 😉
At least he won’t need consoling on the fact that Speedos are briefs.
I see Wolfie as a briefer the better kind of chap. 😉
🙂
Your words will be a comfort to him I’m sure H2H . 😉
Thanks for that link, TaBS – “Deputy Dawg”. Inspired!
Catalan Gunner,
Feelgood is to women what Hungary is to beaches…..even Spanish beaches 😉
Well, here we are a few hours from kick off of the Uefas jewel in the crown nations tournament Euro 2012. Ready for the cream de la cream of the continants talent to pick their wits and skills against each other on the field of play.
Here in the bar I’ve got the big screen and projector set up, plus the place is awash with orange buntings, streamers, flags and assorted crap, all hung in careful accordance to the local fire prevention authorities. Punters are starting to come in, beer is starting to flow.
Anticipation is rising.
Me, I’m feeling a bit… MEH.
I read with interest Holic’s sensible and balanced report of wednesday’s Q and A with IG, and the informed discussion that it provoked above.
I can’t say that I have to date been Ivan’s greatest fan.
Some of the reasons for that instinctive antagonism are not, it has to be said, wholly his fault. His is the face, (at least in Arsenal terms), of the ever-increasing corporatisation of Football, his transatlantic drawl mitigates against him being accepted (at least by the more local support) as being a “football man”, whilst the very nature of his job- to at least partially provide a gloss and a sheen to any explanatory accounts of what Arsenal might be getting wrong- will always provoke at best exasperated shoulder shrugs advertising a view that he is merely the mouthpiece for an uncaring and monolithic corporate giant and at worst exclamatory denunciations of him as a liar, a smooth-talking but ultimately vacuous corporate trickster trying to beguile the Arsenal faithful into pouring their hard-earned into the Arsenal coffers with empty and consciously false promises of “jam tomorrow”.
Judging from some of the premature and, in my view, wrong castigations of him in the drinks above, I can only think that I was not the only one who had already formed a view borne entirely of prejudice prior to seeing what he actually said before commenting.
Notwithstanding I sat down with heavy heart yesterday to watch what I thought would be 65 mins of more corporate schmoozing, I have to say, rightly or wrongly, that I was soon warming to many of the themes that IG expounded and that far from it being an hour of empty rhetoric, it was a session in which he said much both overtly and implicitly. It was,in my view, by some distance Ivan’s finest hour since alighting at Highbury Hill.
First of all I do think that it should be stated that he should be applauded for taking these sessions in the first place. I don’t think,(though I stand to be corrected), that other CEO’s of our major competitors subject themselves to the same scrutiny and it is easy to take for granted the fact that IG does.
His opening address- The Future of Football and the Club’s appraisal of where we currently stand and where we hope to go- was a masterclass both in delivery and more importantly substantive content.
As to where we might be going IG relied heavily on the introduction and implementation of FFP. This of course is just the latest excuse for those of a more cynical bent to throw their hands up in dismay and shout “it will never work”. Don’t be so sure. At the very least it will curb the worst excesses and will also stop Owners funding their new football toys through the provision of loans that can be called in if the going gets sticky (See Portsmouth) .
In truth, I, like most, do not know enough about FFP to comment in any detail. That said, I do, I hope, have some experience to deal with a brusque assertion that often goes up in the Bar :-
“These owners are so wealthy they will scare off any attempt at regulation with expensive and clever lawyers”.
This, it appears to me, is a complete red herring and is to misunderstand the nature of a “private club”, which essentially is what FIFA, UEFA, the FA, and The Premiership are. As Private Clubs, they are able to set the conditions of entry to their members, and as long as these rules do not bring them into conflict with the Laws of the Land eg they are non-discriminatory, they are in accordance with Employment Laws etc- they can set whatever terms of entry they wish to.
To use an extreme example, if it was stated that participating Clubs could only spend a pound on transfer fees for every person paying at the turnstile and it was ratified by the Governing Body,and brought into force, it could not be challenged at Law.
The first prerequisite of FFP therefore, its legitimacy, is achieved without any recourse to Law.
The second, the policing of it, is more problematic I accept, but not I would suggest as problematic as some might suggest. As long as the rules are clear within relatively broad parameters as to what “market rate” is in regard to sponsorship deals etc then they could not be challenged. That should not be beyond the wit of man to devise.
IG stated that there was a broad consensus within football to make it work . I agree. The Germans have shown that it can work. Why not wider Europe?
People then speak of a breakaway League if the rules are implemented harshly. Don’t see it myself. Multi Billionaires willing to sink a significant percentage of their fortune into a football Club ad nauseam do not grow on trees. The contention that should Abramovich leave Chelsea someone would take his place is a fallacy.
I personally don’t see a League with Man C, Chelsea, PSG, Anzhi, and Mallorca attracting much interest. They will therefore have to be guided by those Clubs with a rather more sensible attitude to net spend.
I digress. Ivan’s espousal of the rights of the self sustaining model as opposed to those funded by a rich benefactor was, in my view, as close to perfect as you’re going to get.
IG then went on to admit failings in a) last summer’s transfer window, b)our commercial income, and c)the efficiency of our player wage structure.
It was, I thought, a mea culpa of some magnitude, together with a broad and dynamic vision for what lies ahead.
There were of course small irritations- his use of the word “series” when speaking of the games against Udinese grated , and I hope he had his fingers crossed when he said that the Board never briefed against the Manager- but on the whole I thought it was a bravura performance.
Credit where credit is due, and I tip my hat to him.
There will be some who will call me naive and I understand that. That I am merely a stooge for corporate branding and that I have fallen for it. Maybe .
Ultimately we all believe what we want to believe. I want to believe that notwithstanding the huge corporate shackles now attached to Football, those in charge of Arsenal want and are working towards what we, as fans, want.
If I am wrong, and we, the fans, are merely the cash cow to be milked for as long as empty rhetoric is sustainable, then I’d rather not know, for where is the fun in that ?
You’re welcome Mr C @160.
Good afternoon chaps & chapettes. I want to say right off the bat that I am not proud of the way I scored that goal yesterday. On reflection I felt it was sneaky & underhanded to snatch glory from Pun Miester Trev when his heart was so set on scoring. Although I found it hilariously funny at the time, waking up this morning I was wracked with shame & guilt, so please accept my heartfelt apologies…. NOT!!!
In other news: I found this ( http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18352421 ) on the BBC World Service and thought it might be of interest to Wolfie who I understand has an interest in midget porn. He might want to reconsider given the plight that the industry is currently facing..
Now to catch up with the drinks and limber up for the double-century 😎
Tabs – take a bow son, what a post to mark your return !
What I want to believe is that if ever I am requiring legal representation, then you will be providing it 😉
DanC @139 – Balaclava Man could defeat them 😉
GoonerTerry –
my disappointment has long since evapourated.
There have been so many last minute let-downs in my life when scoring seemed a virtual certainty 😉
GT – Pun MEIster btw, not MIEster, as the use of German is inevitably about to grow over the next few weeks. Must have spent too long chatting to Wind 😉
Where is Wind, by the way ? Probably head-down striving away at that 11-Plus 😉
Such a company man, tabs. Now tipping your hat to Gazidis.
He’s still not getting anywhere near my fence. 😉
And it’s not often I disagree with you, but I think FFP is, or will be, a sham. Based on the organisation that is implementing it if nothing else.
I should say however that about I gave up about 4 paragraphs in.
For a minute I thought Wind had hacked your account 😀
Early departure to the Battle Cruiser – the office already looks like the Marie Celeste…..
Cheers Trev and heh 🙂
Ah Dr Z , you read as many as four ? More than I had hoped 🙂
As regards your concerns re the Implementing Body, I have to say that I agree -they are , after all, a bunch of self-interested fuckwits- but I cling to the hope that there will be some very powerful voices ranged against them if they fail to curb the era of the sugar Daddy.
I am humbled by TaBS´big words…. so I´ll stay quiet and have a beer in the corner!
H2H.. heh for your meh! Me too…. maybe I´ll get into it all soon
Right off to dodge more showers/tempests.
Later Boys and girls – round of hot toddies on the Bar .
TaBS…. @169.
Unless said Sugar Daddy is lining the pockets of messers Platini et al.
Football? Corrupt? Never….
The good news;
As the Continent is one hour ahead of Blighty, I have now arived at beer o´clock.
The bad news;
As Boy Catalan was 5 this week, I am off to a Kiddy Play Park with nigh on 40 screaming kids for the next few hours.
Joy.
Catalan/Mr C @170 –
do we have a recognised cure in The Quackery for swallowed dictionaries ?
TABs: “Ultimately we all believe what we want to believe. I want to believe that notwithstanding the huge corporate shackles now attached to Football, those in charge of Arsenal want and are working towards what we, as fans, want” – Masterful..
That’s why I love you Bro 🙂
Shock horror !
Catalan Gunner changes name to “Joy”.
I didn’t realise we did THAT in The Quackery !
@175 –
I’ll tell you what I want what I really really want . . . . .
As the continent is one hour ahead of Blighty, I have now arrived at beer o’clock
What kept you?
Black on Blonde in each hand, heh 8)
@178 –
Interracial Midget Porn – don’t tell Tabs 😉
Trev: Ooops! Well spotted prof… Wind? He’s on work-study at the Pentagon I believe. I think that he’s helping to reorganize the Un-manned Drone program or something like that…
Dr Zee: If TABs is not pissed off by your remarks about his post then neither will I 😎
Heh Trev. Can´t think of a witty response right now. Will seek inspiration amongst the Mum´s at the B´day party.
Dr Z
One has to accept the Spanish attitude to timing when residing here…! 🙂
Poland is a further hour ahead, right, Dr C?
Ollie
Aah…. okay. Up to speed.
Or at least a drink.
Ollie – 2 hours ahead and 25 years behind – you can work that out !
I was in Warsaw a year ago (and just had a chat 5 minutes ago, with a colleague who’s doing the support for our equipment during the Euros – fingers crossed for him, I’m not doing 3rd level support for him anymore, he’ll have to call the US in case of trouble!), it was all right.
Though it was pissing down and some roads required a boat rather than a car to make progress.
Anyway, I’m off. Still on public transport, and of course there’s a bit of a strike, but hopefully I can catch the second half of that first game.
Heh @ 179.
You can drink midgets? Oh yeah, shorts. 🙂
GT – who rattled your cage? #FFF
There should be plenty of puns associated with MIDGETS and PORN but sadly I can’t think of any as the thought of it makes me strangely sheepish 🙂
Ollie: Any available links to the games today?
Pub. Guinness. Football. Where are the flighty birds with the harps?
GT – Sheep?
Beastly. Stick to the midgets. In shorts, drinking shorts. Of sorts.
All my favorite docs and Tabs at the bar, what a treat! Even better, Gooner Terry is here to keep them in line. Life is good, I tell ya. Watching Poland and Greece. Bring on Nemar!
Evening nurse, night off?
Hey GT, You bet. Gonna enjoy it no matter what!
Goal yes! Poland one up.
1-0 Polska…
Abb –
GoonerTerry couldn’t keep his washing in line 😉
Goal potential here again, but , even though I’m on holiday this week, I have a couple of “emergency” adjustments to do to an errant back and neck!
Thus allowing GoalhangerTerry to nick another one off my toes 🙁
Why are we playing Poland ?
We ARE Poland today sir 🙂
Lobs the goal keeper from 40-yards 😎
WTF?? I thought you were at the Euros John?
Not me GT I am here at a Press gig trying to get the number of this Russian bird: http://www.daylife.com/photo/09xN21scmKdcF?__site=daylife&q=John+Terry
Very sneaky GT. Mr Bould, welcome to Goonerholic, sir. At some time, If I could have a word with you please, about a hot property in Brazil.
Well I’m even on time for some of the first half and I see the Szczesny boys are 1-0 up, Hooray!
Greece down to ten men. Helen Of Troy warming up as as a sub.
heh abb
@163,
Take A Bow Son! 🙂
Erudite and egalitarian post my friend! Much to agree with. I truly do hope that one’s optimism of the implementation of FFP materialises in earnest – for sure the whole footballing family needs it!
GT @165, 180,
Heh! 😀
Trev @166,
Heh, I certainly hope so! 🙂
Oxo Cube reckons she’s Polish – what does he know the bla… blaggard
Referee’s making friends in Poland.
I wouldn’t book a holiday in Crete anytime soon if I were him though.
God, refereeing.
I’m even agreeing with Hansen.
Terry for the double century?! Feck, that cunt gets everywhere! 😉
Was that him claiming the first Polish goal too?! 😉
Evenin’ nursie! 🙂
Wonderful. This is the tournament that will prove technology is absolutely essential. Referees need all the help they can get. Especially this twat.
Evening to all stragglers. Ollie has a legit excuse.
The English FA has assured us that the recent racism incidents in Poland will not be repeated as John Terry has been gagged with Rio Ferdinand’s underpants..
Oh Szczesny, what have you just done? 🙁
Poor Woj! What a muck up!
tabs@163: a great post with many very important points, methinks.
I have to admit that I have been one of those who say “FFP will never work”, but in the past few days I have started to rethink my position. The basis of my pessimism is that UEFA will never want a Champions League without Barca and/or Real, but Arseblog Tom made a good point at Arseblog the other day: what if the only two clubs to fall foul of the rules are Chelsea and Man City? I actually think Platini would be more than happy to bar both those clubs from European football.
Also, I’d like to add that the threat of a breakaway league has one other major problem: UEFA/FIFA could then just change the rules so that they can ban players playing in that league from playing international football, and as much as many of us supporters find internationals to be a massive meeeeeeh, almost all players are very, very keen on playing in the big tournaments.
And this can not be said often enough:
“The contention that should Abramovich leave Chelsea someone would take his place is a fallacy.”
Very, very true. Someone *might* come in with an equally large wallet, but it’s not very likely. This argument is also used for us, you know the “spend the money, if we’re in the dumps someone will come in and buy us” variety. But you only have to look at Glasgow Rangers, who have been shafted royally and are on the brink of extinction. Also, what happens if Ambramovic goes under a bus tomorrow and a huge legal battle over his assets starts?
***
The ref in the Poland-Greece game makes all the Premier League refs seem quite good in comparison.
Greece score, not much Szczesny could have done about it.
1-1 to Sparta
Greece equalise?! Shit!
Manuel, please come back señor! 😉
The Greeks just don’t want to leave the Euro no matter how difficult it gets!
Lars, seeing it on replay, think your right. Woj was very brave.
Lars & Abbs,
Might you just be protecting our boy with abit of the “rose-tinted”?! 😉
BBC Sport football tactics blogger Alistair Magowan tweets: “That goal was Greece’s first shot on target. They have had only four in the game compared to Poland’s 11.”
Sorry Lars but to compare Glasgow Rangers with any team that is playing in the top tier in English football is akin to comparing apples with orangemen, sorry oranges.
If Rangers had had access to the pots of money that is available by virtue of Sky, no one would have heard anything about their present problems – I suspect that they would have long ago settled with HMRC on their EBT case as well before things got to the stage that they are in.
Chelsea now being a successful “franchise” would attract investors in a way that large clubs in other leagues wouldn’t simply because of the platform that Murdoch’s millions provides. It is arguable whether they would be taken over by a multi billionaire but it is more likely than they would fall like a house of cards.
I’m too old and cynical I suspect but if you think the money are going away, you’re sadly mistaken. The ship has already sailed.
PS – Woj still carrying that “mystery” injury I see that makes him do daft things 😉
DanC@220, heh!
abb: looking at the replay, then *maybe* he could have tried to get ahead of the attacker and punch it but it was probably too far out. Had he taken a step back he still wouldn’t have reached the ball after it bounced off the Polish defender, and then the Greek player would still have had a rather easy finish. He couldn’t really just stay in the same position either, then he would have looked really foolish had the Greek player manage to direct the ball towards the corner where he tried to get it to.
* the money men*
Oh dear goalie.
Nightmare for Szcz 🙁
And no Fabianski to rescue Poland.
zico, maybe GR wasn’t the best of examples, I was just pointing to them as a club who are a dominant force in their league and who have a very large fan base. Maybe I should have used Liverpool instead, they might not be on the brink of extinction but their spending spree last summer was funded by borrowed money and we’ll see long-term how good the current owners are. Let’s not forget that for the first two or three years most things looked quite good for them under Hicks and Gillett too.
I’m also not as pessimistic as you are about someone mega-rich taking over Chelsea should RA tire of losing money by the mega-bucket load.
Szczesny sent off!
Red for Woj.
Feel terrible for him.
Woj! Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear! Nightmare 2nd half!
TITAN save
Well fellas Woj out, what say you?
Soft red for Woj, so the saved penalty is some sort of retribution.
I am probably being hyper senstive but these BBC commentators seem to be enjoying the pain of our young goalkeeper.
Harsh lessons being learned by the boy, hopefully good for us in the long run.
Old Greek proverb: ‘In order to score, you have to have a goal’. You don’t say!
Zico, my commentary is in Spanish. Everything is a party for these fine hombres.
Not surprised about the BBC but nevertheless, more harsh but good lessons for our young keeper to learn on the big stage. We do need a good and matured back-up in the transfer window for next season to push him to improve!
@ abbs,
Heh! Fiesta time! 🙂
Come on, I want a late Obraniak winner.
Not impressed by that Lebknowskikvicdkvski fella thus far! Doesn’t look like could clean Robin’s or iPod’s boots from current showing!
Greece seem to get lucky a lot. In football at least, but maybe in other areas too. I know that if I had a couple of spanakopita right now I would feel lucky. 😉
Like I said before – Meh.
Didn’t realise it was Boumsong doing the commentary (well I guess it’s him, doubt there’s any other Jean-Alain likely to comment on football)
Nurse ABB: “Chelsea now being a successful “franchise” would attract investors in a way that large clubs in other leagues wouldn’t …”
I must say the thought of seeing those blue cunts in every major shopping centre in Europe is quite upsetting to me – say it isn’t so..
😎
Re: Peter Hill-Wood: Is that a Polish joke or something?
The Crisp-monger trying to suggest that that game was “a treat”.
Did I watch the same game?
Sorry Nurse ABB: That last post was meant for Dr Zee..
Hey GT, Don’t worry about Chelsea. Arsenal, as you pointed out earlier, get so many things right. Would love for them to come to the states next summer…Chelsea is in Miami this July. Might go see them, but it just won’t be the same.
It was all right Dr Z. Far from the borefest most seemed to have expected.
Personally, I expected more fireworks from Poland, but hey-ho.
Geez, just back from a short venture outside. Is it really June ? Felt like I’d been dropped into the middle of a tornado.
GT , thank you for your kind words, and no I am not at all perturbed by Dr Z’s stinging literary criticism. 🙂
I am aware that the view I espoused was at best controversial and at worst wilfully blind to the potential shortcomings of FFP.
Anyway, I’ll make him pay in Tollie Guinness. 😉
Mr C @172 – Take your point, individuals will always be susceptible to self-interest, but I would be surprised if Platini et al side themselves either publicly or more surreptitiously (and corruptly) with the sugar Daddy Clubs.
Just had a look at the Deloitte top 20. The top 5 are Madrid, Barca, Manure Bayern and ourselves. None are funded by extraneous means. Madrid have of course been subsidised by their Government, but it is difficult to see that happening again anytime soon given the prevailing conditions of the Spanish economy.
Barca have at times struggled to pay their players, ManUre walk a precarious financial tightrope predicated on debt, Bayern have come out in the strongest terms possible against the financially doped Clubs, whilst we have paid the price in onfield success. What is beyond doubt is that each Club has struggled to cope with the financial pressures imposed by the existence of Clubs who can spend without a backward glance at their income.
I honestly don’t think they (the Big Clubs) will allow it to continue and play second fiddle to Clubs who have a fraction of their following .
IG called such a future- one dominated by whoever is the richest owner at any one time- nihilistic. I couldn’t agree more.
Conversely therefore, my view is that the threat of a breakaway League will increase if the FFP rules are NOT implemented.
Midget Porn ? – a short dalliance 😉
DanC – Cheers .
I’ll make him pay in Tollie Guinness
And there you have it – financial fair play, my arse!
Nurse Abb,
No, no, three times no. Don’t go and watch Chelsea.
Go to the local tractor-pulling contest. Or the annual watching-paint-dry competition. Hell you could even go to the poke-a-tree-frog-with-a-stick World Series.
Do anything but legitimise those smelly blue Chavs…..
Now hold on a minute Dr Zee. Maybe Nurse ABB can indeed go to the cunski show and still retain her dignity – but she would have to agree to spend a little time with me learning a few more expletives and abuse. Frankly her attempts on here in the past can best be described as woeful
😎
Lars @217 – Thanks and one right back at yer for the points you raise. And whilst I agree that GR was not perhaps the best analogy, your point still stands, and also gives me a reason to disagree with Dr Z for his earlier cheek. 🙂
The point being that Clubs can only spend more than they earn for so long and that there is only a limited pool of people prepared to fund that extravagance ad infinitum.
As you state Liverpool and to a lesser extent Villa are examples of Ownerships that came in with seemingly big pockets, but were only prepared to fund an assault on the top four and when that aim was not realised, the funds were either recouped by way of sale (Liverpool) or by player sales (Villa).
Only my view, but the contention that Chelsea with a limited fanbase, limited ground and limited appeal overseas would immediately attract another Abramovich is not tenable.
When Abramovich took over he expressed the view that he wanted the Club to be self-financing within 10 years. 10 years on , he is further away from that aim than ever.
Stick that in your pipe Dr Z 😉
@252 🙂
Pipes?
Is it that time already?
I’ll go give Feelgood a shout…..
Looking forward to seeing Andy Arshavin again I must say. I want him to lob Petr Cheque. But I also want Tommy boy to score as well – Hope both avoid being sent off though..
Listen,
Lars and tabs, we’ll have to agree to disagree on FFP.
Time will tell.
I think Gazidis and Arsenal are hoping rather than knowing. I would be delighted to be proved wrong, so pass the hookah 🙂
Quite a challenging game, that last one. Especially the part about pronouncing the names of the two players who were sent off (Szczesny for Poland, Papastathopoulos for Greece). Can Russia v. Czech Republic challenge for the most unpronounceable names??
tabs. June?
Nope it’s March. Perhaps we’ll manage to finish above Spu*s.
PIPES?? Did someone say the magic word? If you are getting the pipe out I will get the munches – where’s Dr DanC? He won’t want to miss a session 😎
Nice. Tomas and Arsh shaking hands as opposing skippers.
heh bt8 😀
Despite Cech (can he get sent off please?), one Arsenal player + one Bordeaux player (same as the Poles) mean : come on, Czech mates!
Zico @ 253 GT @ 254 Multiple chuckles. Dan C are you watching Russia take on Tomas?
Heh Ollie 🙂
Pipes ? Excellent. I’ll go and fetch the large Executive jobs 🙂
8 ball, ain’t that the truth! NBN, I thought the same thing! Ollie, I’m rooting for them as well! Hi, Tabs…
Did you all see TR wink at Arshavin whilst shaking hands. Very touching (giggling).
Funny how ‘how dare Wenger play him on the wing and thus wasting him-Arshavin’ is playing on the wing.
Did I hear someone say “pipes”?! Oh yeah! Where’re my mint speedos?! Already on the cookies and cream! It’s gonna be a FFF 😀
Looking forward to this match; even with that muppet Webb in charge!
Hope TR7 and AA23 have good tournaments!
How the feck is Advocaat still one of the highest paid managers in the world after what he did at Rangers?! What a joke!
Goal! Russia up one!
Cech looked both powerless and pitiful on that one.
Hello Nurse Abb 😉
Ollie @270 – Took the words right out of my mouth .
Sure am abbs! AA23 looking good and a little leaner too if I might add!
Russian goal against the run of play – breakaway football at its best!
Olloe, don’t think AA23’s playing left wing but more like a free attacking role through the midfield!
Lovely ball from Arsh – 2-0 .
He is predominantly left sided but gets better cover from the left back when he vacates! Yet again creates another goal!
Maybe we should sign that Arshavin fella, he doesn’t look too bad.
Zhirkov’s helps Andre out a hell of alot!
Now Woj can feel a little better! Caught out. Russia 2 up.
Arshavin now on the right
Now that’s the AA23 we know and love!
H2H Hey! Arshavin really looking sharp, boy oh boy! Raises glass to Tabs in the corner. Reminds Dan C to lay off the cookies.
Arshavin’s twin looks very good.
Feck me! I go take a shower and the Ruski’s take a 2-goal lead! I wonder if that’ll work with the Arsenal? Hmmmm
@ 285
So that’s what that smell was in January?
It’s all starting to become clear….. 8)
Dapper Dan:
‘don’t Bogart that Cookie my friend,
pass it over to me,
take out another one,
just like the other one..’
😎
Abbs, Hee! Hee!
I would lay off but they contain a fair portion of my daily intake of roughage! You wouldn’t discourage a diet high in fibre would you nurse?! 😉
Dr Zee: Here take a nice tug of this – It’ll take off that edge! If not I have got a pair of tweezers…to pick that bug out of your Arse.. #FFF
🙂
Passes a large “Farley’s Rusk” sized cookie to GT! Gwaan man, take a few bites of that monster! Pass the pipe me bro’! 😎
Petr Jiracek looking half-descent for the Czechs but TR7 very quiet!
Hope the 2nd 45’s more competitive akin to the Poles v Spartans!
Dan C, being as John Terry has been doing plenty of grazing lately, not sure roughage is the way to go. He’s still full of you know what! GT taking on Dr Z, Ollie will negotiate a peace treaty (being French and all).
Farley’s Rusks?! Now that brings back a memory…not a particularly good one mind… but when my eldest was a baby (and I was still fully partaking of the weed) I had the munches one evening and took a shining to a package of her rusks (as one does) ….
I don’t recommend it unless one is well hydrated and mouth is well moist 😎
Go Arshavin, Go Tomas! Boy, Am I conflicted or what. Bet Andy Gorham isn’t.
France’s most fervent supporters may not get there in time for the game on Monday.
Great ball from Plasil! 🙂
Cheques are back in it..
Now we’ve got a game! 2-1.
Rolls ball forward.
What Ollie said 😉
Russians looking the clear group favorite. Arshavin looking fit, energized, dangerous.
Cheers to ‘holic for the RT of my silly play on words 🙂
Men in skirts… where’s Wolfie?
@291,
Hee! Hee! That cunt does certainly like to munch away on other people’s lawn! 2-1! Game on!
Andy Arshavin is a different animal for Russia… what’s missing at the Arsenal?
First time watching a game with bag pipes playing in the background, I like! Arshavin looking extremely dangerous.
@ Guvnor & GT! 🙂
Honestly, never can I recall Andre busting his butt like he is now, what a revelation.
GT 303. I’m confused as to which one is the Owl?
GT,
AA23’s a “different animal for Russia” cos he’s used and played in a different way! Food for thought if he returns but would mean lots of latitude and tweeking to incorporate his luxury and laid-back style of play! Still remains a match winner in an attacking sense!
Can’t help but wonder if Wenger’s match commentary for French TV makes liberal use of the term “handbrake” to describe the second half performances of both Poland and Russia…
DanC: What different way though? On the left wing, tracking back to help his full-back. Snappy crosses, shots?? WTF is Arsene asking him to do if not those things?
If only he was commentating that game, Julian, heh? 😉
Fuck if I know Ollie – I am confused too! I hate it when players play better for their country’s than they do for us..
3-1, bollix
Well, we saw that one coming! 3-1.
It is mightily annoying indeed, GT.
Spu*s cunt scores.
Game over.
When you’re hot, keep going! 4-1
Ollie @311
My mistake — had thought Arsene was working as a pundit for the tournament?
Regardless, the handbrake is clearly disengaged at this point. Goodness.
Ollie: I thought they sold him in the Jan window?
Beautiful effort by TR!
Julian, only a partial mistake, I think he’s doing only the games on TF1, which are few in the first round anyway.
Tonight’s game is not on free-to-air TV, only on BeINSport aka Al-Jazeera Sports.
GT 319, honestly I have no idea.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Pavlyuchenko
Well spotted, Lokomotiv Moscow cunt then 😛
GT,
He’s not just confined to just the left flank mate! He wanders and has the licence to do so. One could argue that the fullbacks and other players are better at covering for his defensive inadequacies than he was permitted under Arsene! He’s a luxury player and always has been!
He’s abit like Ben Arfa at Newcastle but sadly not young enough to be indoctrinated with a defensive ethic alongside his attacking which that cunt Pardew is tryin to instill in Ben Arfa!
Another figure having a better game then maybe we are used to;
Howard Webb.
Yeah, shocking indeed H2H. Though he got some bizarre decisions and didn’t have much hard work to do.
Let’s see if they give him Germany vs Holland.
Andrei, I salute you. Now why were you holding out on us? Cause I’m dumbfounded. Truly.
H2H: Yea the cunt almost snapped his neck looking away when TR was pushed to the ground early in the 2nd half… Manc cunt,
Being Mr Angry is such fun 🙂
I see what you’re saying Dan.. but still…grrr
326 Ollie.
Doubt it.
DanC, I would argue that he always had at least a partial licence to wander at Arsenal. AW doesn’t and never has asked for rigid formations and we are always reasonably fluid.
Perhaps there were differences I didn’t pick up on, but in all honesty I didn’t see huge differences to the way he is asked to play at Arsenal.
Thought the major difference was that he was clearly fitter and as such he was prepared to marry effort to his undoubted technical excellence.
Bloody frustrating.
Oh well. At least his performance makes the possibility of a reasonable transfer fee more likely.
Right, Arshavin played well tonight but let’s not forget that it was against a team that would probably struggle to stay up in the Premier League. I mean, when your biggest star apart from Rosicky and Cech is Milan Baros you know you’re in trouble.
Also, it was one game. He had good games every now and then for us too.
I’m with tabs 331. And I’ll have a drink off Lars 😎
True Lars, though I’m struggling to remember his last good 90 mins for us.
Ollie, feel free to have a drink of your choice on my tab!
tabs, I’m not sure he ever had 90 good minutes seeing as he wasn’t ever fit enough to complete a full game…
Did we win ?
Lars and Tabs, Andrei never played 90 minutes like that, for Arsenal. Must have lost a couple of pounds easy in this game. He was brilliant for us in spurts, but to run down every ball like he did tonite, create so many chances in one game…can’t ever remember seeing him play entire 90 minutes like he just did. Ever.
Lars and Abb – Agreed !
PHW – We always win 😉
Tabs,
Wrt to AA’s fitness, he’s certainly improved on that front and looks more trim and fleet of foot!
Wrt to his freedom to wander under AW, that may have well been the case but he didn’t look as free with us as he looked for Russia this evening and he looked for Zenit before he joined us. The reasons for that, we may never know but I for one am saddened that his technical genius didn’t set the EPL fully alight as it threatened to do early on in his Arsenal career! I guess the pace and demands of life at Arsenal, with the EPL and associated CL, were too much for him to sustain those initial high expectations! I hope that he commands a nice fee from his performances this tournament. So far so good!
TR7 didn’t have a great match; looked lacking in fitness and sharpness!
Interesting factoid. Russia is the ‘lightest’ team in the Euros this time around. Weight wise.
Fair enough Dan, good points, and hope you’re right re the big fat fee.
Yep thought TR7 looked like the TR7 of a year ago – flitted prettily on the edges of the game,without really threatening to make an impact and ultimately flattered to deceive.
Dan C, TR looked a little fatiged but he also was coming off an injury. Don’t know if Woj’s shoulder was a bit sore as well. They showed him rooting on Poland (after his red card exit). Must say, he took it like a man, no fussing with the ref.
Abbs, tabs,
TR7 certainly looked as if he was returning from an injury.
An early exist for the Czechs, a chance for him to rest-up fully before preseason and he’ll be raring to go in August! Job done! COYG!
Abb, if Russia are the lightest team, I reckon AA23 was still munching on his breakfast when the Doc went round with the scales 🙂
Abbs,
Woj got lucky and took it like a man! Knowing him, I’m sure he’ll be ready to make amends as soon as possible! But he must learn from his mistakes! That shoulder injury better not linger through into the start of next season or we’re fecked!
Tabs @344,
Heh!
Amen to early exits to all the Arse boys Dan.
COYG .
Arsenal first, everyone else second!
Not too confident about Robin and iPod though, tabs! Just too damn good for their own good! 😉
COYG!
A guiness for tabs and abbs please bar-keep! Salut! 🙂
Cheers Dan, very kind Sir.
And you may well be right re VP and Poldi.
Don’t think we have too many worries as regards Theo and The Ox though. Not sure if that is a cause for celebration or not.
Tabs,
My pleasure, Maestro!
If Theo and AOC can excel and do their talents justice for the whole international world to see, it can only be good for Arsenal! With young Jack and Kieran awaiting, and hopefully young Carl can attain that level soon too, Arsenal will salvage English football in the future! Where’s your “Arsenal don’t like to rear English players” now you English media feckers! COYGs!
Make mine a Miller Lite, please. Now did someone just mention Theo and the Ox( clasps her hands in delight). Nite guys, I know it’s getting past bedtime, for you (not me)!
Time for an early slumber me thinks! Night, catch y’all tomorrow for two of the favourites with two of our attacking “jewels in the crown”! Especially looking forward to Germany v Portugal! Salut!
Is it just my eyes, or does this man have an unusually large left bicep?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/tennis/18368691
Next question: If we are playing a preseason match in Germany on Sunday August 12, does that not mean that we will have a later first game of the season than we normally do?
http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/arsenal-to-play-fc-cologne-in-pre-season
Abbs,
Whatever you do, never go and watch Cuntski on their travels stateside! Knowing the way they play on off the pitch in search of success at all costs, that cunt Terry and his consistent band of amoral and adulterers will make a pass or two your way! They’ll do whatever they have to for the commercial success of the blue cunts in the land of the star-spangled banner! Be very aware and careful! 😉
Bt8ball –
Season starts on August 19th from memory. Later start than usual due to the Euros, I believe.
i’m sure i’m no different from everyone else , in that i set my moral compass by Bonanza
if there’s a dilemma Ben Cartwright can’t solve in 45 minutes and high waisted trousers i haven’t seen it
(apart from the episodes Little Joe wrote and directed – smug wee twat – if only Half Pint knew what a self promoting cunt her Paw used to be she’d have never acted herself towards Walnut Grove)
anyhoo
life lessons for us all , there , i think
now – subject in hand – today was no exception
Hop Sing – on his hollydoodles from being No. 1 Cook on Ponderosa was prospecting at Miracle Creek when he met his future wife –
a ginger haired , almost feral , white mountain woman lurking in the undergrowth – as time went by he left food out on a plate for her – meal by meal – day by day – night by night – until – eventually – he had coaxed her into his camp – not unlike the wee squirrel he had done likewise with – subtle wasn’t the word – you’d have thought someone had written it
anyhoo
eventually she trusted him enough to speak to him and they fell in love
anyway
it all ended badly
can’t be arsed @ 359: You’re a star in the making mate. Bonanza eh? Reruns still playing here in Jamaica – still have its dedicated followers although the cunt Adam Cartwright was the prototype for John Terry..
🙂
AA looked the player we bought rather than the one who played for us.
Priceless, cba, priceless 😉
Hope all is well.
….a ginger haired, almost feral white mountain woman lurking in the undergrowth….
Mmmm, nice. 8)
Trev@358, it’s not because of the euros. It’s because of some sort of event going on in London from late July and a couple of weeks on, can’t really remember what it was but apparently it’s some sort of thing that takes place every four years in different cities around the world. Not sure it’s been mentioned in the papers too much so I can understand if you’ve missed it 😉
What Lars just said 🙂
Barça are sniffing around M’vila now.
Not to worry Ollie, because I’ve read on Twitter that M’Vila has already signed for us 😉
Ha! Don’t know where we’d be without twitter bringing truth to the masses! 😀
Ollie, we’d be completely lost!
Anyway, time for a bath and some lunch and then off to meet up with mates down the pub. There is a slight possibility that I might be a little bit drunk when I get back home sometime late tonight.
Anyone else see MOTD last night?
Fuck me that was shit, even by their pretty low standards.
I suppose it’s only fitting that this joke of a programme is hosted by a comedian, well I say comedian, I’m guessing that’s what he’s trying to achieve but funny he is not.
The expert pundits *sniggers in a deragotary fashion* for the late night entertainment were Mssrs Savage and James.
The former telling us who the worst player on the field was and what not to do when playing in a top tournament, calling on all his experience of playing for the top teams in the PL relegation struggle and the also rans in the Championship. Now I’m not one to blow my own trumpet, but just between you and me, I’ve played in as many Euro finals as Mr Savage, so I’ll be sitting by the phone waiting to be called up by Auntie.
The latter, brought in to comment on the shotstoppers, a former keeper who’s mostly remembered for his catwalk antics and dodgy hairdos. A guy that was dubbed Calamity James brought in to berate the keepers? That’s tantamont to asking John Terry to host a seminar on how not to be a dispicable cunt.
From what they said after the Poland-Greece highlights, I had the feeling I’d watched a completly different game a few hours before, so confused was I, that I just had to call a mate who was here in the bar during the match to confirm what I thought I remembered.
The guy who did the commentary on the second match started off badly, when he used the same phrase twice. He informed us that Petr Cech was coming into this game
“Fresh off his winning appearance in the CL final”.
Fair enough I suppose, but he also mentioned that Howard Webb came
“Fresh into this game from refereeing the last WC Final”
Eh? What? Fresh?
Now you can call me Mr Picky, but if his idea of fresh is something from two years ago then I’m never going round his gaff for dinner.
He ended the proceedings in breathtaking fashion by informing us that after their win in their first group match, Russia had now a 100% record in the Finals. WOW what a mathmatical genius he must be.
The one good thing about this first highlight show of the Euro’s is the thought that the next one can only get better. *famous last words*
A bit too much faith in the BBC there H2H,
…it can only get better..
what is even more galling is that I have to pay £150 or so for the privilege of watching (I don’t listen) to these cretins…..
Galling indeed.
I get it for free and still feel ripped off.
Afternoon Chaps,
I watched MOTD last night.
In normal circumstances I would have got very upset that the two pundits were a nasally voiced Princess Di looky-likey and a pretentious spice boy, but luckily I was too busy wondering if Colin Murray was cultivating his new “Adolf Hitler windswept” look in honour of either John Terry or the Ukrainian support .
More Harry Redknapp news from his Twitter Q and A …
‘Do you think there will ever be a boy born who can swim faster than a shark?
Harry said:
“I would think so, the way it’s going. If they wear the right swimwear.”*
Now I’m no Biologist, but I like to think I’m something of a Swimwear expert, and I have to tell you ‘Arry, there ain’t a pair of Speedoes out there that’s gonna help you outsprint a shark.
Would love to put ‘Arry in a tank with a shark so that he is able to put his theory to the test ! 😉
*Mediawatch
Ha! I knew I’d read that somewhere, but your * shows me where 🙂
Although, thinking of it, it’s quite fucking bizarre, because I thought I’d read it on the drinks, as I was convinced someone mentioned speedoes on that topic.
Or maybe I just made the natural mental association, which is quite worrying, damn you Wolfie!
Haha 🙂
Wolfie will be pleased Ollie !
Right, off for a bit .
The name Julian means ‘YOUNG’. I wonder if I change my name to Julian if something magical might happen…hmm! Good day youngins!
a bit of what? 😉
Two hours to kick off here, Orange fever not quite kicking in yet, need some more drinks me thinks.
Next round on the bar from me.
*Hup Holland Hup.
*purely from a business point of view.
Abb.
People will probably think you can’t spell Julia, but good luck with that. 🙂
Hey there H2H! Stood in front of my mirror and said my name is Julia. Nothing happened!
So I’ve been sipping the drinks out of my ‘sippy’ cup (hey, I’m starting to revert). cba, very funny. Michael Landon was quite a prankster on the set of ‘Little House on the Praire’. He use to have the seamstress take in the trousers of the male actors, making them think they had gained some weight! Tabs @ 374 Don’t you think being a manager in the EPL is akin to swimming with the sharks?!
What a great start to the day this is: First Sharawhatshername worked up just enough sweat to give her legs that seductive sheen in Paris and then H2H @ 370 as soon as I walk into the bar!
🙂
Its going to be a great day of football folks. Fuck Savage. Like H2H even I have played in as many CL finals, FA Cup finals and won as many Premiership titles as that wanker… Yesterday he said: “Arshavin obviously loves to play in a winning team like Zenith & Russia” – cunt!
Afternoon/Morning Tel.
Pull yourself up a chair and have a beer on me.
It’s Oranje time! Hoping he who scores when he wants, has the desire.
Cheers, H2H.
I mostly hope he doesn’t pick up an injury.
You couldn’t get a ticket for the Ned v Den game here, yet the stadium is nowhere near full.
Well done Uefa.
That too Ollie.
Beautiful effort by RVP!
Robin warming up!
Well Robben, not being selfish, should have taken the shot himself!
Oh my ..Dutch are really easy on the eye, beautifull stuff. Soothing after yesterdays battering from Russia hehe
Clever twist by RVP.
GOAL! What the heck! Practically never having the ball…Eandy, tis your fault!
The Dutch play a bit like the Arsenal – they like to give their opponents a goal lead 🙂
what?..how?..I dont even…!..maybe I should stop watching lol!:D
It’s ok Eandy. I was about to say there was only one team on the pitch, then they scored. lol.
Wesley should just try one of those songesque lobs for Robin to smash in:)
The Dutch are spending too much time questioning the officials and too little time defending the counterattack.
…crafty through pass behind the defence…
Tickles it for 400 😎
GoonerTerry 3 – Coach Potatoes 1 🙂
Well in GT!:)
Well this is going to be tricky for Holland – they need an early 2nd half goal before the Danes settle.
Agreed..and they need to work harder off the ball, too static and effortless.
Agreed GT. Danes look set to shut up shop to nullify the Dutch attack. Reminds me of more than a few Arsenal matches…
Fuck, fuck, fuck.
This is not good for busness. 🙁
Some intricate passing and dazzling footwork by team orange, very pleasing to the eye. If there is a god, they will triumph.
This ought to be another golden generation for the Dutch but they don’t really play as a team (at least today). All brilliant individuals seemingly waiting to take the stage and hardy anyone doing the grub work of stringing their passes together – they need Arteta..
🙂
Or Robben needs tolearn how to pass.
Hup Holland Hup.
2nd half for Oranje, kom op jongens!!
ESPN Commentator: “There’s a saying amongst the Dutch, that Holland is so flat you can watch your dog run away for five days. That pretty much describes their team’s performance during the first half.”
Ouch.
I’ve lived in Holland for over 20 years and I’ve never heard that so called saying.
H2H — no surprise, given this is ESPN we’re talking about…
Ohhhh Robin!
The hell is with Robins feet today?:(
🙁
Ah man! Wesley’s been brilliant. And I think team orange read each other like the back of their hand. Esp. with Wesley’s back passes and headers.
Van Bommel, quelle surprise!
Not looking good, H2H 🙁
Good changes for Holland – come on..
He has his moments, Ollie.
What a pass by Sneijder…reminded me of days when Tomas used to whiff out those on regular basis.
Can’t believe this score line will stand. Dutch have too many players capable of creating magic on a moment’s notice.
I think Dutch have too many players playing crap today, Julian.
They certainly haven’t shown enough to cause the Germans much worry, Ollie.
What Ollie said.
I told you I would have my revenge!
OUCH.
H2H@370, tabs@374 – 🙂
Wish I could get interested in the Euros beyond squirming uneasily every time someone gets near RvP.
Thanks to Lars and Ollie for pointing out my forgetting the Olympics. Just can’t wait for them to start…… 🙁
H2H – you may not have heard that saying but your dog probably did. 😉
Might be tough for the Dutch to qualify now.
Although I still think, contrary to most people, that Portugal is the weakest team in the group, not Denmark, who mostly deserved their win today, it has to be said.
Team Orange not mobile enough for me . . .
Good luck, H2H!
Heh, Trev. Difficult punning domain. Virgin territory, I believe.
Well it will not be popular but they will have to drop Robbin for the next game – he’s seems to cursed this year…
I agree Ollie, Portugal were runners up in the qualification group that the Danes won.
Some straws for me to clutch;
Spain lost their first game but won the WC.
The last time that NL lost a friendly to Bulgaria and lost their first group match they won the EC. (1988)
Maybe a kick in the arse is what they needed.
GT, I agree with the Robben solution.
Trev, well punned sir.
Still, should have had a penalty in the last minute.
My eyes tell me a different story. Vastly superior and very unlucky. Robben sitting on the pitch, drenched in hard earned sweat, looking so dejected. Shaking his head in disbelief. Schneider, god what a jewel he is to behold, how he sparkled and caught my imagination. Disturbing trend in futbol this season, so so teams usurping the greats.
H2H, I can’t figure out whether GT means Robin or Robben 😛
If that cunt Robben had scored his penalty against Chelsea, I could forgive him a lot. As it is, fuck him with a rusty pole.
Agree with others re: Robben. It’s going to be interesting to see how all the Bayern players at the tournament perform for their respective national teams.
Evening chums.
Surely there is a chance the Dutch will drink to forget, H2H? Put on an unhappy hour at Twente percent off 😉
Tonight should be edifying in that respect, Julian, quite a few on show.
Heh Ollie.
2 x Heh ‘holic.
I’ll hire you as promotional manager. Only problem is that 95% of the punters got the fuck out at the final whistle.
Talk about sour losers.
Oh well.
Up next, Poldi Power!
“Lu-Lu-Lukas Podolski” that insidious little tune is stuck in my head 🙂
yeah its contagious:D I have plagued my surroundings by it and everyone hates me for that. Looking forward to see Per and Poldi in action too.
Portugal’s in no danger of winning Eurovision anytime soon based upon their squad’s singing ability.
Fuck Robben, Fuck Van Bommell, Fuck Ronaldo, c’mon Lukas!
442 sounds very French to me.
Yes, Dr Z.
And now Julian has put that Lululu song in my head.
It was nice to sing it at the last home game of the season.
Well, we had to start practising Ollie 😉
Well well, the Danes put a Dutch cap on Holland’s strikers who it appears were firing blanks anyhow.
Oranje boom boom.
I’ll pick up my coat on the way out H2H.
Ollie @449
Wish I’d been there for that! Did it catch on?
There were only a few of us left at that time, Julian 😉
Ollie@432 O2 O2 O2 be…
I considered that one too, Oxon. So far we’ve got 3 then.
Well done Oxon.
Punning seems to fit you to A T (&T)
Shades of the disallowed Lampard effort? Wow.
Not at all, Julian, this one clearly bounced off the line or even a few centimetres in front.
BBC excelling themselves. Have added Harry Yappyapp to Lineker and Hansen.
Yappyapp: “The longer Portugal can stay in it the better for them I s’pose”.
Oh yes BBC, this is what we want to pay for.
Definitely, Ollie. Certainly a tense moment for the Germans, though! Hopefully the austerity measures aren’t affecting the quality of their final ball 😉
Note to self: The Arsenal is not playing. Relax. Enjoy the football. Turn off commentary…
heh GT
I’m not going to attempt a Vodafone pun
At least Meireles ditched the dodgy haircut.
Commentators will have to go off, they’re bigging up the ‘extra-officials’ saying they work very well also in the CL.
What, just because now one has spotted a ball about 1m behind the line that surely the main ref should have seen too?
Fuck off, the extra 2 refs have proved incompetent and useless time and time again.
They’re saying it just to suck up to Platini.
I think you lot are being very unfair to the Beeb. I must have been watching for about 5 minutes now and they have yet to say anything utterly stupid.
Only a matter of time, I’m sure
ESPN = guaranteed stupidity. Count your blessings!
Guaranteed stupidity would be excellent; it’s the waiting and uncertainty that I find so wearing about Auntie Beeb
Yes! Eins zu null!
Nice goal Germany!
finally!
Good pass, good finish! Must admit this was _not_ the type of match I expected.
Germany’s play over the past ten minutes or so looking strangely familiar.
If the camera was a rifle, someone could have shot Mourinho there and then.
Opportunity missed.
It’s very tense. First time these Euros I’m nervous. Probably because it’s the first time in this tournament that a team I really hate is playing.
This is the point where the German centre-back and goalkeeper collide in the area leaving a tap-in for some Portguese wanker
Oh good, no Koscielny/Szczesny moment there
Final whistle, thank fuck.
It wasn’t a classic.
That was a good team performance from Germany – but if Holland play to their strengths they can beat them – don’t give up just yet H2H..
🙂
Not a classic, but a good result for the Germans regardless. It wasn’t Podolski’s best game, to be sure, but I was encouraged by the way he tracked back and otherwise tried to contribute off the ball.
Will somebody please be good enough to tell me what the bloody hell is going on.
I keep hearing our players names mentioned in commentary and on Match of the Day and even that fucking awful Harry Redchap is now joining in.
Where are all these matches taking place ?
It”s empty down here at The Emirates.
I wouldn’t worry about it Mr Hill-Wood sir I think that they are just playing replays from last season..
🙂
Oh jolly good show. I’ll go and turn the big screens on in Club Level. Do feel free to join me, old boy.
By the way, have I signed anybody yet ?
Have we signed Wesley yet ? No? I want a full report on my desk in the morning, Mr. Hill.
@ 359 can’t be arsed
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha… (pauses for breath) …ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!
THE ARSENAL!
Cba @359 – 🙂 missed that on the way thru’
Lars is pissed – heh 😎
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>